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Beginner to Gas

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Old 09-09-2005, 08:25 PM
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SplitWings
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Default Beginner to Gas

I've been flying with glow engines for a couple of years now, but I've been thinking (OK, wanting) to move up to gas engines. Does anyone know of any beginner's guides that have either been posted before or that is available on the internet. Basically I would like to learn the differences in setting up (as opposed to a glow setup). For example, I've some things like gas sometimes uses electronic ingnitions and a gas engine usually has a kill switch.

I'm not asking someone to write a whole newbie's guide to post here, but if someone knows a source thats already been written. I've been searching this forum without much luck so far.

Thanks alot!

Joe
St. Louis
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Old 09-09-2005, 08:46 PM
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gasoline
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Default RE: Beginner to Gas

Hi,I too just move to gas after few years on glow,from this transition what I have found is nothing much diffrent beside the equipment that we use is bigger,stronger and a little more expensive.If we are talking about setup basically is the same.But what I really found out is the balancing of prop,if we take a 40. to 120. plane during my glow time,what I always do is but it from the shelf and fit it to the motor and fly but with gas swinging up to 24 inch prop, if the prop is not balance besides the vibration you will notice the engine won't give out alot of power and the mounting will actually crack which is metal.Then we have to learn to mix our own oil.Tuning the engine is basically the same as 2 stroke glow but the diffrence is the low end will always effect the high end where as inn glow it doesn't.If you buy a gas engine the manual actually give you enough information on the motor and how to use it.

For me its is still a learning curve interms of flying this big bird,I still have problem landing this big bird due to the size when is approaching for landing it makes alot of diffrent.Its a matter of getting use to actually.Lastly all I can say its cheap to run really worth the money.Enjoy
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Old 09-09-2005, 10:08 PM
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Geistware
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Default RE: Beginner to Gas

Try this site
http://www.geistware.com/rcmodeling/glowpower/
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Old 09-10-2005, 01:26 AM
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Tired Old Man
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Default RE: Beginner to Gas

Also try the IMAA web site. They have a couple of articles that work well as gas engine primers
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Old 09-10-2005, 04:30 PM
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Default RE: Beginner to Gas

not much different then glow, just bigger and more complicated: here one good source for info:http://www.troybuiltmodels.com/index.html
e-mail me if you need specific answers, I just got into giant scale and Gas 8 months ago and I enjoy it much.
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Old 09-10-2005, 07:26 PM
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Default RE: Beginner to Gas

Gas isn’t more complicated than glow but it is different. It is helpful if you have tinkered with a weed eater or some other two-stroke engine and know how to mix gas and oil.

One area that needs different and careful attention is range checking with engine running. Spark engines can and often do create stray RF noise that may show up as glitches or failure to range check. I have been searching for a checklist and will post the address when found.

Gas engines smaller than 25cc generally suffer in the power to weight department. Actually the power to weight is much better with bigger engines but they need a big airframe. A 25 to 31cc engine will generally fly a in a 15 # or so airplane (4* 120 and giant Stinger). A 25cc engine will not fly a 25# airplane. Don’t ask how I know. A 56cc or 62cc will fly a 35# airplane in scale like manner.

Bill
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Old 09-10-2005, 10:25 PM
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SplitWings
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Default RE: Beginner to Gas

First of all, I want to thank everyone who has posted a reply so far. Each message has provided some great information.

I recently bought a GP Gene Soucy Extra 300. I built it with the hopes of putting my YS 110 in it. However, as powerful as the YS 110 is for a glow engine, it turned out to be lack luster at at best for a plane of that weight. I kind of knew the YS 110 would be inadequate because I was hoping to move up to gas. It looks like I'll be moving up to gas faster than I thought. This plane is around 13 pounds, so I'm thinking of an engine around the 45-50cc range.

