davidgeorge212

All I know is that I have tried a lot of film coverings and I am sticking with monokote. I havent bought any arfs lately that say they are covered with monokote so i dont know if that really is "true" monokote. If everyone who doesnt like monokote bases their opinion off the covering on todays arfs, then no wonder you say you hate it, I would too. All I know is if they changed the formula for monokote it didnt affect anything about it. When I compare the rolls my dad bought 30 some odd years ago with all the rolls I bought within the last 3 years, I couldnt tell you which roll was created when. It may be that a lot of people dont have the right technique to apply monokote, or maybe I am just gifted[8D]. Either way, I am sticking with monokote till the end and that is my opinion even if no one else agrees!

David

Whistling Death

Motorman you forgot to add one option to the poll.
#4 should have read:
"I was sick of this two years ago and I can't believe you are still *****ing about it."
What the heck do you want them to do? It's a Chinese made ARF for God's sake. I thought they told you to quit cry9ing about this long ago.

Iflyglow

My Feedback: (79)

They are all made over seas, but you do not see Aeroworks, H9, or any of the others advertise a type of covering, and then give you something else.

No one is forcing you to read the thread.

Iflyglow

My Feedback: (79)

I take issue with your defence of a Company that continues to advertise one thing while admitting it is incorrect. What flying field do you want to meet me at? Is that kinda like meeting me at the Bike rack at over a dispute in elementry school.

Responce from GP,
The checkered covering on the bottom of the Skybolt wings is not MonoKote, but a different material specified because such a pattern is not available in MonoKote. The rest of the airplane is most certainly MonoKote.

At this time, we need your patience while we determine what is happening with the factory, and to resolve any issues that may exist. We apologize for any inconvenience to modelers and will stand behind our products, just as we always do. If anyone has a concern or is displeased with the covering on their model, they should contact Product Support- (217) 398-8970 - 8:00 AM to 5:00 PM Central Time M-F. You can also return to us an item you believe to be defective in parts and workmanship of the original manufacture. Here's how:

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_1154095/tm.htm

_____________________________

Bill Baxter, Manager Hobby Services/Futaba Service/North America
3002 N. Apollo Dr. Ste. 1 Champaign, IL 61822 USA
Service Phone: 217 398-0007
Email: [email protected]


CURRENT ADVERTISEMENT

With the Super Skybolt ARF, the only things standing between the pilot and a first performance at the airfield are a few hours of fast, easy assembly. There's no need to build: The airframe is built light, strong and straight. The covering is genuine Top Flite® MonoKote® film. The hardware is generous and Great Planes' best. And the performance is everything an aerobat could want: crisp and precise in execution, silky smooth in transition and adept at making a pilot's best look better than ever. The Super Skybolt offers the elegance of yesteryear's air show greats with the ease that comes with Great Planes' best ARF engineering. Ready to take center stage in as little as 12-15 hours!
Almost a full pound lighter than the kit, for stronger climbs and quicker response overall.
Simplified strut design strengthens structures, speeds assembly — and eliminates unsightly screw-down brackets.
Fast, smooth and predictable in flight, with a long tail moment to ensure true tracking.
Performs classic air show maneuvers with ease and grace — just right for straight, level flight and impressive, low-level fly-bys!

Kit quality — ARF ease! The Super Skybolt is built like the best kits, with a lightweight wood airframe, a four-color MonoKote film trim scheme, painted fiberglass parts and Great Planes-brand hardware.

carrellh

Just wondering...
Exactly what do you want from Great Planes?

Iflyglow

My Feedback: (79)

Admission that they took advantage of us modelers. The excuses that have been given so far are real lame.

ceecrb1

Some may have seen my recent post about monokote.. I work in the TV and events industry doing sound and video and lighting..
I do NOT understand how I can take a lighting filter from over 20 years ago.. but another roll today and they are IDENTICAL.. SO the process IS possbible..

On my GP Extra 300SP, I needed to do a slight repair.. I bought a roll of monokote and it is COMPLETELY different. I then compaired the roll, my plane and a fellow club members identical plane.. we have a total of 5 differente "metalic blue's"!!!!

I'm pretty pi$$sed off because this plane is MENT to be from the "performance" range.. Ie costs a bit more and the cost should be shown in quality, and really the monokote totaly lets the plane down.. I'm having to iron it out once very 3-4 weeks, where other ARTFS that cost less than 90€'s I've done once on the day of purchase and never thought about agian!


