abufletcher

Are there any issues with how to store dope? The original can should be fine, if the top's on tightly. But what about thinning dope? I'd like to mix up a ready to use 1:1 batch large enough for the whole model.

If I don't use the original can, do I need to use a glass jar? Are plastic containers a no-no?

TFF

No plastic, no rubber. Mason jars today have some rubber seal that will melt. Plastic coke bottles are pretty tough but not worth the trouble if something happened. Empty metal paint cans are available at hardware stores and paint stores. Glass if the lid has some paper type seal, like a dope jar. Mixing does not matter; keeping air out does. I turn the cans and bottles upside down if I know the seal is good. As weird as it sounds, the fumes trying to escape cant go through the bottom, but can creep through the seal. If you look at a can of Plastic Wood filler, the can's label is printed upside down so you will shelf it bottom up.

semeraro

I have used empty jars before. I also mix up some 50-50 dope thinner. Eventually the thinner evaporates when you store it in a jar and you have to add more. It works fine if you mix small batches and use it before the thinner has a chance to evaporate. The evaporation rate depends on the type of jar. I find salsa jars work ok as well as olive jars. Some sauce jars work well too. I keep bulk dope in the original gallon cans.

yankee samurai

My Feedback: (175)

Quart cans with lids can be purchased at Home Depot!!

abufletcher

Assuming I use one of the metal paint cans from the hardware store, how long before a 50/50 mix of dope/thinner would need more thinner added? My concern is the thinner. I only have about half a quart of nitrate thinner and that has to do for the whole job. I'm ok on the nitrate dope itself. I think this is probably enough thinner if I'm careful. But getting more would be a real hassle.

TFF

I dont leave the top off when painting. It wants to evaporate fast, so given the chance it will thicken. pour a couple of oz in a jar and work from that; keeping the main closed except to service. Close the small when not in use. Dope and thinner sounds like the most important thing you should bring back every trip to the US. I always put some thinner in the main to counter the loss while it has been open if working a bunch.

abufletcher

Problem is, both dope and thinner fall under the banned dangerous substances for flying.

ARUP

Bummer! Any airport service centers there you can 'hit up' for more?

abufletcher

Japanese modelers do occasionally still use dope, so there must still be dope thinners available. Although I have no idea of there's such a think as nitrate vs. butyrate dope in Japan. Matz has said that the WWI German dopes didn't make the distinction. There was only one kind of dope.

TFF

Butyrate is a 30's invention; not as flammable. Problem is it only sticks to Nitrate, so always first coats are nitrate. No WW1 plane had it but they would have loved it; more time to get a burning plane on the ground. Stits will not sustain fire so it will put its self out; a major reason it is more popular today. Ideal as expensive as it would be, get Aircraft Spruce send a Gallon of nitrate dope, butyrate dope and 2 gallons of thinner. At least a shipping quote. Nitrate can be thinned with acetone, nitrate thinner, or butyrate thinner. I alway buy the butyrate. If you like this covering method you will have 5 planes worth. Butyrate is fuel proof.

abufletcher

I'm not sure Aircraft Spruce can ship dopes and thinners overseas. It's not a cost issue. It's a hazmat issue. In the past, I've been able to "smuggle" small quantities in my checked luggage, usually with a bunch of other modeling supplies in case anyone is curious. On this last trip I thought I had more thinner so didn't need more.

LesUyeda

"If you look at a can of Plastic Wood filler, the can's label is printed upside down so you will shelf it bottom up. "

That is so that the air left in the can will form a "crust" in the bottom, and you will not have to force your way through it when you try to use it.

Les

TFF

They can ship them and Japan has a ACS dealer so there is a path. Just not cheap, but take the bite in the rear once and be set for a long time. Strutter, DH1, Dr1, Eindecker; dang, you need to order more dope just thinking about it. I have done the" its just a big bottle of toothpaste thing"; although at work the TSA let me check 2 gallons of MEK once; they put it on the belt while a co-worker and my self were telling them it probably cant go, just not carry on, but it is tighter in the last year or so. Still might not be economical. Quart with the shipping locks seem to be more shippable hazmat wise for the average.

flyalot

My Feedback: (63)

Try the thinner used for automotive paints. Should be able to get a small amount in Japan to try.
It has been a long time since I have painted a model with Randolph dopes, I always used automotive
lacquer thinner with excellent results.
Joe

fred985

stits covering melts in a fire. butyrate dope sticks to linen, cotten and stits covering. having covered several full scale cubs and stearmans we never used nitrates at all. one coat of butryate and then the coats of silver then the color. there is no need to thin dope. use it right out of the can. dope is self leveling and drys very fast. i use ceconite on all my planes and never use any nitrate. the dope sticks the covering to the frame and also to itself. i have about 10 5 gal cans of different colors along with a few of clear. i mix my own silver from silver powder with the clear. if you crash a lot i guess you can skip the silver. the plane will be re=kitted before the sun does a job on the covering,,hehe . the ww l planes were covered with irish linen or cotton. years ago i talked to some real old timers that were there and they told me that they dont know why they even used the silver because the planes were usually gone in a matter of a few weeks in combat.

abufletcher

To the best of my knowledge only a very small number of the WWI aircraft used silver dope, for example, the Pfalz DIII. It became more common during the 20s and 30s.

TFF

The Ceconite STC says nitrate first. Natural fibers will accept butyrate, but not really doable now as you cant get cotton or linen. Nitrate still sticks things better. You can mix chocolate cookies in nitrate, butyrate is picky. Doing my plane in Stits which is just a fancy dope made from orange vinyl seat covers from the 70's.

abufletcher

???

YellowBlueBird

Fred985
with such large amounts you must be using Randolph's. Do you mix anything with the dope such as plastazier or retarder. I have all ways used sig but have just purchased gals of clear from Spruce Aircraft. and one quart of white. The white is a lot thinner than I had expected. I plan to brush it on. any tips

Jerry

TFF

Nitrate will accept "trash" in and does not react to it. I drained off the thinner from Humbrol paint and used the pigment mixed into clear nitrate. Worked like it was designed that way. It will bond to just about anything which is why it glues things down well. You can make other things do the same, but not as well as the nitrate.