GAS Saito
#1328
RE: GAS Saito
ORIGINAL: orthobird
AND, one last question...
AND, one last question...
can this engine be installed inverted?
Regarding hamming I would suspect you left carb dry for a long time and membrane there become a bit less flexible.
Try to fill carb and leave it for a week then try again. If not resolved you may need carb kit replacement.
Regarding down side installation I have only one problem when priming engine and over filling combastion chamber with fuel.
On my stend I have tried FG-36 in any position and it is performing well in all of them.
#1329
My Feedback: (1)
RE: GAS Saito
Update, today was the maiden of my brand new extreme flight extra 300 78" with a gas saito FG 36. The airplane and airframe is awesome. Had issues with prop, therefore, each flight was like 3 to 5 minutes long while i tested out 3 different props, and i did not like any of the props and their performance.
The 20 x 8 mejzlik = 7000 rpm, slow flight
zinger 20 x 6 = 7600 rpm, even slower, lots of thrust, just not good enough, in my opinion for aerobatics, funny flight characteristics
master airscrew 18 x 12 nylon prop = 6700 rpm, this was best by far, much quicker, but engine was under lots of load on uplines, the engine began to die down, so i immediately cut power down and landed her, but much more quicker on level flight, i liked the airspeed with this prop, but not much thrust.
i have ordered 18 x 8 props, with this, i believe i should get 8000 rpm, and it will be a compromise of speed and thrust.
but the airframe is awesome, she would float in for landing, very agile, and perfectly balanced. did not get to do much, due to prop issues, and i wonder if this engine may not be enough for this airframe. we will see once i get the 18 x 8 props.
The airplane weighs 13.5 pounds, and i cannot see why this engine does not throw it around like a raggedy ann doll. this engine used to be in a super decathlon that weighed 20 pounds. So it will be interesting to see what happens when i get the 18 x 8 prop.
The 20 x 8 mejzlik = 7000 rpm, slow flight
zinger 20 x 6 = 7600 rpm, even slower, lots of thrust, just not good enough, in my opinion for aerobatics, funny flight characteristics
master airscrew 18 x 12 nylon prop = 6700 rpm, this was best by far, much quicker, but engine was under lots of load on uplines, the engine began to die down, so i immediately cut power down and landed her, but much more quicker on level flight, i liked the airspeed with this prop, but not much thrust.
i have ordered 18 x 8 props, with this, i believe i should get 8000 rpm, and it will be a compromise of speed and thrust.
but the airframe is awesome, she would float in for landing, very agile, and perfectly balanced. did not get to do much, due to prop issues, and i wonder if this engine may not be enough for this airframe. we will see once i get the 18 x 8 props.
The airplane weighs 13.5 pounds, and i cannot see why this engine does not throw it around like a raggedy ann doll. this engine used to be in a super decathlon that weighed 20 pounds. So it will be interesting to see what happens when i get the 18 x 8 prop.
also, with the cowl off, the 18 x 12 got 7000 rpm, once the cowl went on, the rpm dropped to 6650 rpm. so i wonder if this has something to do with the loss of power?
also, the cylinder is sticking out the bottom of the cowl, and the cowl has two large air inlets, to the left and right of the prop hub, so i wonder if there is too much air getting in, and causing turbulent airflow, maybe i should cover these up?
i will post a picture soon.
#1331
RE: GAS Saito
I have tested fg36 with different props for static thrust when engine installed on my 27% RV-8.
On the ground the best prop for static thrust I found is 18x8W, which is something like 19x8.5.
I have measured thrust with fish scale and read out 6.5-6.8kg. Electronic scale is sensitive to rope shrinking and expansion, thus I recorded 2 numbers: smallest and biggest.
My RV is 6.5kg W/O fuel and smoke oil, thus FG36 will not do any good verticals, but decent for mid-sport flying.
This engine is too heavy for aerobatic planes.
I recently got OS GF40 and this one is 300gr lighter and 10%-12% more powerful.
This will be good for your plane if you like4-stroke, but for aerobatic planes it is better to use 2-stroke. They are significantly lighter with equal thrust.
Try 18x8W on Saito FG-36. It is my choice for this engine.
Andrei K.
On the ground the best prop for static thrust I found is 18x8W, which is something like 19x8.5.
I have measured thrust with fish scale and read out 6.5-6.8kg. Electronic scale is sensitive to rope shrinking and expansion, thus I recorded 2 numbers: smallest and biggest.
My RV is 6.5kg W/O fuel and smoke oil, thus FG36 will not do any good verticals, but decent for mid-sport flying.
This engine is too heavy for aerobatic planes.
I recently got OS GF40 and this one is 300gr lighter and 10%-12% more powerful.
This will be good for your plane if you like4-stroke, but for aerobatic planes it is better to use 2-stroke. They are significantly lighter with equal thrust.
Try 18x8W on Saito FG-36. It is my choice for this engine.
Andrei K.
#1333
Join Date: Dec 2005
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RE: GAS Saito
THis is the 40cc FG and looks like it goes very well on the EF extra...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tvOH0...q-COsGVDOrK6Vx
500rpm drop is significant...
