Andy P.

Wings and stabs all done and here's a few more pics from today. F1 templated, formed and carbon laminated, now installed. The motor is fitted along with ESC, just finishing up the RX/Flightpack mounting tray. The digiswitch is fitted.

Should have the rudder servo fitted and connected along with the drive battery tray over the next couple of days, job done!

Andy P.

A couple more pics.

Andy P.

A few more pics from today, only really got the rx tray laminated and installed as Ive had some family stuff to do. Done a little prop testing on the Turnigy motor which incidentally runs super smooth and quiet. Ive gotta admit to being really sceptical about cheap motors until now but Ive gotta say that so far Im sold!

Getting 1116W and 35A on a Xoar 18x10 woodie, I knew this prop would be way undersized for the motor but wanted to just get the numbers for curiosity. Then tested the Turnigy 21x12 woodie and got 1675W and 58A, much nearer to where I want to be as the motor ia rated at 60A max. Ive got an APC 20x15 on its way to try yet so the jury is out still.

Andy P.

Pics

Andy P.

More

Andy P.

Well, I got the 120 all done and maidened it today. The verdict is 'pretty much like it's big brother' , smooth, predictable, accurate. I made up a sliding battery tray using some carbon tube I had laying around in my workshop, it took 6 hours to design and make up/install, with probably 70% of that in design and decision making. In use today as I was getting the cg spot on it was immediately apparent that it was time very well spent and made the whole excercise so much easier. I didn't get the chance to physically check the cg position during my visit to our flying site, but will get the measurement and post it up here for future reference.

The turnigy setup Im running is throwing up 1572W @ 59A using the APC 20x15, its bags of power and left 49% capacity in the 5k 20c 8s packs after a P13 today. Im totally sold on this one, which incidentally is for my son whos making a comeback to F3a after a few years off the sticks, lucky boy eh.......

A pic of the battery tray, any q's just ask.

Dave Harmon

Hi Andy....pretty nice!

Who makes those carbon servo arms?
I would like to get some for my Nuance.
Also...that sliding battery tray is slick as well...got me thinking now!

Dave

Andy P.

Hi Dave,

Thanks for the kind words, here's a link to the servo arms you asked about:

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...FTMRtAodjzMABg

The sliding tray was made up from the ply tray as supplied in the kit which I laminated with some 0.1mm carbon sheet that I get from one of our UK team members and the other components are 10mm carbon tube, 4mm carbon rod. I made the blue nylon collets from some spacer discs I had laying around, their from a plumbing supplies store. I just put a 2.5mm clearance hole in one side and tapped it for a 3mm grub screw, the process is easy once the idea was hatched.......

Andy.

Edit: Forgot to say, the 120 kit only comes with the IC mounting plate for a YS etc, there is no F1 for outrunners. Ive templated my F1 and forwarded it to Chris at www.bondaero.co.uk , if you would like an e-copy of that former just shoot Chris a mail and he will get a copy of the file over to you.

john agnew

Andy

Thanks for this thread and the useful information it contains. I am about to buy one of these and have a few questions on motors, batteries etc. Firstly I will not fly compettition, but I like to fly pattern models, I currently fly a Wind 110 and a Miss Wind. I was surprised your 8S setup was only producing 1572 watts, could you post some details of the motor, kv, price etc.I have basically three unused power trains at the moment, a 6S set 380kv producing 1860 watts on a 17x10 apc, an 8S set with 2000 watts on an 18x10 and a 10S with 2200 watts on a 19x10 none of these are specific pattern motors and have relatively high kv as you will gather from the prop sizes.

If yours flys well on 1600 watts I would think that the 6S setup might be the best, it will be the lightest option and I have more 6S packs than anything else. I would be interested to hear your views.

Best regards

Andy P.

Hi John

My motor & esc are both Turnigy, the G110 motor with the 80A Deluxe Opto ESC, £95 for both items delivered and both available from the HK - UK warehouse. Im currently doing lots of prop testing and the 1572w is using the APC 20X15 which is nice but brings the rpm down somewhat hence higher current and less watts. The G110 motor is 210kv so a slight down side there too for performance aspect. However, that said the power available at the moment is more than adequate, I flew a P13 yesterday on it with no problem. I have also bench tested a Turnigy 21x12 woodie and that gave 1674w with slightly less current at around 58A from memory, I am going to fly that prop on Friday so will report back in its flight performance. With this being an outrunner install, a through the nose mounting is required, the maximum motor can size is 63mm for this model so choosing the right motor in that respect is essential. I was advised after buying my motor that something in the 300kv range would have been better perhaps but I like a challenge and have limited knowledge on these things using e-power so my bed was already made really. As I've said though I'm totally happy with the performance but do feel there's room for improvement, we'll see in the weeks ahead. The model is a joy to fly as is and that's the crucial element to me.

Hope some of the above helps.

Andy.

