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Runway take off trouble

Old 07-09-2013, 02:05 PM
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a70eliminator
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Default Runway take off trouble

Although I'm not a total beginner I am new to club flying.
I'm finding it way harder to do everything from starting up taxi takoff and landing ect just because of all the distractions of
people planes and club rules ect.
I'm so used to flying alone secluded and no distractions big field ect. One of the most trying tasks for me is taking off without standing directly behind my plane, ar the field I have to stand in a certain area about 90 degrees from my plane and i'm looking at is from the side rather from behind, also the flight path is also standing looking at my plane sidewars rather than directly in front of behind it like I'm used to.
I've crashed 2 times now with my 1/4 scale bipe, it always happens when there are people around and other planes, by myself is much more relaxing and I'm able to pull off great flights, but in a crowd forget it!
Anyone else have this experience, is it normal in the beginning or is it just maybe a personel problem?
Old 07-09-2013, 02:15 PM
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flyinwalenda
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Default RE: Runway take off trouble

Normal for most ! Some never get accustomed to it .
It's worse if your club has a "peanut gallery" there all of the time. Not so bad if there are folks there who will help you and allow you to bend the "rules" a little. One of those rules to bend would be allowing you to stand behind your plane to take off and then move behind the flight station to fly and land and do this for a few flights until you become comfortable and then you can take off from the flight station. That is allowed where I fly as long as you are the first up and it is safe to do so.
Try and concentrate on your plane and not worry about the others (have a spotter with you) when flying and landing. Tough to say but try and tune everything else out (except your spotter !)
Otherwise it's stage fright and it should pass after a year or two !
Old 07-09-2013, 03:02 PM
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a70eliminator
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Default RE: Runway take off trouble

Thanks for that reply, makes me feel a little more content.
My yesterdays crash with the saito 300 weeks consisted of a nice s-l-o-w landing but it took a big ugly hop, tried to power out but was just a little too slow and tip stalled cartwheel happened, should have just let the darn plane bounce, had there been no spectaters I probably would have just did the ugly landing.
Old 07-09-2013, 03:14 PM
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Live Wire
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Default RE: Runway take off trouble

You will get used to it.
The best thing you can do in your case is to face the way you are taking off so you still see where the plane is heading. Watching your plane and the runway some times keep your mind off spectators. Block out the ones behind you and make sure there is no one in front. I always face the direction of flight where I can see all directions in the path of my plane. The main thing is to not try to show every one how you can fly, they will see that
Old 07-09-2013, 03:33 PM
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daveopam
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Default RE: Runway take off trouble

Perfectly normal. It will get better with time. I don't want to sound like I am bragging but I work hard at my flying skills so here goes. I can fly any sort of plane and can out fly 95% of the people I meet.
Even so ,on fun fly day or the first few flights at a strange field I am nervous. I do everything a little higher and a little safer. By lunchtime I am back to myself and give it hell. So keep after it and keep your chin up. You might even think about a spotter. Just someone to tell you when you are clear and watch for idiots. If you can find someone you are comfortable with and use him all the time it will help.

David
Old 07-09-2013, 03:49 PM
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a70eliminator
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Default RE: Runway take off trouble

Our club is actually on the tail end of the runway of full scale airport, I am required to have a spotter at all times, also monitoring air traffic at all times via reciever and loudspeaker system, sometimes it's buisy and sometimes not during the week, but it's a beautiful place to fly.
I just have to get over that - OKEVERYONE'S WATCHING! - feeling ... It absolutely kills my concentration everytime!
I think it's a phobea that I especially have a weakness to, ok lets put our boots on now lol!
Old 07-09-2013, 04:16 PM
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Live Wire
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Default RE: Runway take off trouble

It is not every one watching you are trying two watch every one. Concentrate on your plane not the people around you, if you have a spotter rely on him and fly your plane in a safe manner.
Larry K
Old 07-09-2013, 04:22 PM
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Live Wire
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Default RE: Runway take off trouble

OK now relax and enjoy. What a great hobby
Old 07-09-2013, 05:39 PM
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Default RE: Runway take off trouble

I can remember the nerves. I learned to fly at a club that had all high end flyers. When I set it up mine was the cheapest plane out there by an easy $1000.00. It was way nerve wracking to see all these guys with turbines and aerobats flying their planes at feet or inches on the runway and just wringing their airframes out. Meanwhile I am on a buddy box at 100-200 feet just trying to learn how to control a plane. I crashed my first trainer about the 3rd day of flying while trying to roll I pulled into the ground just like it was the most natural thing to do. After that I kinda looked around and after a bit of jeering I realized that there is nothing that will happen worse than that and I started to relax around it. The guys didn't throw me out they said well welcome to the club we have all done it and helped me get back in the air. I get very nervous flying in front of larger groups but usually after I do a good preflight and get my head into my own little space I can throw up a good looking demo flight. Just recently I had the chance to get coached in pattern some of the world team members my pre-flight and first few minutes of flight were nervous but soon after taking off I relaxed a bit and it was just like flying with my friends they acted as caller for me and coached/critiqued my pattern flying. I would say try to find times when there are not as many folks out and let yourself get comfortable with having a few people then fly with a few more and few more like in steps. Set a goal say for in a year to fly with others. I like having goals and one of mine is to be able to fly in front on competition judges without overthinking my flying. You will be surprised that most of the [pressure you feel is self induced and realizing that will help.
Old 07-09-2013, 06:33 PM
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Default RE: Runway take off trouble

