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Zenoah G-62 or DA 50

Old 09-07-2005, 12:10 PM
  #26  
Bob Laine
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Default RE: Zenoah G-62 or DA 50

Bill, have you seen the jugs that are advertised as "Zenoah Clones" on the universe? The jugs have been drilled through with what I think he calls "Golf Balled". Looks like it would be lighter but also much weaker. By the way, I'm a firm beliver in strength. That's why I prefer "TAURUS" engines......... Uh, Uh, I've done it again.
Old 09-07-2005, 12:16 PM
  #27  
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Default RE: Zenoah G-62 or DA 50


ORIGINAL: Bob Laine

I slipped, I meant to say almost as lite.

Hi Bob,

Bottomline, I would think, is that a pound difference isn't going to make a significant difference in your 30lb application.
Old 09-07-2005, 12:21 PM
  #28  
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Default RE: Zenoah G-62 or DA 50

ORIGINAL: Bob Laine

Bill, have you seen the jugs that are advertised as "Zenoah Clones" on the universe? The jugs have been drilled through with what I think he calls "Golf Balled". Looks like it would be lighter but also much weaker. By the way, I'm a firm beliver in strength.
No, I haven't. They might be weaker, but it sounds like it would give you more cooling area.

ORIGINAL: Bob Laine
That's why I prefer "TAURUS" engines......... Uh, Uh, I've done it again.
Uh oh. You've done it now Bob. You broke your rules. You know that I agree with you there, but I was trying really hard to follow your rules(which I didn't do really great at anyway), so I didn't bring up the "T" word.
Old 09-07-2005, 01:04 PM
  #29  
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Default RE: Zenoah G-62 or DA 50


ORIGINAL: RCIGN1

I could probably take off a few more oz by making the fins smaller like a ZDZ, making the hub smaller, and using syncro spark instead of my ball bearing spark advance...
Making the fins smaller [:@] Can you say overheat and trashing your engine hahahah, its not worth it for an ounce or two....

Ball bearing spark advance ? Doesnt the new ignition module set the advance based on RPM ? I would be looking for a new supplier if they dont. I mean ball bearing spark advance, thats technology from 100 years ago [X(] I think I saw a ball bearing spark advance once on an old steam locomotive, its been so long ago my memroy of it is a bit fuzzy... maybe on was on a model a model T in a museum...

JettPilot
Old 09-07-2005, 03:25 PM
  #30  
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Default RE: Zenoah G-62 or DA 50

You wanna see small fins, look a any of the ZDZ engines...The Model T Ford had no ball bearings in the spark advance, it was a cup mounted in front of the cam on the engine block and was controlled by a rod activated by a lever on the steering column...A roller on the end of the cam made contact with 4 metal segments connect to the coil box with wires to activate the spark ignition buzzer boxes, one for each cylinder...[8D]
My spark advance is mechanical, operated by a rod from the carb...The ball bearing is behind the hub...It is completely linear and costs about $35 less than a syncro.. The syncro spark design HAS to lag behind the crank rpm and will cause the engine to bog if the low speed needle is adjusted too rich..The lag is almost imperceptible, but can be demonstrated by intentionally richening the low speed needle...
FWIW. the Model T Ford was the most produced car in the world until eclipsed by the VW Beetle...Over 15,000,000 Model T's were produced and did very well, thank you...
Old 09-07-2005, 05:09 PM
  #31  
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Default RE: Zenoah G-62 or DA 50

I am sorry I haven't been using metaphors but I will try. I don't disagree that the G62 is an excellent engine but it has been stated many times, which I also agree with, that it is a work horse. The DA is a race horse. I also agree with that. Don't take the race horse to the field to plow but also if running a race I prefer a race horse. I agree also that you can cut, slice and dice on your engine to get your weight down to where you can replace it with a DA. Now post on a similar form out of California where Giant Scale is the norm not the exception. The question, which produces the most power a G62 or DA 50 is a joke. To quote I almost fell out of my chair when I read this. The DA of course.
Old 09-07-2005, 05:32 PM
  #32  
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Default RE: Zenoah G-62 or DA 50

The debate will never end! Everyone that is convinced one way or the other will likely remain convinced as to their preference. As for the engine weight I considered lightning my new G-62 until the manufacturer told me that any alteration voids the warranty. In other words when you make the conversion to lighten the engine it had better be a great solid engine that you don't want the warranty on . Because any future manufacturer problems will be an out of pocket expense. Good luck and have fun continuing the debate.
Old 09-07-2005, 06:06 PM
  #33  
Bob Laine
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Default RE: Zenoah G-62 or DA 50

