Difference between Spektrum and Xtreme...comments welcome
02-27-2007, 11:49 PM
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RE: Difference between Spektrum and Xtreme...comments welcome
Again, please point to where in the above referenced documents you are getting that. What I read is that the minimum 6db bandwidth for DSSS is 500khz, by my math that makes for a possible 167 channels. FHSS channel carrier frequencies must have a minimum of 25khz separation or the 20db bandwidth, whichever is greater and must use a minimum of 75 hopping channels with a maximum 20db bandwidth of 1mhz. I dont know where you are getting 80 channels and an additional 20 with strict guidelines out of that but if I am misunderstanding something I would appreciate if someone more knowledgeable would please point it out. FHSS using the maximum 1mhz channels would equal 83, and I dont believe they are using that much. And both the Xtremelink and Futaba systems are hybrid FHDSSS systems, not FHSS.
03-20-2007, 02:34 PM
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RE: Difference between Spektrum and Xtreme...comments welcome
Technically, we could have 390,000+ planes flying at the exact same time on 2.4GHz spread spectrum. That is the theoretical maximum limit. We use only 12 "channels" that are 5MHz wide, and can easily fly 10 planes on each "channel" at the exact same time, even when filled by both Futaba and Spektrum noise.
03-21-2007, 10:33 PM
#29
RE: Difference between Spektrum and Xtreme...comments welcome
Please try to come up with some better acronyms
the fdss fhdsss etc., sounds like a pit full of snakes hissing
How about mebbe SSHFD (shifty)
the fdss fhdsss etc., sounds like a pit full of snakes hissing
How about mebbe SSHFD (shifty)
03-22-2007, 10:59 AM
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RE: Difference between Spektrum and Xtreme...comments welcome
ORIGINAL: JimDrew
Technically, we could have 390,000+ planes flying at the exact same time on 2.4GHz spread spectrum. That is the theoretical maximum limit. We use only 12 "channels" that are 5MHz wide, and can easily fly 10 planes on each "channel" at the exact same time, even when filled by both Futaba and Spektrum noise.
Technically, we could have 390,000+ planes flying at the exact same time on 2.4GHz spread spectrum. That is the theoretical maximum limit. We use only 12 "channels" that are 5MHz wide, and can easily fly 10 planes on each "channel" at the exact same time, even when filled by both Futaba and Spektrum noise.
Interestingly either 'your' time will soon come (or has already passed) because instead of claims we will have 'at the field------in the hands of routine pilots' feed back to consider. The clock is still ticking at the moment---------also known as "we shall see"-------finally!!
03-22-2007, 09:43 PM
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RE: Difference between Spektrum and Xtreme...comments welcome
I always have to laugh when I see people slamming Spektrum while fawning about how great Xtreme is. Spektrum has been out on the market for over a year with aviation products and they have been in the market for much longer with their ground products. Spektrum's future products are already in the hands of testers and the AMA as the DX6 and DX7 were months before their actual release. Xtreme has been used by a small handful of people and only under the watch and control of Xtreme.
When Spektrum announces a release of a product, they usually release on time. Xtreme has been promising multiple product releases for Oct...ooops, Nov...ooops, Dec...ooops, Jan, Feb, Mar... If Xtreme's product is as good as its business planning, then I would be concerned about it.
I'll stick with Spektrum which is a known and long tested product that is developed by a company that seems to be pretty reliable that also has a good distributer network to most LHS.
When Spektrum announces a release of a product, they usually release on time. Xtreme has been promising multiple product releases for Oct...ooops, Nov...ooops, Dec...ooops, Jan, Feb, Mar... If Xtreme's product is as good as its business planning, then I would be concerned about it.
I'll stick with Spektrum which is a known and long tested product that is developed by a company that seems to be pretty reliable that also has a good distributer network to most LHS.
03-24-2007, 09:56 PM
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RE: Difference between Spektrum and Xtreme...comments welcome
When Spektrum announces a release of a product, they usually release on time. Xtreme has been promising multiple product releases for Oct...ooops, Nov...ooops, Dec...ooops, Jan, Feb, Mar... If Xtreme's product is as good as its business planning, then I would be concerned about it.