You definately get used to it.  The practice of keeping the model in front of you at all times is worth the effort and practice to learn.
Old 07-09-2013, 06:33 PM
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Gray Beard
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Default RE: Runway take off trouble

Great post and I couldn't help but laugh, it is so very normal. I learned on a small club field and when it was just myself and my basic instructor I had no problems. We used to mow an 8 foot swath for take off and landing. When I started flying at a real club field sometimes it was all I could do to stay on the long wide runway, of course everyone in the peanut gallery was telling me what to do. I finally discovered I was a better pilot them most of them and got over my nerves. Then I started flying IMAA events with a thousand people behind me. By then I was more into watching my plane then worrying about the other people.
I fly a lot off of a dry lake bed these days and have seven square miles of flat. I have a great place to fly but can't get the other guys to fly there, they are so used to the lake bed with all that room they can't land on an asphalt runway that is only as wide as a driveway. You do tend to get spoiled and laxed when you can take off and land anyplace you want/need to. I must admit, the lake bed is a great spot when you are way out there and have a dead stick. You'll get over it after a few days at the club, doesn't take too long to get over the nerves.
Old 07-09-2013, 07:19 PM
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52larry52
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Default RE: Runway take off trouble

All good suggestions and advice from the previous posters. The only thing I could add would be to fly a couple of days with something in your fleet that is very easy and forgiving in the landing and takeoff department to sorta of get you in the groove and relaxed flying at the club field with the extra pressure of spectators and taking off and landing from the side line. Do a couple of good no damage days with something easy then start to bring your more advanced stuff. Maybe flying your first flight of the day with something easy to "warm up" would be helpful. Like others have said, we have all felt that extra pressure at some point. I've been flying for about 12 years now but still sometimes "warm up" with a trainer type. No shame in doing that.
Old 07-09-2013, 07:59 PM
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jester_s1
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Default RE: Runway take off trouble

I'll second Larry's advice. You're having to relearn takeoffs and landings, so your planes that are the most gentle in that area are the ones to use.
Old 07-10-2013, 01:58 AM
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Default RE: Runway take off trouble

I have to agree with what everyone else has said about nerves and all of that. I'm presently building a trainer from plans so I haven't gotten into three dimensions yet but, that being said, I do have the same issue in 2D. I am required to take a driver's test to be qualified to compete at races held by the scale hydroplane club I belong to. Last time I tried to take the driving part of the exam, someone else launched a boat in front of me resulting in me taking my eyes off my boat. Net result was the boat took some serious damage due to me looking away, nerves and adrenalin overload. I'm now scheduled to try again on Saturday, running 5 laps around a marked course in under 2 minutes driving a boat that tops out at around 70 MPH. Looks like another round of adrenalin overload
Old 07-10-2013, 02:24 AM
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Lifer
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Default RE: Runway take off trouble

Everybody goes through this and you will get used to it. As far as the peanut gallery is concerned, it's usually a bunch of bench-warming old farts that can't fly, but make comments about those who do fly. Get a group together and approach them. Request they be silent, or leave. If they don't have a plane with them, they should be required to be behind the safety fence.
Old 07-10-2013, 04:29 AM
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oldfartpilot
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Default RE: Runway take off trouble

I've returned to RC aircraft after an absence of 25 yrs.  My "handle" pretty much describes me now, "oldfartpilot"!.  I live on a farm in so. cen. KY and have a grass airstrip.  I love the peace of flying here on the farm.  I also fly at a privately owned airfield not but a few miles from here.  It too is out in the boonies.  There's never over 6-8 flyers on Sunday, but all are very helpful.  These are guys I went to high school with.  When I first started flying again I suffered from "performance anxiety".  Even here on the farm, I have a spotter as I'm a bilateral amputee, so if I have to land off the airstrip, it's impossible to use my wheelchair to retrieve my plane.  Only time will build up your confidence, so hang in there, concentrate on your aircraft and your flying and always remember, "beware lest the earth rises up and smites thee!"
Old 07-10-2013, 06:27 AM
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Villa
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Default RE: Runway take off trouble

Hi oldfartpilot and a70eliminator
At age 77 I'm an oldfartpilot also. The following may help both of you: Every now and then I hear someone at the field mention that they crashed during a landing because “THE WIND GOT THEMâ€. This looks like a strong downdraft pushed the plane into the ground. That ever happen to you? Since I always insist on determining the cause of every one of my crashes, I kept questioning that “THE WIND GOT ME†reason, since I used it also. Then I realized that these types of crashes always happened when the plane was very far away, or when I was landing at a much different angle to me than usual.

