byrne1157

I used a sim and a GWS Slostik to learn the basics, and wouldn't fly if there was a "breath" of wind, until I got done breaking props. The airplane took a beating!!! Now I have quite a large number of airplanes in my hangar, and I only cancel flying when the wind hits about 30mph, or it won't taxi for takeoff. Crashing is really a downer, but don't let it stop you! Get a real sim, and practice at least 1 hr per day! And every crash on the sim is worth money in your pocket. Take your time, be safe, and above all, ENJOY yourself!!!

carl24bpool

Hey guys, thanks for all teh comments. I'm genuinely surprised at the lack of I told you so's.

It was a god laugh and I met some old mates I hadn't seen for a while as I mentioned my plans on facebook and a few were interested.

I will me buying some sheeting and plywood today to rebuild my plane and have her up again tonight I'm hoping. My dad is a joiner and furniture maker (a very good one) so I have good experience in repairs of timber. To be honest I'm glad it is timber and not plastic as the Tiger looks like it would be easier to make a new one from Coke bottles. lol.

Also thanks for commending me on returning with my report. I think its s little childish to post your intentions asking for help and then not even come back and let the guys know how you did.

My mate flew his really well for a few laps. If anything he choked undeer the excitement and he failed ot get the plane that magical 3 mistakes high. I told him to get height but he just kept going up and down. I think he should of been concentrating on trimming it out with my help but all that went out the window.

I think once mine is repaired I'm just going to take one friend and try to make a more commited job of flying it rather than having fun.

I was on the sim again last night and managed to take off and land half a dozen times without crashing.

One thing I noticed on the sim is that if you give the plane too much throttle too early it tips forward. Is this something that can happen in real life?

byrne1157

Depends on what aircraft you are flying on the sim, and what sim you are using. I noticed in an earlier post you said you were using an i-phone sim? When I said before to get a real sim, I meant one that uses a controller that is like a transmitter. no comparison if you don't use the sticks to fly the sim. Usually the only planes that nose over, are warbirds, or tail-draggers that have the landing gear to far to the rear, it makes them "tippy". The solution is to keep up elevator to keep the tail on the ground. Happy flying!!! 

Edwin

My Feedback: (2)

When I first read this I thought it would end the same way all the other threads like this did. I gotta commend you for reporting back, you're the first, that I've seen, to come back with an honest report. I really do hope you stick with it because flying is really a great sport. I want to agree with the others who've said to get a regular rc flight sim, much more to be gained from that type than a phone sim. I've never been a fan of sims but I teach at our club and there is no doubt that they do a good job of teaching takeoffs and flying around. Not so great on landings but my sim students still learn to land faster than the non sim students. Solo time is much quicker. Things to watch out for are learning bad habits. At some point you'll get to where you can keep it in the air. Start learning to do coordinated turns with the rudder. Rudder is a key control surface that most students ignore for years. It makes a bad landing approach a non-event. Once you get your wits about you, when landing, throttle controls decent, elevator angle of attack, rudder to line up with the runway, ailerons to keep the wings level. I see so many newbies swinging the wings wildly, sometimes almost wings up, to line up with the runway, then crash. When your wings are up, and your speed is slow, you lose lift. Trainers can recover if you're fast enough, but if you're on a low wing trainer, scale, or warbird, they can easily stall and crash. I dont know if you're a gamer or not but they tend to bump the stick causing jerky control movements. Do smooth fluid movements. A jerky plane causes drag. Figure 8's are good practice, put the crosshairs right in front of you, its harder than you think for a newbie. Flat circles are good practice for rudder control. Keep the wings flat using opposite aileron while using rudder to fly in circles. Do the figure 8's that way too. But most important is the smooth fluid movements on the sticks. As you progress, you discover that cross stick flying is tons of fun, flying a straight line at a 45deg angle.

Having said all that, I taught myself too. Buddy boxes just came out and there were no flight sims. I couldnt get anybody to teach me at the club so I went on my own. It was expensive, took a long time, and was very discouraging until one day I went home with a plane that needed no repairs. That didnt last long but it gave me the boost I needed to keep on. That was 20 years ago. I teach now so others dont have to go that route if they dont want to. In the last two years I've had 6 students show up that started on their own and were tired of crashing. Got them on the buddy box and in most cases they solo'd in less than 10 flights. My new raw students generally take 30 to 40 flights to solo, but that also includes aerodynamics theory, how to handle emergencies, how to read your plane, and lots of practice.
Edwin

jester_s1

You also might consider buying a Hobby Zone Super Cub or a GWS Slow Stick to get through this initial phase of learning. Both bounce well and are easy to fix. I'd wager that in the end, you'll actually have less money invested in the learning process by buying one of these planes than you will by going with what you have and continuing to crash it. There's only so many times that a balsa model can be repaired before there are too many patches and glue joints to be able to rebuild it to the strength it needs.

