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  1. #26
    1QwkSport2.5r's Avatar
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    RE: DLE 20 vs OS 120 AX


    ORIGINAL: TimBle

    if it has more torque it probably has more power as well....
    If it has more torque, it has more horsepower. They correlate in some fashion (that I am uneducated with) that as torque goes up, horsepower goes up as well. Some examples may show more of a torque gain than a horsepower gain but they both should go up.

    "Torque gets you going, horsepower keeps you there" is the saying my auto shop teacher always used. There are trade-offs with everything though.

    a pointless note: Horsepower and Torque will be equal at 5,252rpm on any internal combustion engine AFAIK. High school was 14 years ago, so I'll recheck my "facts".

    GlowHead Brotherhood #3
    Happily running Dynamite, Enya, Fox, Jett, K&B, SH, Super Tigre, Thunder Tiger, Traxxas.
    I will trade my OS .10FP for an Enya or..?

  2. #27

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    RE: DLE 20 vs OS 120 AX

    last season iuse 15L 0%nitro fuel with same jen plug and no deadstik.
    apc 15x10 prop 9000rpm.
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  3. #28
    AJsToyz's Avatar
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    RE: DLE 20 vs OS 120 AX

    Depends on the weight of te plane, all the rest is good but knowing how trim this bird is helps. You can always findable good 3d prop if that's what your up for. If you go gas also check out the new Mintor 22cc, fine looking engine!
    ULTRA SPORT BROTHERHOOD #120
    GOLDBERG TIGER CLUB #10
    CLUB SAITO #590

  4. #29
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    RE: DLE 20 vs OS 120 AX


    ORIGINAL: MetallicaJunkie

    ORIGINAL: airraptor

    LOL what are you guys smoking the DLE doesnt make more power.

    You guys post your Honest number on the DLE 20 with props and i will post mine.

    Bone stock OS 120AX with no baffle in the muffler with out extension will turn an APC 16x8 uncut prop at 8,600

    The 16x8 is tha max load for the OS though.

    where guys think the DLE make more power is that it is better suited to turn large props that make more thrust with less speed. the OS will turn a 18x6 ZOAR also but i dont have a number for you. I will mount the engine on the test stand if have to.


    If you really want a more power then just get the DLE 30 for that plane. you will not notice that much more ''power'' with the DLE 20

    Also the OS 120 will also spin the 16x8 APC at 9,600 with the Jett muffler.

    So to save the most money just buy a Jett muffler for 80 dollars and throw on that 18x6 i think it should spin it around 9,000 or more.
    dle 20 xoar 17x6 8400 peak
    I have two DLEs on my 35lb OV-10 Bronco. I put a 17x6 APC on for the first run. They both hit 8900. After checking the needle they where still at 8900. I never ran those props on any flights.I was told it wasn't wise to turn them over 9K. They started out turning MA 16x8 3B at 7700 after six flights they are at 8000. These are some strong little engines. Very happy with my purchase.
    Greg Norman said, \"Happiness is a long walk with a putter.\" Obviously he never flew a P-51 Mustang.

  5. #30
    rhd-RCU's Avatar
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    RE: DLE 20 vs OS 120 AX

    I have them both. They are both great engines, but the OS is much quieter.
    rd

  6. #31

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    RE: DLE 20 vs OS 120 AX

    thats becuse it has a tuned exhaust.
    I just wish DLE would design tunedmufflers for their engines as well. not just canisters

  7. #32

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    RE: DLE 20 vs OS 120 AX

    Plenty of power and weight comparisons here but which engine will best fit the application? Is there room for the ignition box without forcing everything to fit. I'm not suggesting this is the case here but far too often people try to force a small gasser into planes much more suited for glo use. So I simply say use what fits the plane.