I am now convinced that these types of crashes are due to the wing stalling. Yes, stalling. The plane falls straight down because the wing lost lift. And the reason is that the plane is so far away and almost coming toward you, that you have lost your ability to estimate the air speed. So it stalls and crashes. My answer is to land the plane directly in front of you as much as possible, going right to left, or left to right, only. In that location you will be better able to judge the air speed of the plane, and how far off the ground it is. Use the throttle and the elevator during the full length of the landing approach to position the plane to touch down near to “in front of youâ€. Throttle extends the landing point, while elevator shortens the landing point. I usually hold a little throttle during the landing and only go to idle in the last foot or two of elevation. Please give this idea some thought. I would appreciate hearing any input on this.
Old 07-10-2013, 08:03 AM
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a70eliminator
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Default RE: Runway take off trouble

Het thanks villa and yea thats exactly the landing style I have to entertain at the club field.
Just for the record, I now have a new excuse for why It crashed,... it wasn't the wind, it was the darn peanut gallery, they were watching too close lol.
Here's what it looked like heading to the field.

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Old 07-10-2013, 08:05 AM
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kork
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Default RE: Runway take off trouble

if it was that easy the first time, you most likely wound not do it a second. Hang in there and keep doing it!
Old 07-10-2013, 09:12 AM
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Default RE: Runway take off trouble

a70eliminator-

A bunch of great suggestions above. What I like to do to help pilots learn to land on the runway at our field since it's a bit small is to take a trainer or sport plane that is fairly docile and work at flying the pattern and then touch-n-go's.

Start with the pattern first - just fly a standard pattern and instead of landing just fly down the runway at about 5'. This will let you start seeing the planes alignment on the runway and start to get the feel on how it looks to make an approach to land right in front of yourself. Take a weekend or two and just practice this and you'll really be surprised how well you'll start to see the runway centerline and keep the plane ligned up to it.

After you are confortable flying low approaches and going around keeping the plane on the centerline then work on touch-n-go's. At first just get the plane down on the runway centerline, then start working on getting the plane to touch down right in front of you. Take a few weeks and work on nothing but landings.

Before long you'll be making all your landing's right in front of you and the peanut gallery will either be quite or congratulating you on how good your able to land a plane. And you'll find that taking off and landing from the side of the plane will become second nature and you won't think anything about it. Just about anybody can bore a hole in the sky, but watch how few pilots can really do a good soft landing on a hard surface in the same spot everytime with differnt planes. That's the sign of a good pilot and it takes a lot of practice to get good landings down.

Hogflyer
Old 07-10-2013, 09:16 AM
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Default RE: Runway take off trouble

In Europe and other countries abroad standing behind your model and taking off is common practice. If you have doubts you can confirm this by watching UTube videos from abroad. I do the same with any new airplane on its' maiden flight. Flying with others is a mixed bag composed of all different types of personalities. The key to overcoming this is associate yourself with those that will accept you. Believe it or not but the most accepting people in the hobby are helicopter pilots. If none of this is helpful than go back and fly alone and enjoy.
Old 07-10-2013, 09:19 AM
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zacharyR
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Default RE: Runway take off trouble

Some times bad is just bad you might not be a good pilot just saying there's alot of pepole that it doesn't pan out
Old 07-10-2013, 09:57 AM
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Default RE: Runway take off trouble

What hog said.

Wear ear plugs if the circle jerks behind you always have something to say.

If you don't have a good ol 40-60 sized trainer or sport plane or even a cheap parkie foamy so it can be fixed at the field. then you can get one cheap and practice.

If you can, go out alone. Get some milk jugs or traffic cones and set at the edge of the runway at the corners so its easier to pickup in your periferal vision.

Also, don't practice just one direction. Do figure 8s and fly both left and right hand turns/pattern.

It doesn't take weeks. And don't go back to flying "the old way". I've never seen a club or even where you got to stand at the end of the runway to fly and it ist that professional looking either.
Practice your trade/hobby. Get good at it or just stick to your layed back fun in an open pasture and just have fun.
Old 07-10-2013, 10:25 AM
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a70eliminator
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Default RE: Runway take off trouble

No not going back toi the old way!
The challenge and disipline will only force me to do better, that and flying alongside guys that are really really good at it will only inspire me to get better.
I'm already getting bored of doing loops and rolls. I have my high wing trainer plane and it's challenging for me to fly it around as s-l-o-w and low as I possibly can just above stall speed, thats about the only thing I can do with it being not so aerobatic, flying upsidedown is practice it's good for too.
Old 07-10-2013, 02:43 PM
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pitts150hp
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Default RE: Runway take off trouble

Actually standing to the side allows you to see the angle of attack of the wing so you do not stall on takeoff . Standing from the back only tells you if you are going straight on the ground .Can not see any angles that is a bad habit of modelers and sells a lot of arfs if you build you tend to be more careful and put more effort in making them last and understanding theory.

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