Three Axis Stabilizer
An old 75 yr old birdbrain here too, but you younger guy keep me thinking young My first heli was around 1957 and was just about impossible to fly. Had the 35 sized motor mounted on top of the rotor blades with the prop going one way and the torque from the motor driving the rotor blade the opposite way. Best advancement for helis was the gyro for the tail rotor. Just a little food for thought. Who has not had issues trying to keep a big expensive warbird lined up with the runway when you start applying throttle.?? This gyro on the rudder would take that worry away.
Flypaper... you had the money to buy a Dubro Whirlybird! Wow. I saw that on the cover of RCModeler, read how Don Dewey was "flying it" around on a piece of plywood with casters on it in a Sierra Madre parking lot .... fell for it hook, line, and sinker of course, like everything else back in the 60s and 70s. Look at the progress we've made since then.
My biggest fear is that the hobby is evolving into toys.... little foamies.... ARF and BNF only.... still fun, not complaining, but not your father's hobby as they say. I'm 70 now, still fly OK, but I see and feel any skills I had deteriorating. Pretty soon I'll be flying the little toys too.... all I will be able to manage. Still great though. Nothing beats R/C.
Hi Flycatch. The hobby might be evolving as you say, but it still beats the heck out of golf. Now that's a ridiculous game. First time I played, I shot an 81. Then they told me there were 9 more holes....
Flypaper... you had the money to buy a Dubro Whirlybird! Wow. I saw that on the cover of RCModeler, read how Don Dewey was ''flying it'' around on a piece of plywood with casters on it in a Sierra Madre parking lot .... fell for it hook, line, and sinker of course, like everything else back in the 60s and 70s. Look at the progress we've made since then.
My biggest fear is that the hobby is evolving into toys.... little foamies.... ARF and BNF only.... still fun, not complaining, but not your father's hobby as they say. I'm 70 now, still fly OK, but I see and feel any skills I had deteriorating. Pretty soon I'll be flying the little toys too.... all I will be able to manage. Still great though. Nothing beats R/C.
Baracuda, was looking for your review. Could you post a link please?
but it still beats the heck out of golf. Now that's a ridiculous game. First time I played, I shot an 81. Then they told me there were 9 more holes....
Golf ROCKS baby.....next to RC, it's the next best
The models I have using the AS3X systems are what the eye doctor ordered .
Why?
We fly RC by observing then correcting
having flown pattern/ IMAC/ Quicky - 40 pounders and 17 gram stuf - -the system remains the same - look correct as needed . Along come macular degeneration and the nice clear image out ther got all fuzzy
the result?
I can't see the minute corrections needed .
I have four models now using the 635 rx -
The instant difference is that I can have that little time difference needed to alter the flight path as desired.
Having thrown these models to friends who are good /very good/ world class aerobatic flyers etc., - I get varying feedback
One: concern that this technology will find it's way into competition models - don't blame em-
The solid feedback- the system works - extremely well and can be applied to any vibration free design.
Doesit make you a better flyer
It CAN help- properly applied
But like the guy who asked the doc if his new hand would make him into a great pianist - you know the joke.
Anyboy else have an eyesight problem- ?
The models I have using the AS3X systems are what the eye doctor ordered .
Why?
We fly RC by observing then correcting
having flown pattern/ IMAC/ Quicky - 40 pounders and 17 gram stuf - -the system remains the same - look correct as needed . Along come macular degeneration and the nice clear image out ther got all fuzzy
the result?
I can't see the minute corrections needed .
I have four models now using the 635 rx -
The instant difference is that I can have that little time difference needed to alter the flight path as desired.
Having thrown these models to friends who are good /very good/ world class aerobatic flyers etc., - I get varying feedback
One: concern that this technology will find it's way into competition models - don't blame em-
The solid feedback- the system works - extremely well and can be applied to any vibration free design.
Doesit make you a better flyer
It CAN help- properly applied
But like the guy who asked the doc if his new hand would make him into a great pianist - you know the joke.
They are fun to mess with, I reviewed the Eagle Tree for Fly RC
It would make my 3D Hobby Shop EBT knife edge or hover hands off, I dont recall it making anything difficult. It would also snap it upright straight and level simply by letting go of the sticks from any orientation I could get it into.
That being said, if it meant flying or not I would probably use them. Some of my friends don't agree with me, but I will probably find a good pilot to fly for me if I no longer can ! It will give me more time to admire the flybys !
I will probably always have a couple planes half built whether I can see to fly or not.
[/quote]
Larry,
I don't think you understand what they do. It is funny, because they do exactly the opposite of what you are inferring. They provide stability, not maneuverability. Just like the computer does on an F-16, which is inherently unstable - the computer provides stability - the pilot then performs the maneuvers.
Kurt
it uses accelerometers which provide a counterforce to any force (gusts?) trying to cause a change in last position assigned by YOU, to model attitude/position direction.
It does not fight you - it does not take over - - it just holds the line till YOU assign a change .
I have four models using the system - three wildly aerobatic capable and a fourth, pattern capable it is the best thing since sliced bread for the vision issiue I have .
just gives me that little assist inkeeping on line long enough for me to decide exactly th model position'attitude .
