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Fuel Barb Soldering Help Please!

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Old 12-09-2011, 02:27 PM
  #1  
oldtyme
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Default Fuel Barb Soldering Help Please!

Hi all,

I'm really kinda new to the gas thing and setting up my first gas airplane. I know that I need to solder barbs on the 1/8" brass tubing but my question is how do you solder the barbs on both ends of the brass tubes going through the stopper without melting the stopper?

Thanks for any and all tips,
Andy
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Old 12-09-2011, 02:45 PM
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Default RE: Fuel Barb Soldering Help Please!

I solder one end, assemble with cap, stopper and back platepushed against barb that soldered on, then solder the remaining barb. Works for me.
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Old 12-09-2011, 02:45 PM
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Default RE: Fuel Barb Soldering Help Please!

I don't use barbs for that very reason. I secure the Tygon gasoline line to the brass tubes with a very small tie-wrap. Put one on every connection point inside and outside the tank.

If you like the barbs, it is possible to solder one on to both ends after it's put through the stopper. The stopper can handle some heat and if you do it quickly it will work. Move the stopper as far away as you can and put a heat sink (like a pair of needle nose pliers with a rubber band) on the brass tube in between the solder point and the stopper.
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Old 12-09-2011, 02:48 PM
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Brian Smith
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Default RE: Fuel Barb Soldering Help Please!

I have soldered plenty of them on..
Solder on one end then slide all the way into the stopper and solder the other end. You don't have to get it so hot it will damage the stopper. Brian


ORIGINAL: oldtyme

Hi all,

I'm really kinda new to the gas thing and setting up my first gas airplane. I know that I need to solder barbs on the 1/8'' brass tubing but my question is how do you solder the barbs on both ends of the brass tubes going through the stopper without melting the stopper?

Thanks for any and all tips,
Andy
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Old 12-09-2011, 04:47 PM
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Default RE: Fuel Barb Soldering Help Please!


ORIGINAL: D McQuinn

I don't use barbs for that very reason. I secure the Tygon gasoline line to the brass tubes with a very small tie-wrap. Put one on every connection point inside and outside the tank.

If you like the barbs, it is possible to solder one on to both ends after it's put through the stopper. The stopper can handle some heat and if you do it quickly it will work. Move the stopper as far away as you can and put a heat sink (like a pair of needle nose pliers with a rubber band) on the brass tube in between the solder point and the stopper.

That is VERY sound advice - all of it.


To Solder them on. Ask your electronics store for the lowest melting point solder they have. Make sure the metal surfaces are cleaned (see the preparation listed below) and work quickly. I have found the use of a higher powered soldering iron is best as the time to heat soak the solder area is shorter.

If you are not confident with the use of the soldering iron near the stopper you can also install them with JB Weld or some other epoxy Just rough the end of the tube with some sandpaper (say about 300 - 450 grit), clean inside the barb and the outside of the tube with alcohol, acetone or spirits then epoxy immediately afterwards. When you install the tube, push it all the way over the barb.

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Old 12-09-2011, 04:48 PM
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Default RE: Fuel Barb Soldering Help Please!

You can get by without using a barb. A bit of solder on the eng of the tubing will do the trick. I used to put barbs on the fuel tubing until I figured out a bit solder will do just as well by itself.
When you get ready to solder make sure your 1/8 brass tube is 90° to the floor with your soldering end at the bottom. Apply flux, heat and then a bit of solder. it should flow around the end of the tubing forming a perfect little blob at the end.
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Old 12-09-2011, 05:12 PM
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Default RE: Fuel Barb Soldering Help Please!

i used to use barbs when i used conventional tanks... now i use threaded fitting that are barbed, and stopper free

barbs are a pain in the ass when it come time to change the stopper....
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Old 12-09-2011, 05:29 PM
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Default RE: Fuel Barb Soldering Help Please!

I use a miniature flair tool.
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Old 12-09-2011, 09:02 PM
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Default RE: Fuel Barb Soldering Help Please!

For the purpose of a fuel barb on brass tubing, is electrical solder okay to use or should the barb be soldered with silver solder?

Mike
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Old 12-09-2011, 09:19 PM
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Default RE: Fuel Barb Soldering Help Please!

electrical solder is fine
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Old 12-09-2011, 09:56 PM
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Default RE: Fuel Barb Soldering Help Please!

The outside-the-fuel-bottle side barb can be JB-weld into place. Just wrap the wire a couple of turns onto the brass tubing, apply the JB-weld, let it cure over night, and sand to shape.
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Old 12-10-2011, 05:29 AM
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Default RE: Fuel Barb Soldering Help Please!

Get yourself a small center punch to tap into the ends of the tubes to flair them just a lil bit. Jobs done in seconds.
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Old 12-10-2011, 06:37 AM
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Default RE: Fuel Barb Soldering Help Please!


