Extreme Speed Prop Planes Discuss the need for speed with fast prop planes (Screamin Demon, Diamond Dust, Shrikes or any REAL sound breakin'''' plane)

need help picking first "go faster"

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Old 08-06-2009, 03:19 PM
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STANG KILLA SS
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Default need help picking first "go faster"

looking to build my first prop "go faster". i fly everthing from giant scale 3d gassers, to foamie EDFs. but never had a nitro prop speed demon.

a few things id like

#1 i want it to look like i nemisis, sundowner etc, i LOVE that look!
#2 id like something i can run .30 to .60 (maybe .90) size two stroke on
#3 id like to do 125 mph (unrealistic?)
#4 id like to be able to buy the motor from tower or horizon. no specialty speed engines, same thing with props no specialized carbon fiber etc. (read budget build) what motor would you suggest?
#5 id like the possiblilty to run a pipe some day. even if its hanging under the plane. probly never happen but just in case.

i think that about covers it (whew!)
i looked into the world models nemesis but have heard reports that even when addiquatly powered its quite slow.
open to any and all suggestions. your advice would be of great help. im not familiar with this side of the hobby. or even whats out there.

thanks!
Cory

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Old 08-06-2009, 04:28 PM
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Welcome....

In brief, what you want is not likely going to be found in an ARF.

The closest sundowner, set up with a TT46pro or OS46AX, add the turbo-jett muffler, and complete the installation like shown on the Jett Engineering web site. Figure on 110-115 mph with a stock 9x7 prop.

Otherwise,
What you want to find is the "retired" type QM-40 aircraft, and set it up for the TT40pro or TT46pro engine.

Something like this
http://www.houseofpylon.com/Q40/Stinger/Stinger.aspx

Easy to build, fly great, and with the sport engine and a 9x6, or 9x7 ...... easy 125mph.

Bob
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Old 08-07-2009, 07:44 AM
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Hey Bob that looks like a real fun plane, I guess a .46 FX would be ok in something like that, or would it?
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Old 08-07-2009, 08:56 AM
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THANKS BOB!
ok sounds like my 125 was a bit unrealistic.

yeah i like the sundowner. could i stuff a larger engine in it? like a .50-.60? any motor recomendations there?
is this the TT motor you were refering to? http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXKF97

also found a tower hobbies .46 it give a higher power rating than the TT and even the OS. think thats true?

that plane in the link isnt quite for me. looks wise. although i see the similarities in shape. not quite what im after. i love the nemesis and sundown look.

keep the suggestions coming!
thanks!
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Old 08-07-2009, 12:30 PM
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The Tower .46 is very poor in quality control. So is GMS as a side note. I have a Tower .46 motor that has always run very reliably but I have seen several that refused to do that. I put one on a test stand to find out if it was the fuel system or some external problem and it still did not run well. The Thunder Tiger is a much better choice and the price is comparable. The Tower is not more powerful, in my opinion.

If you decide on a Thunder Tiger Pro .46 you can save a few $$ by ordering from Radical RC. They get $93 and shipping is $3. I have ordered many times from Dave @ Radical RC and highly recommend them. http://www.radicalrc.com/shop/?shop=...=2996748&cat=6

I think the OS is the best all around sport engine available and parts are readily available. If you cannot run an OS engine you have very little chance of making anything else run.

Wiggy
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Old 08-07-2009, 01:06 PM
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How about a nice OS 55AX ... weight is about the same .... fits a .46 motor mount and puts out a bit more power at 16,000 1.75 hp ...you can enhance it with a Jett muffler as well.
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Old 08-07-2009, 02:21 PM
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ORIGINAL: Blade47

How about a nice OS 55AX ... weight is about the same .... fits a .46 motor mount and puts out a bit more power at 16,000 1.75 hp ...you can in enhance it with a Jett muffler as well.

