do335a

Absolutely they do. It's their sandbox. They make the rules.

You may not like the rules. In order to break them, you need an exemption granted by the rule maker or your own sandbox where you make the rules.

astrohog

My Feedback: (1)

EAA is to GA what the AMA is to modeling. (loosely speaking).

You are a proud dues paying member of the EAA, but the AMA "taxes" you? LOL

Get a grip on reality.

Regards,

Astro

on_your_six

My Feedback: (11)

I never said that.. so at least quote me correctly if you're going to say something about me.

I never said any thing about "tax" nor "proud"

rivnut13

My Feedback: (24)

So I told myself I wasn't going to do this, BUT I knew the EAA would come up. The only reason that builders of experimental aircraft are allowed to maintain their own aircraft is because they are listed on the airworthiness certificate as the AIRCRAFT MANUFACTURER. The maintenance procedures and inspections have to be APPROVED BY THE ADMINISTRATOR. It is most certainly not an opportunity to do whatever you want.

If you, as the manufacturer and person who maintains and operates the aircraft, do not follow the approved procedures for maintaining that aircraft. powerplant and accessories, you will void your insurance and be held liable for any damages that your aircraft causes in the event of an accident. The thing about experimental aircraft is that most of them are filled with certificated aircraft parts, engine, instruments, vacuum pumps, tires, whatever, and those still have to be maintained according to the MANUFACTURERS PROCEDURES. Yes you can do it. But you do it to their rules.

What I have been told, by a friend at the FAA is that FPV beyond visual range will be included in the UAS regulations, and from what I understand, the AMA wants to COMPLETELY SEPARATE beyond visual range FPV from MODEL AVIATION.

If you don't believe that a fatal FPV accident will damage model aviation for the rest of us you couldn't be more wrong. Try buying rifle or handgun ammo right now if you don't think a few yahoos can ruin things for the rest of us.

Fear Mongering? You should try some reality mongering. A little tiny FPV airplane will be incapable of carrying all the equipment that will be required. Let's say its the smallest is the size of a 30cc airplane. If you don't think that can do any real damage, I'll give you my 30cc Aeroworks Extra 300 on the stipulation that you have to fly it into the side of your own car at 40MPH, while YOU are sitting inside that car. Now imagine that on a crowded highway at rush hour.

So, once again, There are rules, there will be more rules, and you will have to abide by them. You have been advised.

By the way, call up TBM and see what they say about it. I'll bet they know, I'll bet they were told before hand, in fact, I'll bet it's in the contract.

So here's an idea, get some friends, a grill and some food, go to the flying field, eat, enjoy hanging with your friends, and talking about airplanes and flying, and spot for each others FPVs. Do it safely and often and have a good time. Stuff like that is, without question, the best part of our hobby.

astrohog

My Feedback: (1)

I never said any thing about "tax" nor "proud"



OH REALLY?

BTW, I didn't "quote" you on the proud part, it was fairly obvious the way you wrote it!

Like another posted here, maybe you should think before you post.......

Regards,

Astro

on_your_six

My Feedback: (11)

Well if you can imagine this... hundreds of square miles of farmland, or dessert largely unpopulated.

I am certainly not advocating flying any RC aircraft into any vehicle anywhere or any time. GA airplanes do fall out of the sky, rarely hurting anyone on the ground. It is possible to build and fly responsibly a legitimate FPV privately.
All the scare tactics are; EPIC FAIL.

opps... OK... yes I do feel that it is a TAX. Usually don't voice that feeling, though.

DONE

aa1a

My Feedback: (4)

We had hundreds of square miles of farmland around the small town in Northern Colorado where I grew up. Lots of corn. Lots of Ag Cats, Air Tractors , Thrushes and occasional Pawnee at treetop level at 100 mph or so. They rarely climbed to pattern altitude and were usually at 200 feet or less. What happens when your copter with the camera and all of the goodies goes through the prop of an Ag plane 100 feet off the deck? Probably not a happy ending.

rivnut13

My Feedback: (24)

Sorry, but if you feel that the AMA membership fees are a TAX, do you feel that the membership fees to your local flying club is a tax? Then don't join up. If you want to play, you have to pay. Go buy your own land, and fly on it.