  8. #33

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    RE: DLE 20 vs OS 120 AX


    ORIGINAL: jcvt

    Well...., You could make your own fuel for less than $10, also in the unfortunate event that you crash it, how much could cost you with the DLE. ???I can tell you that they are pretty light constructed...
    By the way, I had a DLE 20 and sold it, Using Thunder tiger 1.20 now. I like the simplicity of glow in this size also they are very tough...... beautiful engine this dle 20 though
    Before you sold your DLE 20 you could have installed a Golw plug adapter and ran it on Glow fuel. It would be a great experiment. You could have used Supertiger fuel for the bigger Tigers. It has less oil...still plenty of lube. Or you could mix you own fuel far cheaper. I bet she would have big-time power and like one says...its more simple. I think AV8TOR is running gas/glow engines...read his postings. Also by using a different carb (one better for acohol) you could have put the engine back to stock...and sold it if you did not like it! Capt,n
    I never met a engine I did not like !

  9. #34

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    RE: DLE 20 vs OS 120 AX

    a1pc have you ever run a Saito 125 yet alone on 45% nitro..

    the Saito 125 will spin the 13x11 at 11,200 on 45%
    The OS 120 AX with stock muffler turns the same prop at 11,300 close enough for me. now the OS will unload a bit more in the air over the saito.

    3D with little gas get the DLE
    3D with no worry on gas get the OS and prop it correctly
    for all out speed you need rpm and that is where the OS will out shine the DLE by a long shot.
    The OS 120 AX with the Jett muffler is in the same power range as the YS 115 on 40% nitro. where is the little DLE now lol
    120AX spins a 14.5x14.5 at 9,100 with the jett muffler on 15% fuel.
    AMA # 126183
    Fly light, fly fast and fly low.

  10. #35

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    RE: DLE 20 vs OS 120 AX

    In addition to the DLE-20, you might want to consider the Mintor 22. It is basically the same dimensions, weight and price as the DLE-20 but is CNC billet construction, made in Italy. It has a 4 bolt, O ring seal muffler and is a bit quieter than the DLE-20 (I have had 2). I have been flying it on a 3DHS Velox for a few weeks now on a 17-6 and in this video just went with a Falcon 18-6. As soon as the wx permits, we will know how the 18-6 flys.
    http://youtu.be/qbWB5WFrdHw




  11. #36

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    RE: DLE 20 vs OS 120 AX

    How does the weight compare between a Dle 20 and the Mintor 22? Also what ignition is on the Mintor? Thanks Capt,n
    I never met a engine I did not like !

  12. #37

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    RE: DLE 20 vs OS 120 AX

    Essentially the same weight, slightly less for the Mintor, and they both use a Rcexl ignition.  

  13. #38
    Sport_Pilot's Avatar
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    RE: DLE 20 vs OS 120 AX

    If it has more torque, it has more horsepower
    Only if they get that torque at or near the same speed. Torque is a force, if it is used to turn a crank that does not move then there is no power. When the crank moves then work is being done. Power is the rate that work is being done. Your analogy is somewhat true, torque is the force pushing the car, but to push it faster means more speed thus more power is created as a result.

    Intresting fact. AA fuel dragster enginesare too powerful and too unpredictable to test run on a dyno. Thier power is measured from the data of an actual run by measuring the speed and acceleration of the run.
    Glow Head Brotherhood #15

  14. #39

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    RE: DLE 20 vs OS 120 AX

    can you get a bigger carb on the Mintor??????? its as big as the cylinder lol
    AMA # 126183
    Fly light, fly fast and fly low.

  15. #40

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    RE: DLE 20 vs OS 120 AX


    ORIGINAL: Sport_Pilot

    If it has more torque, it has more horsepower
    Only if they get that torque at or near the same speed. Torque is a force, if it is used to turn a crank that does not move then there is no power. When the crank moves then work is being done. Power is the rate that work is being done. Your analogy is somewhat true, torque is the force pushing the car, but to push it faster means more speed thus more power is created as a result.

    Intresting fact. AA fuel dragster enginesare too powerful and too unpredictable to test run on a dyno. Thier power is measured from the data of an actual run by measuring the speed and acceleration of the run.

    My analogy is completely true.


