New Saito 4 Cycle Gas Engine, 3 Cyl FG-84
#51
My Feedback: (2)
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Sault Ste Marieont, CANADA
Posts: 946
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes
on
2 Posts
RE: New Saito 4 Cycle Gas Engine, 3 Cyl FG-84
I have an engine,but it needs to be overhauled,its been in a box for about 10 years.It had low compression on one cylinder.I guess I can send it to Horizon for that or can someone else do that,does anyone know?Also Adrian how does the fuel burn compare to the regular glow engine,I remember it was a thirsty beast when I had it in my 1/3 Dr1 Triplane.
#53
Senior Member
RE: New Saito 4 Cycle Gas Engine, 3 Cyl FG-84
Buy a new FA450R3 for $1400, add $200 for a C&H CDI & run it on methanol.
It will make as much or mre power than this low compression gas version.
The displacement comes out to 180 cylinders on the 150 stroke 27.9cc X 3 = 83.7cc. Unless theu made new, longer rods (I doubt that) it will be about 7.8:1 compression ratio.
I doubt that the 10% increase in displacement will make up for 8N Ford tractor compression ratio burning gasoline.
As far as power, anything the FG84R3 will do, an FA450 on CDI will do better.
It will make as much or mre power than this low compression gas version.
The displacement comes out to 180 cylinders on the 150 stroke 27.9cc X 3 = 83.7cc. Unless theu made new, longer rods (I doubt that) it will be about 7.8:1 compression ratio.
I doubt that the 10% increase in displacement will make up for 8N Ford tractor compression ratio burning gasoline.
As far as power, anything the FG84R3 will do, an FA450 on CDI will do better.
#54
RE: New Saito 4 Cycle Gas Engine, 3 Cyl FG-84
I dont think that FG-84 R3 is that slouchy, On the video they are turning a 23x12. Which is not bad, But I would rather have gas as it is easier to come by.
#55
My Feedback: (8)
RE: New Saito 4 Cycle Gas Engine, 3 Cyl FG-84
ORIGINAL: SrTelemaster150
Buy a new FA450R3 for $1400, add $200 for a C&H CDI & run it on methanol.
It will make as much or mre power than this low compression gas version.
The displacement comes out to 180 cylinders on the 150 stroke 27.9cc X 3 = 83.7cc. Unless theu made new, longer rods (I doubt that) it will be about 7.8:1 compression ratio.
I doubt that the 10% increase in displacement will make up for 8N Ford tractor compression ratio burning gasoline.
As far as power, anything the FG84R3 will do, an FA450 on CDI will do better.
Buy a new FA450R3 for $1400, add $200 for a C&H CDI & run it on methanol.
It will make as much or mre power than this low compression gas version.
The displacement comes out to 180 cylinders on the 150 stroke 27.9cc X 3 = 83.7cc. Unless theu made new, longer rods (I doubt that) it will be about 7.8:1 compression ratio.
I doubt that the 10% increase in displacement will make up for 8N Ford tractor compression ratio burning gasoline.
As far as power, anything the FG84R3 will do, an FA450 on CDI will do better.
#57
RE: New Saito 4 Cycle Gas Engine, 3 Cyl FG-84
ORIGINAL: n8622t
Don't mean to be skeptic but how do you know?
ORIGINAL: rcnut101
THe new FG-84 should be out around April time with a price around $1650 USD, Which includes ingnition and muffler.
THe new FG-84 should be out around April time with a price around $1650 USD, Which includes ingnition and muffler.
#59
Senior Member
RE: New Saito 4 Cycle Gas Engine, 3 Cyl FG-84
ORIGINAL: n8622t
You can have my whole share of glo fuel....it's all yers
ORIGINAL: SrTelemaster150
Buy a new FA450R3 for $1400, add $200 for a C&H CDI & run it on methanol.
It will make as much or mre power than this low compression gas version.
The displacement comes out to 180 cylinders on the 150 stroke 27.9cc X 3 = 83.7cc. Unless theu made new, longer rods (I doubt that) it will be about 7.8:1 compression ratio.
I doubt that the 10% increase in displacement will make up for 8N Ford tractor compression ratio burning gasoline.
As far as power, anything the FG84R3 will do, an FA450 on CDI will do better.
Buy a new FA450R3 for $1400, add $200 for a C&H CDI & run it on methanol.
It will make as much or mre power than this low compression gas version.
The displacement comes out to 180 cylinders on the 150 stroke 27.9cc X 3 = 83.7cc. Unless theu made new, longer rods (I doubt that) it will be about 7.8:1 compression ratio.
I doubt that the 10% increase in displacement will make up for 8N Ford tractor compression ratio burning gasoline.
As far as power, anything the FG84R3 will do, an FA450 on CDI will do better.
A 55 gallon drum of methanol is $100 has an almost infinate shelf lifen& doesn't smell. Cheaper, easier to store & less volitile. So what if I burn a little more of it to more power & longer engine life.
