IV Ti has gone bonkers
10-09-2008, 11:09 PM
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IV Ti has gone bonkers
I unpacked my IV Ti from storage a couple weeks ago and have been practicing flights. Just when I felt a bit more confident I take it out today, zoom up and at about 60' up, it dies completely. I watched it soar straight down to a harsh pavement landing. The culprit was a blown fuse, and other than that it seemed I was lucky - sure are sturdy buggers.
However, once I replaced the fuse I found my little friend has gone insane. At anything over very low throttle, it becomes wildly twitchy. At times one or more of the motors goes to fully power (not good for stability I found). Upon closer inspection, it looks like one of the capacitors on the bottom of a motor is cracked. I know they filter interference, but could that cause the wild behavior? Is there a good source for a replacement?
Thanks for any help!
However, once I replaced the fuse I found my little friend has gone insane. At anything over very low throttle, it becomes wildly twitchy. At times one or more of the motors goes to fully power (not good for stability I found). Upon closer inspection, it looks like one of the capacitors on the bottom of a motor is cracked. I know they filter interference, but could that cause the wild behavior? Is there a good source for a replacement?
Thanks for any help!
10-10-2008, 05:12 AM
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RE: IV Ti has gone bonkers
The capacitors filter out the RF noise created by the motors. Without them you risk a serious crash caused by the interference. I would not fly the DF with even the smallest crack! They are too cheap to risk a crash by not using them.
i have done some research on capacitors as i to needed to replace mine due to a crash and found the following info on the ones used on the DF:
10nF Ceramic Disc Capacitor
* For general purpose applications.
* 50Vdc max working voltage.
* 5mm lead pitch.
* High dielectric constant ceramic.
* -20% +80% standard tolerance.
* -25 deg +80 deg temperature rating.
must be ceramic and no less than 12vdc. i replaced all my caps with these. i got them from ebay for about £2 for a pack of 50!
however i would still look at anyother connection on the board cos the problems you have could be down to more than one issue. you still have to think about "what made the fuse blow mid air"??!
i have done some research on capacitors as i to needed to replace mine due to a crash and found the following info on the ones used on the DF:
10nF Ceramic Disc Capacitor
* For general purpose applications.
* 50Vdc max working voltage.
* 5mm lead pitch.
* High dielectric constant ceramic.
* -20% +80% standard tolerance.
* -25 deg +80 deg temperature rating.
must be ceramic and no less than 12vdc. i replaced all my caps with these. i got them from ebay for about £2 for a pack of 50!
however i would still look at anyother connection on the board cos the problems you have could be down to more than one issue. you still have to think about "what made the fuse blow mid air"??!
10-10-2008, 07:40 AM
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RE: IV Ti has gone bonkers
It could also be a bad gyro or broken solder joint. You could try hitting all of the solder joints with a little heat from a soldering iron. If that does not work Mike from spectrolutions will fix it for a $50 flat fee. http://www.spectrolutions.com/
Keith Cable
Keith Cable
10-10-2008, 07:52 AM
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RE: IV Ti has gone bonkers
thats true. the gyros will course the irratic behaviour and also if the motors sustained damage. i would try to bench test the unit and see if you can figure out a solution.
have you looked at the wire connections and the magnets. sometimes they slip and need pushing up. sometimes its the simple things that need looking at first.
good luck
have you looked at the wire connections and the magnets. sometimes they slip and need pushing up. sometimes its the simple things that need looking at first.
good luck
10-10-2008, 01:32 PM
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RE: IV Ti has gone bonkers
I'm chasing a similar problem with mine. The right motor seems to start faster than all the rest and with more power.
If you can solder, make sure you don't have any cold solder joints in the 4 FET transistors. Those are the big black ones on the mail board. If a slight crack in the solder can cause this.
The capacitors can cause some problems, but if you at least think that those are the problem, then just unsolder 1 lead and test. All the capacitor does is reduce some RF noise for the receiver. It won't make much difference if your 3ft from the DF. Further away, in flight mode, it will make a difference.
