Geistware

My Feedback: (16)

I had my engine rebuilt and have burned 4 gallons of lawnboy ashless at 32:1.
My question is this, other than the mess, what are the pros and cons of contunued use of lawnboy oil? Is anyone using it at 40:1 or 50:1?

I know about the other oils, so any information you have on Lawnboy would be appreciated.

Flypaper 2

I run chainsaw oil of whatever brand the local gas station has as 40-1 ratio. Most of it is ashless.

captinjohn

Any good hi-performance chainsaw oil would be better than Lawn-Boy. Sthil Oil is great. Yamalube....Klotz....Husky.....Echoe....go for it...try somthing else. Good Luck Capt,n

Geistware

My Feedback: (16)

I would like to thank you all for your replies.
I am/was an Amsoil distributor. I have used Amsoil, Klotz, or Valvoline for the past 3 years. My question was with the Lawnboy ashless specifically. I will probably go to either Belray or Pennsoil because they are readily available and I have discontinued my dealership for Amsoil. (at least for the short term)

What I have gathered from the responses is that Lawnboy is messy and should not be used thinner than 32:1. The reason this question came up is that after 4 gallons, my engine has zero carbon in the exhaust nipple. There is an oily film but it looks clean. Clean up is like cleaning a glow plane again and it is discoloring the white on my plane. What caused me to look at different oils in the first place was an article that was done by Elson Shields which I posted on my site.
http://www.geistware.com/rcmodeling/articles/oil_test/

Amsoil leaves a hard carbon powder in my exhaust but no wear has been noted. I just wanted to see what was the thought of lawnboy and what specifically is it's intent for new engines that would not benefit any engine through continued use.
Thanks
Miles

flyinrazrback

My Feedback: (69)

You will like the bel ray mc-1, I run it 50:1 and everything is clean.

bob_nj

My Feedback: (62)

flyingrazrback -> I switched to MC-1 this season and like it so far_bob

cwoodstx

My Feedback: (5)

Geistware: I was wondering the same thing, i.e. if continued use of lawnboy ashless at 32:1 would be a problem. I decided to try it. After 2 seasons of lawnboy at 32:1 on 3 different DA 50's I see no problems. The cylinder head has a few thin carbon spots, but its not coated in carbon. The carbon is very soft and would be easy to remove if I so chose. The rings look fine. The engines run great. There is some oil buildup on the bottom of the place after a day's flying, but it only takes a minute to clean, so I don't consider that a problem.

As has been said many times in this forum - how you run your engine is more important than the type of oil. I run my DA's on the rich side and still have plenty of power. I always figured I would crash damage an engine before I came close to wearing it out anyway.

My son runs penzoil air cooled in his DA 100 at 40:1 with no issues either.

I like amsoil in high reving applications like gas helis, yard blowers, etc.

DMichael

My Feedback: (5)

A few years back I had a BME100 that I broke in with Lawn Boy Ashless at 32-1. I was happy with it and could get it at the local hardware store so I just kept on using it- about 3 years in all. I ended up selling the plane and engine to a fellow local to me who continued to use the same oil. He had a crash and sent the motor in for servicing. According to him, Keith at BME wanted to know what kind of oil had been used because the inside of the engine looked so good. I had no problems using it and neither has this other fellow.

Based on my experience, not only can you use it, but the engine likes it too.

Now I am flying ZDZ engines and they have other recommendations about oil so, in order to comply and ensure that any warranty will be honored, I am using sythetic at 40-1 (Mobil 1).

Dave Michael
SP: RC Showcase/ZDZ Engines

Flypaper 2

You need extra oil for the first gallon just because of the high friction and heat buildup because of it. Once things polish up and cool down there is no need for high oil ratio. Waste of oil and a lot of slober is the only result. I remember when I worked for a Merc marina They said you could only use Mercury outboard oil. If you looked close at the bottom of the bottle, in small letters it said "Made by Castrol"

Geistware

My Feedback: (16)

Dave Michael and cwoodstx, this is the kind of information that I am looking for. I have 3 cans of Lawnbow that I am going to mix at 32:1 (6 gallons) and see how it goes. I am finding that this engine is making a lot more power than it did before. I am not sure if it is due to the modifications Keith made to the engine or just re-breaking the engine in with a different oil. I am now ripping the propeller that I could not get to pull hard. I wonder what will happen when I put on a CF propeller. I expect increased performance just this oil is messy.

Geistware

My Feedback: (16)

A subsequent question that was discussed over lunch.
If you know that a engine is running strong and leaving unburned oil, would increasing the ratio (decreasing oil) to a point just before you stop having unburned oil damage the engine or reduce the oils ability to lubricate the engine. The premise is that if there is unburned oil then there is enough to seal the ring and bearings.

