Which motor for the Inferno Gt.
12-07-2011, 05:23 PM
#26
RE: Which motor for the Inferno Gt.
OK...I think we have succesfully run off the OP!
Here are some numbers camparing the engines I listed earlier along with a mach 427. these are real numbers. No BS here
Engine: LRP Z.28 Spec 3
Chassis: Mugen MBX5T
Pipe: Jammin JP-2
Diff ratio: 4.6:1
Spur gear:46T
Clutch Bell: 13T
Tire diameter:6.5 inches compensated for "ballooning"
Fuel: 30% Nitro, 9.5% castor oil (for better protection)
Plug: McCoy MC-9
Top Speed: 41.8 MPH
RPM: 35200
Engine: Werks B6
Chassis: Mugen MBX5T
Pipe: Werks 2058
Diff ratio: 4.6:1
Spur gear: 46T
Clutch Bell: 13T
Tire diameter: 6.5 inches compensated for "ballooning"
MPH: 45.5
RPM: 38400
Fuel: 30% nitro, 9.5% oil
Engine: OS 21 VZB V-Spec
Chassis: Kyosho Inferno GT1
Pipe: Jammin JP-3
Diff ratio: 3.30:1
Spur gear:40T (second gear)
Clutch Bell: 24T (second gear)
Tire diameter: 100mm
MPH: 65.5
RPM: 29530 (Gearing was too tall for the space I was running. But this is a good gage to show the amount of power this engine has to be capable of going this fast with gearing that is too tall.)
Fuel: 30% nitro, 9.5% oil
Engine: OS 21 VZB V-Spec
Chassis: Ofna Hyper 7
Pipe Jammin JP-3
Diff ratio: 3.3077
spur gear: 46T
Clutch bell: 15T
tire diameter: 118mm
MPH: 50.6
RPM: 37100
Fuel: 20%
Engine: Losi mach 427 (teal head)
Chassis: Ofna Hyper 7
Pipe Jammin JP-3
Diff ratio: 3.3077
spur gear: 46T
Clutch bell: 15T
tire diameter:118mm
MPH: 49
RPM:35900
Fuel:20%
Here are some numbers camparing the engines I listed earlier along with a mach 427. these are real numbers. No BS here
Engine: LRP Z.28 Spec 3
Chassis: Mugen MBX5T
Pipe: Jammin JP-2
Diff ratio: 4.6:1
Spur gear:46T
Clutch Bell: 13T
Tire diameter:6.5 inches compensated for "ballooning"
Fuel: 30% Nitro, 9.5% castor oil (for better protection)
Plug: McCoy MC-9
Top Speed: 41.8 MPH
RPM: 35200
Engine: Werks B6
Chassis: Mugen MBX5T
Pipe: Werks 2058
Diff ratio: 4.6:1
Spur gear: 46T
Clutch Bell: 13T
Tire diameter: 6.5 inches compensated for "ballooning"
MPH: 45.5
RPM: 38400
Fuel: 30% nitro, 9.5% oil
Engine: OS 21 VZB V-Spec
Chassis: Kyosho Inferno GT1
Pipe: Jammin JP-3
Diff ratio: 3.30:1
Spur gear:40T (second gear)
Clutch Bell: 24T (second gear)
Tire diameter: 100mm
MPH: 65.5
RPM: 29530 (Gearing was too tall for the space I was running. But this is a good gage to show the amount of power this engine has to be capable of going this fast with gearing that is too tall.)
Fuel: 30% nitro, 9.5% oil
Engine: OS 21 VZB V-Spec
Chassis: Ofna Hyper 7
Pipe Jammin JP-3
Diff ratio: 3.3077
spur gear: 46T
Clutch bell: 15T
tire diameter: 118mm
MPH: 50.6
RPM: 37100
Fuel: 20%
Engine: Losi mach 427 (teal head)
Chassis: Ofna Hyper 7
Pipe Jammin JP-3
Diff ratio: 3.3077
spur gear: 46T
Clutch bell: 15T
tire diameter:118mm
MPH: 49
RPM:35900
Fuel:20%
12-07-2011, 10:21 PM
#27
Senior Member
RE: Which motor for the Inferno Gt.
21's can be cool and all, but if you're not seriously into organized racing, they bring with them an enormous PIA and cost factor. So an engine like the LRP DOES very much represent an excellent value, not only in terms of big power for low cost, but also low hassle.