that sounds like a setup id be very interested in. i was looking at that sundowner on jetts site adn that gave me alot of ideas.
what does the AX mean? are there certain motors that are better suited for high speed? even though there the same cubes? ie lets say OS has 3 or 4 .46 size motors (i have no idea) are some better suited for high rpms? why?


after looking up the 55ax
anythoughts on this
On the other hand, I am not proposing that the .55AX was intended to be a screamer. That just isn't likely when running in such a small crankcase for its displacement.
Gentlemen,we SK engine users have been warned by the thech dept.that an underpropped engine should be overheated on air because of port designing.I think that new OS 55 has similiar design that to give more torque than more revv.So try to load it properly about 11000-11500 RPM s on ground and check the performance.
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Old 08-07-2009, 02:38 PM
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Hmmm with the OS55 that I have with the Jett Muffler (red one ) I can prop it with a MAS 11x7 scimitar 2 prop on the ground for 14,500 rpm and can hear it unload in the air ..( not sure to what RPM in the Air ..but would think maybe up to 15,500 or more ) as for the AX ..not sure what that would mean ...maybe if you sent OS a email they can tell you.
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Old 08-08-2009, 02:03 PM
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ORIGINAL: smoknrv4

Hey Bob that looks like a real fun plane, I guess a .46 FX would be ok in something like that, or would it?
Definately...... the QM40 planes fly great with any sort of sport engine from a .32 up to about a .46. Ground clearnace is more of a problem on the "newer" type, but older ones are good to go with 9" prop with no issues.
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Old 08-08-2009, 02:09 PM
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Default RE: need help picking first

Yes, displacement of the engine is a reference, but does not tell you the power of an engine. An OS LA40 puts out around 1 hp, A QM40 .40 engine puts out about 3+ hp . Each engine has a purpose and is designed accordingly.

The AX engines from OS are just a type designation. The previous series were the FSR, SX and FX .

The newer OS AX engines are designed for "quieter" operation, and in general are designed for slightly lower peak rpm than the FX engines. Air passages and carb are designed accordingly, and the new AX engines come with a powerbox muffler that helps with performance and provides the proper backpressure. OS did a great job on this line of engines.

So yes, the AX engines are lower rpm engines. However, they do produce great power at their designed rpm. As the example Blade47 gave there for his OS55AX with the Jett Muffler. Key is, prop it correctly to keep it in its prefered power band, and they run great.... stock muffler or by adding a tuned muffler or pipe .... good performance all around. You can get speed from them when set up correctly.
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Old 08-08-2009, 02:45 PM
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Default RE: need help picking first

Funny how that combo of a Master Airscrew 11X7 S-2 prop on a 55AX + tuned muffler works like magic on a lot of sport planes.
A gal flier, runs the 55AX with a red Jett muffler and a 11X8 S-2 cut down to 10 3/4" on a WM T-34, it's quick, some guys use an APC 10X8 or 10X9 with that set up.
There guys running APC 10X10 on there Vipers.

The Q-40 is a clean, quick plane, I don't think you'll get the most out of the 55AX on that plane unless you can swing 10" prop or find a seriously over square 9" prop.
An old FX series may do better here, or something that turns higher rpms so you can use a 9" prop or smaller.
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Old 08-08-2009, 04:18 PM
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ORIGINAL: STANG KILLA SS

THANKS BOB!
ok sounds like my 125 was a bit unrealistic.

that plane in the link isnt quite for me. looks wise. although i see the similarities in shape. not quite what im after. i love the nemesis and sundown look.

keep the suggestions coming!
thanks!
Jett MFG has done the ground work to hit your looks/performance mark: http://www.jettengineering.com/sundowner.html but not on your on your budget.

So if you want to get there, You'll have to buy used and get creative. Even a used Jett 60 or 90 may be out of budget as these engines hold value so well.

