Redharris

So....

Have you all Noticed the RXB Prototype that will Show at the IHOBBY Convention has a Totally redesigned Suspension?

It's looks like C-Hub now, as opposed to the PBS from this last year.....

I wonder if Himoto is going to do the same with the RXT line.

I wonder WHY they did it.... People seem to really Like the RXB and RXT, and the PBS style suspension is so easy to Adjust.....

ehroof

I am finding out all the info and will let you know.

shadey10

I wonder if it has any effect from the joint venture with Himoto and JQ Products or is the JQ Product line totally it's own entitiy? Either way it looks like JQ will be putting out some nice stuff and I'd hope that he would be making parts for the Himoto line as well.

{GBI}Harryball

PBS for me. hope they dont change it. That wouldnt be good. [&o]

ehroof

Here are some pictures of the rxb-2, has boot covered universal joints in the front, dust cover. Looks like a real nice supsension system. I will let you know more as i find out more.

ehroof

2 more pictures

shadey10

That does look like a nice suspension setup. Makes me wonder if should go ahead and get the RXT-1 Truggy and wait for the RXB-2 to come out. Lord knows I can't own just one RC and I was going to get the Truggy down the road anyways.

ehroof

i have a feeling there will be an rxt-2 coming soon also. but I love my rxt-1 and i dont personally own the rxb-1 but will very soon but i have heard nothing but good about it.

ugly duck

PBS and the Redcat Monsoon's "kingpin" suspension (totally mislabeled, by the way) have a high surface area and rely on close tolerances, but when they get dusty and dirty they get really sticky. This affects both steering and suspension travel. Racers don't like that.

C-hub suspension (which really IS a kingpin design, in the classic sense of the word) doesn't bind up and doesn't really rely on such close tolerances, because the steering axis points are further apart. Also, the steering bushings have nothing to do with suspension travel, so it doesn't matter if you're steering while you're coming off a bump or not: you get more consistent performance.

I've also heard complaints about PBS not being able to steer as far from straight ahead as a C-hub design, and I can totally see that. C-hub can turn as far as the clearance around it will allow, or until the CVD/Dogbone binds up. PBS can only turn so far, or else the "cup" of the hub is too weak to retain the ball. Another advantage for racers: maneuverability after a pileup. The "kingpin" suspension would have similar turning radius to the C-hub, due to the on-axis ball.

C-hub is heavier and doesn't provide as good a suspension geometry as PBS (up/down suspension pivots are further inboard due to the design of the C-hub) but otherwise I think racers prefer it.

Redharris

U.D....
I have "heard " the same talking points in your Post, from folks at the LHS, the Track, and here in the Forums.
I would also add that (I have heard) PBS is Much easier/faster to adjust at the track, if a racer wishes to do so, and Thats what Some folks Like about PBS.
Since I'm not an accomplished racer, it's impossible for me to say how much of it is Hot Air and how much the Truth.

I CAN tell you all what I have personally Witnessed though......

I own a Monsoon, and I HAVE had some steering issues with it on the Track. To be fair, I think it is more of a Parts issue(steering plate) than a design issue.

I have seen that Kupplers RXT-1 steers better (right out of the box) than I have ever gotten my Monsoon to do, even with careful tuning and a few mods for improvement. Again, to be fair, the RTR servos in Both of these Truggys need upgrading.

All of this is MOOT though. The NEW stuff is not for sale yet. We do not yet KNOW what Himoto will do. Perhaps the Prototype is only for show at the I HOBBY show to gauge reaction....

Whatever happens....the current model is popular, and I am guessing that any new model will find its Fans as well. Himoto has always supported ALL its models, so parts should not be a problem for anybody.