A fancy "race" .21 often carries the following baggage with it:
1.) Double the price of an LRP Spec 3/Losi 454
2.) You "need" a matching pipe and more expensive, sometimes harder to find turbo plug
3.) You need to preheat.. MASSIVE PIA.. Engine preheaters are a complete and total rip-off. And dicking around with hair-driers is a PIA..
4.) Longer break-in.
5.) Narrower tuning window. Will probably stay there once you find it, but for people not that experienced, it might be harder to get it running right initially.
6.) You'll be told that you need to change the conrod, and maybe bearings after 1-2 gallons. More cost, more hassle.
7.) For some people, if you don't already have one, you'll need a starterbox with batteries.
So in the end you will have spent $500 and ten times the hassle for an engine that sounds better, has maybe slightly better performance(sound and speed are not the same..), but drinks less fuel. If you want to do that to run a Kyosho IGT2 around your street or some parking lot, go ahead. With a Losi 454 you can get it for $130, break it in five tanks without preheating, run any ole' plug or pipe, forget conrods and bearings, start it with a rotostart if you want, use it in your MT also btw if you have one...(can't do that with a .21..), run it for eight gallons, throw it away, and get a new one.. Excellent value afaic - not only in terms of cost, but also hassle.
A fancy "race" .21 often carries the following baggage with it:
1.) Double the price of an LRP Spec 3/Losi 454
2.) You "need" a matching pipe and more expensive, sometimes harder to find turbo plug
3.) You need to preheat.. MASSIVE PIA.. Engine preheaters are a complete and total rip-off. And dicking around with hair-driers is a PIA..
4.) Longer break-in.
5.) Narrower tuning window. Will probably stay there once you find it, but for people not that experienced, it might be harder to get it running right initially.
6.) You'll be told that you need to change the conrod, and maybe bearings after 1-2 gallons. More cost, more hassle.
7.) For some people, if you don't already have one, you'll need a starterbox with batteries.
So in the end you will have spent $500 and ten times the hassle for an engine that sounds better, has maybe slightly better performance(sound and speed are not the same..), but drinks less fuel. If you want to do that to run a Kyosho IGT2 around your street or some parking lot, go ahead. With a Losi 454 you can get it for $130, break it in five tanks without preheating, run any ole' plug or pipe, forget conrods and bearings, start it with a rotostart if you want, use it in your MT also btw if you have one...(can't do that with a .21..), run it for eight gallons, throw it away, and get a new one.. Excellent value afaic - not only in terms of cost, but also hassle.
12-08-2011, 09:27 AM
#28
RE: Which motor for the Inferno Gt.
ORIGINAL: HerrSavage
21's can be cool and all, but if you're not seriously into organized racing, they bring with them an enormous PIA and cost factor. So an engine like the LRP DOES very much represent an excellent value, not only in terms of big power for low cost, but also low hassle.
A fancy ''race'' .21 often carries the following baggage with it:
1.) Double the price of an LRP Spec 3/Losi 454
2.) You ''need'' a matching pipe and more expensive, sometimes harder to find turbo plug
3.) You need to preheat.. MASSIVE PIA.. Engine preheaters are a complete and total rip-off. And dicking around with hair-driers is a PIA..
4.) Longer break-in.
5.) Narrower tuning window. Will probably stay there once you find it, but for people not that experienced, it might be harder to get it running right initially.
6.) You'll be told that you need to change the conrod, and maybe bearings after 1-2 gallons. More cost, more hassle.
7.) For some people, if you don't already have one, you'll need a starterbox with batteries.
So in the end you will have spent $500 and ten times the hassle for an engine that sounds better, has maybe slightly better performance(sound and speed are not the same..), but drinks less fuel. If you want to do that to run a Kyosho IGT2 around your street or some parking lot, go ahead. With a Losi 454 you can get it for $130, break it in five tanks without preheating, run any ole' plug or pipe, forget conrods and bearings, start it with a rotostart if you want, use it in your MT also btw if you have one...(can't do that with a .21..), run it for eight gallons, throw it away, and get a new one.. Excellent value afaic - not only in terms of cost, but also hassle.
21's can be cool and all, but if you're not seriously into organized racing, they bring with them an enormous PIA and cost factor. So an engine like the LRP DOES very much represent an excellent value, not only in terms of big power for low cost, but also low hassle.