Lazer

My Feedback: (27)

Great job Andy. Do you have the tray attached to a servo? I've been thinking that our pattern planes are so stable that when it is time to do a stall turn into a spin. I'm sorry but after flying RC and pattern for 30 years I have not yet to seen what I would call a stalled tip true spin performed by the planes were flying today. I would even say that when watching one of our F3a USA team members practice here at our field and he flys a biplane. Maybe by setting up a servo to the tray you may be able to set the position of the tray into a more unstable condition thus creating more of a pronounced spin and not so much of a spiral dive, then switching back to stable. Just an idea I've had in my head and you actually came up with what I also envisioned.
Beautiful plane and you have done an excellent job of setting it up.
Terry

Andy P.

Hi Terry and thanks for the comments. I havn't used a servo to reposition the tray but that would be a good concept to try for manouvres like the spin and stall turn, a simple flight condition set up on a switch would be all that was needed. Ironically I have just been having the same conversation with one of our judges over this past weekend on the same subject!

Andy.

Andy P.

Just cropped the Turnigy 21x12 down to 20" and am now getting 1838 Watts @ 61 Amps, motor seems happier with the slightly higher rpm, just need to get to the flying site now and give it a blast, stay tuned!!!

Andy.

john agnew

Have ordered my Nuance 120 in yellow this morning, power will be a Hyperion ZS4035-12-299Kv with the Hyperion Opto 90 ESC and 8S 5000 pack, should give around 2000watts on an 18x10 APC. Managed to sell my Otop at the club today so cost of Nuance somewhat less painful! Looking forward to the build.

John

SAB

John,

I think 8S is the right choice, will you be doing a build thread?
So the OTOP has moved on, how did it fly by the way?

Steve

Lazer

My Feedback: (27)

Andy, please keep use informed if you decide to make it movable. After looking at how well you have done the tray it appears that the tray should hold up to some g's. You could set one switch with avaliable three positions it need.

john agnew

Steve

I don't think I could add much to Andy's build thread, if anything comes up I will post it though. The Otop was a good flyer virtually no pull either way on knife edge. I originally flew it on the Axi / 10S and it had loads of power, however I wanted to keep the Axi so I converted it to 6S with the lipo in the nose to balance and it still flew surprisingly well at just over 10lbs on 1860 watts.

John

Lazer

My Feedback: (27)

That sounds great John. What was the prop you used on the 6s lipo to get the 1860 watts. Was this the Turnigy motor? How many amps is this setup pulling? Thanks in advance.
Terry

rodney tanner

Interesting thread.
Just for a comparison I have an 8s 5000 set up using an e-flight Power 90 (325 kV)
which produces 1790 W, 65A on an APC 17x10.
An 18x10 would produce over 2000 W but would be over the max current limits for the motor.

john agnew

Terry

The motor is a Purple Power pro series 5065-380Kv, prop is an APCE 17x10 drawing around 80amps at max power on a fresh lipo, the power does fall off slightly near the end of the flight but the Otop is a full 2 metre model and I think I am really pushing things at 6S on this model, however I do like to experiment!

Rodney

I would think your motor could probably stand the extra 10amps on the 18x10 in short bursts, I suspect from what Andy says this model does not need 2000watts to fly well, that is going to be over 220 watts per pound.

Regards

John

rodney tanner

John.

I would agree. My plane is an old Desire 60 e-conversion. AUW of 7.5lbs.
Others have told me the Power90 can take an 18x10 on 8s no problem but I will
try the 17x10 as that will give about 240 watts per pound!
A competitive 2m set up goes at 2500w/10lbs for 250 WPP?
I fly the Advanced schedule, hoping to move up to Masters this year, so
the 17x10 should work ok short term.

john agnew

Rodney

I ran some numbers through e-calc today and my Hyperion is showing as drawing around 76 amps on the 18x10APC which is just below the reccomended max. However I have been running this setup on a Pilot Yak 73" weighing around 11lbs for a while now with no issues. Certainly the average ambient temps here in Scotland are usually around 16-18 degrees C in the summer so maybe motor temps are not so much as issue here!

Regards

John

Andy P.

I have now tested the cropped Turnigy prop but although static watts were up on the APC the thrust was no where near the same. I have an APC 21x13W to try now so will post up the stats and flight feedback nearer the weekend, so much fun........

john agnew

My Nuance arrived on Friday and I just had time to unpack it before heading off on a short holiday. The quality seems very good, film covering very neatly done on the flying surfaces etc. Major downside was that the wing / tailplane tubes were all missing from the kit as were the wing locating pegs etc. I am assuming all of these would be bagged together and someone just forgot to put that bag in the box! Only other minor downside is that the slots for the control horns are not premilled, you have to cut these yourself, there are of course no instructions, CG or otherwise so some guess work will be entailed here.

John

Andy P.

Hi John,

The tubes, locating dowels etc are all packaged inside the wing tube!

As for instructions, your right, currently none available for this particular variant, however, simply follow the 170 variant which is available either from Chris or via BJ's website, see [link]http://rcone.kr/board/index.html?id=bjreference1&no=11[/link]

Best regards,

Andy.