HOWEVER.......
A friend of mine bought some Billet upgrade parts (from Himoto) for his RXB-1 and he had to Dremel and Drill them to make them Fit his buggy! This is not a good thing..... Parts bought for a particular car should FIT a particular car.....We hope this is not a Trend for the Future.

ugly duck

Well I've never owned a PBS car, but I can see how a PBS would be limited in steering angle or possibly even suspension travel by the design of a the ball joint sticking through the hub, off-axis from the direction of pivot. I can also see how PBS would get gunked up and require more maintanence than a C-hub. I cannot see how adjusting camber on a PBS would be quicker than on a C-hub, though - it's still essentially one turnbuckle that you crank on. Adjusting rear toe might be easier, though, assuming it's a 3 point PBS rear end like the 1/10 trucks have, compared to a toe block system like many other trucks have.

Anyway, I'm not arguing, I'm just pointing out that there might be good reason for Himoto to change to C-hub suspension, even though it seems like a step backwards to some people. It might actually be an improvement!

ehroof

They should have contacted us and let us know, maybe they were the wrong parts or miss milled. We cant correct a problem that we dont know about

vnmsgt

I have had C-hub cars and PBS. Once I got a PBS car I liked it so much better. No more broken knuckles, loose of fallen out knuckle screws and all around easier to adjust track width and camber. I think the reliability of PBS is alot higher than C-hub too because of all this. Unless it comes out with CNC machined 7075 knuckles from the factory on RTR and KIT it WILL be a step back IMO.

ehroof

Here are some details about it also (RXB-2)

- 3 differentials and 4WD straight shaft transmission system.
- Universal joints are used in all parts of this car to achieve flexible
control.
- New Dust Protect Cover (Design Patent) is used in all transmission shafts.
- The caster angle can be adjusted easily by changing of different C mount
Adjusting Plate (Design Patent) to match the different contest site.
- Hardened aviation aluminum sheets 7075T6 and 6061T6 are used in this model.
- All joints are treated to a high degree of hardness.
- All plastic parts are made of super tough nylon.
- Big shock absorber (Design Patent) with "quick down and slow up motion"
are used to improve the shock absorb function.
- Central gear and differential gears are made of high grade steel.
- High speed ball bearings are used in every joint.
- Special tire with better grip and good directional ability for.
- Stable tail wing with great down pressure.
- High grade silicon oil is used in all differential gear trains and shock
absorbers.
- Extra long suspensions with ground clearance of 70mm.
- Indepenent suspension system to maintain good passage ability.
-All the screws, aluminium alloy accessories,bearings,gears and engines
are imported from Taiwan.
-14.8V 2200mA x 2 super high capacity lithium cell and B4465/04-2060
brushless motor provide this racing buggy with super strength for
Electric Buggy Model.

{GBI}Harryball

Thank you. I was hoping someone would say this. I love the PBS. The C-hub design IMO is a much weaker design. I know some like it, and so on. Im going to have to agree. If the new one comes with the C-hub design I will put it back to the PBS setup.

ugly duck

Some like beef and some like chicken. Some are just happy to eat.

The PBS doesn't mean it's a stronger design. The design and execution of the steering knuckle itself determines if it's strong or not. The only thing I've ever broken on a C-hub suspension is the steering boss. That has nothing to do with it being a C-hub - only in the materials and the shape of the hub itself. If you're basing this opinion ONLY on the strength of a Volcano front suspension, I encourage you to drive something else and see. True, I've broken a steering knuckle on my Losi, but it was after landing on one wheel after an 8 foot jump onto flat ground. Doesn't make it too weak in my book, if that's what it takes for a 15 lb monster truck to break one.

If you feel that you need to make a track width change and you feel that this change is helping you be a better driver, fine by me. Personally, I think if any of us participated in a double-blind test, we'd have no idea which suspension is which from just driving it. If you think it's easier to work on or easier to maintain, that's good with me.