A fancy ''race'' .21 often carries the following baggage with it:
1.) Double the price of an LRP Spec 3/Losi 454
2.) You ''need'' a matching pipe and more expensive, sometimes harder to find turbo plug
3.) You need to preheat.. MASSIVE PIA.. Engine preheaters are a complete and total rip-off. And dicking around with hair-driers is a PIA..
4.) Longer break-in.
5.) Narrower tuning window. Will probably stay there once you find it, but for people not that experienced, it might be harder to get it running right initially.
6.) You'll be told that you need to change the conrod, and maybe bearings after 1-2 gallons. More cost, more hassle.
7.) For some people, if you don't already have one, you'll need a starterbox with batteries.
So in the end you will have spent $500 and ten times the hassle for an engine that sounds better, has maybe slightly better performance(sound and speed are not the same..), but drinks less fuel. If you want to do that to run a Kyosho IGT2 around your street or some parking lot, go ahead. With a Losi 454 you can get it for $130, break it in five tanks without preheating, run any ole' plug or pipe, forget conrods and bearings, start it with a rotostart if you want, use it in your MT also btw if you have one...(can't do that with a .21..), run it for eight gallons, throw it away, and get a new one.. Excellent value afaic - not only in terms of cost, but also hassle.
1.) ANY OS motor will be better, even the sport models.
2.) EFRA pipes can be had for cheap on ebay , especially if used.
3.) I have never been to a hobby shop that didn't carry turbo plugs. On average, they are about $1-2 more. A $7 plug isn't a big deal if you can make them last.
4.) That isn't a downside, it insures a strong running engine. Any engine should be broken in right, regardless of cost.
5.) No.
6.) Depends on the engine, this is really only true with Novarossi engines.
7.) You will need that with any engine that isn't pull start, there are definitely some quality engines that do have pull start.
So, in the end... you will spend about $250 on a good, reliable engine, maybe more if you want something nicer. I dont understand why you think decent engines are more of a hassle? Because of pre-warming? Wow, big deal... use a blow dryer.
Even people with Losis don't like the 454.
12-08-2011, 10:33 AM
#29
Senior Member
RE: Which motor for the Inferno Gt.
If you're talking organized buggy racing, sure, get a fancy .21 and all the bells and whistles, and be prepared for far more effort to get it running right - and A LOT more money. A gallon break-in is a PIA afaic, period. I got a great deal on an Argus A52 too - €110 shipped. And I like it - I really do. Was breaking it in in my SC8 before winter started. But honestly, pre-heating is a total absolute PIA, even with a hair-drier. And it still has mega pinch after like 25 tanks. Honestly, it can take me a long time to burn a gallon of nitro through one engine - I started breaking in my Argus in the summer.. But with work, family, holidays, weather, whatever else, I just don't have time for a gallon+ break-in.. So here I am four months later and the thing's not even broken in yet..(I've run several other RC's and engines in that time too..) I also had to order a €60 pipe from Asia to get the best performance out of it. I made the mistake on a couple of occasions of going a bit heavy on the throttle in my SC8 with the body on, and temps hit 345F.. Now, that I didn't spend so much on it is good, cuz if it does blow up, it's less of a big deal. But it goes to show how these high-pinch .21's are more hassle than an LRP Spec 3/454, which I can break in in an afternoon without pre-heating, in winter, by wrapping a sock and some alu foil around the head. 5-6 tanks, done, letter' rip.. And that's exactly what I'm going to do with my DM-1..
Again, is the OP racing buggies against Maifield and Tebo and those guys?...
I just today snapped up a Losi 454 for €89, and I'm stoked.. Can run it in my DM-1 AND two LST2's.., and my SC8 too.. Works in all my RC's, is easy to break-in - even in winter, will run great with the pipes I already have, I can put a closed backplate on it OR run it with the original backplate in my LST2's..
