Yep another quetion thats been asked a thousand times
03-28-2013, 12:05 PM
#76
Senior Member
RE: Yep another quetion thats been asked a thousand times
ORIGINAL: willig10
I think we have beat this horse long enough, time to move on?
I think we have beat this horse long enough, time to move on?
In Scott's defense I'll say this: It wasn't that long ago that many of the more knowledgeable posters were in his shoes, particularly regarding small gasoline engines. Some of us did our own research with the enginesand created our own answers and others did not. Personally, I think we ALL should take a step back. Also personally, I will continue to answer as best I can, questions regarding my findings, the things I trust most. Afterall it is trully an issue of whose answers do you trust most, isn't it?
03-28-2013, 01:45 PM
#78
Senior Member
RE: Yep another quetion thats been asked a thousand times
ORIGINAL: BarracudaHockey
Besides, if nobody asks these questions once in a while how will we all find out about the latest and greatest oil that will make you fly like QuiQue in less than 1 gallon??
Besides, if nobody asks these questions once in a while how will we all find out about the latest and greatest oil that will make you fly like QuiQue in less than 1 gallon??
05-04-2013, 09:14 PM
#79
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RE: Yep another quetion thats been asked a thousand times
ORIGINAL: pe reivers
One last word before closing the subscription.
On several occasions airplane engines are compared with Mx engines and weed whackers, and how much simpler airplane engines are. Nothing is less true.
One last word before closing the subscription.
On several occasions airplane engines are compared with Mx engines and weed whackers, and how much simpler airplane engines are. Nothing is less true.
This is not comparing the LOAD at which they carry.... but DANG... do those motorcross bike engines take a beating....
If taking off the fan that was used for a stationary tool (leaf blower), for a conversion (not many bother with this nowadays, because these engines don't produce the power that a China cheape can at half the cost)
We simply stick the converted engine in a plane, and the movement of air takes care of the rest....
Try to take a radiator off a motocross bike You wouldn't get but a few minutes of track time before that piston melted.
This is do to the higher piston heat that a water cooled/jacketed engine puts out....
Does a rc plane engine have a constant hardship placed apon it? Absolutely..... Do the Aircooled rc plane engines get a constant load placed on it, that other engines would have a very hard time living through?
YES YES and YES....
This brings up a very good question though............. Do we use oil designed for AIR COOLED engines or Water cooled engines??
15 years ago, all the ultralight flyers would say that Penzoil Air cooled 2-stroke oil is what should be used .... and the motors have almost No signs of ware, when inspected after use of this oil...
05-04-2013, 09:26 PM
#80
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RE: Yep another quetion thats been asked a thousand times
Recent trends have changed from 2-strokes to 4-stroke engines in the off road racing motocross bikes, 4-wheelers, snowmobiles, and personal water crafts...
prior to this was a change from air cooled 2 strokes to H2o cooled motors....
This all lends to my recent read:
Water cooled two-cycle engine oils require higher levels of a heavy oil to prevent piston and cylinder wall scuffing. Because of their high average piston temperature, lighter oils evaporate too quickly from the piston cylinder contact area. The heavy base oil, which vaporizes at very high temperatures, resists evaporation and remains in place to provide lubrication to the piston and cylinder. Air cooled oil formulations must have much lower levels of the heavy base oil than water cooled engine oils. These oils require only a small amount of heavy oil to provide protection against piston scuffing and seizure at peak temperatures. High levels of heavy base oils in an oil formulated for air cooled engines can cause engine deposits. These deposits form as a result of incomplete burning of the heavy oil. The deposits can cause piston ring sticking and can eventually plug or disrupt the flow of the exhaust system, resulting in power loss and possible engine damage.
This article was written some time ago, but applies to our very basic design air cooled engines...
A synthetic oil with (c) instead of the (D) rating be better for out engines//????? if you are concerned with gumming up your expensive tuned pipes???
Any good 2stroke oil should work well in our engines.... but what is best for the future surge of gas 4-stroke engines???
That will be the Next ongoing discussion....
I may just go with stihl synthetic, but the castor 999 smells great...but so doesn't McDonald's French fries!
prior to this was a change from air cooled 2 strokes to H2o cooled motors....