The reliability of "gas" engines has nothing to do W/the fuel used. It has everyting to do W/spark ignition.
#60
Senior Member
RE: New Saito 4 Cycle Gas Engine, 3 Cyl FG-84
ORIGINAL: rcnut101
I dont think that FG-84 R3 is that slouchy, On the video they are turning a 23x12. Which is not bad, But I would rather have gas as it is easier to come by.
I dont think that FG-84 R3 is that slouchy, On the video they are turning a 23x12. Which is not bad, But I would rather have gas as it is easier to come by.
#62
My Feedback: (2)
RE: New Saito 4 Cycle Gas Engine, 3 Cyl FG-84
Saito must feel that there's a market for the gas versions of their engines or else they wouldn't make them. So regardless of the discussion about glow and CDI vs gas etc. it is what it is. The good part is that you'll have a choice.. I can't see an issue with that
#63
My Feedback: (22)
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Windham,
ME
Posts: 110
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: New Saito 4 Cycle Gas Engine, 3 Cyl FG-84
From what I could see the diameter is 250mm? Is that correct? Im just trying to get an overall size of the motor. I wish it would fit in my Hanger 9 P-47
#65
My Feedback: (8)
RE: New Saito 4 Cycle Gas Engine, 3 Cyl FG-84
ORIGINAL: SrTelemaster150
It won't out perform the FA450R3 on GI (as far as power) like people think & will lag behind when CDI is used on the 450.
ORIGINAL: rcnut101
I dont think that FG-84 R3 is that slouchy, On the video they are turning a 23x12. Which is not bad, But I would rather have gas as it is easier to come by.
I dont think that FG-84 R3 is that slouchy, On the video they are turning a 23x12. Which is not bad, But I would rather have gas as it is easier to come by.
#66
My Feedback: (16)
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Perth, AUSTRALIA
Posts: 54
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: New Saito 4 Cycle Gas Engine, 3 Cyl FG-84
Please correct me if I'm wrong, but don't radial engines have non-symetrical spark firing?
Meaning a 3 cylinder engine does not fire every 120 degrees.
I believe it is to do with how the master rod and other rods interact.
This would be why every cylinder needs it's own magnet to fire?
Meaning a 3 cylinder engine does not fire every 120 degrees.
I believe it is to do with how the master rod and other rods interact.
This would be why every cylinder needs it's own magnet to fire?
#67
My Feedback: (16)
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Cincinnati,
OH
Posts: 486
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE: New Saito 4 Cycle Gas Engine, 3 Cyl FG-84
A cylinder fires every 240 deg. Normally the firing order is 1-3-2. 1 & 3 fire on the first revolution and only cylinder 2 fires on the 2nd revolution. 2 revolutions of the crank complete a firing cycle on a 4 stroke engine. ( I hope )
#68
RE: New Saito 4 Cycle Gas Engine, 3 Cyl FG-84
I'm not sure if any one knows, But here are the specs.
http://www.saito-mfg.com/radial-file...3/fg-84r3.html
http://www.saito-mfg.com/radial-file...3/fg-84r3.html
#69
Senior Member
RE: New Saito 4 Cycle Gas Engine, 3 Cyl FG-84
ORIGINAL: n8622t
And that's why Saito is converting so many glow engines to gas?
ORIGINAL: SrTelemaster150
It won't out perform the FA450R3 on GI (as far as power) like people think & will lag behind when CDI is used on the 450.
ORIGINAL: rcnut101
I dont think that FG-84 R3 is that slouchy, On the video they are turning a 23x12. Which is not bad, But I would rather have gas as it is easier to come by.
I dont think that FG-84 R3 is that slouchy, On the video they are turning a 23x12. Which is not bad, But I would rather have gas as it is easier to come by.
Should Saito ignored the current gas engine market?
Heck no. People get it in their heads that they want something, they will buy it even if it is not a significant improvement. Might as well give the suckers what they want.
Should Saito have utillized more proven components in their ignition systems rather than trying to utilize "proprietary" components?
Very much so. Most of their single cylinder gas engines are flops & require converting to C&H CDI & ZAMA/Walbro carburators for dependable power. Saito is taking a serious hit in reputation as this unfolds.
Should Saito have redesigned their engines for gasoline fuel?
Yes, but other than increasing displacement & (I assume) lowering CR they have not. Still the same crankshafts & connecting rods on most FG engines. The part #s for the crankshafts differ in that the FG crank has a provision to lock in the prop hub. (another poorly designed part of their ignition systems) No provisions for increased operating tempertures or reduced oiling.
A Saito engine converted to CDI while retaining methanol fuel will make more power than a gasoline conterpart W/less smell. It will run cooler & most likely last much longer. Other than the somewhat reduced operating cost for gasoline, (not taking into account reduced engine life) the CDI methanol engine will have all of the advantages of the gasoline counterpart.