I still have Seniorita, Senior -Fun Cub - Bucker Jungmann (old TOC model) a big Dalotel etc.,-so I have experience flying many types (and many contests) and the AS3X simply makes the "reflexes -based on visual feedback much like I had before the eyesight went bonkers .
Before you judge this system- fly one
I've seen these stabilizing gyros in use at our field. They do what they are supposed to for straight level flight stability or for holding other attitudes when flipped to the 3D mode. Supposedly it will recover to normal level flight when flipped from 3D to 2D mode and this seems to work. The drawback I have notices happens when landing. It seems to hold attitude or even cause a pitch up as the model slows. To counteract this requires down elevator during the flair to land. Totally counter to what normally is required. It took my buddy a few landings to learn this and cost him some repairs. This may be obvious to others but it's probably best to turn stabilization off at some point prior to the flare for landing.
Larry,
I don't think you understand what they do. It is funny, because they do exactly the opposite of what you are inferring. They provide stability, not maneuverability. Just like the computer does on an F-16, which is inherently unstable - the computer provides stability - the pilot then performs the maneuvers.
Kurt
[/quote]
Kurt. Thank you for your kind response but respectfully I have to disagree with most of what you stated. I am a retired helicopter and airplane pilot. I actually understand quite a bit about stability systems. Please read post # 4 where Barracudahockey states from experience that the 3 axis system "would make my 3D Hobbyshop EBT knife edge or hover hands off. It would also snap it upright etc etc." "Hands off" means the pilot does not have to fly /manuver anything. Everything is being handeled by the flick of a "Switch". I am not trying to take anything away from the hobby or you as a respected member of the community. In fact I look forward to your comments. As for me , I get the most satisfaction out of hand flying my aircraft. Thank you for respecting my opinion. Larry
Larry,
I don't think you understand what they do. It is funny, because they do exactly the opposite of what you are inferring. They provide stability, not maneuverability. Just like the computer does on an F-16, which is inherently unstable - the computer provides stability - the pilot then performs the maneuvers.
Kurt
[/quote]
Hi Larry,
Then you will understand that there is no closed loop flight control system with these little 3-axis circuit boards - only accelerometers.
Kurt
I
I've seen these stabilizing gyros in use at our field. They do what they are supposed to for straight level flight stability or for holding other attitudes when flipped to the 3D mode. Supposedly it will recover to normal level flight when flipped from 3D to 2D mode and this seems to work. The drawback I have notices happens when landing. It seems to hold attitude or even cause a pitch up as the model slows. To counteract this requires down elevator during the flair to land. Totally counter to what normally is required. It took my buddy a few landings to learn this and cost him some repairs. This may be obvious to others but it's probably best to turn stabilization off at some point prior to the flare for landing.
It has two rates of throw/compensation/correction
the 3D is the high throw high gain (compensation
the second rate (selected using the retract switch) has very low elevator throw and slightly lessened aileron throw with correspondingly lower gain.
That's it. You can switch between the two as desired whilst flying
It NEVER does a recovery to level flight from some other attitude..
It does try to hold the model in last attitude YOU select - so a landing simply remains level unless you move the attitude deliberately. As I noted - I have four of em - they all work the same way- all make all maneuvers including landings nicer.
My tiny 12 ounce Zoom is now a breeze to land in grass - No sudden stall
rmh - I think we are responding in parallel!
Kurt
1. I doubt the review is online, it was done for Fly RC magazine and appeared about 2 issues ago (if you're really determined to track it down I can see if I can find the exact issue), there's also a non-technical version thats going to be in the soon to be released "beginners issue". I also did an article on the FMA Co Pilot II for the same two issues.
2. Other than flybarless helis that actually do need them, I had never messed with an auto pilot or 3 axis stab in a fixed wing before. As a reviewer I kept an open mind and honestly wrote about what I thought. It was neat to mess with, they will help a lot of people, but neither are something I would go and buy.
3. I'm more than capable of flying knife edge or hovering without one
The CPII was cool in that it had a baro metric altimiter function that you could set to auto recover at 50 feet. Do any aerobatics or 3D you wanted above that, at 50 feet it did an auto recovery (airplane or heli), so if you wanted to learn 3D on a heli but were scared to crash, this is a good training tool.
Bottom line, this is a hobby, do what you enjoy. I like to fly, I dont like to build sticks, so I buy ARF's. I'm certainly capable of it, I have an old 80's glider kit that I'm slowly and meticulously building. In the big scheme of things, as long as you're having fun thats what it's all about, if you have fun tinkering with electronics you'll love these things.
My own experiences with the 635 are based on my experience in aerobatic design and learning how to do th various tricks reqd- this also includess tiny one ounce aerobats - learning how each type responds to attempts to hover-tumble- slide - whatever- made my experiences with the AS3x setup very interesting -to me
In a nutshell-it simply attempts to hold any postion till deliberate stick commands override the accelerometer feedbacks.
Done right - the result is seamless - no surprises just a smoothness impossible to duplicate unless you can see and correct in milliseconds.
Hint for the hard core 3Dflyer - setup the model such that it is very neutral( tailheavy by some standards)
The system keeps the model flying smoothly yet allows for instant reversals etc..in any direction- great fun!
You really need the best servos and full throw / high gain to maximize the fast AS3X response
Just as good heli setups require - sloppy stuf won't work It does NOT fly the model