Gp,do yourself a favour! ditch Monokote!! Try solarfilm!!!

carrellh

In today's society of "File a lawsuit over everything," do you honestly believe ANY company is going to issue a statement like that? Everyone that bought one of the planes would be asking for a check.

Iflyglow

My Feedback: (79)

What would happen if companies like Extreme Flite, Aeroworks, or any of the Big Arf copanies supplied a plane that was advertised to be covered with Ultracote (Oracover), but instead was covered with some Chinese covering.
People would be hysterical, and would have the right to be.

This is no different! These planes were advertised as covered in GENUINE MONOKOTE. It is fairly clear that they are not. I would have settled for 4 rolls of real Monokote, and redone it myself, since the covering is a nightmare to keep up. You cannot stop it from falling apart.

AJsToyz

I must be lucky, so far no bad luck with the covering. Now with Nitro Models, that is the worst god awful stuff I've seen!!

GP Stik purchased in 2006. Tail was cracked all the way around, had to recover, and had a hole on the horizontal stab.

Iflyglow

My Feedback: (79)

The type of covering used on the Arf's from Nitro Planes acts just like the JUNK on the RV-4. If I wanted a plane covered in China coat, I would buy a plane were they mention nothing about the covering. I instead purchased a plane from GP, the supposibly repliable company following there advertising of Real Monokote, and inturn recieved the same low quality Chinese knock off covering that started deteriating straight out of the box. The clear was seperating from the Black stripes just by taking the supplied masking tape off the controll surfaces. This is also very common, and is reported over and over again in the RV-4 thread. I just like any other Good modeler grabbed the Iron and ironed it back down, not realizing the trouble I was headed for.
I now realize I should have boxed it back up, sent it back demanding a full refund. It is to bad that this model is covered with this junk, since it is one heck of nice flying airplane.

Eplane65

My Feedback: (16)

The last GP ARF I covered in genuine "Wrinklecoat" bought came with the usual wrinkles. I had to practically burn the stuff to get it to shrink. A couple of weeks later, the wrinkles were back. I've had several models covered with Ultracoat and they all held up well and still look good today. Tower doesn't want to seem to stand up and fix the problem.

Iflyglow

My Feedback: (79)

They probably never will either.

PEOPLE NEED TO STAND UP AND BOYCOTT THERE ARFS, SINCE THERE ARE MUCH HIGHER QUALITY ARF'S ON THE MARKET THAT ARE ADVERTISED MORE HONESTLY. COVERED IN MONOKOTE MEANS MONOKOTE, NOT THE CHEAPEST CRAP THAT THEY CAN PASS OFF AS MONOKOTE. I REALIZE SOME ARE INDEED MONOKOTE, BUT SOME OTHERS WERE AND ARE STILL ADVERTISED WHEN THEY ARE NOT!!

Bax
Moderator
Certified
Posts: 14672
Score: 123
Joined: 4/26/2002
Last Login: 3/11/2010
From: Champaign, IL, USA
Status: offline As I have stated before, and will state again here:

We are aware of the feedback given to us regarding Top Flite MonoKote covering on some Great Planes ARF kits, and we are investigating the situation. The product manager concerned is overseas visiting our ARF factory to see what the problem happens to be. When he gets back, he'll be getting ready for the iHobby Show. Even so, we hope to get out soon an answer and a proposed solution.


Please realize that until I have any information, I can only repeat that this is most certainly being checked, and people at the highest levels of Great Planes are involved with this. Sending PM after PM asking the same question won't get things moving faster. More than once, I've said that things are being looked into, and I'd post what information I'm given.

We are also aware that there have been complaints about the color match of the Skybolt cowling and complaints about the checkerboard covering on the bottom of the wings. The cowlings are being checked to see what the difficulty happens to be, and what solution we can present. The product manager responsible is currently overseas talking to our airplane maker and will present this to them.

The checkered covering on the bottom of the Skybolt wings is not MonoKote, but a different material specified because such a pattern is not available in MonoKote. The rest of the airplane is most certainly MonoKote.