As for replacement, the caps don't need to be anything mil spec, just able to have a 12v rating. In fact, if you really want to make sure you kill all the RF noise, adding ferrite beads to the motor leads will help as well.
If you hold the DF by the bottom and start to power up, does it 'twitch' on a specific axis? If so, it might be a gyro. Mine is going that, but by doing some advanced voltage checks and looking at it on a scope, it doesn't seem to be a gyro. Mike is sending me a replacement gyro just in case.
Fastest full proof solution is to fire over to Spectrolutions with $50 or so and have it overhauled. I will commend him on his amazing service.
Mike VA3MW
If you can solder, make sure you don't have any cold solder joints in the 4 FET transistors. Those are the big black ones on the mail board. If a slight crack in the solder can cause this.
The capacitors can cause some problems, but if you at least think that those are the problem, then just unsolder 1 lead and test. All the capacitor does is reduce some RF noise for the receiver. It won't make much difference if your 3ft from the DF. Further away, in flight mode, it will make a difference.
As for replacement, the caps don't need to be anything mil spec, just able to have a 12v rating. In fact, if you really want to make sure you kill all the RF noise, adding ferrite beads to the motor leads will help as well.
If you hold the DF by the bottom and start to power up, does it 'twitch' on a specific axis? If so, it might be a gyro. Mine is going that, but by doing some advanced voltage checks and looking at it on a scope, it doesn't seem to be a gyro. Mike is sending me a replacement gyro just in case.
Fastest full proof solution is to fire over to Spectrolutions with $50 or so and have it overhauled. I will commend him on his amazing service.
Mike VA3MW
12-26-2008, 05:00 PM
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RE: IV Ti has gone bonkers
As of about 15 minutes ago, I'm having the same issue. It's a two-axis twitter, and makes the DF nearly impossible to keep in the air. Here's a strange bit that I'm hesitant to mention, because I'm quite sure it's not the cause of the twitching... A few days ago the DF took a spill that cracked one of the motor-mounted capacitors. However, since then it's been running fine. It may have not been in an ideal state to fly, but it could hold a steady hover without Ti.
Then today after an incredibly light nudge into a wall indoors at a height of about 6 inches (barely enough to fold the rotors back), the DF can't keep it's sh*t together.
I'm posting this as I'm pretty sure the capacitor is not the cause of the problem. Hopefully it'll help others more tech-savvy than myself to figure out the issue.
Then today after an incredibly light nudge into a wall indoors at a height of about 6 inches (barely enough to fold the rotors back), the DF can't keep it's sh*t together.
I'm posting this as I'm pretty sure the capacitor is not the cause of the problem. Hopefully it'll help others more tech-savvy than myself to figure out the issue.
12-26-2008, 05:07 PM
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RE: IV Ti has gone bonkers
cracked one of the motor-mounted capacitors
sure the capacitor is not the cause of the problem
you can never be sure.if you cracked it, then replace it!
Then today after an incredibly light nudge into a wall indoors at a height of about 6 inches (barely enough to fold the rotors back), the DF can't keep it's sh*t together.
12-26-2008, 05:39 PM
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RE: IV Ti has gone bonkers
You're right. I'll be heading to town to pick up some replacement capacitors tomorrow, hopefully those'll do the trick. And I'm curious- why are they necessary?
IMHO, the thermal sensors shouldn't play any role in my issue, as it's occurring indoors without Ti on. They're not used when Ti is off, correct?
IMHO, the thermal sensors shouldn't play any role in my issue, as it's occurring indoors without Ti on. They're not used when Ti is off, correct?
12-26-2008, 05:47 PM
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RE: IV Ti has gone bonkers
TI should never be used indoors. heat signatures from radiators etc will send your DF out of controll. never use ti indoors!
the capacitors dampen out the FM singnals! very essential!
i managed to grab a pack of 50 off ebay for about £1
the capacitors dampen out the FM singnals! very essential!
i managed to grab a pack of 50 off ebay for about £1
12-26-2008, 05:52 PM
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RE: IV Ti has gone bonkers
So you were able to find them for about half price since your last post, eh?