And FWIW, this is the most helpful group of guys you'll ever find. We are nearly all willing to invest significant time in explaining things to a guy who wants to learn and is willing to listen, which describes maybe 20% of the newbies who start threads like this one. Stick with it and continue to ask questions, and we'll be here for you.

carl24bpool

Thanks for a great post Edwin. Your wisdom is much appreciated.

I will try and get myself some sort of simulator that uses a proper controller.

I've wante dto fly planes since I was 15 and I'm 33 now. It all started out with a Precedent Hi Boy trainer which I built when I was 15 but have, to this day, still never flown. Unfortunately the wings got damaged in a housse move so I only have the fuselage but I still have it and when I see some wings for sale on ebay I'll get it in the air one day. It would be nice to see somethng I built so lonbg ago flying. i'll keep that plane until I can fly though as I'd like to have that one for my son to fly one day too.

I am a gamer but he simulator on the I-pad has shown me to only make small movements.

I think as everyone has already pointed out its the trimming out thats the ultimate hurdle. I think once trimmed I could fly it to a level where I can at least perform a moderate crash landing with little damage.

I'm halfway through the rebuild now. I couldn;t get my hands on any of the super thin plywood for sheeting it over so I'll just make the skeleton extra extra strong and film over it instead. It should all be done in a couple of hours. I'll post some pics of the damage as it is and once repaired. It wont be anything special. I'm looking for strength not looks. Same with covering. I'm using all sorts of bits left over.

theres probably a 5mph wind right now so if it holds like that I'll be back to the field later. If anyone comes with me I'll video the results.

Edwin

My Feedback: (2)

You DO KNOW that rc is a recognized disease and once you have the burn in the belly, the only cure is money. At least this hobby is one of those that can be as cheap as you want, or as expensive as you want. Just remember, its not a problem if you dont admit it.
Edwin

zacharyR

My Feedback: (5)

hope your good at repairs or rebuilding .. thats the route your going . LOL

byrne1157

A GWS Slo Stik is a great choice for beginners, they are quite sturdy, and will take a beating, and can be repaired with packing tape(most of the time). Get a "prop-saver" adapter, and you won't lose too many props to poor landings. And remember, if you try to make rudder-only turns, you need to feed in some elevator to keep the nose up. I didn't start flying till I was 50, so don't feel like a "late starter", be glad you started!! It's a great way to keep a kid like me off the streets.

BobFE

I've been in the hobby for over 13 years, but it has been more of an on and off affair. I've been away from it for the past 5 years and am just getting back into it so I'm kinda starting over. Before I learned on a buddy box, but this time I'm going it alone. To your question about wind. As long as the wind is low and steady I wouldn't worry too much about it. If it is gusty at all don't fly. While you are trying to learn the basics of maneuvering you will also be fighting the wind pushing your plane around. I experienced this on my first flight a week ago, I spent as much time fighting the wind as knocking the rust off. My second flight there was a steady 5-10 mph wind and I had a great flight. Later when you get more experienced you can have a great time flying in gusty conditions, but not yet.

Anyone who is giving you grief about your decision to teach yourself to fly should be ignored. Yes it will probably cost you more, yes you'll have to get really good at repairs. Remember, the Wright brothers didn't have anyone to teach them. The original method of developing planes was "Fly, Fix, Fly". If you can use a resource, use it, if you don't have one, good luck, but it doesn't mean you can't learn to fly. Have fun and enjoy! Do follow the advice of the people on here on recommendations of what to fly and techniques you can use. Good luck!

okdreamin

My Feedback: (9)

JOHN BUCKNER is dead on.   Absolutely dead calm for solo or new plane maiden.

carl24bpool

The advice on here is great and I really appreciate he time everyone has taken to offer tips. When I have funds I'll def buy a foam flyer. Just for something a little safer as much as anything else.

If you want to see my friends first flight search YouTube for "captain stix". Please excuse the bad language, my mate filming was. Little excited. In the end it crashed into a bramble bush with no damage.

The second flight is another story. That ended nose in at 40mph. Removed firewall, servo tray, landing gear and pretty much everything. It had been repaired before though and broke on all repair points. We're considering repair but with this abs plastic it's not easy especially when all the wing mount area is smashed to bits.