At this time, we need your patience while we determine what is happening with the factory, and to resolve any issues that may exist. We apologize for any inconvenience to modelers and will stand behind our products, just as we always do. If anyone has a concern or is displeased with the covering on their model, they should contact Product Support- (217) 398-8970 - 8:00 AM to 5:00 PM Central Time M-F. You can also return to us an item you believe to be defective in parts and workmanship of the original manufacture. Here's how:

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_1154095/tm.htm

_____________________________

Bill Baxter, Manager Hobby Services/Futaba Service/North America
3002 N. Apollo Dr. Ste. 1 Champaign, IL 61822 USA
Service Phone: 217 398-0007
Email: [email protected]


CURRENTLY ONLINE FOR THE SKYBOLT THAT BAX FROM GP STATED OVER TWO YEARS AGO HAS CHECKER BOARD COVERING THAT IS NOT MONOKOTE
With the Super Skybolt ARF, the only things standing between the pilot and a first performance at the airfield are a few hours of fast, easy assembly. There's no need to build: The airframe is built light, strong and straight. The covering is genuine Top Flite® MonoKote® film. The hardware is generous and Great Planes' best. And the performance is everything an aerobat could want: crisp and precise in execution, silky smooth in transition and adept at making a pilot's best look better than ever. The Super Skybolt offers the elegance of yesteryear's air show greats with the ease that comes with Great Planes' best ARF engineering. Ready to take center stage in as little as 12-15 hours!
Almost a full pound lighter than the kit, for stronger climbs and quicker response overall.
Simplified strut design strengthens structures, speeds assembly — and eliminates unsightly screw-down brackets.
Fast, smooth and predictable in flight, with a long tail moment to ensure true tracking.
Performs classic air show maneuvers with ease and grace — just right for straight, level flight and impressive, low-level fly-bys!

Kit quality — ARF ease! The Super Skybolt is built like the best kits, with a lightweight wood airframe, a four-color MonoKote film trim scheme, painted fiberglass parts and Great Planes-brand hardware.

CURRENT ONLINE MANUAL FOR RV-4

• The RV-4 ARF is factory-covered with Top Flite®
MonoKote® film. Should repairs ever be required, MonoKote
can be patched with additional MonoKote purchased
separately. MonoKote is packaged in six-foot rolls, but some
hobby shops also sell it by the foot. If only a small piece of
MonoKote is needed for a minor patch, perhaps a fellow
modeler would give you some. MonoKote is applied with a
model airplane covering iron, but in an emergency a regular
iron could be used. A roll of MonoKote includes full
instructions for application. Following are the colors used on
this model and order numbers for six foot rolls.
White – TOPQ0204
Aluminum – TOPQ0205
Black – TOPQ0208
Metallic Red – TOPQ0405

OVER TWO YEARS LATER, AND THEY HAVE NOT CHANGED THE ADVERTISING YET!!

Eplane65

My Feedback: (16)

Tower can't ditch Monokote or Futaba or any of their house brands. They own the stuff!

Iflyglow

My Feedback: (79)

They don't have to ditch it, but instead just actually use it on the RV-4. That is what I and many others had payed for!!

hairy46

My Feedback: (1)

I feel motorman is right to complain, If it said Monokote then it should have Monokote on it! I like others have had great luck with Tower and great planes have always been a favorit. To bad they are not dealing with the problem well! Who knows whats going on in China anymore with the toys having lead paint and the dog food and snacks poisioned. I had freinds that lost a dog over it! Maybe using the cheap stuff they are making more money when Great planes wanted them to use the Monokote, who knows with China any more? But that said MonoKote is not what it use to be, over tweenty years ago when I built my first plane and covered it with Monokote it came out beautiful and was super easy to work with, Now its a battle from start to finish! And so now I have started to buy ultracote!

Iflyglow

My Feedback: (79)

It's fine with me is they never come forward and tell the truth, because I will never buy anything I know comes from them again. I will also try my hardest to inform fellow modelers of there type of advertising.

mvallyman

My Feedback: (32)

Maybe this stuff "is" Monocote, just not the same stuff they made 10 years ago.

I too bought a Great Planes ARF that the wrinkles would not shrink out. I strpped it and recovered with Ultracote.

I've also noticed on kit builds where the modeler used Monocote, the covering became brittle after a couple years and its easy to put your finger through it.

I had a lawnchair fold up on my wing covered with Ultracote, it made a dent about 1/2 inch deep. Didnt puncture and came out like new with some heat. Try that with Monocoat!

Mike06659

There is worse things. Shut-Up and Fly is my outlook.

Oberst

I think it's China, that is not telling the truth to Great Planes. That is possibe isn't it?

Pete

ramboy

The formula for Monokote was changed several years ago due to environmetal regulations.

