You Guys Seen This?
02-20-2013, 11:10 AM
#3
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RE: You Guys Seen This?
Nice one Dave! What's the knife edge performance like:-)
How about folding wings so it can be towed behind a vehicle ? Love the concept.
Regards Mark H
How about folding wings so it can be towed behind a vehicle ? Love the concept.
Regards Mark H
02-20-2013, 12:21 PM
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RE: You Guys Seen This?
That's a 40Kg thrust on a 150Kg plane (without a person), so the thrust to weight ratio less then 1/5th...
gives you a whole new perspective about wing lift and power ratios...
gives you a whole new perspective about wing lift and power ratios...
02-20-2013, 12:44 PM
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RE: You Guys Seen This?
Empty weight is only 101kg, you have to add a 80kg pilot and kerozene, around 6 to 10 kg ?
That's a less than 200kg airplane with 40kg push power... That a push/weight ratio of 1/5, alias 0.2, your are right.
Lots of planes have such a power ratio, it's only modellers that always want a 5/1 power ratio...
Let's have a look at the real Boeing 777 for fun...
Max take off weight : 351 tons, thats 351.000 kg
Max total push : 1024kN, that's around 102,4 tons...
Push/Weight ratio is only 0.29, but you can see on airports that the climb rate is not fainted...
For great fun, same plane : empty weight is 143 tons, so empty the power ratio should be 0.72 !!!
Have a look to a fighter, lets say F-18 super Hornet ?
Max weight : 29,937 tons with weapons
Max power 79kN x2 engines
power ratio is 15,8/29,937 = 0.52 only !
Empty weight is 13,865 tons, so power ratio is 1,14 (only again...)
That's a less than 200kg airplane with 40kg push power... That a push/weight ratio of 1/5, alias 0.2, your are right.
Lots of planes have such a power ratio, it's only modellers that always want a 5/1 power ratio...
Let's have a look at the real Boeing 777 for fun...
Max take off weight : 351 tons, thats 351.000 kg
Max total push : 1024kN, that's around 102,4 tons...
Push/Weight ratio is only 0.29, but you can see on airports that the climb rate is not fainted...
For great fun, same plane : empty weight is 143 tons, so empty the power ratio should be 0.72 !!!
Have a look to a fighter, lets say F-18 super Hornet ?
Max weight : 29,937 tons with weapons
Max power 79kN x2 engines
power ratio is 15,8/29,937 = 0.52 only !
Empty weight is 13,865 tons, so power ratio is 1,14 (only again...)
02-20-2013, 01:02 PM
#9
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RE: You Guys Seen This?
Its amazing what people can do with "MODEL ENGINES"
check this out:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gLfNplcSC1U
it basically uses sing cylinder 2-stroke engines on a tuned pipe, the upgraded to olympus turbines and got to fly at 150 Mph:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Y-AL3YfWzM
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colomban_Cri-cri
here is another one with jetcats:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sh6Eb-jsrSU
and finally ON BRUSHLESS MOTORS lol, I wonder if they used castle speed controllers heh:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&v...ture=endscreen
check this out:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gLfNplcSC1U
it basically uses sing cylinder 2-stroke engines on a tuned pipe, the upgraded to olympus turbines and got to fly at 150 Mph:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Y-AL3YfWzM
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colomban_Cri-cri
here is another one with jetcats:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sh6Eb-jsrSU
and finally ON BRUSHLESS MOTORS lol, I wonder if they used castle speed controllers heh:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&v...ture=endscreen
02-20-2013, 02:58 PM
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RE: You Guys Seen This?
Whoever "said pilot 80kg" I'm flattered 
I am considerably more than that lol!
Plane weighs 100kg and needs to carry 46 ltrs of fuel for a 20 min flight with a bit of a reserve.
Plane has a recovery chute I built into the wing, it's housed in a modified plastic bucket (I like to call it the ****it bucket!)
It will maintain height on 1 engine (just)
Not flown it much, waiting for Marcus to send the P300s
Dave
I am considerably more than that lol!Plane weighs 100kg and needs to carry 46 ltrs of fuel for a 20 min flight with a bit of a reserve.
Plane has a recovery chute I built into the wing, it's housed in a modified plastic bucket (I like to call it the ****it bucket!)
It will maintain height on 1 engine (just)
Not flown it much, waiting for Marcus to send the P300s
Dave
02-20-2013, 05:26 PM
#14
RE: You Guys Seen This?
With a 25 hour "TBO", and the afore-mentioned 22 gal/hr fuel consumption, plus turbine oil...yes, it looks like a lot of fun, but also a pricey $$$/hr operating cost. I would also think you'd get to 25 hours a lot sooner in a "full scale" plane than most of us do with our model jets.
Still, it would be waaaaaay cool to have one!!
Still, it would be waaaaaay cool to have one!!
02-20-2013, 07:18 PM
#15
RE: You Guys Seen This?
Well done Dave. Fantastic to see this project.
I bet the paper work required for flight testing was an enormous task.
I would think that this would be crying out for a model Turbo fan to be developed. Maybe a Turbofan would go a long way to solving the endurance issue.. Just a thought.
Roger
I bet the paper work required for flight testing was an enormous task.
I would think that this would be crying out for a model Turbo fan to be developed. Maybe a Turbofan would go a long way to solving the endurance issue.. Just a thought.
Roger
02-20-2013, 10:53 PM
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RE: You Guys Seen This?
Hi Roger,
No paperwork! That's why we did it, there is a class of plane in the uk that's called SSDR (single seat de-regulated microlight) and as long as the plane is under 115kg (250lb) and has an empty wing loading of less than10kg per sq. meter then it needs no airworthiness cert. We just wanted to see how far we could push the bounderies within this class.
The idea is its self limiting, that weight with that wing area is never going to be fast and is very low inertia so the chances are you can only damage yourself! You still need a licence, insurance, registration etc.
Even so I did have a stress engineer that works for Airbus come and do an inspection and calcs before I flew it!
Dave
No paperwork! That's why we did it, there is a class of plane in the uk that's called SSDR (single seat de-regulated microlight) and as long as the plane is under 115kg (250lb) and has an empty wing loading of less than10kg per sq. meter then it needs no airworthiness cert. We just wanted to see how far we could push the bounderies within this class.
The idea is its self limiting, that weight with that wing area is never going to be fast and is very low inertia so the chances are you can only damage yourself! You still need a licence, insurance, registration etc.
Even so I did have a stress engineer that works for Airbus come and do an inspection and calcs before I flew it!
Dave
02-20-2013, 11:55 PM
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RE: You Guys Seen This?
Dave good to see your using CAT's in there, no doubt Ali suggested it 
If you need more I'm happy to send you a few as long as I get a mention!
You could also opt for 2 x B300F turbines, same size (bar a few mm) as the p200 but 300N + thrust and I'm again happy to do a deal on them as UK importer.
marcs
If you need more I'm happy to send you a few as long as I get a mention!You could also opt for 2 x B300F turbines, same size (bar a few mm) as the p200 but 300N + thrust and I'm again happy to do a deal on them as UK importer.
marcs
02-22-2013, 09:52 AM
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RE: You Guys Seen This?
Hi Mark,
I might be in touch
Don't know the full cost as I did not add it all up but I would say about £12-14k minus the engines
Dave
I might be in touch
Don't know the full cost as I did not add it all up but I would say about £12-14k minus the engines
Dave
02-22-2013, 10:01 AM
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RE: You Guys Seen This?
Mark, did you spot your UATs in there in the video? They do a good job and are very strong, And have to be as there drawing fuel up from 4 feet below just by the vacume created inside them! Others would just collapse
Dave
Dave