He was still happy with his performance though.

Hawk131

So I watched the video, that trainer looks fast, was it trimmed out or do you have the throws to high, seemed very twitchy to me.

Calvinman

Good flight guys!! Remember you can throttle it back a bit Calvi

byrne1157

Some wild and crazy guys!!!

carl24bpool

I'd say exciteable more than wild and crazy. Were too old to be wild and crazy these days.

We did check all throws were as per the manual but I guess it will do no harm checking them agian before we fly tonight. I must admit hte elevator did seem quite twitchy but maybe he was throwing the stick all over the place in a panic.

I'll post link to tonights video later or in the morning.

a70eliminator

Your buddy appears to be doing pretty darn good. A tailheavy plane flies just like that, with the uncontrollable elevator up and down hard to stabilize level flight, the pushrods unsupported will also have the uncrollable effect when they are flexing, you should be able to grab the elevator and move servo (switch off) without deflection of pushrod, can't wait to see new video like Saturday Night at the Movies lol..

carl24bpool

We did balance it (dry) and then filed it up so I't can't f been tail heavy so early in flight. The elevator is controlled by a wooden dowel so there is no chance of flex at all on this.

I think it was just a lack of self control and he was throwing the sticks all over the place to be honest.

JohnBuckner

My Feedback: (1)

OK I did google 'Captain Stix' and it to took some scrolling down to find something that may have been your video and if it is the correct one was shocked at the complete and deliberate setup for failure. The deliberate laughing and heckling by perhaps the camera operator or others for the entire duration of the flight is a recipe for failure.

If that crap occurs to one of my students while we are working together then the perpetrators are firmly asked to remove themselves elsewhere.

Whatever losses or damages occurred that day along with a complete lack of learning, to apparently two airplanes rests squarely with rather poor decisions by both you and your friend.

John

cessnaflyer54

My Feedback: (68)

Hi,
Racing cars in the past...WILL NOT HELP YOU. I raced 1/8 scale on road for 25 years and it did not help
at all. You might think it will, Not. I taught myself to fly and I used a flight sim. It helped with the sticks
and the orintation of the plane in the air. Was not totally the same, but did help with plane reaction in the
air. Landing was an other story. Keep at it and you'll get there.

a70eliminator

I disagree, and heres why, in the beginning I went out and bought a cheapie remote controlled car with stick controls, it totally helped me with left to right orientation, it was quite a while befor I was able to run the car up turn and come back without crashing it, had a hard time with the reversal of input car facing you or pointing away from you, it takes alot of hrs before your not even thinking about it anymore, good thing is with a car you just take your food and kick it back onto all fours, you just can't do that with a plane!
Having a car definately helped train by brain for left and right orientation.

daddyrabbit1234

My Feedback: (14)

I commend your friend for keeping that plane up as long as he did. I've not been flying long myself and take it from me It's best to fly when the air is dead calm like early mornings just after daylight. When you fly with wind you'll find out that the planes flies much steadier in a very light head wind but when you turn to come back with a tail wind pushing you the plane flies very different unless you have a lot of speed and speed is something you don't need when your trying to trim a plane out.

I watched the video and I would suggest easing up on the throttle a bit. The elevator seemed to need trimming as the plane kept diving. To get the plane trimmed you need to take it up high and get it flying flat and straight then turn loose of the sticks and that plane will tell you what needs to be trimmed. Good luck on your future flights and keep us updated.

carl24bpool

John, I'm really only after help.

The laughing was our mates and to be honest it wouldn't bother me as I'd be concentrating too much. I wouldn't say we made poor decisions, more lack of experience.

more importantly friends got together and we had a right good laugh.

My plane is back together and ready for round two. I was going to fly tonight but friends, BBQ and cider got in the way. I'll be flying tomorrow so ill update you. I'll be on my own this time as captain stix has gone to london.

I've been on the sim all night again, I just wish you could fly out of trim and practice that. Surely some sims offer this option?

Anyway, thanks again for all the comments of encouragement. I'll report back tomorrow with flight report. I may struggle with video but will try and get a helper.

JohnBuckner

My Feedback: (1)

Believe it or not this is some of the best help of the thread. That kind of 'help' i.e. harassment while you are flying is always detrimental to your performance regardless of your age and the right stuff is a myth. Now without all the harassment tomorrow I predict you will do better, I hope you do.

John

thebest_102

My Feedback: (6)

Also to add to this make sure when you trim you are heading into the wind. Downwind trimming can be erratic. Keep in mind that depending on the field the wind direction at altitude maybe different than that on the surface.