This all lends to my recent read:
Water cooled two-cycle engine oils require higher levels of a heavy oil to prevent piston and cylinder wall scuffing. Because of their high average piston temperature, lighter oils evaporate too quickly from the piston cylinder contact area. The heavy base oil, which vaporizes at very high temperatures, resists evaporation and remains in place to provide lubrication to the piston and cylinder. Air cooled oil formulations must have much lower levels of the heavy base oil than water cooled engine oils. These oils require only a small amount of heavy oil to provide protection against piston scuffing and seizure at peak temperatures. High levels of heavy base oils in an oil formulated for air cooled engines can cause engine deposits. These deposits form as a result of incomplete burning of the heavy oil. The deposits can cause piston ring sticking and can eventually plug or disrupt the flow of the exhaust system, resulting in power loss and possible engine damage.
This article was written some time ago, but applies to our very basic design air cooled engines...
A synthetic oil with (c) instead of the (D) rating be better for out engines//????? if you are concerned with gumming up your expensive tuned pipes???
Any good 2stroke oil should work well in our engines.... but what is best for the future surge of gas 4-stroke engines???
That will be the Next ongoing discussion....
I may just go with stihl synthetic, but the castor 999 smells great...but so doesn't McDonald's French fries!
05-05-2013, 11:44 PM
#81
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RE: Yep another quetion thats been asked a thousand times
The jury says Stihl HP Ultra 2T oil.Unobtainable in many parts of the world. It is designed for chain saw engines and thinking along those lines how about oils produced for the ECHO line of chain saws which can had just about from any mower shop where I live? Custom PC if you read this you may want to comment .Vaguely remember you checking out oils and came to the conclusion that theECHO Syn . is good as any.I am aware that you are picky about oils for your 2T glow engines.
05-06-2013, 03:51 AM
#82
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RE: Yep another quetion thats been asked a thousand times
ORIGINAL: Bob Pastorello
Hope nobody minds my .02 worth, since I did the "Gas Info for Newbies" sticky.... I still stand by my oil comments there.
1. There is no "Magic"oil with miraculous properties.
2. What has been tried, and endured the test of more than just RC'ers for decades still works fine - plain ol' Pennzoil Air Cooled for 2 strokes.
3. If you like a synthetic, after trying all sorts of flavors (inlcuding the miracle-oils), I found that Stihl Ultra is just dandy.
So for me, it's a nice comfortable issue - I know what works very well, have had great personal experience with them, and can support their use/recommendation to anyone running a gasser.
There is just no need for me to seek out something different, when what I've settled with works so well not only for me, but thousands of others.
Hope nobody minds my .02 worth, since I did the "Gas Info for Newbies" sticky.... I still stand by my oil comments there.
1. There is no "Magic"oil with miraculous properties.
2. What has been tried, and endured the test of more than just RC'ers for decades still works fine - plain ol' Pennzoil Air Cooled for 2 strokes.
3. If you like a synthetic, after trying all sorts of flavors (inlcuding the miracle-oils), I found that Stihl Ultra is just dandy.
So for me, it's a nice comfortable issue - I know what works very well, have had great personal experience with them, and can support their use/recommendation to anyone running a gasser.
There is just no need for me to seek out something different, when what I've settled with works so well not only for me, but thousands of others.
Couldn't agree more.
And if you can;t find Pennz Air cooled then Shell Advance 2 is a suitble alternative
05-06-2013, 04:19 AM
#83
RE: Yep another quetion thats been asked a thousand times
ORIGINAL: pe reivers
One last word before closing the subscription.
On several occasions airplane engines are compared with Mx engines and weed wackers, and how much simpler airplane engines are. Nothing is less true.
Airplane engines work on a propeller load, that loads the engine to the maximum without any forced cooling. At the same time, our engines have extremely small cooling fins, and ever decreasing engine mass to act as buffer for excessive heat. It is like a Mx engine running in high gear all the time. How long would that last?
When converting engines, the first thing to remove is the air blower that provides the cooling for the engine, just to save weight and reduce overall dimensions.
We don't need that in our engines, don't we? DO WE?