Reed's were for controling model airplains when I got started in the hobby.
Old 09-07-2005, 06:08 PM
  #34  
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Default RE: Zenoah G-62 or DA 50

We'll ride that "T" horse another day.........
Old 09-07-2005, 06:13 PM
  #35  
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Default RE: Zenoah G-62 or DA 50

Horizon is NOT the manufacturer, Komatsu Zenoah is.. If someone talked to the manufacturer they would have had to call Zenoah in Japan......Horizon was just in the right place at the right time to get the exclusive rights to the line...ISC International owned the rights to Zenoah engines before Horizon Hobbies..I asked Jim Goad, the owner of ISC, if conversion to CD ignition would void the warranty..He said no..
Horizon might be different...I have seen very few G62 engines in 18 years that needed any warranty....The warranty on my conversion is lifetime, much longer than the warranty on the engine itself...The only cutting involved is the mount for the source coil on the front of the crankcase...I install a much better carb insulator block than the leaky stock part...The ignition coil is retained...There is NOTHING involved with a conversion that could possibly cause any problem with any part of the engine...If Horizon won't warranty an engine problem on a converted engine they're just using that for an excuse...IMO
FWIW...I have been buying Zenoah engines for 18 years...Only problem I ever saw was years ago when they changed the cylinder casting...There was a thin spot under the intake port that opened up into the port, causing a pulse leak...All the leaky cylinders were replaced at no charge to the customer...Once in a great while a small 1/8" piece of the case gasket will end up inside the case..Won't hurt anything....Haven't seen any of those in years....
Horizon is violating its own rule..The leaky phenolic carb insulator blocks are not from the chainsaw cylinders used on the G62, they're made somewhere else..Is that an alteration ?
Old 09-07-2005, 06:16 PM
  #36  
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Default RE: Zenoah G-62 or DA 50

Well now you've gone and done it. One must consider what kind of racing they are going to do. If you're just racing around with the little airplanes get the DA. But if on the other hand you want to get in with the BIG guy's and really race airplanes, you have to use a G-62.
Old 09-07-2005, 06:28 PM
  #37  
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Default RE: Zenoah G-62 or DA 50

a 30 pound stinger is not a big plane it's just fat
Old 09-07-2005, 06:29 PM
  #38  
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Default RE: Zenoah G-62 or DA 50

Not quite...The AT6 class that used G62s is dead...The Formula one and Biplane class all use GT80s, some stock and some modified...Rignt now nothing else is as fast or reliable...
Now the REALLY big racers use modified 32hp 289cc Herbrandson drone engines..
Old 09-07-2005, 06:29 PM
  #39  
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Default RE: Zenoah G-62 or DA 50

i love you bob
Old 09-07-2005, 06:49 PM
  #40  
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Default RE: Zenoah G-62 or DA 50

Point taken, However as far as I know Horizon IS the main distributor and service center for the USA. One would think they would know the Warranty issues. I am not implying that there is anything wrong with the conversions, or that it is harmful to the engine. I am merely stating facts that I was given by the manufacturers representive. But if we are going there, lets look at the meat of the situation. The fact that Zenoahs benifit from the conversions, are because they are manufactured without electronic ignition DA,s however are . So calculate the cost of the engine, the ignition system, the labor, the shipping, as well as the down time, and you are priced right with DA. so in conclusion I wonder if Horizon, (a Great Company in my opinion) tells me that if I modify my engine it will void my warranty, and I do it anyway and then a problem unrelated to the modification where do I get service, Japan ? I also agree that Zenoahs are great engines with a great tract record, but that does not mean that a problem will never arise. I am a great driver and have a great driving record but that don't mean I couldn't have an incident tomorrow. No disrespect intended, I have flown a plane with the conversion on it and it ran great. I would consider having it installed on mine ,but not untill I know that the engine can survive most of its warranty. Thanks for all you do
Old 09-07-2005, 07:31 PM
  #41  
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Default RE: Zenoah G-62 or DA 50