{GBI}Harryball

K, I however race on the weekends. The PBS is strong, and never seems to fail. I appreciate your passion for the C-hub design, however, the fact that mugen and himoto use them makes the sale for me. I have driven the C-hub and have found that it will break quick. You said in your other post that you didnt have a vehicle with PBS. I can only hope that you would, before making such statments. My statement are not based on OPINIONS it is based on track proven performance.

vnmsgt

Never broken PBS knuckles, not once......... Many broken C-hub knuckles. All I do is run on tracks and race. Never bash or run on fields or anything. No track, no drive. So I am just speaking in terms of racing. Also for as long as I have been racing (not very long, about 1.5 years) but I run every week, sometimes twice, I have never seen a broken PBS knuckle. That does it for me. Also just so you do not think I am totally against C-hub, I do think C-hub steers better in the turns. I still would sacrifice a little steering for more reliability.

ugly duck

Relax, all I'm saying (and all I've been trying to say in every post) is that C-hub is not automatically junk. I'm not saying that I wouldn't buy an RC with PBS: in fact, I'd love to try one. There are many good quality machines with C-hub design suspension, and for like the fifth time, I'm suggesting that Himoto is probably going that way for a reason (and that reason is probably not to sell more parts).

Don't mistake passion for openmindedness.

I've never EVER suggested that PBS is weak.

I've never EVER suggested that what I was saying was anything but an opinion.

Nobody seems to be complaining about the MXT-2S front end.

Putting Himoto on the same level as Mugen? Okay... I'm trying to defend Himoto here, but that's taking it a bit far.

{GBI}Harryball

First, I am relaxed. You would know if I wasnt. Second check out the Mugen buggy. You will see that the himoto and mugen are very similar. Like i said earlier, and will say it again. When posts are made, individuals should know what they are saying, and not form opinions just based on what they are reading. Bottom line it all boils down to what the driver perfers. I perfer the PBS, the C-hub design IMO breaks to easy on track and off track. In the race this weekend, I hit a guy with a jammin, guess what broke. The C-hub and lower control arm. So to say that the performance and quality of the himoto product is less, I have to disagree with you, and thats all, I just disagree. People without first hand experiance like to say such things. That is until they get BEAT

If you want to talk, join the paltalk chat. It might make more sence if you do.

Redharris

People are Passionate about what works for THEM....and that's perfectly understandable.....

But ...we are all Friends here, Right?...Lol.

Also. I would like to extend Harryball's Pal Talk invitation to EVERYONE. Its a Chat room with a friendly environment.
We have folks from many different backgrounds who own Many different brands of RC.
Come in and check it out....

Redharris

O.K.
I checked into this......
As it turns out, Himoto has sold Many of these Upgrade Billet parts for thr RXB-1 and had No problems with Fit or Function.
Most Likely, my buddy just received the parts, (for the Truggy instead of the Buggy) and didnt notice. Being a "Can Do" sort of guy, he broke out his trusty Dremel and MADE 'em Work! [sm=48_48.gif]
Thats what we DO in RC, right? Lol....

In the Future, if you have any questions or problems with parts, Contact HimotoRacingUSA, and they will get you straightened out Quick!

Now...I want Everyone to go out and Upgrade your Himotos with Billet Parts!
Or, as our Aussie friends say,,,,AluMINium!!!!

{GBI}Harryball

Sometimes we have to break out the old dremmel LOL I think that if a newbie by the upgrades they should fit, and fit well. Ill stick with the plastic. LOL You know were im coming from

firebird78

ok I've been giving this some thought....at the time this came up I wasnt to excited about the idea of having 2 1/8th buggies..would like to know a few things.....first of all who designed this buggy?...what other buggies would this buggy share parts with??...what would the quality of material would the chassis and plastics be made of?...would it be offered in just rtr or as a kit or race roller?...would the race kit or race roller have all available hop ups stock? and what would the price be?


My suggestions would that it would be as durable if not more durable as the rxb-1....atleast the race roller or kit whichever it may be come stock with high quality chassis, 100 % cv shafts...thick towers and big bore shocks....captured hinge pins is also a must....basically I think the race roller or kit which ever should come with all the hops, ready to add your gear and thrown on the track....also a one piece engine mount would be nice....

just some thoughts from a buggy guy

Swamp3r

Nice post Randy I agree 100%