  16. #41
    Sport_Pilot's Avatar
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    RE: DLE 20 vs OS 120 AX


    ORIGINAL: TimBle


    ORIGINAL: Sport_Pilot

    If it has more torque, it has more horsepower
    Only if they get that torque at or near the same speed. Torque is a force, if it is used to turn a crank that does not move then there is no power. When the crank moves then work is being done. Power is the rate that work is being done. Your analogy is somewhat true, torque is the force pushing the car, but to push it faster means more speed thus more power is created as a result.

    Intresting fact. AA fuel dragster enginesare too powerful and too unpredictable to test run on a dyno. Thier power is measured from the data of an actual run by measuring the speed and acceleration of the run.

    My analogy is completely true.

    What are you talking about? You gave no analogy.
    Glow Head Brotherhood #15

  17. #42

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    RE: DLE 20 vs OS 120 AX


    ORIGINAL: Sport_Pilot


    ORIGINAL: TimBle


    ORIGINAL: Sport_Pilot

    If it has more torque, it has more horsepower
    Only if they get that torque at or near the same speed. Torque is a force, if it is used to turn a crank that does not move then there is no power. When the crank moves then work is being done. Power is the rate that work is being done. Your analogy is somewhat true, torque is the force pushing the car, but to push it faster means more speed thus more power is created as a result.

    Intresting fact. AA fuel dragster enginesare too powerful and too unpredictable to test run on a dyno. Thier power is measured from the data of an actual run by measuring the speed and acceleration of the run.

    My analogy is completely true.

    What are you talking about? You gave no analogy.

    I know I didn't. I just left the quotes out. You used the word.
    What is stated is a mathematical principal and a fact.

  18. #43

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    RE: DLE 20 vs OS 120 AX


    ORIGINAL: a1pcfixer


    ORIGINAL: kerwin50

    I would really like to know the power differences beteewn the two
    I'd say the OS to be about 2 steps below the DLE20. A better comparison might be that the DLE20 is somewhere between the power of a Saito 1.25 & a Saito 1.50 (4-strokers). Just consider the DLE20 to be similar to a Saito 1.25 on steroids!!!

    The DLE20 does best with a 17 x 6 prop, but some have even gone to an 18 x 6!
    Top suggested prop(s) for that OS are 16x8-10

    For weight, the OS is about 1 ounce heavier with muffler & extension -vs- the DLE20 with muffler & ign module. PLUS, with the DLE20 you'd be using a much smaller fuel tank than what the OS would require, so there's another weighs less item for the DLE20.

    That OS costs about $20.00 more than the DLE20, and like STUKA BARRY said, there's the much higher cost of the nitro fuel for that OS.
    Soooo....there's just a plethora of reasons that put the DLE20 ahead of the OS. But YOU need to decide for yourself in the end.

    For more details head over to this msg thread;

    NEW DLE 20cc Gasser! (Data & Links 1st Post)
    http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_9863953/tm.htm


    Like the subject states.....(Data & Links 1st Post)
    My buddy has the 20 with a header and pipe and is getting to many RR's, with a 17x6 it is still a tad over 9000.. He is going to try an 18x6 and see if it bringsitdown some, any suggestions if it's still to high?
    Ultra Sport Brotherhood #92

  19. #44

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    RE: DLE 20 vs OS 120 AX


    ORIGINAL: airraptor

    can you get a bigger carb on the Mintor??????? its as big as the cylinder lol
    Same physical size WT series carb used on all engines in this size range. Yes, the carb looks big but its exactly the same physical size used on the DLE 20, 30, 55, etc.

  20. #45
    Sport_Pilot's Avatar
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    RE: DLE 20 vs OS 120 AX


    ORIGINAL: TimBle


    ORIGINAL: Sport_Pilot


    ORIGINAL: TimBle


    ORIGINAL: Sport_Pilot

    If it has more torque, it has more horsepower
    Only if they get that torque at or near the same speed. Torque is a force, if it is used to turn a crank that does not move then there is no power. When the crank moves then work is being done. Power is the rate that work is being done. Your analogy is somewhat true, torque is the force pushing the car, but to push it faster means more speed thus more power is created as a result.

    Intresting fact. AA fuel dragster enginesare too powerful and too unpredictable to test run on a dyno. Thier power is measured from the data of an actual run by measuring the speed and acceleration of the run.

