outacontrol41

My Feedback: (9)

Large gas engine owners: HELP!!

Never had a large engine like a Zen G62 before, I'm trying to start it but can't. Using a Sullivan Dynatron super duty starter with two 12 volt lawn tractor batteries, 280 amps each and connected 24 volt style. Is this starter made for such an engine or are my batteries getting weak? Starts my G38 engines just fine. What are you guys using to start 60cc + engines?

p.s. Forget hand cranking as in the manual...that's never worked for me.

Kweasel

My Feedback: (29)

Most of our engines have battery ignitions that only require a gentle push through compression to get them running. A g62 is not the easiest engine to handstart with its magneto, most modelers add a spring starter to the back of the engine or convert them to battery ignition. A spring starter is just like whats standard on .049s, wind it up and let it go. My Dynatron on 24V won't turn a G62 either. There are some specially made starters that will turn big engines, they are expensive, more so than an ignition conversion.

NM2K

My Feedback: (14)

Or one could purchase the C&H Jump Start.

The Jump Start consists of wiring and a battery box that provides the engine with enough electricity to start at low rpm (hand starting). It is easy to connect to the engine, costs much less than a full electronic ignition unit and works just fine with the stock magneto system.

When I bought mine some years ago, it sold for $60 USD. This would be much less expensive than buying a true high power starter, even if using the present batteries.

Why someone hasn't fashioned a compression release for these engines is beyond me. It shouldn't be that difficult to install for anyone with modest machining skills. Then you could start the engine with a conventional starter and smaller battery. It sure worked great on a single cylinder Yamaha 360cc enduro that my friend owned. Without the compression release, that engine could tear the heel right off of a good boot. <G>

Ed Cregger

Zippi

My Feedback: (10)

outacontrol41,

I just got a Zenoah G-62 on a trade and I'm not even going to try and start this engine until I send it to [link=http://www.tompierce.net/190/html/building/RCign.htm]RCIGN1[/link] and have it converted to electronic ignition. The guy I got it from made a video of him starting it with the mag setup and it didn't look that bad. The engine had been in a crash and I just ask him if everything was ok and did it still run and he made a nice video. If you would like to see the video, I can post a link to it. I plan on putting mine in the new WH Extra 300 84".

larry@coyotenet

My Feedback: (21)

G-62's are easy to start by hand once you get the touch. My biggest problem starting them was trying to get them wet enough by flipping with the choke closed. I could never get them primed enough. I now use a prime bottle and give the carb a good shot of gas with the throttle wide open, then pull through slowly a couple times to get the gas in the engine, set the throttle at mid range with the choke open, make sure you have the prop set right, (the prop should be lined up with the two notches on the prop driver) move the prop up on compression , should be straight up, move the prop back to the 3:00 position and throw it through compression, not flip, throw!. You have to give it a good throw in order for the mag to fire properly. Done right the engine will fire on the 3rd flip just like all the electronic ignition engines. Biggest mistake most make is trying to flip a mag engine like a glow engine. The mag is firing at about the 2:00 position but compression is at 12:00 so you have no resistance to feel like you have on a glow engine until it is too late for the mag to fire. Once done I am sure you will get the feel and from then on it's easy. It is hard to describe the proper technique since it is more feel than any thing else but once mastered mag engines will start just as easy as the EI ones.

Larry

outacontrol41

My Feedback: (9)

Thanks everyone....I guess I'm not alone on this one. Zippi, I'd like to see that video if you don't mind. And Ed, I've never heard of a C&H Jump Start before. Sounds good except I really can't afford any more nose weight considering the weight of this engine. I have a feeling that once this engine is started and ran for awhile it may become easier. It's brand new and the piston is very tight to the cylinder causing great resistance. I know they're expensive, but what else is out there as far as starters that will turn this beast?

p.s. Kweasel, where could I get that spring from and could I install it myself?

outacontrol41

My Feedback: (9)

Larry, I'm gonna keep trying your way but I've still got to try an alternative in case I never master it. Thanks.

dirtybird

My Feedback: (5)

The cheapest thing to do is get some model engine deisel fuel. If you can find a buddy that runs deisel he will probably give you some. Squirt a bit of that into the carb and the engine will be off and running in a couple of flips. Be prepared for the engine to start the first time you flip it even if you have the ignition off.
Some cold start fluid from the auto store works but not as well.
If you want a starter put a Miller Persuader on that Dynatron and you will be able to start a small Honda

rcbill

My Feedback: (1)

Outacontrol, I used to start my G62 with a Sullivan model 4 which costs about $160. It has two handles and a large cone for the spinner. Hooked up to just a lawn mower 12 volt battery it would spin the engine easily. I have since installed a CH Ignition costing somewhere around $150. Stick my finger in the carb and turn slowly a few times with ign off and throttle open you can hear and feel the gas sucking into engine. Remove finger from carb (very important step ), turn on ign, set transmitter one or two clicks above idle and be ready for it to fire after 2 or 3 flips. If I were to do over again I would send my engine to RCIGN like Zippy mentioned. He (Ralph) will lighten the engine and install ign in the back and make it run before he sends it back to you. His pricing is very reasonable. I suggested doing this to one of my friends and he is going with Ralph. I am thinking about doing the same for my new winter project. Bill

Zippi

My Feedback: (10)

outacontrol41,

Here is the link to the video that the guy sent me before I bought the engine. Hope it helps.

http://www.putfile.com/lowslo

Eagle Flyer

My Feedback: (84)

If you don't want to go EI the spring starters work great. Especially if ya mess up and flood it. Quickly and easily clean it out. The added weight is not much either. But need to be regreased ocasionaly. Don't have any experience with the jump start but have talked with people that used them and they like them. Mostly personal preference.

