Classic 40/45 power choice?
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Classic 40/45 power choice?
What is one the availability of good 40/45 size engines especially in rear exhaust? Should 4 stroke be considered or electric conversion? I think we need to consider different opinions on the forum about this issue. There seems to be interest in a project for a classic 40/45-size plane so a discussion about power would be helpful for me.
Thanks
Tim
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RE: Classic 40/45 power choice?
Jim's comment about the RE Rossi is spot on. They're next to impossible to find. I started a thread recently (on RCU I believe) to discuss this engine as I happened to be lucky enough to find one. I suspect it will be perfect, given the header I have for it, for a Citation 45.
On the other hand, I have had plenty of success sourcing YS 45's both in side and rear exhaust configurations. A simple wanted ad should produce one or two within a short time and the YS 45 is perhaps the most powerful RE 45 still around.
Another pair of options for RE configurations are: 1) at the high end, a Jett 60 could be used as this engine is specifically built into a 45 size case. It is also designed to turn smaller props (10") at high rpm and I suspect it would be another ideal light candidate for the Citation. 2) At the other end of the spektrum, in terms of cost and performance, is the MVVS 40 which is indeed a very good engine by all reports but it is a 40 and is likely not in the same power league as the YS, OS or Rossi. The nice thing about the MVVS is that it can be setup as SE or RE before its first run. Once the configuration is chosen, it should not be changed.
I mentioned OS above and certainly the OS 40 and 46 VF (-P) are other well known options that were commonly used by the Japanese in their designs. These are harder to source than the YS (in my experience) but not impossible. I have been able to locate a 40 VF-P and I believe the engine can probably be turned into a 46 by transferring the guts (crankshaft, piston and sleeve) of a 46 SF into the 40 VF crankcase. This is really just a theory but I believe it might be possible. The ramification of course is that parts for your VF can be easily had by sourcing SF engines. On the downside, the 46 SF seems to be the rarest of the great SF line with the 61's, 40's, and 25's being more readily available in that order (from high to low).
There may be other options out there that I'm not aware of and would be interesting to hear about. OPS and Picco made a RE 46 (now very rare) but from what I know Webra never did.
David
On the other hand, I have had plenty of success sourcing YS 45's both in side and rear exhaust configurations. A simple wanted ad should produce one or two within a short time and the YS 45 is perhaps the most powerful RE 45 still around.
Another pair of options for RE configurations are: 1) at the high end, a Jett 60 could be used as this engine is specifically built into a 45 size case. It is also designed to turn smaller props (10") at high rpm and I suspect it would be another ideal light candidate for the Citation. 2) At the other end of the spektrum, in terms of cost and performance, is the MVVS 40 which is indeed a very good engine by all reports but it is a 40 and is likely not in the same power league as the YS, OS or Rossi. The nice thing about the MVVS is that it can be setup as SE or RE before its first run. Once the configuration is chosen, it should not be changed.
I mentioned OS above and certainly the OS 40 and 46 VF (-P) are other well known options that were commonly used by the Japanese in their designs. These are harder to source than the YS (in my experience) but not impossible. I have been able to locate a 40 VF-P and I believe the engine can probably be turned into a 46 by transferring the guts (crankshaft, piston and sleeve) of a 46 SF into the 40 VF crankcase. This is really just a theory but I believe it might be possible. The ramification of course is that parts for your VF can be easily had by sourcing SF engines. On the downside, the 46 SF seems to be the rarest of the great SF line with the 61's, 40's, and 25's being more readily available in that order (from high to low).
There may be other options out there that I'm not aware of and would be interesting to hear about. OPS and Picco made a RE 46 (now very rare) but from what I know Webra never did.
David
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RE: Classic 40/45 power choice?
VF40's and 46's can be found from C/L Stunt guys, too. They were popular pipe engines. Stunthangar.com and Stukastuntforums have classifieds for want ads as well. I had 3 VF 46's but sold them off, sorry.
Chris...
Chris...
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RE: Classic 40/45 power choice?
Jim,
That is undoubtedly true. They do however have plenty for sale as well as parts. They also come up about twice a month on the auction site. They go for about $75.
I'm looking forward to running mine in RE configuration along with the Rossi RE to see how they both fare. I plan to use the MVVS tuned can exhaust as well as standard pipes.
David
That is undoubtedly true. They do however have plenty for sale as well as parts. They also come up about twice a month on the auction site. They go for about $75.
I'm looking forward to running mine in RE configuration along with the Rossi RE to see how they both fare. I plan to use the MVVS tuned can exhaust as well as standard pipes.
David
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RE: Classic 40/45 power choice?
I currently own 2 of the rossi 45 re engine nib and one of the vf 45 Nib as well, the os engines are more common, but a 7.5 K&b or a Picco RE or side exhaust are good candidates as well. the sleeper engine is the Irvine Re 40
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RE: Classic 40/45 power choice?
OS FS 62v will this engine work in Citation 45 or other classic design? Weight appears to be about 2 ounces heavier than 2 stroke will turn 11 x 8 nicely.
Tim
Tim
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RE: Classic 40/45 power choice?
Does the OPS 40 spa rca or OPS Monza Sport 40 count in this regard?
Both a little below the "modern" 46 milestone but nevertheless both cracking engines in their own right.
DF
Both a little below the "modern" 46 milestone but nevertheless both cracking engines in their own right.
DF
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RE: Classic 40/45 power choice?
ORIGINAL: tgwhitley
What is one the availability of good 40/45 size engines especially in rear exhaust? Should 4 stroke be considered or electric conversion? I think we need to consider different opinions on the forum about this issue. There seems to be interest in a project for a classic 40/45-size plane so a discussion about power would be helpful for me.