No, Ti was not and is never used indoors. Out of curiosity I turned it on one day- I'm sure there's no way anyone could fly it like that. Crazy town.
No, Ti was not and is never used indoors. Out of curiosity I turned it on one day- I'm sure there's no way anyone could fly it like that. Crazy town.
12-26-2008, 06:00 PM
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RE: IV Ti has gone bonkers
sorry yeah i knew it was cheapand somewhere around that price. £2!
i would say that if you cannot find the exact ones, replace all four with the same ones! i have 46 left!!
this is how i broke mine:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VW39u...eature=channel
this is it now:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U10J3...eature=channel
i would say that if you cannot find the exact ones, replace all four with the same ones! i have 46 left!!
this is how i broke mine:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VW39u...eature=channel
this is it now:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U10J3...eature=channel
12-26-2008, 06:11 PM
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RE: IV Ti has gone bonkers
Just messing with you. I found a whole bunch on eBay for around $2 as well. I think I'll grab a bag just in case.
That custom landing gear seems like a good idea. I was thinking of something like 4 foam half-spheres (the white, arts and crafts variety) strapped on to each of the motors. Super stable on the ground, will protect the motors from any landing other than an inverted one. Simple and cheap. I initially birthed the idea from worries of melted snow causing motor shorts, but realize it'll protect the capacitors just as well. Might keep the heatsinks from doing their job if it weren't winter here. Suppose I'll have to come up with something else for the warmer months.
That custom landing gear seems like a good idea. I was thinking of something like 4 foam half-spheres (the white, arts and crafts variety) strapped on to each of the motors. Super stable on the ground, will protect the motors from any landing other than an inverted one. Simple and cheap. I initially birthed the idea from worries of melted snow causing motor shorts, but realize it'll protect the capacitors just as well. Might keep the heatsinks from doing their job if it weren't winter here. Suppose I'll have to come up with something else for the warmer months.
12-26-2008, 06:21 PM
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RE: IV Ti has gone bonkers
have a closer look if you like.
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Dragan...27446297?ref=s
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Dragan...27446297?ref=s
12-28-2008, 09:38 AM
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RE: IV Ti has gone bonkers
Turns out it wasn't the capacitors. I replaced all 4, and it's still twitching like crazy. I think it might be a front/back only twitch, but either way it's impossible to get off the ground.
I'm sending it into Spectrolutions tomorrow.
I'm sending it into Spectrolutions tomorrow.
01-09-2009, 09:37 PM
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RE: IV Ti has gone bonkers
For anyone following, my issues turned out to be the pitch gyro, just as suspected. From Spectrolutions:
They're great. Can't wait to get up and flying again!
ORIGINAL: Spectrolutions Support
Just informing you your circuit board is repaired and on its way back to you. What we found wrong was that the pitch gyro had gone out, which explains the symptoms you were describing. Once we replaced it, it flew smoothly again. We also found a cracked trace on pin 5 of the 9-pin header which was causing your left LED to act flakey. So we reworked that area, and got it up and running again. All other systems check out great.
Just informing you your circuit board is repaired and on its way back to you. What we found wrong was that the pitch gyro had gone out, which explains the symptoms you were describing. Once we replaced it, it flew smoothly again. We also found a cracked trace on pin 5 of the 9-pin header which was causing your left LED to act flakey. So we reworked that area, and got it up and running again. All other systems check out great.
03-01-2009, 05:55 PM
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RE: IV Ti has gone bonkers
Keith,
Just wanted to let you know that little tip re: http://www.spectrolutions.com/ was some useful info (to many besides me, I'm sure). Haven't used them (yet) but it's nice to be sharing that type of info.
Just wanted to let you know that little tip re: http://www.spectrolutions.com/ was some useful info (to many besides me, I'm sure). Haven't used them (yet) but it's nice to be sharing that type of info.