And its funny how everyone on the Spektrum bandwagon doesnt think anyone else can bring a good product to market. Since Spektrum was first thye must be the only ones capable, everyone else is "playing catchup." I think once this thing shakes out and several systems are avialable Spektrum will be an after thought.
03-25-2007, 08:53 AM
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RE: Difference between Spektrum and Xtreme...comments welcome
Why? Because I have been following this from the start and am tireed of people making statements that are innacurate? Or because I dont like Spektrum? Either way the answer is no I do not.
03-25-2007, 09:53 AM
#35
RE: Difference between Spektrum and Xtreme...comments welcome
I detect a wee bit of hostility--
But to be candid - tho you may not like SPEKTRUM-- that does not mean it is not completely viable .
I am really betting when the other Johnny-Come -Lately system actually get into the hands of the eager (but not always technically astute) model guys - problems will arise which were simply never expected .
Maybe not big ones-- just little niggling ones - but they will occur.
I find a few thingabout my Spectrums that I don't care for -but they are little things and compared to the things I positively loathed about the preceeding 72.xx stuff - I am happy as pup .
But to be candid - tho you may not like SPEKTRUM-- that does not mean it is not completely viable .
I am really betting when the other Johnny-Come -Lately system actually get into the hands of the eager (but not always technically astute) model guys - problems will arise which were simply never expected .
Maybe not big ones-- just little niggling ones - but they will occur.
I find a few thingabout my Spectrums that I don't care for -but they are little things and compared to the things I positively loathed about the preceeding 72.xx stuff - I am happy as pup .
03-25-2007, 09:58 AM
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RE: Difference between Spektrum and Xtreme...comments welcome
that does not mean it is not completely viable .
03-25-2007, 11:01 AM
#37
RE: Difference between Spektrum and Xtreme...comments welcome
Not picking on you -
way back when -I did work as a new product engineer - I would look at our products -compared to competition - in the field - then propose and in some cases develop/design equipment to hopefully, replace competition's equipment .
Everyone does it . At least , any successful ones do it.
The thing that also ALWAYS happens --is that -- no matter how you shake n dance -- at least two drops go down yer pants.
Just part of the big picture
The engineers blame manufacturing/ purchasing / tooling/ mfg eng/ - mfg blames sales - sales blames engineering and around and around it goes .
Sometimes - I missed the target on what the customers really wanted - so all the rest of it meant - nothing-.
Same thing happened mfg, selling models n kits for --20 years .
All business are the same - really.
way back when -I did work as a new product engineer - I would look at our products -compared to competition - in the field - then propose and in some cases develop/design equipment to hopefully, replace competition's equipment .
Everyone does it . At least , any successful ones do it.
The thing that also ALWAYS happens --is that -- no matter how you shake n dance -- at least two drops go down yer pants.
Just part of the big picture
The engineers blame manufacturing/ purchasing / tooling/ mfg eng/ - mfg blames sales - sales blames engineering and around and around it goes .
Sometimes - I missed the target on what the customers really wanted - so all the rest of it meant - nothing-.
Same thing happened mfg, selling models n kits for --20 years .
All business are the same - really.
03-25-2007, 11:22 AM
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RE: Difference between Spektrum and Xtreme...comments welcome
Not picking on you -
And it wasnt taken as such. Just setting the record straight, again...
03-25-2007, 06:41 PM
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RE: Difference between Spektrum and Xtreme...comments welcome
I went thru a couple of "what was that?" issues with one of my 6100's (none of the 7000s) and did some swapping of 6100 rx to other models .
Apparantly, the problem is - enviroment - more specifically electrical /power supply enviroment.that is-- in some cases the ESC/BEC setup is not friendly. and the problem pops up in these cases
when swapping the rx to other model (different enviroment) - the problems vanished .
Let's see what the "fix" is . I won't venture a guess.