I am really itching to pick up an RB Fire 11 combo this winter, and most probably will.. So it's not that I hate 21's or anything. They are just much more cost-and-hassle-intensive, period, absolutely.. With this 454 I can take my DM-1 or LST2 or SC8 or whatever out and just thrash it without having to care that much if it's preheated, if the pinch is gone after a gallon.., if it needs a new conrod, whatever.. I have full confidence it will put up big power in all my RC's for multiple gallons, and if it does blow up, screw it - I only paid 89 bucks ha ha..
ps A 454 will be faster than an OS 30 in an MT, and WAY faster in a DM-1 as it will have a bunch more top-end than the OS 30, and faster than any of the sport 21's in a DM-1 or whatever else. In a DM-1 only the 25XZ or 28XZ or maybe a perfectly set-up XZ-b or Speed will outdo it... I honestly wouldn't bet on it though, not in my 9lb.+ DM-1...
pps Here's my Argus in the SC8:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WpBItjjHQSc
pps I recently got a new Andriod smartphone, and have been researching how to optimize it, and getting sucked into the Android-vs.-Apple bull****.. And you know what, all these computer geek ideologically fanatical Apple-haters just don't get that not everybody wants to screw around updating, setting-up, optimizing, jumping through hoops, whatever.. a phone to be able to just do the stuff people need a phone to do.. I got the Android though cuz the Iphone was so much more expensive.. In a way, with engines it's similar - but different.. The easiest option is FAR cheaper.. And also, face it, a LOT of the people who buy big-money or big-name engines do it for bragging rights, and hardly even run them.. I want something that I can go rag out, and throw in the corner when I'm done. Then take it out again six months later and have it run without a hitch, not having to waste a thought the whole time as to whether or not I should change the conrod or plug or whatever the hell else.. I like this hobby because I have fun burning nitro when I get the chance, not because I give two c.raps what some obnoxious engine-modder or anybody else thinks..
Again, is the OP racing buggies against Maifield and Tebo and those guys?...
I just today snapped up a Losi 454 for €89, and I'm stoked.. Can run it in my DM-1 AND two LST2's.., and my SC8 too.. Works in all my RC's, is easy to break-in - even in winter, will run great with the pipes I already have, I can put a closed backplate on it OR run it with the original backplate in my LST2's..
I am really itching to pick up an RB Fire 11 combo this winter, and most probably will.. So it's not that I hate 21's or anything. They are just much more cost-and-hassle-intensive, period, absolutely.. With this 454 I can take my DM-1 or LST2 or SC8 or whatever out and just thrash it without having to care that much if it's preheated, if the pinch is gone after a gallon.., if it needs a new conrod, whatever.. I have full confidence it will put up big power in all my RC's for multiple gallons, and if it does blow up, screw it - I only paid 89 bucks ha ha..
ps A 454 will be faster than an OS 30 in an MT, and WAY faster in a DM-1 as it will have a bunch more top-end than the OS 30, and faster than any of the sport 21's in a DM-1 or whatever else. In a DM-1 only the 25XZ or 28XZ or maybe a perfectly set-up XZ-b or Speed will outdo it... I honestly wouldn't bet on it though, not in my 9lb.+ DM-1...
pps Here's my Argus in the SC8:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WpBItjjHQSc
pps I recently got a new Andriod smartphone, and have been researching how to optimize it, and getting sucked into the Android-vs.-Apple bull****.. And you know what, all these computer geek ideologically fanatical Apple-haters just don't get that not everybody wants to screw around updating, setting-up, optimizing, jumping through hoops, whatever.. a phone to be able to just do the stuff people need a phone to do.. I got the Android though cuz the Iphone was so much more expensive.. In a way, with engines it's similar - but different.. The easiest option is FAR cheaper.. And also, face it, a LOT of the people who buy big-money or big-name engines do it for bragging rights, and hardly even run them.. I want something that I can go rag out, and throw in the corner when I'm done. Then take it out again six months later and have it run without a hitch, not having to waste a thought the whole time as to whether or not I should change the conrod or plug or whatever the hell else.. I like this hobby because I have fun burning nitro when I get the chance, not because I give two c.raps what some obnoxious engine-modder or anybody else thinks..
12-08-2011, 11:35 AM
#30
Senior Member
RE: Which motor for the Inferno Gt.
I have a headache [sm=cry_smile.gif][sm=52_52.gif]
dude, u-r the only-1 talking about fancy $500 engines [&o]
is a $200/$250 engine, fancy?
just because u like the 454 engine doesn't make it better.
lots of people love the 3.3 traxxas engine also,, and guess what? is still junk. [&:]
dude, u-r the only-1 talking about fancy $500 engines [&o]
is a $200/$250 engine, fancy?
just because u like the 454 engine doesn't make it better.
lots of people love the 3.3 traxxas engine also,, and guess what? is still junk. [&:]
12-08-2011, 11:46 AM
#31
Senior Member
RE: Which motor for the Inferno Gt.