Listen, I TOTALLY UNDERSTAND WHAT YOUR POINT IS.

No "scare tactics". I'm not trying to scare you. You will do whatever you want. And, for the most part, none of us really care. Until, your actions affect the rest of us. That's where the AMA stands.

I love how you think I advocate "flying an RC airplane into a vehicle". It was to make a point. Now imagine you are flying over your desolated hundreds of square miles of desert in a Cessna 172. Then a 7 pound styrofoam FPV comes flying into your flight path and crashes right through your NON-BIRDSTRIKE rated windshield. How do you think that will end up? Remember the damage cased by a mid air is based on CLOSURE RATE. Not the 35 knot airspeed of the FPV. At cruise speed in a 172? That's about 150 knots. The 115 knot cruise of the Cessna and the 35 knot cruise of the FPV. That equal about 160 MPH.

EPIC FAIL? Talk like an adult and you'll be treated like one. YOU started a discussion, and are upset they everyone didn't immediately jump on your band wagon. Now you say DONE because you've run out of intelligent things to say. Don't come on here and start spouting off acronyms like you are the only person on this site that has any full scale aviation experience and are somehow an authority on it because you either posses a light sport or private pilot certificate. That is what is referred to as DANGEROUS. You probably don't have a lot of experience and probably haven't had your first BIG scare yet. Or you have and that's why the FPV/RPV and you won't fly anymore.

I as an American RESPECT YOUR RIGHT TO HAVE A DIFFERING OPINION, but don't accuse people of Fear Mongering (your words) and scare tactics(your words) simply because we don't agree with you. Personally I think you are very excited about the FPV thing, and that is great, that's how we all got started, excitement over the hobby, and like the rest of us you don't want your hobby regulated out of existence. However, you must realize that BEYOND VISUAL RANGE FPV can be VERY DANGEROUS if not operated by the right people. The WRONG people include Terrorists or just some DUMB*****.

The AMA has the right to inform people that different rules apply to FPV flight, in addition to what is considered "normal" model airplane flights. They will have the right to make rules, and make new rules. The FAA will SEVERELY restrict UAS. It will happen.

Get ready.

That's it. I'm done. I'm going flying.

rcbuzz79

My Feedback: (21)

Six, before you take up the fight for TBM and all other manufacturers, why don't you contact them and ask them if are opposed to the INFORMATIOAL advertisement by the AMA.  You are the only one claiming that is a 'warning' ad.  Nothing was printed that would create the negative impact you claim. If you don't understand the impact and importance of this topic, then just zip your trap and do some research before you run around and huff & puff about it acting like a sheriff or something.

HoundDog

My Feedback: (49)

The FAA has been working on the FAR's for the use of sUAS small Unmaned Aerial Systems for over 5 years. If people knowingly or unknowingly purchase these fly them self (QUADROSTER) FPV systems and get in conflict with full scale aviation all of RC Modeling is going to suffer. on_your_six I don't know U but from your posts here and in other forums I'd say U were an AMA BASHER Am I correct?

Steve Percifield

My Feedback: (14)

because of irresponsible, flagrant misuse of that product.

Steve Percifield

My Feedback: (14)

this is the first page in an assembly manual for an ARF I am assembling


A QUICK WORD ABOUT SAFETY AND RADIO CONTROL FLYING MODELS
With radio control aircraft, like any hobby or sport, there are certain risks. The operator of these models is responsible for these risks. If misused or abused, you may cause serious bodily injury and/or damage to property. With this in mind, you will want to be certain that you build your model carefully and correctly. If you are not an experienced flier, have your work checked by an experienced pilot and ask for help in learning to fly the model safely. This model aircraft is not a toy and must be operated and flown in a safe manner at all times. Always perform a pre-flight check of the model which includes proper movements of all control surfaces, proper function of the radio gear, structural integrity, and radio range.
Models are not insurable but operators are. You can obtain coverage through membership in the Academy of Model Aeronautics (AMA). For an AMA information package call 1-800-435-9262, ex t. 292 or visit the AMA website at "www.modelaircraft .org".
By the act of using the final assembled model, the purchaser/operator accepts all resulting liability.

siberianhusky

There was an interesting article on NPR yesterday about rc fpv flying, drones, commercial uses and upcoming regulations.
Some of the attitudes expressed here are going to blow up in your faces when the new rules come down in 2015. The FAA, government and some other groups are pretty worried about this FPV stuff. Pretty sure there is going to be some big changes coming down the pipe.
Sucks for your guys down south who are really into the FPV thing.