One idea is to look for a used OS 70SZ-H heli engine and a used pipe or tuned muffler. It will absolutely cook with a 11X8 APC. The OS 70 heli is kinda a lost child, it is nether a 60 nor a 90 size and it doesn't seem to hold value(good for you) It was mainly intended as a hop-up for the 60 class helis but it has the same case size near weight as the 91's. In fact it weighs 6 1/2 oz. more than a jett 60, so this may reduce turning in a Sundowner and make for a bit hotter landings. The OS 70 is very strong engine, a bit less power than a Jett 90LX. It can use the standard prop drive adapter that the OS 60 and 91 aircraft engines use.

You will need to do some beefing up and cutting here and there, a bigger fuel tank, so it wont be a "turn key" ARF any more. Are you up to it?

Swap meets and the listings here on RCU are the best places to find an engine for the best price, I don't even look a flea-bay anymore, too much $$$.
If you run across a good deal on a OS91 heli, go for it, even better if it's a pumped 91.
These engines have rings, so it may not feel like there is as much compression as a good ABC or ABN engine, but the rings seat tight when running. (this can be a bargaining tool swap meets) Count on a bearing change too. Other brand engines are OK, but you may have to hunt or make your own prop drive.

Tuned pipes and tuned mufflers are hands down are always cheaper at swap meets....like $10 for a Macs 60size muffled tuned pipe, not once but twice, from two different people!!!
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Old 08-24-2009, 10:41 AM
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Default RE: need help picking first

well ive think ive kind found something that would work. has the look, the size, and the price.
Pole Cat 50 $99 (sold out here, but other places have them at the same price)
http://www.nitroplanes.com/newaepocat50.html

only thing that worries me are the large control surfaces. ie flutter at high speeds. any insight there? advice?
throw a good .46 on there, and a jett muffler and it ought to do exactly what im after.

thoughts?

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Old 08-24-2009, 12:35 PM
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not easy to install the jett engine (or muffler) in there. It is a good plane, but the muffler install without using extensions is challenging.
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Old 08-24-2009, 01:06 PM
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Default RE: need help picking first

That Nitro Planes Pole cat is not really designed for speed. I know it is made to look like a racer but it has a thick airfoil so it can 3D. And, as you pointed out, large control surfaces.

I'd keep looking if I were you.

Blessings, Terry
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Old 08-24-2009, 01:47 PM
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Default RE: need help picking first

bob, yeah i had planed to notch out a section of the cowl and fuse' too for the jett muffler.

still4given. thats a good point. the thick airfoil hadnt crossed my mind

this was my second choice. total not a reno/sundowner style. but cool i guess. im worred about prop selection/availabily though (pusher)
http://www.nitroplanes.com/newsibo5051a.html

thoughts?
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Old 08-24-2009, 01:52 PM
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Do a forum search here for SPEEDBOY and his PATRIOT. His is powered with a Rossi .53, but a $100 .45 engine would give you 90% of what he is getting.
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Old 08-24-2009, 04:51 PM
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I had a Bobcat. It is a nice plane but takes a bit of power to make it fast. I ran a Tower 75 on mine and it went pretty good. One of the folks on here had an OS 55 with a Jett muffler and claimed it went pretty fast. I think it's a lot of plane for a 46. A few things to think about with the Bobcat. It takes 4 HS 82 servos and a reversing "Y" cord just for the Elevator and Rudder, not to mention several long extensions. I put retracts on mine. That's another $100.

There's a couple of threads here on the Bobcat that I would call required reading before you build one. I'm not trying to talk you out of it, just want you to know what you are in for. It's a very good looking plane.

Blessings, Terry
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Old 08-24-2009, 05:47 PM
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Look up Speedboy and his awesome Patriot. His is powered with a Rossi .53. I saw a Rossi .53 for sale in the RCU classifieds recently for a good price. Not a super cheap combo, but not bad for the price.
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Old 08-24-2009, 08:30 PM
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ORIGINAL: Wiggy

The Tower .46 is very poor in quality control. So is GMS as a side note. I have a Tower .46 motor that has always run very reliably but I have seen several that refused to do that. I put one on a test stand to find out if it was the fuel system or some external problem and it still did not run well. The Thunder Tiger is a much better choice and the price is comparable. The Tower is not more powerful, in my opinion.