    My analogy is completely true.

    What are you talking about? You gave no analogy.

    I know I didn't. I just left the quotes out. You used the word.
    What is stated is a mathematical principal and a fact.
    You never mentioned any mathematics either unless it was some very early message and I was not responding to you. I used the fast reply by error, I thought i was responding to 1QwkSport2.5r . His analogy was that torque gets you moving and horsepower keeps you moving. Not quite true but certainly truer than the statement that more torque means more horsepower. The latter is only true if the engine is turning at the same speed or at a speed not significantly slower. a 10% increase in RPM increase horsepower 10% which is the same amount a 10% increase of torque increases horsepower.

    Glow Head Brotherhood #15

  21. #46
    MetallicaJunkie's Avatar
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    RE: DLE 20 vs OS 120 AX


    ORIGINAL: Mustangman40


    ORIGINAL: a1pcfixer


    ORIGINAL: kerwin50

    I would really like to know the power differences beteewn the two
    I'd say the OS to be about 2 steps below the DLE20. A better comparison might be that the DLE20 is somewhere between the power of a Saito 1.25 & a Saito 1.50 (4-strokers). Just consider the DLE20 to be similar to a Saito 1.25 on steroids!!!

    The DLE20 does best with a 17 x 6 prop, but some have even gone to an 18 x 6!
    Top suggested prop(s) for that OS are 16x8-10

    For weight, the OS is about 1 ounce heavier with muffler & extension -vs- the DLE20 with muffler & ign module. PLUS, with the DLE20 you'd be using a much smaller fuel tank than what the OS would require, so there's another weighs less item for the DLE20.

    That OS costs about $20.00 more than the DLE20, and like STUKA BARRY said, there's the much higher cost of the nitro fuel for that OS.
    Soooo....there's just a plethora of reasons that put the DLE20 ahead of the OS. But YOU need to decide for yourself in the end.

    For more details head over to this msg thread;

    NEW DLE 20cc Gasser! (Data & Links 1st Post)
    http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_9863953/tm.htm


    Like the subject states.....(Data & Links 1st Post)
    My buddy has the 20 with a header and pipe and is getting to many RR's, with a 17x6 it is still a tad over 9000.. He is going to try an 18x6 and see if it bringsΒ*itΒ*down some, any suggestions if it's still to high?

    it depends if he wants a fast plane(smaller prop more pitch) or if he wants to fly 3D(larger prop less pitch)
    \"Propellers are notorious for inflicting serious bodily harm while vigorously defending their space\" George Aldrich

  22. #47

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    RE: DLE 20 vs OS 120 AX


    ORIGINAL: Sport_Pilot


    ORIGINAL: TimBle


    ORIGINAL: Sport_Pilot


    ORIGINAL: TimBle


    ORIGINAL: Sport_Pilot

    If it has more torque, it has more horsepower
    Only if they get that torque at or near the same speed. Torque is a force, if it is used to turn a crank that does not move then there is no power. When the crank moves then work is being done. Power is the rate that work is being done. Your analogy is somewhat true, torque is the force pushing the car, but to push it faster means more speed thus more power is created as a result.

    Intresting fact. AA fuel dragster enginesare too powerful and too unpredictable to test run on a dyno. Thier power is measured from the data of an actual run by measuring the speed and acceleration of the run.

    My analogy is completely true.

    What are you talking about? You gave no analogy.

    I know I didn't. I just left the quotes out. You used the word.
    What is stated is a mathematical principal and a fact.
    You never mentioned any mathematics either unless it was some very early message and I was not responding to you. I used the fast reply by error, I thought i was responding to 1QwkSport2.5r . His analogy was that torque gets you moving and horsepower keeps you moving. Not quite true but certainly truer than the statement that more torque means more horsepower. The latter is only true if the engine is turning at the same speed or at a speed not significantly slower. a 10% increase in RPM increase horsepower 10% which is the same amount a 10% increase of torque increases horsepower.

    You love to argue don;t you.