_____________________________
I am watching you ----
Libby
I guess product realiblity is relative, because I would consider the problem w/ Spekrum's 6100 receiver Major. I really don't think that receiver should have ever been released, or at the leat, it should have undergone more field testing. If it had. alot of planes would have been spared, and Spekrtum wouldn't look as bad as they do from it.
DM
ORIGINAL: dick Hanson
I detect a wee bit of hostility--
But to be candid - tho you may not like SPEKTRUM-- that does not mean it is not completely viable .
I am really betting when the other Johnny-Come -Lately system actually get into the hands of the eager (but not always technically astute) model guys - problems will arise which were simply never expected .
Maybe not big ones-- just little niggling ones - but they will occur.
I find a few thingabout my Spectrums that I don't care for -but they are little things and compared to the things I positively loathed about the preceeding 72.xx stuff - I am happy as pup .
I detect a wee bit of hostility--
But to be candid - tho you may not like SPEKTRUM-- that does not mean it is not completely viable .
I am really betting when the other Johnny-Come -Lately system actually get into the hands of the eager (but not always technically astute) model guys - problems will arise which were simply never expected .
Maybe not big ones-- just little niggling ones - but they will occur.
I find a few thingabout my Spectrums that I don't care for -but they are little things and compared to the things I positively loathed about the preceeding 72.xx stuff - I am happy as pup .
03-25-2007, 07:05 PM
#40
RE: Difference between Spektrum and Xtreme...comments welcome
perfection is a relative thing -
jeeze--For an entirely different radio concept -for us -I think the Spektrum is doing very well.
as an example - the Ford minivan trans is still very iffy- after over 10 years of development. No wonder Ford is sucking hind ti t.
In what -4 months - the Spektrum is a " sold out " design and has set a standard for others to follow
jeeze--For an entirely different radio concept -for us -I think the Spektrum is doing very well.
as an example - the Ford minivan trans is still very iffy- after over 10 years of development. No wonder Ford is sucking hind ti t.
In what -4 months - the Spektrum is a " sold out " design and has set a standard for others to follow
03-25-2007, 07:24 PM
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RE: Difference between Spektrum and Xtreme...comments welcome
But the Ford Minivan was AVAILABLE.
I would rather base my purchases on product developement than on availablity. If I have to wait a while for the better units, so beit. Better wait than have to deal w/ a poor product.
DM
I would rather base my purchases on product developement than on availablity. If I have to wait a while for the better units, so beit. Better wait than have to deal w/ a poor product.
DM
03-25-2007, 07:32 PM
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RE: Difference between Spektrum and Xtreme...comments welcome
On 3/24/07 I sent the following email to XPS sales:
">Will the telemetry module be available at Toledo? Cost? When will you
> start taking mail orders? Why haven't you posted any company
> info/background? Why no telephone? Sorry if I have overloaded your
> circuits ;-)<"
Here is their reply:
"The telemetry system won't be available for about 45 days after the
initial release.
We have no release date yet for the XtremeLink.
All of the information pertaining to our background has already been
stated in public forums.
We do not use telephones for our business. Everything is done via email
and Internet forums. We have run multi-million companies successfully
this way since 1992."
Did Jim say that Extreme Link would be available at Toledo? Did he mean that it would be available to purchase or that the company would be available. Their email clearly states that *no* release date has been set. If that's so why all the furor about Toledo? Why are prices advertised for modules and receivers (still vaporware) but no pricing is available for the telemetry module. Why must I search for backgroung info on the company when it could easily be posted om the XPS Web site? When you click on "About Us" all you get is "Company started Januart 1, 2006." Why the seeming secrecy? Never any telephone support? That alone is enough for me to favor Spektrum.
I'd really like to see the XPS people succeed but I'd like more info. Can anyone provide any answers to the questions posed by XPS' answer to my email?
">Will the telemetry module be available at Toledo? Cost? When will you
> start taking mail orders? Why haven't you posted any company
> info/background? Why no telephone? Sorry if I have overloaded your
> circuits ;-)<"
Here is their reply:
"The telemetry system won't be available for about 45 days after the
initial release.
