NCIS

Hey Everyone,

I just bought a G62 for my Top Flite Giant FU4-1 Corsair and was wondering how hard they are to start with the standard CDI ignition system. I thought about having Ralph convert it but don't really want to spend the extra $175.00 if they start reasonable well the way they are. Please respond and give me some advice.

Thanks,

Gibbs

gboulton

My Feedback: (15)

They ain't exactly easy to start. Certainly, it's doable, but it's not what i'd reccomend for an afternoon's fun at the airfield, ya know?

I must say this, however...hands down, without ANY doubts, Ralph's mods are WELL worth the cost. Easier starting, lighter weight, and, ime, better power. DEFINITELY a $175 you'll be glad you spent, imo.

MinnFlyer

My Feedback: (4)

One of these days I'm going to have Ralph convert mine. But in the meantime, a $50 spring starter from B&B starts mine very well (W/ standard Magneto ignition)

gboulton

My Feedback: (15)

Yeah, gotta agree with Mike...a good spring starter makes em MUCH easier to start. In fact, I probably have an EASIER time with my spring-starter equipped US 41 than I do with the G-62, and it's EASY to start.

Downside, however, is of course the extra weight of the starter. Of course, given we're talking about a warbird here, the extra weight may not be a big issue.

Varad

is it the same with a Zenoah G45? I have a brand new one I was just trying to start 5 minutes ago and I couldnt get it to turn over at all. I have a spring starter, should I install it?

MinnFlyer

My Feedback: (4)

Did you choke it? I don't mean to offend you by asking a stupid question, but I don't know how much experience you have with gassers

NCIS

Can You use the spring starter with a dummy radial engine in the way?

Gibbs

Varad

yeah it was choked. I tried with and without the kill switch attached. Fuel was dripping out of the carb once in a while so I had fuel. I took the brand new plug out and tried turning the motor over and it didnt look like i had any spark but the plug is brand new. Its probably not getting enough ignition.

Rcpilot

My Feedback: (78)

The kicker with the magneto ignition is that it's not going to spark unless you swing that prop at 400RPM or more. Just taking the plug out of the hole and grounding it to the cylinder--then turning the prop over by hand is not enough to generate a spark with the magneto. You have to flip that prop like you mean it to get the magneto spinning past the coil at a high enough rate of speed to make it spark.

Bolt the prop on so that the blades are in front of the round slots in the hub. Put the plug back in. Choke it untill it's wet. Now start at about 3 o'clock and flip it like you hate it. If you do it right, it'll start.

ME? I never could start a G-62 on the magneto. Flipped till my arm about fell off one day and got mad. From that point on, I decided I was using electronic ignition on all of them. I just buy the C&H Quick mount unit for all mine or send it to Ralph. With electronic ignition, you can turn that prop at 1 RPM and it sparks every time you turn it over. Speed it not necessary to make it spark.

I start my G-62 engines as follows:
Ignition on
Choke on
Full throttle
Flip till it pops once
Choke off
Throttle down to high idle
Flip a couple times
Putter putter putter piece-o-cake

dirtybird

My Feedback: (5)

You can also get a jump start from C&H. That charges the coil and makes it easy to start

bzyguy01

I have a g62 in my H9 Edge 540 33% and I have yet to get to fire? It'll pop and sputter but I tell ya.....Than ^$7*% THING GONNA GET THROWN AWAY!!! LOL Really....I think I'm gonna convert it to electronic Ign. or buy some huge starter!

hopkimf

My Feedback: (56)

I have a new G-62 installed on a recently built M-5 Stinson. Have not flown it yet, but have run the engine. It has a spring starter and standard mag. I found that I needed to put my thumb over the carb and pull it over until it was pretty wet (has the B&B Power Ram-easy to choke). Then I used the spring. Popped right off. Ran it a half dozen times same way. Lots of fuel and it goes right away. Also tried not choking and giving it a good shot of gas in carb with fuel bulb. That worked too. Engine is inverted. Don't know what effect that has.

Eagle Flyer

My Feedback: (84)

I have a G62 with a spring starter. Works great. But the trick to starting any gasser is knowing just how much to choke it. Getting the carb tuned just right. And as they break in more and more they require more tuning till they settle in. Just like any other plane engine. But as they break in and you get them set right they start easier.
Also have a Poulan 46 on spring start, works great!!!!!!! No battery to worry about either.

NCIS

I think I'm spending $175.00 and having good old Ralph save my fingers and my arm. All that flipping of the prop is hard on the airframe also. How do you put your finger over the carb when it's inside a big cowling with a dummy engine in the way. Seems like it is more hassle than it's worth!

Thanks for the input,

Gibbs

Varad

Thanks for the help. I am going to mount my prop the way rcpilet says and see if that works. I will probably still need the spring starter but I want to keep this extra light. For the spring starter, I need a thin wall socket to get the nut holding the starter on the back of the crank right?

kwilliby

My Feedback: (13)

I have to vote for the rcign electronic conversion. Ralph did his majic on mine and it's awesome. I have it mounted on my bench for breakin. Temp here is about 40 degrees. I use this process to start mine and it works great! And the engine isn't even broken in yet since it's brand new;

1. full choke, just off ilde
2. 2-3 flips till it pops
3. no choke, just off idle
4. 4-5 flips and it's running

The engine runs sooo smoooth. I enjoy just running it on the bench to hear it run!