Several people have said that there are more similarities than differences when changing from glow to gas. I've found the following:

1. You need to choke the engine before starting. Some people use a separate servo to do this, which can double as a kill switch.
2. Many (not all?) gas engines have an electronic ignition. Do you mount this directly on the engine or the firewall? This requires and additional battery pack?
3. Different fuel tubing is needed so the gas doesn't destroy the glow fuel tubing.
4. I think I've seen pilots use two switches on the plane. Is one the regular switch/battery for the receiver, and the other for the ignition to the engine?
5. Most gas engines are started by flipping the prop by hand, as opposed to using and electic starter on glow.

Any other differences that I've missed? Anything above incorrect (its entirely possible). I'm hoping to find some gas planes at the airfield tomorrow. Hopefully I can talk to someone at the airfield that can show me around their gas powered plane, but all of this info is of great help.

Thanks again. Joe
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Old 09-11-2005, 12:11 AM
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Default RE: Beginner to Gas

for that plane the weight will be a factor in choosing an engine. Look into the MVVS 45/Evolution-45... same engine imported by two different companys. It has a magniesium case and is the lightest engine in its class
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Old 09-11-2005, 12:22 AM
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Default RE: Beginner to Gas

ORIGINAL: SplitWings

Several people have said that there are more similarities than differences when changing from glow to gas. I've found the following:

1. You need to choke the engine before starting. Some people use a separate servo to do this, which can double as a kill switch.

Yes, but a manual choke can work as well

2. Many (not all?) gas engines have an electronic ignition. Do you mount this directly on the engine or the firewall? This requires and additional battery pack?

the ignition box is mounted to the fierwall or engine box, electronic igniton uses a seperate battery pack

3. Different fuel tubing is needed so the gas doesn't destroy the glow fuel tubing.

Tygon and areotrend are the two types of gas fuel tubing

4. I think I've seen pilots use two switches on the plane. Is one the regular switch/battery for the receiver, and the other for the ignition to the engine?

5. Most gas engines are started by flipping the prop by hand, as opposed to using and electic starter on glow.

Use a heavy leather glove or chicken stick for safty

Any other differences that I've missed? Anything above incorrect (its entirely possible). I'm hoping to find some gas planes at the airfield tomorrow. Hopefully I can talk to someone at the airfield that can show me around their gas powered plane, but all of this info is of great help.

No Slime on the plane after every flight!

Thanks again. Joe
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Old 09-11-2005, 01:01 AM
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Default RE: Beginner to Gas

I was flying my GP Soucy extra with an super tigre G-2300 and it was very good. You will find when you try to install a gas engine in this plane that the airframe is a little too small (I tried it). Any engine in the 50cc range is going to be too heavy and too big and have way more power than you will ever need. You will also have prop clearance problems. You will have to add weight to the tail to get it to balance and the plane will weigh in the 14 to 15 pound range when you are done. It will fly at this weight but the wing loading will be high. Also smaller gas engines power to weight ratio are not very good. I tried my 3W-24 in the soucy and while it flew the plane it was not as fun as the large glow engine. If I was starting out in gas powered planes again I would go with a 50cc size plane and engine. You will be better off in the long run and have a better flying plane.

Rick
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Old 09-11-2005, 05:56 AM
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Default RE: Beginner to Gas

The Futaba web page has some good information about Gas engines, and WhildHareRC also has a good page on their web site about stepping up to gas.

As aways there are great people on here who have been there and done that, and will answer any question you have.


Good Luck, and enjoy the ride its a great one..
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Old 09-18-2005, 09:18 PM
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skywalker
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Default RE: Beginner to Gas

There is a lot of good info for the newbie here, thanks for this post. What about the fuel support equipment? The gasoline can type and size, pump that is used, etc. Thanks for the help. Dennis
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Old 09-19-2005, 12:14 PM
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Richard L.
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Default RE: Beginner to Gas


ORIGINAL: mstroh3961

the ignition box is mounted to the fierwall or engine box, electronic igniton uses a seperate battery pack
I'm about to step into gas myself. I have seen a couple of ignition modules mounted on the engine box ahead of the firewall. If mounted this way, won't engine heat affect the functionality and longevity of the ignition module?
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Old 09-19-2005, 01:54 PM
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hello is anybody there?
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Old 09-21-2005, 08:38 PM
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Tsutomu Mabuchi
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Default RE: Beginner to Gas

ORIGINAL: Richard L.