250 engine, 80-100 pipe, for those without a startbox, 100+, etc.. Then you'll be told you can only run an M2C clutch, you need a Comp Heat rip-off pre-heater, etc..
At the very least you will be hounded into getting the "right" pipe, and yeah, if you don't have a startbox you'll need one of those.. So 300 before you can mount the d.amn thing, assuming you already have a starterbox.
OP?? Do you have a startbox?......
And you seriously can't compare the Traxxas 3.3 to an LRP Spec 3.
Show up at a track or parking lot with %90 of the .21's out there, you either won't or will barely hang with a Spec 3 in a DM-1 or IGT2. Period. You'll have a nicer idle and will burn less fuel, but you will have spent three times as much, and likely will be slower - at best similar-ish speed-wise..
The Spec 3 was dynoed - by a nonbiased, objective source - and put up about 1.8 hp (the truggy version scraping 1.9 with 1.89) and somewhere north of 75 oz of torque. VERY few 21's will do that. Especially on a dyno not owned and operated by someone trying to sell something else.
At the very least you will be hounded into getting the "right" pipe, and yeah, if you don't have a startbox you'll need one of those.. So 300 before you can mount the d.amn thing, assuming you already have a starterbox.
OP?? Do you have a startbox?......
And you seriously can't compare the Traxxas 3.3 to an LRP Spec 3.
Show up at a track or parking lot with %90 of the .21's out there, you either won't or will barely hang with a Spec 3 in a DM-1 or IGT2. Period. You'll have a nicer idle and will burn less fuel, but you will have spent three times as much, and likely will be slower - at best similar-ish speed-wise..
The Spec 3 was dynoed - by a nonbiased, objective source - and put up about 1.8 hp (the truggy version scraping 1.9 with 1.89) and somewhere north of 75 oz of torque. VERY few 21's will do that. Especially on a dyno not owned and operated by someone trying to sell something else.
12-16-2011, 10:03 PM
#33
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RE: Which motor for the Inferno Gt.
I've been an avid GT racer since 2007, so here's my personal experence based on real track racing events.
For lower budget/Spec class racing the Werks B5 with 2013 pipe combo is very hard to beat. It offers excellent power, rpm's and fuel run time with OS P4 Turbo plugs on Byron 30% fuel.
For higher budget/Open class racing The Sirio CL7R-STI is a powerhouse engine that fears nobody. It offers outstanding power, insane rpm's and very good run time too; when used with the 2013 pipe, OS P5 Turbo plugs and Byron 20% or 30% fuels.
Like I've said, I'm just an on-road track racer and these are my suggestions based on experence.
See ya at the races!
For lower budget/Spec class racing the Werks B5 with 2013 pipe combo is very hard to beat. It offers excellent power, rpm's and fuel run time with OS P4 Turbo plugs on Byron 30% fuel.
For higher budget/Open class racing The Sirio CL7R-STI is a powerhouse engine that fears nobody. It offers outstanding power, insane rpm's and very good run time too; when used with the 2013 pipe, OS P5 Turbo plugs and Byron 20% or 30% fuels.
Like I've said, I'm just an on-road track racer and these are my suggestions based on experence.
See ya at the races!
12-17-2011, 07:21 AM
#34
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RE: Which motor for the Inferno Gt.
Herrsavage, I can agree AND disagree with you on the .21 in a DM-1. I installed a modified Kangaroo in my DM-1 once and did not like the bottom end at all as you experienced too. Well I put one of my brand new modified .21 RB Xenons in the DM-1 for an extended break in time and once that engine was broken in to where I wanted to start ripping on the throttle, it was an absolute animal and ran just as hard as a .28 does.
As for the top dollar .28's, what I see Neal posting is a $219 engine and not a $400-$500 engine package. My personal preference is a Picco P3 .28 as that thing runs hard out the box let alone modded. The only downfall to the P3 is that the rods will break on you if you don't keep an eye on them. If and when I get a few dollars put together, I am going to buy a RB TM928.
To the Original Poster, choose wisely and you do have guys in this very thread that have ahd great experiences with all engines involved in the discussion. For the cost of the engine that Neal is posting, it is modified and cost the same as a box stock Picco P3 or LRP does. Good luck with your decision as well.