That is about what 4cc extra would give you! LOL.... Except you are Losing cc's!
The engine runs great, except the cowl deal????
I wouldn't change the carb or ignition if it is running well...
Run the plane w/O the cowl !...
I would try running the saito fg36 w/o a muffler and see if you have any gain...
Run High Octane Gas and make sure you have plenty of cooling....
15lbs of thrust in a 13.5 lb plane isn't earth shattering, but it would be enough for some 3d....
In the video below, He said it was 11.5lbs but I am guessing it is 13lbs...
I believe others have ran the EF 78" extra with a 26cc engine and had good results...
Like QQ said about his 26cc and 73inch yak
"It will not climb out like a glow , but it will climb out a few clicks out under full power. It's not bad"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bV3qHPU4aaU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tvOH0...q-COsGVDOrK6Vx
500rpm drop is significant...
That is about what 4cc extra would give you! LOL.... Except you are Losing cc's!
The engine runs great, except the cowl deal????
I wouldn't change the carb or ignition if it is running well...
Run the plane w/O the cowl !...
I would try running the saito fg36 w/o a muffler and see if you have any gain...
Run High Octane Gas and make sure you have plenty of cooling....
15lbs of thrust in a 13.5 lb plane isn't earth shattering, but it would be enough for some 3d....
In the video below, He said it was 11.5lbs but I am guessing it is 13lbs...
I believe others have ran the EF 78" extra with a 26cc engine and had good results...
Like QQ said about his 26cc and 73inch yak
"It will not climb out like a glow , but it will climb out a few clicks out under full power. It's not bad"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bV3qHPU4aaU
#1334
My Feedback: (1)
RE: GAS Saito
wow, saw that saito 40 on you tube, on my plane!! mine cannot do that!!
did some tests today:
brand new gas tank, brand new lines, no air in bubbles:
cowl on cowl off
17 x 12 7440 7230
18 x 12 6720 6600
20 x 6 7020 7100
premium gas
red line oil 20 to 1
and, the motor hesitates, burps, powers down, etc.. does not turn off, but sounds like it is about to.
just don't know if this is going to be good for me.
mr yaguti had a 20 x 8 falcon prop on his saito 40
#1336
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RE: GAS Saito
w8ye
Do you know what is the dif. between the 57cc Twin's carb and the fg36 carb??
Also, is the FG40 carb changed from the FG36 carb?
Do your FG36's burp when inverted???
Thank you.
Do you know what is the dif. between the 57cc Twin's carb and the fg36 carb??
Also, is the FG40 carb changed from the FG36 carb?
Do your FG36's burp when inverted???
Thank you.
#1339
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Bird....
What did you find out? I think the OS 40 4stroke gas would do better in this plane... as it can use less oil in fuel and more cc's...
How much running do you have on the fg36? just curious.... I am going to use my Fg36 but in a sport plane or scale plane...not for 3d stuff....
Still may pick up the os 40fg... as it is a good deal right now... 120$ off and 50$ rebate... cheapest it will be...
What did you find out? I think the OS 40 4stroke gas would do better in this plane... as it can use less oil in fuel and more cc's...
How much running do you have on the fg36? just curious.... I am going to use my Fg36 but in a sport plane or scale plane...not for 3d stuff....
Still may pick up the os 40fg... as it is a good deal right now... 120$ off and 50$ rebate... cheapest it will be...
#1340
Need suggestions.
I have an FG56T. It has been running just fine as late as last weekend. This weekend however, though it started just fine it is only running on one cylinder. Looking from the back of the plane the right cylinder is the only one firing. Things I have tried.
I changed the spark plug. Though wet with fuel the one I pulled out was not fouled.
I checked the valves. They are set as per spec.
I changed the fuel.
I tried retuning the carb.
any ideal what next to try?
I have an FG56T. It has been running just fine as late as last weekend. This weekend however, though it started just fine it is only running on one cylinder. Looking from the back of the plane the right cylinder is the only one firing. Things I have tried.
I changed the spark plug. Though wet with fuel the one I pulled out was not fouled.
I checked the valves. They are set as per spec.
I changed the fuel.
I tried retuning the carb.
any ideal what next to try?
#1341
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Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Eastlake, OH
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Need suggestions.
I have an FG56T. It has been running just fine as late as last weekend. This weekend however, though it started just fine it is only running on one cylinder. Looking from the back of the plane the right cylinder is the only one firing. Things I have tried.
I changed the spark plug. Though wet with fuel the one I pulled out was not fouled.
I checked the valves. They are set as per spec.
I changed the fuel.
I tried retuning the carb.
any ideal what next to try?
I have an FG56T. It has been running just fine as late as last weekend. This weekend however, though it started just fine it is only running on one cylinder. Looking from the back of the plane the right cylinder is the only one firing. Things I have tried.
I changed the spark plug. Though wet with fuel the one I pulled out was not fouled.
I checked the valves. They are set as per spec.
I changed the fuel.
I tried retuning the carb.
any ideal what next to try?