ORIGINAL: mstroh3961

the ignition box is mounted to the fierwall or engine box, electronic igniton uses a seperate battery pack
I'm about to step into gas myself. I have seen a couple of ignition modules mounted on the engine box ahead of the firewall. If mounted this way, won't engine heat affect the functionality and longevity of the ignition module?
Richard L.

As I answered in another thread, I have had no ploblem so far since I made an air
exit hole in the cowl of my P-47. I flew it yesterday and had no problem, too.
P-47's cowl has enough air inlet for engine cooling( and ignition module in my case).
However, I don't know how the heat affects the longevity of the ignition module yet.
One defference about heat I noticed is that gas engines need more cooling measures
for itself than glow engines.
My buddy flew H9 P-51 150 with RORO35 and the engine stopped every time after
several minutes flight. He installs the ignition module after the firewall.
The airplane has a small air intake in front as P-51 and almost no air outlet except
muffler cutouts.
We suggested him to fly it without the cowling and then the engine run very well
all the flight.
I realized that gas engines tend to overheat more than glow. Or overheat affects
gas carb easily than glow carb.
The temperature on the ground was 25deg. Celcius.

Tsutomu Mabuchi

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Old 06-09-2019, 02:29 AM
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madmagro75
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Gday Guys/Gals , My Name is Andrew and have been flying glow Planes for over 25 yrs, just recently began getting back into it after w a few years off so decided to purchase a new model of a club member from miles and miles away my only problem is that its a gasoline engine and i have no idea on how to connect the thing to my radio as the previous owner used only the one battery to power the spark and receiver , now im getting told by others that , thats a bad idea , so ok i need two batteries that should be simple enough, but for me its became a struggle as no longer a spring chicken and dont handle pressure and new tech too well, so if someone could give us the run down on how to connect two battery packs one for receiver and one for the spark would be so gratefully appreciated my engine is the evolution 10 GXE With pumped Carb,

where do i plug in the spark batt and what type should i use basically how do i have two packs running at the same time one for spark and one for receiver do i plug batt for spark to engine and alocate a switch on radio to turn on and off and do i plug the normal 6v pack into the batt section of receiver and so on please help lol !!
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Old 06-09-2019, 03:53 AM
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I see this is your first post, so first things first. Welcome to RCU, and welcome to gas!

Second, I think many of us will agree, especially when talking about the size plane that will likely be found with a 10cc gasser in it's nose, that one battery will do just fine - and there's no need for it to be something huge either. The ignition module won't use much more than a servo would.

If you are buying a new battery, I would HIGHLY recommend you seriously consider a battery with LiFe chemistry. They have proven very reliable, user friendly, and they can deliver the "punch" needed to run an entire flight pack, plus ignition with no struggle.
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Old 06-14-2019, 07:34 AM
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Originally Posted by ahicks View Post
I see this is your first post, so first things first. Welcome to RCU, and welcome to gas!

Second, I think many of us will agree, especially when talking about the size plane that will likely be found with a 10cc gasser in it's nose, that one battery will do just fine - and there's no need for it to be something huge either. The ignition module won't use much more than a servo would.

If you are buying a new battery, I would HIGHLY recommend you seriously consider a battery with LiFe chemistry. They have proven very reliable, user friendly, and they can deliver the "punch" needed to run an entire flight pack, plus ignition with no struggle.
I second this as great info. When 1 battery is being used we rely on an IBEC (Ignition Battery Eliminator Circuit). This isolates the radio from ignition noise and provides an extra engine cut off feature. All new IBEC will come with a set up info.
welcome back and happy landings.
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