As for the top dollar .28's, what I see Neal posting is a $219 engine and not a $400-$500 engine package. My personal preference is a Picco P3 .28 as that thing runs hard out the box let alone modded. The only downfall to the P3 is that the rods will break on you if you don't keep an eye on them. If and when I get a few dollars put together, I am going to buy a RB TM928.
To the Original Poster, choose wisely and you do have guys in this very thread that have ahd great experiences with all engines involved in the discussion. For the cost of the engine that Neal is posting, it is modified and cost the same as a box stock Picco P3 or LRP does. Good luck with your decision as well.
12-17-2011, 07:43 AM
#35
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RE: Which motor for the Inferno Gt.
ORIGINAL: HerrSavage
I'm not trying to sell anything.
Nor convince people they have to spend $400 on a nitro engine set-up for running around a parking lot. With a nice idle ha ha...
I'm not trying to sell anything.
Nor convince people they have to spend $400 on a nitro engine set-up for running around a parking lot. With a nice idle ha ha...
12-17-2011, 07:48 AM
#36
Senior Member
RE: Which motor for the Inferno Gt.
ORIGINAL: Brent Davis
Herrsavage, I can agree AND disagree with you on the .21 in a DM-1. I installed a modified Kangaroo in my DM-1 once and did not like the bottom end at all as you experienced too. Well I put one of my brand new modified .21 RB Xenons in the DM-1 for an extended break in time and once that engine was broken in to where I wanted to start ripping on the throttle, it was an absolute animal and ran just as hard as a .28 does.
As for the top dollar .28's, what I see Neal posting is a $219 engine and not a $400-$500 engine package. My personal preference is a Picco P3 .28 as that thing runs hard out the box let alone modded. The only downfall to the P3 is that the rods will break on you if you don't keep an eye on them. If and when I get a few dollars put together, I am going to buy a RB TM928.
To the Original Poster, choose wisely and you do have guys in this very thread that have ahd great experiences with all engines involved in the discussion. For the cost of the engine that Neal is posting, it is modified and cost the same as a box stock Picco P3 or LRP does. Good luck with your decision as well.
Herrsavage, I can agree AND disagree with you on the .21 in a DM-1. I installed a modified Kangaroo in my DM-1 once and did not like the bottom end at all as you experienced too. Well I put one of my brand new modified .21 RB Xenons in the DM-1 for an extended break in time and once that engine was broken in to where I wanted to start ripping on the throttle, it was an absolute animal and ran just as hard as a .28 does.
As for the top dollar .28's, what I see Neal posting is a $219 engine and not a $400-$500 engine package. My personal preference is a Picco P3 .28 as that thing runs hard out the box let alone modded. The only downfall to the P3 is that the rods will break on you if you don't keep an eye on them. If and when I get a few dollars put together, I am going to buy a RB TM928.
To the Original Poster, choose wisely and you do have guys in this very thread that have ahd great experiences with all engines involved in the discussion. For the cost of the engine that Neal is posting, it is modified and cost the same as a box stock Picco P3 or LRP does. Good luck with your decision as well.
you should see the 28-7 run bro...or at least my 28-7..... has the bottom of the Picco 28 but about 10 000 more RPM on the topside
12-17-2011, 08:21 AM
#37
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RE: Which motor for the Inferno Gt.
ORIGINAL: supertib
you should see the 28-7 run bro...or at least my 28-7..... has the bottom of the Picco 28 but about 10 000 more RPM on the topside
you should see the 28-7 run bro...or at least my 28-7..... has the bottom of the Picco 28 but about 10 000 more RPM on the topside
12-17-2011, 08:37 AM
#38
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RE: Which motor for the Inferno Gt.
ORIGINAL: Brent Davis
So I take it that you aren't as big a fan of the Picco P3 like you used to be then hugh? How much for this 28-7 engine and with 10K more RPM and the same P3 bottom end, it will kill the P3 point blank.
ORIGINAL: supertib
you should see the 28-7 run bro...or at least my 28-7..... has the bottom of the Picco 28 but about 10 000 more RPM on the topside
you should see the 28-7 run bro...or at least my 28-7..... has the bottom of the Picco 28 but about 10 000 more RPM on the topside
I am still a fan of the P3...However OFNA has not had them available for about a year now...So it makes it hard to promote them when the importer doesn`t have inventory.........
However with that being said the modified 28-7 is on another level....they retail at $370.00 PM me for further details