Thanks
Tim
To be honest with you, the YS .45 two-stroke and the .63 to .70 four-strokes would be my choices. Especially the four-strokes. The four-strokes by YS are unmatchable by any two-stroke in the .40 to .52 displacement range. I'm not referring to just horsepower, but tractability also.
Ed Cregger
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RE: Classic 40/45 power choice?
ORIGINAL: NM2K
To be honest with you, the YS .45 two-stroke and the .63 to .70 four-strokes would be my choices. Especially the four-strokes. The four-strokes by YS are unmatchable by any two-stroke in the .40 to .52 displacement range. I'm not referring to just horsepower, but tractability also.
Ed Cregger
To be honest with you, the YS .45 two-stroke and the .63 to .70 four-strokes would be my choices. Especially the four-strokes. The four-strokes by YS are unmatchable by any two-stroke in the .40 to .52 displacement range. I'm not referring to just horsepower, but tractability also.
Ed Cregger
Chuck
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RE: Classic 40/45 power choice?
In the midst of other RE Italian engine discussion, we forgot to mention the venerable SuperTigre X40 and X45 FIRE. These are the front intake version of the famous F1 X40 RIRE engines.
They are somewhat hard to find but not impossible. I have been able to source one of each over the last year. The Macs headers I picked unfortunately don't fit properly as the engine exhaust and header mount flange is very narrow and the screws interfere with the header pipe. A little work on the header should sort it out though.
David
They are somewhat hard to find but not impossible. I have been able to source one of each over the last year. The Macs headers I picked unfortunately don't fit properly as the engine exhaust and header mount flange is very narrow and the screws interfere with the header pipe. A little work on the header should sort it out though.
David
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RE: Classic 40/45 power choice?
ORIGINAL: dphill2
You guy's need to look at the FIRE 46 from Nova Rossi !! I'm sure that would make a real good small Pattern mota..
Dave.
You guy's need to look at the FIRE 46 from Nova Rossi !! I'm sure that would make a real good small Pattern mota..
Dave.
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RE: Classic 40/45 power choice?
ORIGINAL: dphill2
You guy's need to look at the FIRE 46 from Nova Rossi !! I'm sure that would make a real good small Pattern mota..
Dave.
You guy's need to look at the FIRE 46 from Nova Rossi !! I'm sure that would make a real good small Pattern mota..
Dave.
Yes. The NR was the first engine search I did as I wasn't familiar with their 40 class engines. From what I've been able learn though they are not producing any RE engines in this displacement. The new CR series are SE remote needle valve engines and according to some timed for 3D performance. They're making a 46 and a 57.
A smaller 46 size version of the Speed 61 FIRE would be equally unique! Any chance one might be produced?
Or maybe we're missing something?
David
Edit: Hmm... yes, we are! See below
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RE: Classic 40/45 power choice?
Looks like NR already has!
Here's their marine 46. An air cooling head, a drive washer and some timing tweaking for pattern applications and presto fatto! Nice mota indeed!
Dave, what do you think? Any chance the idea might be brought up with NR now that they've put stock into their pattern 61's?
I take it the same headers and pipes used on the 61 would serve here too. Maybe the shorty pipe would also work well on the 46?
Here's a link:
http://www.novarossi.it/2012/index.p...c/to-be46.html
David
No image upload at present. RCU needs to get the skids under the new IT team...
Here's their marine 46. An air cooling head, a drive washer and some timing tweaking for pattern applications and presto fatto! Nice mota indeed!
Dave, what do you think? Any chance the idea might be brought up with NR now that they've put stock into their pattern 61's?
I take it the same headers and pipes used on the 61 would serve here too. Maybe the shorty pipe would also work well on the 46?
Here's a link:
http://www.novarossi.it/2012/index.p...c/to-be46.html
David
No image upload at present. RCU needs to get the skids under the new IT team...
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RE: Classic 40/45 power choice?
ORIGINAL: NM2K
To be honest with you, the YS .45 two-stroke and the .63 to .70 four-strokes would be my choices. Especially the four-strokes. The four-strokes by YS are unmatchable by any two-stroke in the .40 to .52 displacement range. I'm not referring to just horsepower, but tractability also.
Ed Cregger
To be honest with you, the YS .45 two-stroke and the .63 to .70 four-strokes would be my choices. Especially the four-strokes. The four-strokes by YS are unmatchable by any two-stroke in the .40 to .52 displacement range. I'm not referring to just horsepower, but tractability also.
Ed Cregger
I wonder how these Nova/Rossi engines are in that regard??
Have Fun...
Chuck
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RE: Classic 40/45 power choice?
Guy's
This is a shot of the 46 FIRE from Nova Rossi !! Looks just like the Speed 61 so I guess you could call it the Lil Brother. Anyway We are going to put this Engine in a 40 size Pattern plane and see just what it has to offer as a pattern motor. If it's anything like the 61 it will be a new player in the 40 to 46 motor line..
This is a shot of the 46 FIRE from Nova Rossi !! Looks just like the Speed 61 so I guess you could call it the Lil Brother. Anyway We are going to put this Engine in a 40 size Pattern plane and see just what it has to offer as a pattern motor. If it's anything like the 61 it will be a new player in the 40 to 46 motor line..
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RE: Classic 40/45 power choice?
Hey Chris,
If it runs like the Big Brother R61 Speed, it will be something on a 40 size planes !! This is my test airplane that I've been playing around with Pipes and Props with the 61 !! all I can say is WOW what a motor !!
Dave...
If it runs like the Big Brother R61 Speed, it will be something on a 40 size planes !! This is my test airplane that I've been playing around with Pipes and Props with the 61 !! all I can say is WOW what a motor !!
Dave...