Albatross

My Feedback: (7)

Quick question:
What distance shoul I adjust the ignition sensor for a 50 RV engine?
(The RC Showcase web site already incldes this specification for 50 NG could not find the one for 50RV)

Thanks

Oilsands

You could check this site, it may help although it does not list the 50 RV. http://www.zdz-modelmotor.cz/zdz/en/

k_caller

My Feedback: (1)

According to ZDZ, the 50cc motor (they don't state any differences in RV or NG- just 50cc) should be 3.5mm.

Albatross

My Feedback: (7)

Their FAQ section states:

# osition the piston exactly TDC
# Measure the distance from the center of the magnet to the center of the sensor (see image above). Image not included
# Set this distance to: 5mm for the 40RV-L and 50NG engines
# Set this distance to: 6 mm for 60/80/80B2/100B2 engines
# Set this distance to: 7 mm for 120B2 and 160 Champion engines
# Set this distance to: 9 mm for the 210B2 engine

I bought the 50 RV years ago just prior to the introduction of the 50NG and recall that there were some differences among the ignition sensor position.

Can anybody check one of those old engine owner maulas that used to be suplied with the 50 RV?

Thanks

JoeAirPort

My Feedback: (41)

My (2) 50NG's are a year old. The manuals came with hand written corrections and I think mine were changed to 6 mm. They run great.

Alejandro what are you using this engine on now?

Saludos
Joe

Albatross

My Feedback: (7)

Hi Joe

Thanks to reply!

6 mm sounds close to the one I used to set.
The RV and NG had some differences though and this was one of them.
I will start setting 6 mm and see what happens.

The Airplane I am going to put this engine on will be the 28% YAK BME.
Although will come bit heavier, as all we know this airplane never meet the anounced specs, I still will give it a try.

This should be my back up airplane and most likely used as IMAC-pattern flying. I am still flying the Edge H9 33%. The BME 110 is settling down and I think am leraning how to live with it. Not too bad after all, 6500 rpm on 27X10 Mejzlick !! with stock mufflers.

As far as I recall the 2nd generation of these airplanes was provided with a bit larger wing area.

What about your's?

Regards!

Alejandro

JoeAirPort

My Feedback: (41)

# Set this distance to: 5mm changed to 6mm for the 40RV-L and 50NG engines
# Set this distance to: 6 mm changed to 6.5mm for 60/80/80B2/100B2 engines
The bigger engines were the same.

-I'm running one 50NG on a 30% BME Edge, awesome flyer.
-The other is on an Ultra RC 30% Yak (same as Extreme Flight). AWESOME flyer if I could only keep the engine from shaking the bolts off the cowling, breaking off cowling tabs, or shearing cowling bolts. The engine shakes the heck out of this plane, especially at low idle.

But they both run amazingly well. I 3D the heck of them, torture them with g force, unusual attitudes, at all throttle settings, and they just keep running.

Albatross

My Feedback: (7)

Glad to hear that your engines and airplanes are doing OK!

mm... did you say vibrations?
Make sure to firmly tight the spark plug, short of that and the seemingly already fixed hard starting behavior , ZDZ 50 engines run fine.

c ya !

bob_nj

My Feedback: (62)

I know this is an old thread, but I'm a new user and have a few questions.
Just wound up with a 50NG.

TIMING - To set the timing, it seems like there is some play if you position the piston on at TDC.
This is normal, but I'm not sure where to set the sensor in reference to this play?
The site listed above uses a reference to "x"mm before TDC with the new ignitions.
Mine has a Falkon ignition, so I'm not sure what distances to use for sensor or piston position?

SERIAL# - Engine is relatively new, but is an older engine that hadn't been used.
Serial # is 27841
Anyone know how to determine the approximate age?

PLUG - The site above lists the new ingitions with no spark plug gasket.
Is this true for an older engine like mine?

CARB - Carb is a W76A. I see there were/are options for a 201W carb.
Is this carb lots better?

STARTING - When my buddy has this engine, it was VERY hard to start.
The timing may be off which doesn't help, but what is the preferred method
to start the engine?

I've contacted R/C Showcase and am waiting for a call back.
Just thought I'd throw this out there in the meantime.

Thanks for any ideas.
Bob

JoeAirPort

My Feedback: (41)

-If you want you can get the crank positioned in the center of the play by looking at the piston as you turn it. Just wiggle the crank back and forth in the play, then center it in the play. I don't know if the distance changes with the old to new ignition but my manual shows a scratched out 5mm with a 6mm written next to it. So possibly the Falcon was 5mm. First just line up the prop hub magnet with the web on the case and it's very close (see pic). Then measure the distance from the magnet to the pickup and you're set. Don't crank the screw down too hard when you tighten it and use a little Permatex Ultra copper on it to keep it from loosening (or any good RTV).

