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Self taught flying - My diary / progress

Old 07-30-2013, 09:13 AM
  #26  
hogflyer
 
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Default RE: Self taught flying - My diary / progress


ORIGINAL: carl24bpool

In addition I'm using 10% nitro fuel which I thought was fine.

10% fuel is fine, and what I fly in a couple of my engines.

One way to tune your engine is using the pinch method. Go to full throttle and pinch the fuel line briefly. Does then engine speed up, slow down or stay the same?

Here's how I set my engines when I'm not using a tach:
I'll go to full throttle and turn the mixture out a bit to make it rich, then lean it until I hear the RPM's peak and want to start to drop. Then I'll go 4 clicks rich and use the pinch test to double check (I usually pinch the fuel tubing about the middle of the cylinder):
Engine speeds up slightly when the fuel line is pinched: It's slightly rich and OK to fly.
Engine slows down or stays the same when the fuel line is pinched: It's too lean and needs a click or two richer on the mixture setting.

Another thing you may want to look into is the Eagle Tree 2D/3D Stabilizer. I have one to try on a trainer (Kadet LT-40) but haven't hooked it up yet. Guys I 've talked to who have used it say it works great. You can turn it on and off - fly with it off and if you get into trouble turn it on and let it recover your plane back to level flight. They've used it on windy days to shoot landings and say it keeps the plane in a level attituds to the point they use throttle and rudder to adjust the approach path. Besides being able to turn it on and off, you can also adjust the gain while in flight. But it does require at least on extra channel to turn on/off, and a second extra channel for gain adjustment.

Hogflyer
Old 07-30-2013, 09:22 AM
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BobFE
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Default RE: Self taught flying - My diary / progress

Carl, drube's comment was great! Get a simulator. On days where the weather is too bad to fly you can be flying the sim. It is not exactly like the real thing, I know I've found the site picture hard to follow at times due to the lack of peripheral vision, but the way the plane handles is really quite real.

I do want to comment on your engine tuning. There are several websites out there that can show you how to tune your engine, just Google, "RC glow engine tuning" and pick the one that makes the most sense to you. You always want to have the engine rich. Too much rich is better than any lean. The more you run lean the faster you will burn up the engine. Also a good check just before you go flying is to pinch the fuel hose. The engine RPM should increase, then go back to normal if you are set right.

I know I run 15-18% glow that will work for both 2-stroke and 4-stroke because I fly both. Also I've found synthetic fuel leaves less mess. Also if you haven't done so already, turn your muffler nozzle so it is pointing up, this will reduce the amount of mess you have to clean after the flight, most of it will be on top of the wing instead of all over the body.
Old 07-30-2013, 10:25 AM
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Default RE: Self taught flying - My diary / progress

I started her up with the low idle in the middle of the hole and it seems ot idle quite well. I reset the high end revs and then tried the idle for a while and hte transition is fairly smooth. theres a couple of splutters but from an instant change from idle to wide open I'd say it takes 2 - 3 seconds to reach full rpm.

You should have instant throttle response with no burbling sputtering hesitation at all, it should sit there and idle for 2-3 minutes and still transition without sputter or delay, the low speed screw still needs a 1/4 turn or more. You relly need to get this tuned out or your bound to have another dead stick, they usually happen on an aborted landing when you try to throttle up and get away.
Old 07-30-2013, 11:53 AM
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Default RE: Self taught flying - My diary / progress

Its too windy tonight. 15 - 20mph gusts. Looking like a simulator night.

ill try richening and the pinch test to check the mix.

what i also learnt was that there should be slight white smoke coming from the muffler and when you put your hand there it gets oil on it. There is a defenite white smoke and my hand gets oily in seconds when behind the muffler. Can it still be lean even with these signs of richness?
Old 07-30-2013, 11:54 AM
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carl24bpool
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Ps i did fly tonight but it was a 5m power kite. It was windy enough to lift me up and I'm 18 stone. It was good fun though.
Old 07-30-2013, 12:04 PM
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Default RE: Self taught flying - My diary / progress

Carl, you will always have oil come out of the exhaust. And you can still have some smoke, so don't use that to judge. Use the pinch test to tell if you are set right. Works every time. OH, and what is 18 stone? We here in the US are not really familiar with that expression.
Old 07-30-2013, 12:17 PM
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carl24bpool
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Default RE: Self taught flying - My diary / progress

Stone are the next weight up from pounds. Surey you guys use pounds. Certainly in boxing at least?

14 pound in a stone so I weigh around 250 pound. Thats what I meant. lol
Old 07-30-2013, 12:34 PM
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Default RE: Self taught flying - My diary / progress

Got ya. We don't use that here. We just go up to ton after pound. Personally I would think carrying around 18 stones with your 250 lbs would get tiring after a while, wouldn't it? I'll stick with my 235 lbs and no stones. Ha ha ha.
Old 07-30-2013, 01:06 PM
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Default RE: Self taught flying - My diary / progress

I taught myself to fly with the MultiPlex EasyStar.
The pusher-type prop never broke. The Elapor EPO foam was very durable. And, the three-channel radio was simple.