    P= 2 x pi x N x T

    P, N and T are proportional to each other, When one rises, so do the others. When one falls, so do the others. This relationship is true across the whole rev range. The degree of proportionality can vary due to efficiency at different rpm but the guiding matehmaticl principal and the physics of it is pretty clear.
    It is a very true and real statement.








  23. #48

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    RE: DLE 20 vs OS 120 AX

    The plane is a 68 inch goldwing yak. I'm wanting it for 3D.

  24. #49

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    RE: DLE 20 vs OS 120 AX

    Those come in at around 4.4Kg. The DLE 20 will hover it but the pull out will be gradual.
    The Evolution 26cc is more suitable but much more expensive and heavier so the all up weight will rise to around 4.7Kg which is smack where a DLE30cc with drag it around like a rag doll.
    You'd need to check ground clearance with a DLE 30 because it wants a 19" prop or at a push a flat 20".
    The DLE20 will swing a 17x6VESS or XOAR or APC very well in the low 8000's.

    I have a LE 20 in my SHowtime 90. Also around 68" span, weight around 4.1Kg. It hovers very nicely around half throttle with good traction on the pull out. This is just for comparison.

  25. #50
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    RE: DLE 20 vs OS 120 AX


    ORIGINAL: TimBle


    ORIGINAL: Sport_Pilot


    ORIGINAL: TimBle


    ORIGINAL: Sport_Pilot


    ORIGINAL: TimBle


    ORIGINAL: Sport_Pilot

    If it has more torque, it has more horsepower
    Only if they get that torque at or near the same speed. Torque is a force, if it is used to turn a crank that does not move then there is no power. When the crank moves then work is being done. Power is the rate that work is being done. Your analogy is somewhat true, torque is the force pushing the car, but to push it faster means more speed thus more power is created as a result.

    Intresting fact. AA fuel dragster enginesare too powerful and too unpredictable to test run on a dyno. Thier power is measured from the data of an actual run by measuring the speed and acceleration of the run.

    My analogy is completely true.

    What are you talking about? You gave no analogy.

    I know I didn't. I just left the quotes out. You used the word.
    What is stated is a mathematical principal and a fact.
    You never mentioned any mathematics either unless it was some very early message and I was not responding to you. I used the fast reply by error, I thought i was responding to 1QwkSport2.5r . His analogy was that torque gets you moving and horsepower keeps you moving. Not quite true but certainly truer than the statement that more torque means more horsepower. The latter is only true if the engine is turning at the same speed or at a speed not significantly slower. a 10% increase in RPM increase horsepower 10% which is the same amount a 10% increase of torque increases horsepower.

    You love to argue don;t you.

    P= 2 x pi x N x T

    P, N and T are proportional to each other, When one rises, so do the others. When one falls, so do the others. This relationship is true across the whole rev range. The degree of proportionality can vary due to efficiency at different rpm but the guiding matehmaticl principal and the physics of it is pretty clear.
    It is a very true and real statement.







    The statement was if torque goes up then power goes up. That is only true if the RPM does not go down. The simple statement ignores the fact that you cannot get more torque from an engine without changing the timing, and that often means you have to time for a lower speed. I know the mathmatics and the equasion proves that the power goes up or down on the same porportion for speed and torque.

    The effect is that increasing torque requires decreasing speed, and increasing speed decreces torque. This is not based on the equasion, but on the breathing ability of the engine. Higher speed means it cannot breath as well so you get less air and fuel in the cylinder so less pressure on the crank which means less torque, lower speed does the opposite so there is more torque and less speed.

    However a glow engine has a more powerfull fuel. So everything being equal (which theyare not between these engines) the same size glow engine should have more power than the same size gas engines. Most glow engines are simply designed for RPM so simply converting them to gas means they will slow down and are no longer running at their optimal timing.Gas engines have the opposite problem, the fuel has more power when converted so a bigger prop must be used to run a**** optimal speed, sometimes so much so the fuel wants to detonate.

    The effect is that increasing torque requires decreasing speed, and increasing speed decreces torque.

    This is why I do not like to see the simple statements that hide other factors.
    Glow Head Brotherhood #15


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