-Mine doesn't have a spark plug gasket. Torque the plug to 15 ft-lbs or risk it falling out.

-The WT-201 starts a little easier. I've heard the mid range is cleaner too. My year old NG has a WT-201 since I special requested it. New ones come as standard now. Personally don't know how the W76A-1 is.

-Starting mine's a breeze but it used to be hard when I didn't know how. In general ZDZ/RCShowcase recommends the 5-5-1 method:
5 flips ignition off, full throttle, full choke (or keep flipping until it makes a squishy sound).
5 flips with ignition off, full throttle, no choke.
1 flip high idle, ignition on, no choke.

Here's where I had to improvise to spend less time flipping and more time flying:
The first 5 priming flips may end up being 10-20 flips depending on many things: How cold it is outside, how long it's been since you ran the engine, how well your choke seats, how well your pump in your carb is working. What I do is what Dick Hanson taught me in the forum. Keep flipping during the prime until you hear a squishy sound in the cylinder. That means the fuel has arrived. Also during the 1 flip at high idle: I generally keep the choke partially on for a gauranteed one flip start. It keeps running because the choking makes it rich which is what you want for a cold engine. After a few seconds I remove the choke. Without this choking trick I wouldn't want to have to start my engine. It just doesn't seem to start too easy without it. I may be doing something wrong but it works. My 2-stroke snow blower won't start and stay running without the choke until it's warm. I guess maybe that's why it works on the 50 NG.

bob_nj

My Feedback: (62)

Thanks alot Joe.

On the plug torque;

Should I use the ZDZ wrench and a crows foot, or is there a thin walled socket
that will work?

What is the serial# of your year old engine?
Maybe I can determine the approximate age of mine from that.

Take Care
Bob

JoeAirPort

My Feedback: (41)

I actually take ZDZ's socket and put it inside a 3/4" deep well socket (pretty sure it's 3/4"). Then I use a torque wrench on the 3/4" deep well (15 ft-lbs). Works great. I think one of my deep well sockets fits the plug directly but it's so tight that it's a pain to get on and off the plug. The ZDZ one fits better.

I can look at the S/N when I get home.

bob_nj

My Feedback: (62)

Good idea, and thanks for looking for the serial# info!

Take care
Bob

bob_nj

My Feedback: (62)

Looks like the timing on this engine was a little retarded [X(]
I set it to 6mm and am hoping for the best.

Is there an alternative to solder for the choke butterfly hole?
I'm not pulling the engine off right now, and I can't get solder where it needs to be.
It doesn't seem to want to stick either.
Don't want to get any down the intake.

Thanks for the help
Bob

Zeeb

My Feedback: (41)

Umm.... That timing is advanced Bob, not retarded....

I'd try the existing choke plate before you get too carried away with the soldering up the hole deal and see what happens. You MUST make sure the choke plate is closing all the way or you'll be wasting your time. If it doesn't want to start and you don't have the "snotty nose" sound I mentioned in another post, it's not pulling enough fuel and the solder mod would be in order.

FWIW, I had a 50-RV which I got used on a model with the older carb and it had the solder mod. It started okay but was a bit uneven on the transition and quite a bit of burbling (four stroking) at the lower mid range power settings. I got the new 201 carb from RCS and it did improve the transition and mid range on the RV and it was used without the solder mod. One of the things mentioned about the 201 is that it is supposed to improve starting, but not too many people mention that it also improves the mid range, or at least IMHO it does.

When I bought the 50-NG new, it came with the older carb as well (IIRC RCS now ships them with the 201?) so I changed that carb for the 201 I'd gotten. The NG has always started well and the mid range is great once it got broken in and I could lean out bottom end a bit. I've not had any problem starting either the RV or the NG with the 201 carb in it's unmodified condition.

If you have problems getting it started without the solder mod, I'd give the idea of getting the newer model carb some serious consideration.

bob_nj

My Feedback: (62)

I will consider the 201.
Also got the choke plate soldered this morning since i needed to add some thrust to the engine.

I'm hoping not to have to deal with midrange woes as my last 50cc engine was awful.
Doesn't the rotary valve take care of some of the reed valve, fuel puddling, burbling stuff?


Thanks
Bob