You guys are asking for trouble!
Old 07-30-2013, 01:58 PM
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ORIGINAL: ssautter

I taught myself to fly with the MultiPlex EasyStar.
The pusher-type prop never broke. The Elapor EPO foam was very durable. And, the three-channel radio was simple.

You guys are asking for trouble!
I wouldn't say I'm asking for trouble. It's harder but nitro is what I had already so I'm not going out and buying electric just to learn. I'm still confident ill learn to fly nitro quickly.

Hopefully I can get out tomorrow and you can see a video of my progress. Weather permitting anyway.
Old 07-30-2013, 02:52 PM
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Default RE: Self taught flying - My diary / progress

Go for it Carl . These foamy electrics just wouldn't understand . And I fly both !!! ENJOY !!! RED
Old 07-30-2013, 03:33 PM
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ORIGINAL: carl24bpool

Its too windy tonight. 15 - 20mph gusts. Looking like a simulator night.

ill try richening and the pinch test to check the mix.

what i also learnt was that there should be slight white smoke coming from the muffler and when you put your hand there it gets oil on it. There is a defenite white smoke and my hand gets oily in seconds when behind the muffler. Can it still be lean even with these signs of richness?

I said, it may need a little leaning out, it sounds like too rich on the low adjustment, you do realize there are two adjustments, you high speed needle valve and the low speed needle valve.
when the low speed is rich you'll get a little sputtering and hesitation along with losts of smoke when throttle is advanced to full from idle, when low adjustment is tto lean then it will just stall when advanced to full from idle.
Old 07-30-2013, 03:39 PM
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ORIGINAL: a70eliminator


ORIGINAL: carl24bpool

Its too windy tonight. 15 - 20mph gusts. Looking like a simulator night.

ill try richening and the pinch test to check the mix.

what i also learnt was that there should be slight white smoke coming from the muffler and when you put your hand there it gets oil on it. There is a defenite white smoke and my hand gets oily in seconds when behind the muffler. Can it still be lean even with these signs of richness?

I said, it may need a little leaning out, it sounds like too rich on the low adjustment, you do realize there are two adjustments, you high speed needle valve and the low speed needle valve.
when the low speed is rich you'll get a little sputtering and hesitation along with losts of smoke when throttle is advanced to full from idle, when low adjustment is tto lean then it will just stall when advanced to full from idle.
fully aware of both valves yes but cant seem to get low revs right. Ill try tiny adjustments next time to lean out a bit. That's screwing out at liw end.
Old 07-30-2013, 04:44 PM
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Default RE: Self taught flying - My diary / progress

Carl, check out this link. I tuned my engine to this and it worked. http://www.rc-airplane-advisor.com/m...ne-tuning.html
Old 07-30-2013, 05:48 PM
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Default RE: Self taught flying - My diary / progress

Carl, greetings from SoCal.
Like you, I taught myself how to fly at an accelerated pace. It was possibly the most fun I ever had flying rc!
It looks to me your doing fantastic, probably as good as half of the veterans in my club, lol!
I have two .46 engines that run bad on 10% but run great on 15 %. Maybe something to think about.
Also glow plugs on new engines can get contaminated with fine bits of metal and run to cold but look fine when powered. Fairly common I think.
Keep trying (Up High) new moves, explore all your control throws at different speeds (Bang Those Sticks)!
Keep it up, your going to be a good pilot!
Scott
Old 07-30-2013, 06:40 PM
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Default RE: Self taught flying - My diary / progress

I to am fully self tought. Aircraft had always fascinated me from an early age.My father and I put together a stick kit that was rubber band propulsion.this kit was a full stick build and was covered with tissue cloth dope and a hair dryer.It had about a 24 inch wing span the wings and fuselage were fully built up. Wind it and throw it and then hope for the best....I believe I was about 9 or 10. At that time. Two years later I got a kadet jr and built that but never flew it. With in 6 years I had built 4 planes and did not fly any.  P-51 mustang. Ws. 46.....  Real sporty. 32 in ws
Top flight gold edition p-40.  These planes sat around for a while, and then I decided it was time to fly.  I had an 80 acre field behind and in front of my house.I HAD PREVIOUSLY ATTEMPTED FLIGHT WITH A 40size trainer,it was in the air for about 30 seconds. After that I purchased a sturdy birdy from tower hobbies. After many Saturdays of failure and frustration and in all honesty about an additional 600 dollars I could actually fly!!!!!!!Ii
I could take of complete several circuits of the field in a controlled manor and land when and were I wanted to. I was extremely happy, it had taken many many crashes lots of determination and money.That day I did that was about 20 years ago.In hind sight I should have joined a club and been mentored, it would have saved me time money and frustration.  Needless to say I'm still envolved in the hobby today and am presently working on my second twin engine aircraft.....stick with it and you will succeed....
Old 07-31-2013, 01:35 AM
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Thanks again for the link and positive coments guys. Keep em coming. It all helpps my confidence when flying.