If you want a gas burning 4-stroke engine, buy one designed as such from the get-go.
http://www.rotomotor.cz/rotomotor/en/default.html
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XhHNzVIhapI[/youtube]
All this, mind you, from a rabid Saito fan that has been running CDI W/methanol in my Saito engines since 1997.
#70
Senior Member
RE: New Saito 4 Cycle Gas Engine, 3 Cyl FG-84
Same price, same displacement, same HP as the FG84 at .8# less weight.
Designed as a gas engine from the start.
http://www.rcuniverse.com/market/item.cfm?itemId=884603
Designed as a gas engine from the start.
http://www.rcuniverse.com/market/item.cfm?itemId=884603
#73
Senior Member
RE: New Saito 4 Cycle Gas Engine, 3 Cyl FG-84
ORIGINAL: Old Fart
Yes but..it's a two stroke.I'd like to see saito go down the same path kolm engines have.
Yes but..it's a two stroke.I'd like to see saito go down the same path kolm engines have.
ORIGINAL: Old Fart
In the bird dog i meant.
In the bird dog i meant.
I'll go back & edit in some 4-stroke bench test videos then. The 85cc 4-stroke is what I was comparing to the FG84R3.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rlm7QjS38Ro[/youtube]
#74
My Feedback: (8)
RE: New Saito 4 Cycle Gas Engine, 3 Cyl FG-84
ORIGINAL: SrTelemaster150
You have to give the public what it thinks it wants regardless of practcality.
Should Saito ignored the current gas engine market?
Heck no. People get it in their heads that they want something, they will buy it even if it is not a significant improvement. Might as well give the suckers what they want.
Should Saito have utillized more proven components in their ignition systems rather than trying to utilize ''proprietary'' components?
Very much so. Most of their single cylinder gas engines are flops & require converting to C&H CDI & ZAMA/Walbro carburators for dependable power. Saito is taking a serious hit in reputation as this unfolds.
Should Saito have redesigned their engines for gasoline fuel?
Yes, but other than increasing displacement & (I assume) lowering CR they have not. Still the same crankshafts & connecting rods on most FG engines. The part #s for the crankshafts differ in that the FG crank has a provision to lock in the prop hub. (another poorly designed part of their ignition systems) No provisions for increased operating tempertures or reduced oiling.
A Saito engine converted to CDI while retaining methanol fuel will make more power than a gasoline conterpart W/less smell. It will run cooler & most likely last much longer. Other than the somewhat reduced operating cost for gasoline, (not taking into account reduced engine life) the CDI methanol engine will have all of the advantages of the gasoline counterpart.
If you want a gas burning 4-stroke engine, buy one designed as such from the get-go.
http://www.rotomotor.cz/rotomotor/en/default.html
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XhHNzVIhapI[/youtube]
All this, mind you, from a rabid Saito fan that has been running CDI W/methanol in my Saito engines since 1997.
ORIGINAL: n8622t
And that's why Saito is converting so many glow engines to gas?
ORIGINAL: SrTelemaster150
It won't out perform the FA450R3 on GI (as far as power) like people think & will lag behind when CDI is used on the 450.
ORIGINAL: rcnut101
I dont think that FG-84 R3 is that slouchy, On the video they are turning a 23x12. Which is not bad, But I would rather have gas as it is easier to come by.
I dont think that FG-84 R3 is that slouchy, On the video they are turning a 23x12. Which is not bad, But I would rather have gas as it is easier to come by.
Should Saito ignored the current gas engine market?
Heck no. People get it in their heads that they want something, they will buy it even if it is not a significant improvement. Might as well give the suckers what they want.
Should Saito have utillized more proven components in their ignition systems rather than trying to utilize ''proprietary'' components?
Very much so. Most of their single cylinder gas engines are flops & require converting to C&H CDI & ZAMA/Walbro carburators for dependable power. Saito is taking a serious hit in reputation as this unfolds.
Should Saito have redesigned their engines for gasoline fuel?
Yes, but other than increasing displacement & (I assume) lowering CR they have not. Still the same crankshafts & connecting rods on most FG engines. The part #s for the crankshafts differ in that the FG crank has a provision to lock in the prop hub. (another poorly designed part of their ignition systems) No provisions for increased operating tempertures or reduced oiling.
A Saito engine converted to CDI while retaining methanol fuel will make more power than a gasoline conterpart W/less smell. It will run cooler & most likely last much longer. Other than the somewhat reduced operating cost for gasoline, (not taking into account reduced engine life) the CDI methanol engine will have all of the advantages of the gasoline counterpart.
If you want a gas burning 4-stroke engine, buy one designed as such from the get-go.
http://www.rotomotor.cz/rotomotor/en/default.html
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XhHNzVIhapI[/youtube]
All this, mind you, from a rabid Saito fan that has been running CDI W/methanol in my Saito engines since 1997.