ORIGINAL: styk

electrical solder is fine
Styk
More data if one wants it. http://www.ishor.com/Solders.php Capt,n
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Old 12-10-2011, 08:24 AM
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Default RE: Fuel Barb Soldering Help Please!

Using a tie wrap is just about the worst thing you could do. Paul.
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Old 12-10-2011, 08:56 AM
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Default RE: Fuel Barb Soldering Help Please!

A metal sleeve that slips tight over the fuel line where line goes on the metal tubing works good too. Some fuel tanks come that way....maybe the Kraft brand???
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Old 12-10-2011, 09:57 AM
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Default RE: Fuel Barb Soldering Help Please!

I make my fuel tank tubes slightly longer than necessary. I solder one barb on, and then install the tubes into the tank stopper. I push the tubes all the way in so that the barbs are touching the stopper hardware. Then I clamp some hemostats on the tubing as a heat sink, and solder on the other barbs. I use thin rosin core solder, and I clean the tube and barb with a drop of muriatic acid first. They solder on in seconds, and the hemostat heat sink isn't really necessary. Careful you don't crush the tubing with the hemostats. You may not be able to close the hemostats all the way until they latch; and if not, just use a rubber band on the hemostats to give them enough tension to stay on the tube. Takes more time to write this than do it....

Also, I quit paying big bucks for the fuel barbs, I now use 1/8" compression ferrules from the hardware store. You can buy a handful of them for what one package of barbs costs.

AV8TOR
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Old 12-10-2011, 10:00 AM
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Default RE: Fuel Barb Soldering Help Please!

I have never used a barb... I'm not going to sit here and tell you it is the "right" way.. as Many people do both ways......

Normally I use either safety wire...

or a zip tie....

and contrary to some.. the zip tie will last and not be "eaten away" by the gas.....

I also replace my fuel line once a year....
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Old 12-10-2011, 10:06 AM
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Default RE: Fuel Barb Soldering Help Please!

I use aviation safety wire on mine as well, and I do like using barbs since a lot of the tubing swells on contact with gas and the barbs are a little insurance against a leak. Some people say don't use Tywraps because they don't put even pressure around the tubing and could actually cause a leak. I have seen that happen...

Some people also say don't use safety wire as it will cut the tubing, but I have never had that problem. I think you would have to be really "yanking and cranking" on the safety wire to make that happen. Years of doing all the plumbing on ultralight airplanes with safety wire and I still have never seen it cut a tube.

AV8TOR
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Old 12-10-2011, 10:55 AM
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Default RE: Fuel Barb Soldering Help Please!

ORIGINAL: MetallicaJunkie

i used to use barbs when i used conventional tanks... now i use threaded fitting that are barbed, and stopper free

barbs are a pain in the ass when it come time to change the stopper....
+1.....Stopper style tanks are old/hat....With the "New"gasoline blends, it's ONLY a matter of time when your "Stopper" will fail & leak fuel all over the inside of your fuze....This is now the best way to set/up a "Gasser" fuel tank http://pspmfg.com/FijiAluminumwaterb...eltankcap.html FWIW, I attend the "Xtreme/Flight" international competition event each year (as a spectator) this year I did a survey; could not find a SINGLE flier using the old style "Stopper" type fuel tanks....Just say'in........(& no, I have NO connections with "PSP"...)
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Old 12-10-2011, 11:04 AM
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Default RE: Fuel Barb Soldering Help Please!

I use the dubro barbs on all of my tanks. Solder a barb on one end of the tubing, put it through the stopper, solder the other barb on. Im not the best at soldering but I havent melted one yet. A tiny bit of flux on the joint and it only takes a couple seconds of heat to do the trick.
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Old 12-10-2011, 12:36 PM
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Default RE: Fuel Barb Soldering Help Please!


ORIGINAL: tande

ORIGINAL: MetallicaJunkie

i used to use barbs when i used conventional tanks... now i use threaded fitting that are barbed, and stopper free

barbs are a pain in the ass when it come time to change the stopper....
+1.....Stopper style tanks are old/hat....With the ''New''gasoline blends, it's ONLY a matter of time when your ''Stopper'' will fail & leak fuel all over the inside of your fuze....This is now the best way to set/up a ''Gasser'' fuel tank http://pspmfg.com/FijiAluminumwaterb...eltankcap.html FWIW, I attend the ''Xtreme/Flight'' international competition event each year (as a spectator) this year I did a survey; could not find a SINGLE flier using the old style ''Stopper'' type fuel tanks....Just say'in........(& no, I have NO connections with ''PSP''...)
Interesting. What kind of water bottle is good for gas? The PSPMFG site does not mention it.

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Old 12-10-2011, 01:04 PM
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Default RE: Fuel Barb Soldering Help Please!