I can fly around in a fairly controlled manner. What I need to get the hang of is flying an even rectangle as sometimes I tend to fall into flying ovals and around my head. Directional orientation is not a problem as it seems second nature for me to turn the right way. Flying towards myself inverted would hurt my head but its not something I'll be doing with a trainer just yet.

It doesn't seem as windy today so hopefully I can get out later for some fun and hopefully my lad can come and video the entire flight. We will see what happens.
Old 07-31-2013, 01:55 AM
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ORIGINAL: VCScott

It was possibly the most fun I ever had flying rc!

That is sooooo true.

I well remember the completely absorbing experiences of those first years. A bit like finding a new woman ... except the feelings lasted longer. It's been nearly 30 years and I'm still wedded to model planes. I couldn't imagine doing that with a woman; except out of habit, maybe.



Teaching yourself is very rewarding, but by God, it's a stony path to tread. If you are going to do it properly, it will lead you to research; since you will discover problems that you can't readily conceptualise. But, the answers are there, in the books. Lots of "Ahaaah" moments to enjoy.



On reflection, after nearly 30 years of model flying, I'm glad that I chose the more difficult path ... although that was the result of chance. I had no idea that there such things as clubs and instructors. You see, if I'd joined a club, I might have been lucky enough to find a good instructor ... but, there are many duffers, masquerading as instructors. I might more easily have fallen victim to one of those and been bequeathed a life-time of bad habits. As far as instruction goes, it's Russian Roulette, out there.

If you teach yourself ... and turn out duff ... at least you'll know who to blame.
Old 07-31-2013, 02:57 AM
  #44  
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lol - bogbeagle.

Wise words.

I'm loving hte self teaching route and the excitement of hte next flight and hopng to come back with a plane in one piece is great. I kind of like the anxiety and anticipation. I find myself constantly looking at the trees out of my home office window to see how windy it is and whether I will get a flight today. At present it looks like calm with say 7mph gusts which I'm willing ot fly in.

I've not flown for 3 days and its killing me. I want to spend a few hours nailing landings and getting used to turning and keeping level.

Then progress to using the rudder to line up on approach.

Old 07-31-2013, 05:45 AM
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Default RE: Self taught flying - My diary / progress

hey Carl.. probably a silly question, RE the needle valves...
I have not been able to find a good answer to the following about your engine .. the LOW speed needle valve:
the low speed can be either a proper needle valve (turn it IN to LEAN the mixture, turn OUT to richen)
OR it can be a bleed air valve: (turn it OUT <allowing more air into the mix> to LEAN the mixture, turn IN to richen)
do you know which type you've got?
Old 07-31-2013, 06:33 AM
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Default RE: Self taught flying - My diary / progress

Carl, maintaining orientation while the plane is flying, and understanding how to operate the controls to make the plane go the right way, even when it is coming at you is not easy. Good for you for getting it this early in your training.

Work on that box pattern. You might first try a racetrack pattern, then expand it till you are flying a box. You will find that when you can fly a nice box pattern this will help setting yourself up with the approach. Remember, in order to have a good landing, you need to have a good approach. Keep at it, it will come. Also, remember, if you can see the plane, you will have control of it. It will be out of sight before you loose radio control (batteries not withstanding).

One other thing you might want to start doing, establish a foul line. Draw an imaginary line, left to right, immediately in front of you. The plane should never be flown past this line. The reason for this is safety, anyone watching you should be behind you, and you want to keep the plane away from them if anything goes wrong.
Old 07-31-2013, 06:34 AM
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Hi,

Its an air bleed screw so like you say you turn it in to richen it and out to lean it. Its fairly primitive to be honest and being a Magnum engine its not the best. I'm going to try the pinch test.

High speed works okay but seems to rattle loose so I've stuck a cable tie around the two prongs that hold it steady. Hopefully this will address any mid air full throttle mixture changes.

As for low speed I need to tweak it a little more and see how it goes.

I'll run another test for overheating later and see how it runs. Hopefully I can get a full tank through it. I'm going to try and simulate a flight on ground by using different throttle ranges and then the low throttle for a few minutes prior to landing. Hopefully I can get a full tank through without problem.

Worst case I'm also going to try and get my Irvine 40 running too so I have options.
Old 07-31-2013, 09:15 AM
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Default RE: Self taught flying - My diary / progress

You won't get the same results running the engine on the ground as you would flying because without the airplane moving forward through the air, the prop will never get the chance to unload. Running a full tank of fuel through the engine on the ground is more or less just a waste of a tank of fuel.
Old 07-31-2013, 09:55 AM
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ORIGINAL: JollyPopper

You won't get the same results running the engine on the ground as you would flying because without the airplane moving forward through the air, the prop will never get the chance to unload. Running a full tank of fuel through the engine on the ground is more or less just a waste of a tank of fuel.
Surely its a better option that sending it up without testing?
Old 07-31-2013, 10:29 AM
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ORIGINAL: carl24bpool

Surely its a better option that sending it up without testing?
I'd say no, at least not a whole tank of fuel... 1-2 minutes at the most is really as much as you'd need to run it.
once it's warmed up and the needle valves are set, it should either keep running or quit within a min or two.

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