This engine runs and idle's better than my DA50 after 10 gallons of fuel thru it.

hopkimf

My Feedback: (56)

Ever watch a full scale plane being propped? Old Cubs, etc. without electrical systems were all started by hand. Just a quick pull of a quarter turn or less and they were going. But one of the mags was impulse coupled to make it snap over faster and provide adequate spark at slow cranking speeds. Likewise, a spring starter helps turn the RC engine over faster for a hotter spark.

With the simplicity of the mag, it's hard for me to spend the extra bucks for something that needs external power to spark the engine. One more thing to maintain. All my lawn mowers, snow blowers, chain saws, etc. have mags. Most of them start on the first or second pull if maintained.

Rcpilot

My Feedback: (78)

Yeah, and they all have a starter rope too. You get 8 or 10 revolutions on the motor every time you yank on the rope. We get one flip with a prop.

The electronic ignition units will idle a LOT smoother if you get a synchrospark of throttle coupled unit. The timing is retarded to only 4 or 5 degrees for starting and idle. The stock magnetos are timed at 28* BTDC. Thats why a stock G-62 looks like a paint shaker at idle. Thats kinda hard on the airframe when the tail surfaces are jumping up and down from the vibration.

My engines on ignition idle smooth as silk and throttle up nicely.

You can do it either way, but don't discredit the ignition unit because of having to charge a battery. There are some great advantages to having the ignition units.

Quinoa

Hi!
What do you mean with convert a Zenoah G62? I have understood that this engines are difficult to start (why?)

Who is Ralph?

Dr1Driver

I used a spring starter on a standard G-62 with great success. No special tools are needed for the installation. Here's the routine:

Switch on the ignition
Close the choke fully
Prop the engine until it pops
Open the choke
Be sure the throttle is at idle, and start the engine

Works every time

Dr.1

DaddySam

My Feedback: (9)

Varad
The nut on the rear of the crank has nothing to do with the spring starter. Make sure you grease the roller bearings inside the clutch sleeve, and this should be done at least once per season - I do it when the plane is down for winter servicing anyway. The spring has a loop on one end and a bent "leg" on the other end. The "leg" goes into the small round hole in the clutch sleeve. You slip on the mounting cup and then you slide the spring and clutch sleeve onto the rear of the crank, with the loop end of the spirng going into the cup mount first. The loop of the spring is fastened to the cup mount by one of the four mounting bolts that holds the cup onto the rear of the engine. Should be a 1/4-20 cap head bolt, I think. Then you're done. It's very easy and the spring starter works like a gem. One day I'll get a G62 modded by Ralph, but for now, especially since warbirds need nose weight, this works for me.
Sam

bzyguy01

RcPilet,
Great point, that is very overlooked when considering the stock VS Electronic ignition!

gboulton

My Feedback: (15)

Hope you'll excuse me if I go on a bit of a rant.

Ralph is Ralph Cunningham of RC Ignitions. His username here is RCIGN, his website is http://www.rcignitions.com/

He offers a service called "G62 Lite" which involves removing the magneto ignition system of the G-62, and replacing it with an electronic ignition. He also then adds a custom mount, and will then turn a custom prop hub for you to get the Firewall - Spinner measurement EXACTLY what you specify. The ignition is then buried down in the mount, and simple RCA jacks are provided so you can use inexpensive shielded AV cables for the battery connection. It is absolutely the best $175 I've ever spent in this hobby, and I have another G-62 sitting here as we speak (UPS just dropped it off an hour ago) that's on its way to him soon for the same treatment....this one's going on my 1/3rd scale Jim LeRoy Bulldog.

Advantages to the modified G-62:

1) MUCH easier starting
2) Mounting the ignition as he does allows the engine mount itself to act as a Faraday cage to shield RF. I've NEVER read ANYONE say they had interference problems with one of Ralph's G-62's...and, as a test just for curiosity's sake, I put my RX less than 4" from the motor on the test bench once, and couldn't get it to jitter.
3) Significant weight savings. In my case, firewall ready, the modified G-62 for my PW Extra was nearly a full pound lighter than the stock unit.
4) More power. This one is a hotly debated topic around here, but interestingly those who feel they have more power are the guys who own them, those who think they don't aren't. *shrug*

My own G-62 with Ralph's mods turns a Xoar 23x8 at 7000+, and yanks my ~17 lb PW Extra around like a foamy. hovers at 1/3 throttle, pulls out at 3/4, LEAPS out at full.

Essentially, with Ralph's mods to a G-62, you get:

Enough power to do ANYTHING you can think of with a 17+ pound plane
EXACTLY the mounting depth you need for your plane
Easy and Reliable starting
very smooth and reliable idle at ridiculously low RPM's
No interference worries

All for < $500 total, firewall ready.

Not sure about the rest of you guys, but I've yet to find another motor THAT reliable, THAT readily available, THAT powerful, and THAT specifically fit to my plane for that price.

*shrug*

Varad

DaddySam, Thanks for the walk through. You say that the nut on the back of the tapered crankshaft has nothing to do with the spring starter? That nut holds the entire starter on right? The spring is around the clutch, and the clutch is around a stainless (what you call mounting cup) and that nut holds the mounting cup to the tapered crank. So I need a thin wall socket to tighten that nut right?

Zippi

My Feedback: (10)

gboulton,

I plan on sending my G-62 to Ralph. The RCA jacks you speak of, If I was to use a standard HD on-off switch as I have on my others planes for the ignition, how would you connect those RCA jacks to the switch that has a 3 pin connector? Is there another switch I could get that has the connection that will hook up to Ralphs?