We have no release date yet for the XtremeLink.
All of the information pertaining to our background has already been
stated in public forums.
We do not use telephones for our business. Everything is done via email
and Internet forums. We have run multi-million companies successfully
this way since 1992."
Did Jim say that Extreme Link would be available at Toledo? Did he mean that it would be available to purchase or that the company would be available. Their email clearly states that *no* release date has been set. If that's so why all the furor about Toledo? Why are prices advertised for modules and receivers (still vaporware) but no pricing is available for the telemetry module. Why must I search for backgroung info on the company when it could easily be posted om the XPS Web site? When you click on "About Us" all you get is "Company started Januart 1, 2006." Why the seeming secrecy? Never any telephone support? That alone is enough for me to favor Spektrum.
I'd really like to see the XPS people succeed but I'd like more info. Can anyone provide any answers to the questions posed by XPS' answer to my email?
03-25-2007, 08:14 PM
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RE: Difference between Spektrum and Xtreme...comments welcome
It says on the website that it will be available at Toledo, and yes he has said that. He also said on rcgroups that it may be available before then, hence the no release date part. I guess its one of those things you have to take at face value and be ok with it or not be comfortable with.
And I have to agree with vintage, the problems they are having with the AR6100 are more than just new product road bumps, I would say its pretty serious. Especially considering the proliferation of cheap, imported hardware in the last couple of years. Not to say that Xtremelink wont have issues, that remains to be seen, but I do agree that given the magnitude of the problem it doesnt appear that much testing was done on production run samples or their quality control sucks.
And I have to agree with vintage, the problems they are having with the AR6100 are more than just new product road bumps, I would say its pretty serious. Especially considering the proliferation of cheap, imported hardware in the last couple of years. Not to say that Xtremelink wont have issues, that remains to be seen, but I do agree that given the magnitude of the problem it doesnt appear that much testing was done on production run samples or their quality control sucks.
03-25-2007, 08:38 PM
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RE: Difference between Spektrum and Xtreme...comments welcome
ORIGINAL: Mach Buster
On 3/24/07 I sent the following email to XPS sales:
">Will the telemetry module be available at Toledo? Cost? When will you
> start taking mail orders? Why haven't you posted any company
> info/background? Why no telephone? Sorry if I have overloaded your
> circuits ;-)<"
Here is their reply:
"The telemetry system won't be available for about 45 days after the
initial release.
We have no release date yet for the XtremeLink.
All of the information pertaining to our background has already been
stated in public forums.
We do not use telephones for our business. Everything is done via email
and Internet forums. We have run multi-million companies successfully
this way since 1992."
Did Jim say that Extreme Link would be available at Toledo? Did he mean that it would be available to purchase or that the company would be available. Their email clearly states that *no* release date has been set. If that's so why all the furor about Toledo? Why are prices advertised for modules and receivers (still vaporware) but no pricing is available for the telemetry module. Why must I search for backgroung info on the company when it could easily be posted om the XPS Web site? When you click on "About Us" all you get is "Company started Januart 1, 2006." Why the seeming secrecy? Never any telephone support? That alone is enough for me to favor Spektrum.
I'd really like to see the XPS people succeed but I'd like more info. Can anyone provide any answers to the questions posed by XPS' answer to my email?
On 3/24/07 I sent the following email to XPS sales:
">Will the telemetry module be available at Toledo? Cost? When will you
> start taking mail orders? Why haven't you posted any company
> info/background? Why no telephone? Sorry if I have overloaded your
> circuits ;-)<"
Here is their reply:
"The telemetry system won't be available for about 45 days after the
initial release.
We have no release date yet for the XtremeLink.
All of the information pertaining to our background has already been
stated in public forums.
We do not use telephones for our business. Everything is done via email
and Internet forums. We have run multi-million companies successfully
this way since 1992."