ORIGINAL: nonstoprc


ORIGINAL: tande

ORIGINAL: MetallicaJunkie

i used to use barbs when i used conventional tanks... now i use threaded fitting that are barbed, and stopper free

barbs are a pain in the ass when it come time to change the stopper....
+1.....Stopper style tanks are old/hat....With the ''New''gasoline blends, it's ONLY a matter of time when your ''Stopper'' will fail & leak fuel all over the inside of your fuze....This is now the best way to set/up a ''Gasser'' fuel tank http://pspmfg.com/FijiAluminumwaterb...eltankcap.html FWIW, I attend the ''Xtreme/Flight'' international competition event each year (as a spectator) this year I did a survey; could not find a SINGLE flier using the old style ''Stopper'' type fuel tanks....Just say'in........(& no, I have NO connections with ''PSP''...)
Interesting. What kind of water bottle is good for gas? The PSPMFG site does not mention it.

Ya....Just go to your local "Walmart" or equiv. & look in the bottled water aisle for "Fiji" water....comes in at least four sizes & all have a "Square" cross/section shape (Tough as nails...I've seen these things along/side the road, ran over & still not leaking).....FWIW, No need to buy the special "PSP" cap (although it will work just fine)....the "Fiji" cap is a "Non/Gasket design that uses a tapered lip wedge for sealing (I think most water bottles are of this type, but NOT any soda bottles that I've found)....The"Fiji" cap (no need to over tighten)& these fittings are all you need...a single barb for the vent & a double barb for the fuel supply (bottom of page) http://www.pspmfg.com/WaterBottleFuelTankCap.html ....Again FWIW....
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Old 12-10-2011, 01:36 PM
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Default RE: Fuel Barb Soldering Help Please!

Again FWIW.....For anyone who might be interested in trying the "Fiji" water bottle fuel tank, the following IS a worthwhile test;....With a fresh non/opened bottle of "Fiji" water, use a felt/tip pen to make an "Indexing" mark across the cap & bottle where the two meet....Now remove the cap & the "Tamper/Proof" ring....Reinstall the cap & line up the marks to learn just how tight the cap was originally installed.....Might surprise ya! ....So, don't over/tighten when you build your new fuel tank....Just say'in....
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Old 12-10-2011, 01:50 PM
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Default RE: Fuel Barb Soldering Help Please!


ORIGINAL: tande

ORIGINAL: MetallicaJunkie

i used to use barbs when i used conventional tanks... now i use threaded fitting that are barbed, and stopper free

barbs are a pain in the ass when it come time to change the stopper....
+1.....Stopper style tanks are old/hat....With the ''New''gasoline blends, it's ONLY a matter of time when your ''Stopper'' will fail & leak fuel all over the inside of your fuze....This is now the best way to set/up a ''Gasser'' fuel tank http://pspmfg.com/FijiAluminumwaterb...eltankcap.html FWIW, I attend the ''Xtreme/Flight'' international competition event each year (as a spectator) this year I did a survey; could not find a SINGLE flier using the old style ''Stopper'' type fuel tanks....Just say'in........(& no, I have NO connections with ''PSP''...)
Maybe they were all sponsored? Following what sponsored flyers use is not the way to choose quality products, IMHO.

I have not had any problems using Du-Bro tanks and red/brown stoppers. I have not needed to redo any of my tanks, stoppers or lines - some are more than 8 years old. Yes, our gas here does contain up to 10% alky. Stoppers have not fallen apart and Tygon tube has not cracked. The sky has not fallen either.

I find it funny that many flyers will share their wisdom but their aircraft never out live the life expectancy it could have had - ie, severe deceleration syndrome ends the aircraft before it's time.

Bliksem
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Old 12-10-2011, 02:11 PM
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Default RE: Fuel Barb Soldering Help Please!

ORIGINAL: blikseme300


ORIGINAL: tande

ORIGINAL: MetallicaJunkie

i used to use barbs when i used conventional tanks... now i use threaded fitting that are barbed, and stopper free

barbs are a pain in the ass when it come time to change the stopper....
+1.....Stopper style tanks are old/hat....With the ''New''gasoline blends, it's ONLY a matter of time when your ''Stopper'' will fail & leak fuel all over the inside of your fuze....This is now the best way to set/up a ''Gasser'' fuel tank http://pspmfg.com/FijiAluminumwaterb...eltankcap.html FWIW, I attend the ''Xtreme/Flight'' international competition event each year (as a spectator) this year I did a survey; could not find a SINGLE flier using the old style ''Stopper'' type fuel tanks....Just say'in........(& no, I have NO connections with ''PSP''...)
Maybe they were all sponsored? Following what sponsored flyers use is not the way to choose quality products, IMHO.

I have not had any problems using Du-Bro tanks and red/brown stoppers. I have not needed to redo any of my tanks, stoppers or lines - some are more than 8 years old. Yes, our gas here does contain up to 10% alky. Stoppers have not fallen apart and Tygon tube has not cracked. The sky has not fallen either.

I find it funny that many flyers will share their wisdom but their aircraft never out live the life expectancy it could have had - ie, severe deceleration syndrome ends the aircraft before it's time.

Bliksem

LOL!....As they say..."No good deed goes unpunished".....
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