Good luck
Fred
AMA L815
#1342
Thankyou Mustand314, I did as you suggested. I have a good ground between the shielding and the engine. When I swapped the leads at 1st it ran with both cylinders then the same one as before stared missing, then it stopped firing all together, now it runs on one cylinder but every now and then the not running one will fire for a short burst then stop firing again. At ideal it seems to be firing for that cylinder will heat up but not near as hot as the one that is firing.
I am thinking that the ignition modual is not producing enough spark to fire both cylinders at full throttle and just a weak spark for the left cylinder at ideal.
Do you have any other suggestions or thoughts?
I am thinking that the ignition modual is not producing enough spark to fire both cylinders at full throttle and just a weak spark for the left cylinder at ideal.
Do you have any other suggestions or thoughts?
#1344
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Thankyou Mustand314, I did as you suggested. I have a good ground between the shielding and the engine. When I swapped the leads at 1st it ran with both cylinders then the same one as before stared missing, then it stopped firing all together, now it runs on one cylinder but every now and then the not running one will fire for a short burst then stop firing again. At ideal it seems to be firing for that cylinder will heat up but not near as hot as the one that is firing.
I am thinking that the ignition modual is not producing enough spark to fire both cylinders at full throttle and just a weak spark for the left cylinder at ideal.
Do you have any other suggestions or thoughts?
I am thinking that the ignition modual is not producing enough spark to fire both cylinders at full throttle and just a weak spark for the left cylinder at ideal.
Do you have any other suggestions or thoughts?
After determining that both my leads were making ground, I still had a problem with one plug lead. After digging around in my miscellaneous junk box, I found some spring inserts for the plug covers. Installing them solved the problem. They really lock the ignition leads to the plug securely. Before installing the springs, one lead was not making a secure connection to the plug and could be wiggled easily though not unlock or vibrate off. I think that the looseness creating an intermittent ground resulting in a miss in that cylinder.
Unfortunately, I cannot remember where I purchased them. I think it was from a retailer that handled RCEXL products however, I have not been able to find them by Googling.
PM, if you wish, your email address and I can send you photos of the springs
Fred
#1345
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Saito FG-30 power question
I just got my first gas plane, a used 82-inch Bee Gee with a DLE 30 on it. I'm going to start with the existing setup, but would like to change to a 4-stroke engine in the near future.
How does the power of the Saito FG-30 compare to the DLE 30? I saw a spec saying the DLE 30 was 3.7 hp at 8500 rpm (don't know what prop). On the Bee Gee, the engine does 7100 rpm with a 20x6 static. (And this didn't vary much from 3/4 to full throttle).
I'm not a high speed flyer, but want enough power for the basic aerobatics. An FG-30 would fit in without having to relocate anything. An FG-40 is more $$ and would require moving the batteries,ignition, etc.
How does the power of the Saito FG-30 compare to the DLE 30? I saw a spec saying the DLE 30 was 3.7 hp at 8500 rpm (don't know what prop). On the Bee Gee, the engine does 7100 rpm with a 20x6 static. (And this didn't vary much from 3/4 to full throttle).
I'm not a high speed flyer, but want enough power for the basic aerobatics. An FG-30 would fit in without having to relocate anything. An FG-40 is more $$ and would require moving the batteries,ignition, etc.
#1346
My Feedback: (7)
I just had a Carl Goldberg Sukhoi ARF given to me NIB and was thinking of a Saito four stroke gasser. My original Sukhoi kit had a Saito 180 glow decades ago. Flew very well and we started with a 120, then 150 and finally 180. Well, I've moved on to 40% gassers and can't remember much more about it except a big one piece wing, crappy gear mount and no access to the insides while wing was on. Debating between the FG40 and an FG30. I have bigger planes to knock around everywhere. Just want a nice nostalgic plane to remind of my early IMAC days. Which motor would you go with? There's 12 oz difference and about 3" prop clearance difference around that big round cowl. I do have a Top Flite GS ARF P-47 with the Saito 60 radial that I love so using a different fuel mixture isn't a problem. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Last edited by patrnflyr; 11-24-2016 at 02:06 PM.
#1347
40cc 4-stroke gas engine is equal in power-thrust to 33cc 2-stroke engine.
Keeping this 1.21 ratio in mind you can see that 30cc 4-stroke gas engine is equal to 24cc 2-stroke gas engine.
If you have to select between 30cc and 40cc SAITO gas engines go for 40cc one.
It has better weight to power ratio.
Keeping this 1.21 ratio in mind you can see that 30cc 4-stroke gas engine is equal to 24cc 2-stroke gas engine.
If you have to select between 30cc and 40cc SAITO gas engines go for 40cc one.
It has better weight to power ratio.
#1350
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Have u tried hobbyheadquaters ? There the Aus importers of Saito . If its to replace the carbs on the FG20 ( at one stage I think ) they were replacing them for free so if thats the case u could explore that further . HHQ wont sell directly to u but at least u can establish whether there in Aus. and then u will have to order through a hobbyshop and I think HHQ now have a online shop so that may work or horizon in the USA but I presume u have tried there ! Cheers