This will be my final post on this thread. I still say that the correct answer to my original question is the Zenoah is the more powerful engine for that application. Now let me say this. If all I were flying were 20 lb airplanes, I would choose the DA every time if those were my only two choices. However, There are other engines that I would choose over either one of the fore mentioned. I don't need to name the engine I would choose. There are many on this site that no what my favorite engine is. The real fact is that it is hard to fault most any engine manufactured today. I'm from the old school when our choices were between Zenoah, Quadra, and kerowitz. That last name is spelled wrong but most of the old timers will know what I'm talking about. Engines are just like the radios we use today, The cheapest radio on the market today, is far more reliable and has more features than the most expensive years ago. I even include the "Kraft signature" radio that sold for 900.00. This thread has been fun but like all the other threads that pose one question, thirty more will be answered that have nothing to do with the original. But I will say this, IT'S BEEN FUN. hummm, What can I ask next.
Old 09-07-2005, 08:12 PM
  #42  
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Default RE: Zenoah G-62 or DA 50

Well just to continue the fun guess which one in the picture is Ralph.
Old 09-07-2005, 08:24 PM
  #43  
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Default RE: Zenoah G-62 or DA 50

A G62 will outlast any airplane it is put on, and more..I just called DA...Price of a new DA50R is $595....Price of a new converted G62 is $525....
Warranty on my ignition is lifetime, don't know about DA....I have NEVER replaced a crank that prematurely wore out on a G62.. I know of some that are 18 years old and still going.....G62s don't have the carb problems that DA had/has...My service is every bit as good and just as fast as DA...I have bought back, for full price, a few Zenoah engines from dissatisfied customers..Has DA?....
Old 09-07-2005, 08:45 PM
  #44  
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Default RE: Zenoah G-62 or DA 50

This has been a fun thread. Thanks Bob.

Ralph, you didn't answer the question, are you in that picture, and if so, which one?
Old 09-08-2005, 12:12 AM
  #45  
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Default RE: Zenoah G-62 or DA 50

Didn't know anyone asked, just RTK...Old guy in the middle fondling the engine is me, picture was taken in ElDorado, Kansas....
Old 09-08-2005, 01:24 AM
  #46  
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Default RE: Zenoah G-62 or DA 50


ORIGINAL: RCIGN1

Didn't know anyone asked, just RTK...Old guy in the middle fondling the engine is me, picture was taken in ElDorado, Kansas....
I should have guessed, just from what you were doing.
Old 09-08-2005, 01:53 AM
  #47  
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Default RE: Zenoah G-62 or DA 50

Bob, Do you have a link to the Kerowitz website?? I'd like to meet these ba%%^ds!
Old 09-08-2005, 09:08 AM
  #48  
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Default RE: Zenoah G-62 or DA 50

Bass1 Sorry but I don't have a link. I didn't know that they were still in business. Thank's for showing me the correct spelling of the name.

PS Sounds like you bought one of them...
Old 09-08-2005, 09:55 AM
  #49  
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Default RE: Zenoah G-62 or DA 50

Again I AM NOT DISPUTING THE QUALITY OF ZENOAH, I also do not dispute that you may stand behind your work, I am certain that you do. I will continue to state that Horizon says that the conversion voids the warranty on the engine. Now you may issue a engine warranty when you do the conversion stating that you will warranty any internal problems that may arise during the origional manufacturers warranty period. I don't understand how if the only cutting involved is the mount for the source coil on the front of the crankcase, where does the weight loss come from ? As for the carb issue you state G62s doesn't have the carb problem DA has, but refer to your post where you state that you replace a much better carb insulater block than the leaky stock part, HUMMMM........... conected to the carb ? I don't know. Any way the G 62 is a great engine, but so is the DA, and it is still a baby. I understand that you recieve income associated with the Zenoah engines, and must defend them at all cost, I feel that anyone should have the right to know what may void their warranty. I know many in the hobby that state that you are highly reputable, so to me that is not, nor has been in debate. The only debate I have is Manufacturers Warranty on my engine. No disrespect intended to you, Zenoah, or anyone else. God Bless, & this is my final post on the subject.
Old 09-08-2005, 10:25 AM
  #50  
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Default RE: Zenoah G-62 or DA 50


ORIGINAL: DNB/AIR

I understand that you recieve income associated with the Zenoah engines, and must defend them at all cost,
I'll tell you right now, that that's dead wrong. I've been dealing with Ralph for years, and he tells it like it is, whether it's a product he's selling or not. All Ralph has been stating is what he does, he has not been saying anything against you, or what you're saying.

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