Zippi

My Feedback: (10)

When I got my G-62 it had a home made smoke muffler and the bolts that held it on didn't look like what would have come with the engine new. When you buy a new muffler, wrap around or whatever, do you get new bolts with it? Does anyone have a pic of what the stock bolts look like so I can compare it to mine. May have to buy some new ones.

outacontrol41

My Feedback: (9)

Zippi, I would suggest getting a 'Bennett Built' aftermarket muffler from B&B Specialties. Dick Bennett is a great guy to deal with. It's lightweight and does not take much room under the cowl. But if you prefer stock setup, pm me your address and I'll send you a manual and parts list. I'm thinking you're probably going to have to order the muffler, bolts and gasket as seperate parts, not a kit.
As for me[>:]. Well I tried the hand starting thing again...for half an hour straight!![:@] This left me stunned, dazed and confused under a thick layer of sweat! Writing this with arm in cast. Okay then, I'm down to two options. By the way, thanks to everyone for writing to help me out, your advice was taken seriously. Option one is Ed Cregger's Jump start system. Option two is a new Sullivan Megatron starter (1200 oz. torque vs. 680 of my starter). Latter option $ka-ching$. But then, I've got a $2,800 plane with no way to start it! Just a little more $$$ and I'll be in the air. Like having a new Corvette with no key[]

rt3232

My Feedback: (6)

Strange hpw the $$$$ just keep going up.. [>:][>:]

Bob

Antique

My Feedback: (4)

Stock G62 muffler "bolts" are long studs with square ends that exactly fit in the slots in the cylinder...Most aftermarket mufflers come with 10-32 allen bolts with hex nuts that barely fit the slots...Only Slimline does it right, they use 10-32 SQUARE nuts that fit the slots...
The stock studs are grade 8 and hard to thread, but it can be done with a good die after the studs are cut to the correct length...

Stuka Jon N

My Feedback: (33)

Ralph I concur I take the stock bolts heat the end I want to thread to a dull cherry red and then run the die over them. Works great. Forget the thread size It is a Millimeter size. Have these on a Slimline Pitts style and the G62 I bought from you. Stuka Jon

Antique

My Feedback: (4)

Thread size is 5mm .8 pitch...A 10-32 is only .007 smaller and works well...

kerwin50

I have a g 62 an the spring starter works great I've had electronic ing before but many times I've gotten noise out of them an had many close calls but after switching back to mag no noise an like i said the spring starter works well

Antique

My Feedback: (4)

Someone explain to me how an electronic ignition INSIDE the rear mount and making less spark than the mag can cause RF interference....The wire from the battery is shielded from the engine to the switch...I have been making EI conversions for 18 years...I can count on the fingers of one hand how many customers needed a Bosch cap....
Most problems with EI are related to the installation...
My own G62 powered Ultra Hots has the receiver and ignition batteries mounted across from each other in the fuselage, just ahead of the leading edge of the wing..The receiver is a Hitec, mounted about on the cg..The ignition switch and receiver switch are on opposite sides of the fuselage, between the batteries and firewall...No Bosch cap on the spark plug wire..NO interference using my OLD 1972 FM MicroPro transmitter with Hitec servos....Dumb luck maybe ?

geardaddy

My Feedback: (27)

I learned to hand start the G-62 a while back, is fun to demonstrate. For real ease of starting the 62cc Zenoah saw engines cannot be beat, larger flywheel and a big fat spark. Have 8 of these engines here if anyone has interest in one. Will also mod into the lightest 62cc engine on the globe by Ralph.

Zippi

My Feedback: (10)

That G-62 in the video that I posted was the first time that he had tried to start that engine after it had been taken off of a plane that went in by someone else. That being a stock engine without EI didn't look that bad to start by hand. That being said, I'd still like to have RCIGN1 convert mine to EI and get it on a diet.

mrbigg

My Feedback: (21)

you can start Ralph's engines with one finger. I tried for fun.[sm=lol.gif]

Zippi

My Feedback: (10)

mrbigg,

Yeah, that's what everyone has told me and also what I have read. That's why I gotta get mine converted just after I get my WH Extra 300 for the G-62, my new 7202 JR radio, pay AMA and club dues, finish up my QQ YAK 54 with the Brillelli 40cc, and something for the wifes birthday tomorrow. Just to many things going on #@%$^%&)(*^.

mrbigg

My Feedback: (21)

Too busy myself. There's alot of Christmas shopping coming up. I would just get the engine converted and be done with it. Alot easier on the arm.

rcbill

My Feedback: (1)

outcontrol,
I would go with zippi and mrbigg. You won't be sorry for losing the weight and for getting the electronic ignition. The cost is very reasonable. A friend of mine got the Ralph conversion and loves it.... Bill