Iflyglow

My Feedback: (79)

Wrinkles are not the problem. THE COVERING DELAMINATES (Coverings are composed of a Clear layer & Color/glue layer). The coverg litterly seperates. When the clear lifts up only the Colored Glue stays on the airplane. If you look at the Black, you can see the spots, and on the white look at the hinge gap, where you will see crumbles of white under the clear layer. I seriously wonder about the structural integrity of the covering, since the chemical bond attaching the covering itself is about like cling wrap. Just picture being able to grab the clear and pull it up leaving nothing but colored glue behind.[X(]

Iflyglow

My Feedback: (79)

Nope, since GP said 2-1/2 years ago that they would not be able tell there covering from someone elses. You can cut a piece of Real White Monokote, and tell the diiference completely, since the Monokote is much much more opaque. The white on the RV is damb near translucent in color, and much thinner. It barely covers the wood grain color.

I have brand new rolls of Monokote, and this is not the samestuff. GP just pulled the wool over the modelers eyes, and got away with it kinda.

Bax from GP admitted the outsourcing of the the checkerd material on the Skybolt, and still say that it is covered in Genuine Monokote. It appears as if the covering was outsourced the same way, since it does the same delaminating as the Checker Board on the Skybolt wings. Read the Skybolt thread, and see it for yourself.

"We are also aware that there have been complaints about the color match of the Skybolt cowling and complaints about the checkerboard covering on the bottom of the wings. The cowlings are being checked to see what the difficulty happens to be, and what solution we can present. The product manager responsible is currently overseas talking to our airplane maker and will present this to them. The checkered covering on the bottom of the Skybolt wings is not MonoKote, but a different material specified because such a pattern is not available in MonoKote. The rest of the airplane is most certainly MonoKote."

Why is it allmost three years later and they still call the Skybolt Genuine Monokote covered after there own admission that the Checkerboard covering is not? The checkerboard covering makes up a huge percentage of the covering. Here is a current picture, and advertisement for it from GP's website.

CURRENT ADVERTISEMENT

With the Super Skybolt ARF, the only things standing between the pilot and a first performance at the airfield are a few hours of fast, easy assembly. There's no need to build: The airframe is built light, strong and straight. The covering is genuine Top Flite® MonoKote® film. The hardware is generous and Great Planes' best. And the performance is everything an aerobat could want: crisp and precise in execution, silky smooth in transition and adept at making a pilot's best look better than ever. The Super Skybolt offers the elegance of yesteryear's air show greats with the ease that comes with Great Planes' best ARF engineering. Ready to take center stage in as little as 12-15 hours!
Almost a full pound lighter than the kit, for stronger climbs and quicker response overall.
Simplified strut design strengthens structures, speeds assembly — and eliminates unsightly screw-down brackets.
Fast, smooth and predictable in flight, with a long tail moment to ensure true tracking.
Performs classic air show maneuvers with ease and grace — just right for straight, level flight and impressive, low-level fly-bys!

Kit quality — ARF ease! The Super Skybolt is built like the best kits, with a lightweight wood airframe, a four-color MonoKote film trim scheme, painted fiberglass parts and Great Planes-brand hardware.

They simply don't care, since they know people will still buy it, since many are rnot aware of what the covering actually does except for the people who have owned one of these models with the cheap ass covering.

masonman

Is there an chance, that the newer RV-4's would have the advertised covering on it. Like one ordered just a week ago?

Iflyglow

My Feedback: (79)

Good luck, since I doubt that they have changed anything. Infact they nolonger list it as Monokote Covered. At least it is advertised fairly now, so I would not expect it. But they forgot to change the online Manual, which still states Genuine Monokote.

Here is clip from the Current Manual online.

CURRENT ONLINE MANUAL FOR RV-4

• The RV-4 ARF is factory-covered with Top Flite®
MonoKote® film. Should repairs ever be required, MonoKote
can be patched with additional MonoKote purchased
separately. MonoKote is packaged in six-foot rolls, but some
hobby shops also sell it by the foot. If only a small piece of
MonoKote is needed for a minor patch, perhaps a fellow
modeler would give you some. MonoKote is applied with a
model airplane covering iron, but in an emergency a regular
iron could be used. A roll of MonoKote includes full
instructions for application. Following are the colors used on
this model and order numbers for six foot rolls.
White – TOPQ0204
Aluminum – TOPQ0205
Black – TOPQ0208
Metallic Red – TOPQ0405