Remember, I am NOT doing this but it was lunch time conversation and a very interesting discussion with some good old boys and chain saw usage.

cwoodstx

My Feedback: (5)

Interesting question. I think it would be difficult to measure unburned oil in such a way as to apply to all conditions. 32:1 is the recommended ratio for lawnboy ashless and I'm sure includes some margin to allow for different running conditions. I know there are days during the Texas summer when I get very little residue on the bottom of the plane, and other cooler days I get more. Each of the 3 DA's is different as well - they all run best at slightly different needle settings. Then there is also the ever present possibility that the mechanic might mis-tune and run the engine too lean for a flight.

With all that considered I'm content to leave it at 32:1 and clean up a little oil residue. Its still considerably cleaner than the glow planes I used to fly.

Geistware

My Feedback: (16)

Lawnboy recommends different ratios for their oil. The defacto standard is 32:1 but that is not a hard fast rule. I don't have a can in front of me but there are 5 or more ratios listed right on the can. There is enough people who say that the ability to wear or lap in the rings and the saturation of internal moving parts is the benefit of Lawnboy. Continued use is not desirable. I cold not find any technical data on it like you can on Amsoil and others. If I could, then it would be easier to understand fact from conjecture.

Flypaper 2

Quite a few yrs. ago, on a Quadra 35, I tried 50 to 1 mix. Wouldn't idle that slow as it sucked air through the seals, as the oil helps to seal them and prevents wear. Tried 30 to1 Worked well but slobered a lot of oil and carbon fouled plugs to soon. 40 to 1 was the best compromize between the two.

captinjohn

FLYPAPER....what atre you sticking with? ( Kind of a pun HA!) Have a good day. Capt,n

Kweasel

My Feedback: (29)

Oils with an ashless additive package are designed for low ring land temeratures and will not contribute to plug fouling. Thats ideal for a model aircraft application and is also the most available. Most common oil is pre-diluted with some solvent to make it mix easily with gas and will require more in the mix to get as much to the engine.

Geistware

My Feedback: (16)

I am still looking for technical specifications for Lawnboy ashless.
What I am finding is that it is a high quality petrolium oil.
A little messy but will not foul your plugs if not run too thick.

The guy at I talked to who had an engine repair shop told me that so long as I kept the engine cool, that 40:1 is not a problem. He said if I didn't have good air flow and overloaded the engine, then 32:1 should be the ratio I run.

Flypaper 2

I agree with the guy from the small engine shop. I ran my own small engine business for 35 yrs till I retired three yrs ago. Back in the 50s there was no " chainsaw oil' just mixed # 40 mineral oil at 20 to 1 ratio and that was it.

Geistware

My Feedback: (16)

OK, I got off the phone with Lawnboy and we had an interesting discussion.
In a nutshell, lawnboy is recommended for 50:1 for their snow blowers.
Snowblowers are not considered to run in an extreme work environment.
Trimmers and weedeaters are considered extreme environments and are recommended at 32:1.

I told him what I did and he was surprised that people were putting weedeater engines in airplanes.
He felt that this was a light duty service and unless it is very hot or no air flow over the engine that 40:1 was OK. (told me not to quote him so gents, this is NOT a quote) While I will switch to Belray or Pennzoil, I feel comfortable with using Lawnboy at 40:1 if the need arises.

mrbigg

My Feedback: (21)

My Lawnboy mower loves it at 32:1. Ah, the smell of 2 stroke while cutting the grass. Oops, I mean while the Wife is cutting the grass!

Geistware

My Feedback: (16)

Yea, my plane loves 32:1 as well but I hate the clean up.
I decided to use one of the three remaining cans that I have in my 2 gallon gas jug.
It seems that Lawnboy oil is a high grade petro oil with no adverse effects from long term use.

Diablo-RCU

My Feedback: (1)

Lawnboy is Citgo oil.
Is that high-grade?........

Geistware

My Feedback: (16)

Well someone has to make the base stock.
Citgo gas products are good.
I prefer them over kangaroo gas.
I will say that I only use Chevron and BP in my engines.
The reason is those two stations are close to the house.

Diablo-RCU

My Feedback: (1)

Citgo not only makes the base stock, but blends the whole package. It's a standard Citgo product according to the MSDS. Can't get Lawnboy?.....Go to a Citgo station.

desmobob

I don't have a gasser yet, but this thread is interesting to me. I used to roadrace a two-stroke motorcycle back in the '80s. It was oil injected and liquid cooled. I used one of BelRay's synthetic products for lube.

A lot of the guys that were running older air-cooled two-strokes used castor or castor/synthetic blends. How come nobody uses it in their model airplane gassers? Plug fouling issues?

Good flying,
desmobob