If you decide on a Thunder Tiger Pro .46 you can save a few $$ by ordering from Radical RC. They get $93 and shipping is $3. I have ordered many times from Dave @ Radical RC and highly recommend them. http://www.radicalrc.com/shop/?shop=...=2996748&cat=6

I think the OS is the best all around sport engine available and parts are readily available. If you cannot run an OS engine you have very little chance of making anything else run.

Wiggy
Boy do I have to agree with this one. The money you save over OS will soon be eaten up by wrecked planes from dead sticks. Add the frustration of spending your day at the field futsing with the engine instead of flying and its just not worth it. I would spend the extra money for an OS and take care of the thing like its a $40,000 car and you will get years and years worth of enjoyment. I had to learn the hard way, I did have pretty good luck with the TT .40, but OS is definitely the quality leader for 2 strokes.
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Old 08-24-2009, 08:37 PM
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My first "fast" plane was a sonic 500 and I still think they are an absolute blast to fly. They make much better sport planes then the standard q500 and are almost as fast. Definitely an ugly duckling though.
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Old 08-25-2009, 03:26 AM
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ORIGINAL: freakingfast



Jett MFG has done the ground work to hit your looks/performance mark: http://www.jettengineering.com/sundowner.html but not on your on your budget.

So if you want to get there, You'll have to buy used and get creative. Even a used Jett 60 or 90 may be out of budget as these engines hold value so well.

One idea is to look for a used OS 70SZ-H heli engine and a used pipe or tuned muffler. It will absolutely cook with a 11X8 APC. The OS 70 heli is kinda a lost child, it is nether a 60 nor a 90 size and it doesn't seem to hold value(good for you) It was mainly intended as a hop-up for the 60 class helis but it has the same case size near weight as the 91's. In fact it weighs 6 1/2 oz. more than a jett 60, so this may reduce turning in a Sundowner and make for a bit hotter landings. The OS 70 is very strong engine, a bit less power than a Jett 90LX. It can use the standard prop drive adapter that the OS 60 and 91 aircraft engines use.

You will need to do some beefing up and cutting here and there, a bigger fuel tank, so it wont be a ''turn key'' ARF any more. Are you up to it?

Swap meets and the listings here on RCU are the best places to find an engine for the best price, I don't even look a flea-bay anymore, too much $$$.
If you run across a good deal on a OS91 heli, go for it, even better if it's a pumped 91.
These engines have rings, so it may not feel like there is as much compression as a good ABC or ABN engine, but the rings seat tight when running. (this can be a bargaining tool swap meets) Count on a bearing change too. Other brand engines are OK, but you may have to hunt or make your own prop drive.

Tuned pipes and tuned mufflers are hands down are always cheaper at swap meets....like $10 for a Macs 60size muffled tuned pipe, not once but twice, from two different people!!!
Here we go, just what I was talking about, you just don't find power any cheaper: http://www.rcuniverse.com/market/item.cfm?itemId=546969
See if he has the clutch removal tool, and ask him to remove it before he sends it to you, or you need to find a heli guy that has one to do it right.
Sell the pipe & clutch and it's an even sweeter deal.
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Old 08-25-2009, 02:29 PM
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anyone recognize this plane? manufacture? looks like a perfect match for my needs!



Wingspan: 51 in
Wing Area: 510 sq in
Weight: 5-6 lbs
Length: 52 in
Engine: 2-stroke .46-.55

This almost-ready-to-fly R/C racing plane. It is designed for .46-.55 2-stroke nitro motor. It is a low-cost entry-level scale pylon racer. It is intended for intermediate to advanced modelers.
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Old 08-25-2009, 03:26 PM
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Looks like a Sundowner!!

Sweet. You need to abuse that with some raw power!!
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Old 08-25-2009, 06:19 PM
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Yes it does look like a Sundower, I like the wingtip treatment.
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