CafeenMan

OK, you might see it that way but look what happened to alcohol consumption in the USA since those messages started appearing. Nobody in America drinks alcohol any more and the only alcohol manufacturers left are subsisting on meager overseas sales. Think of the babies!

hairy46

My Feedback: (1)

AMA is our hope of flying in the future, my renewel will be on their desk come December!

ssautter

Yes,
The AMA can label the FPV advertisements.

And,
Yes,
The paying advertisers can pull their adds.

The AMA hassurveyed FPV flyers with specific questions, regarding FPV flying regulations.
And,theFPVdistributorscan easily use this raw data to target the growing and volatile FPV market.
If the FPV enthusiasts cancel their AMA memberships, then there is no more incentive for the distributors to advertise.

The AMA is definitely tippy-toe-ing around theFPVissue, in the case of advertisers.
But, the AMA is also encouraging the use of some FPV equipment, at sanctioned airfields.

The FAA's NPRM, regarding the use of sUAS in the NAS, is the real deal breaker. And, the delays have put the AMA "between a rock and a hard place".
I see the AMA as being proactive, by labeling FPV advertisements. It's about the only move that the AMA can make, at this point,amidst the FAA's growing backlog....

warningshot

This statement is about as false as false can be.

HoundDog

My Feedback: (49)

ORIGINAL: ssautter
If the FPV enthusiasts cancel their AMA memberships, then there is no more incentive for the distributors to advertise.

Do U remember the Senate and House bills that were passed into law stating the FAA could not pass FAR's concerning Hobby/Sport Community Based Organizations ...
The only people flying any kind of R/C i.e. will be AMA members at AMA Fields.
Any one wanting to fly any type R/C / sUAS other than under the AMA will require a Federal sUAS (Drone) License .... Mark my words. It's coming to a field near U.
The saving grace has / is Budget Sequestration and the loss of funding the FAA has suffered that has delayed the new Proposal of sUAS FAR's

CafeenMan

So you didn't think it was strange that there hasn't been a single beer commercial during an American professional sporting event for the past five years including the super bowl???

(In case you're missing the sarcasm, my point is that advisories never stop anyone from doing anything so I'm not seeing the problem)

warningshot

Not sure which backwoods place you live in but beer is on tv almost every day out here in gods country. If you are trying for sarcasm then you need to try a little harder cause it aint comin thru.

CafeenMan

So it being blatantly obvious that alcohol sales are thriving in the USA and you think I believe that no one in the USA drinks any more? Not sure if I can try harder than that. Sorry to waste your time though. Peace and carry on.

hairy46

My Feedback: (1)

I think we need to get behind AMA so that we have a voice, just like some of us are with the NRA, I hate to think what would have happen to our rights a long time ago without these two!

spog1

I agree. Maybe if we push the AMA and MAAC they will be able to accelerate the governments regulation of FPV before something bad happens and severely restricts our hobby.

HoundDog

My Feedback: (49)

Be careful of what u wish for concerning any government agency especially if it federal i.e. FAA IRS anything with "Department of" In the title. I understand your concern to having the FAA complete their NPRM. before someone does something really stupid but Believe me these Proposed set of FAR's will be so comprehensive as to even cover the use of a Kite in the NAS. Don't rush the feds. EVER. JMHO

But yes our best chance for preserving our Hobby/Sport is the origination like AMA IMAC JPO IMAA ect. We all have to stick together in one loud voice with out any discord at all.

abelard

Whooossshhh....