Did Jim say that Extreme Link would be available at Toledo? Did he mean that it would be available to purchase or that the company would be available. Their email clearly states that *no* release date has been set. If that's so why all the furor about Toledo? Why are prices advertised for modules and receivers (still vaporware) but no pricing is available for the telemetry module. Why must I search for backgroung info on the company when it could easily be posted om the XPS Web site? When you click on "About Us" all you get is "Company started Januart 1, 2006." Why the seeming secrecy? Never any telephone support? That alone is enough for me to favor Spektrum.
I'd really like to see the XPS people succeed but I'd like more info. Can anyone provide any answers to the questions posed by XPS' answer to my email?
.
.
Just makes you wonder how a company that currently consists of two guys are going to support a couple thousand XPS units once they get into the field, eh?
.
.
.
03-25-2007, 10:24 PM
#45
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RE: Difference between Spektrum and Xtreme...comments welcome
One more question to ponder, Why are the only other two systems (soon to be available or at least announced) not using Spektrum DSS technology??????????
Me thinks FHDSS "could be" better technoloy.................
Me thinks FHDSS "could be" better technoloy.................
03-26-2007, 11:36 AM
#46
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RE: Difference between Spektrum and Xtreme...comments welcome
Or.... just "different".
You know, like one radio uses positive going pulses, others use negative.
Depends on which engineering school of hard knocks the designer/creator graduated (or dropped out) from...
You know, like one radio uses positive going pulses, others use negative.
Depends on which engineering school of hard knocks the designer/creator graduated (or dropped out) from...
ORIGINAL: RTK
One more question to ponder, Why are the only other two systems (soon to be available or at least announced) not using Spektrum DSS technology??????????
Me thinks FHDSS "could be" better technoloy.................
One more question to ponder, Why are the only other two systems (soon to be available or at least announced) not using Spektrum DSS technology??????????
Me thinks FHDSS "could be" better technoloy.................
03-26-2007, 12:22 PM
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RE: Difference between Spektrum and Xtreme...comments welcome
I'm not an engineer or technically trained in this field but,,,,, I would think hopping is be a better way of dealing with interference than locking into (2) channels
03-26-2007, 03:13 PM
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RE: Difference between Spektrum and Xtreme...comments welcome
RTK..
I agree, as do many others here. Reduntancy is the key.
We'll see just how reliable these systems are. They sure do look better made.
DM
I agree, as do many others here. Reduntancy is the key.
We'll see just how reliable these systems are. They sure do look better made.
DM
03-26-2007, 04:40 PM
#49
RE: Difference between Spektrum and Xtreme...comments welcome
RTK-- the Spektrum is a proprietary system--That is why no one else is using it.
Perhaps it is available as a licensed/whatever -
But- FWIW-- It does work very well
you have not tried it? -
Our field is LOADED with em and everybody that has em likes em
thats everybody- not a single exception.
Some of the DX6 setups were head scrratchers but usually because the guys set em up incorrectly.
I had one iffy rx - put it in a different enviroment - presto no problems .
sold on it?
you bet.
Perhaps it is available as a licensed/whatever -
But- FWIW-- It does work very well
you have not tried it? -
Our field is LOADED with em and everybody that has em likes em
thats everybody- not a single exception.
Some of the DX6 setups were head scrratchers but usually because the guys set em up incorrectly.
I had one iffy rx - put it in a different enviroment - presto no problems .
sold on it?
you bet.
03-26-2007, 04:48 PM
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RE: Difference between Spektrum and Xtreme...comments welcome
Gotcha Dick
Still,,, in my little pea brain it seems to be an inferior way to go if running in a highly saturated 2.4 RF environment.
I have not tried it, you know me waiting for the guy's in orange to make the 14mzg I might try one of those plug in modules for my 9z when they hit the market.
Still,,, in my little pea brain it seems to be an inferior way to go if running in a highly saturated 2.4 RF environment.
I have not tried it, you know me waiting for the guy's in orange to make the 14mzg
I might try one of those plug in modules for my 9z when they hit the market.