Considering that general attitude towards those poor engines, the oil we use is the only defense our engine has against abuse. That is why not just any oil will do. Use the best you can get, mixable at the ratio the engine manufacturer demands. Those few drops of oil will some day save your day.
What is good oil?
Oil with a good base stock. These are expensive by nature, be it mineral or synthetic. Walmart oil is only cheap because of low quality base oils, distilled straight from the crude oil.
Stay away from the very thin oils of less than 8 cStokes at 100°C. All good oils have data sheets where you can look up these data.
Synthetic oils tend to have less or no wear in the engine. They also tend to have a little more carbon inside the engine. Grade 3 and higher base stock often is labeled synthetic, because the art of producing it. It is however still Mineral oil, and not an ester which is a true synthetic.
One last word before closing the subscription.
On several occasions airplane engines are compared with Mx engines and weed wackers, and how much simpler airplane engines are. Nothing is less true.
Airplane engines work on a propeller load, that loads the engine to the maximum without any forced cooling. At the same time, our engines have extremely small cooling fins, and ever decreasing engine mass to act as buffer for excessive heat. It is like a Mx engine running in high gear all the time. How long would that last?
When converting engines, the first thing to remove is the air blower that provides the cooling for the engine, just to save weight and reduce overall dimensions.
We don't need that in our engines, don't we? DO WE?
Considering that general attitude towards those poor engines, the oil we use is the only defense our engine has against abuse. That is why not just any oil will do. Use the best you can get, mixable at the ratio the engine manufacturer demands. Those few drops of oil will some day save your day.
What is good oil?
Oil with a good base stock. These are expensive by nature, be it mineral or synthetic. Walmart oil is only cheap because of low quality base oils, distilled straight from the crude oil.
Stay away from the very thin oils of less than 8 cStokes at 100°C. All good oils have data sheets where you can look up these data.
Synthetic oils tend to have less or no wear in the engine. They also tend to have a little more carbon inside the engine. Grade 3 and higher base stock often is labeled synthetic, because the art of producing it. It is however still Mineral oil, and not an ester which is a true synthetic.
i've quoted you above in the hope that it might make someone think.
05-06-2013, 05:51 AM
#84
RE: Yep another quetion thats been asked a thousand times
ORIGINAL: av8tor1977
Well, nobody (I don't think) has attempted to answer his original question. I think Walmart has small one gallon treatment two stroke oil bottles, but who knows what oil it is, and doubtful that it will be to mix your 30:1 ratio. Next best thing I can think of is Pennzoil for Air Cooled Engines, which is sometimes sold in 8 oz. bottles. One of those bottles in TWO gallons of gas would make a 32:1 mixture, which is fine though not exactly what you specified. Also, the Pennzoil is getting hard to find.
People kind of get all bent out of shape about figuring fuel/oil mixtures. It is simple. A gallon of gas is 128 oz., and you simply divide that by your desired ratio to find the amount of oil to use. 128 divided by a ratio of 32 equals 4 oz. - 128 divided by your 30 ratio equals 4.26 oz. (Stick with the 32. It is fine, easy, and your engine will never know the difference.)
AV8TOR
ORIGINAL: SCOTT42
ok I just want to keep it simple so I want to ask all of you DLE users whats the best oil to use on a brand new DLE 35RA? I would like something that requires no measuring if possible like something that comes in the tiny bottles that mix to one gallon of gas if possible, also need to know whats the best mix ratio. 30-1 is what im thinking for break in. Thanks.
ok I just want to keep it simple so I want to ask all of you DLE users whats the best oil to use on a brand new DLE 35RA? I would like something that requires no measuring if possible like something that comes in the tiny bottles that mix to one gallon of gas if possible, also need to know whats the best mix ratio. 30-1 is what im thinking for break in. Thanks.
People kind of get all bent out of shape about figuring fuel/oil mixtures. It is simple. A gallon of gas is 128 oz., and you simply divide that by your desired ratio to find the amount of oil to use. 128 divided by a ratio of 32 equals 4 oz. - 128 divided by your 30 ratio equals 4.26 oz. (Stick with the 32. It is fine, easy, and your engine will never know the difference.)
AV8TOR
