Register

If this is your first visit, please click the Sign Up now button to begin the process of creating your account so you can begin posting on our forums! The Sign Up process will only take up about a minute of two of your time.

Results 1 to 24 of 24

  1. #1
    Buggygovroom's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA
    Posts
    483
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    Cap 232G 27% problems on landing...

    Im not really sure if this is called ballooning but i'll try my best to describe what is going on.

    I just finished a CAP 232G by hangar 9 and maidened it today. Whenever I come in for a landing and get to a good speed the plane noses up and climbs slightly and then wants to stall. The pattern is like a U shape. It seems to fly ok in the air but I am not sure why the problems on landing. I never experienced this before.

    I balanced it at the recommended 7" back on an empty tank and still had to add a little bit of nose weight. Id like to straighten out the problem since this condition has lead to 2 hard landings and im sure a wreck in the future if it continues.

    Thanks
    B


  2. #2
    KenLambert's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Livingston, TX
    Posts
    843
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: Cap 232G 27% problems on landing...

    check for down thrust on the engine.
    website
    www.lambertsrc.com
    Super Tiger conversions
    thanks Kenneth

  3. #3

    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Salem , OR
    Posts
    703
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: Cap 232G 27% problems on landing...

    That's also my suggestion. Too much down thrust will cause a ballooning, or nose up attitude when you let off the throttle. It'll really throw you off because you have the plane settled into a nice sink rate on final, then when you're just over the threshold and you cut the throttle to idle all of a sudden the plane noses up and now you end up fighting it to get it down.
    ORIGINAL: KenLambert

    check for down thrust on the engine.

  4. #4

    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Calgary, AB, CANADA
    Posts
    2,331
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: Cap 232G 27% problems on landing...


    ORIGINAL: KenLambert

    check for down thrust on the engine.
    The 232 is known for this, because of the high thrust line. They like to land with a bit of power on to prevent the ballooning when you chop the throttle. Too much down thrust will only make the problem worse.


    Mark
    Waco Brotherhood #4

  5. #5

    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    ButterworthPenang, MALAYSIA
    Posts
    287
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: Cap 232G 27% problems on landing...

    Ill move cg to 6" & slowly adjust from there
    then check for down thrust
    thx

  6. #6

    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Boca Raton, FL
    Posts
    133
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: Cap 232G 27% problems on landing...

    Buggy:
    Dial in a throttle to elevator mix so when you go to idle on final approach you won't balloon.
    ifshnee

  7. #7
    BaldEagel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Wychling, Kent, UNITED KINGDOM
    Posts
    9,583
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: Cap 232G 27% problems on landing...

    What ifshnee said plus you could dial in a bit of aileron up at closed throttle which will kill the lift, not too much otherwise you will put the thing into the deck.

    Mike
    My Gast is Flabered.
    No matter what anyone say's 100% is the maximum you can get.
    If you see a deleted post, my Avatar say's it all.

  8. #8
    rmh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    , UT
    Posts
    12,597
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: Cap 232G 27% problems on landing...

    hold on-- If the model is balanced per the kit -leave the thrust line as is .
    Caps have a very high thrust line to wing c/ relationship
    When you CHOP power at low speed -the model will nose up -enough to cause ballooning.
    The best technique is to learn the scale approach

    establish the right line to the field - at low power and gradually reduce power till model settles
    leave the elevator alone!
    As the model approaches the field -do low speed fly bys -till you get a visual of the model flying at a slightly nose up attitude
    this is the proper approach.
    then once you get this hooked up in your head - practice simply lowering power as it nears the ground -
    you can not chop power and dive at the field - or come in "hot"
    you can fifddle with thrust line till the cows come home but that is not the problem- it is getting the correct sink approach.
    Wheel landings ar fine on the CAPS.
    as you get more familiar - you can increase attitude

    best CG on that model is 25%- to 30% from MAC
    pics are of my 33% and my 27% -done a few of these-----all land the same -
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Vt58040.jpg 
Views:	3 
Size:	30.5 KB 
ID:	680718   Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Fa85995.jpg 
Views:	4 
Size:	87.0 KB 
ID:	680719   Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Qn38404.jpg 
Views:	5 
Size:	64.1 KB 
ID:	680720  
    Libby is still watching you

  9. #9

    Join Date
    Feb 2002
    Location
    Valley Springs, CA
    Posts
    18,602
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: Cap 232G 27% problems on landing...

    Thanks for the explanation Dick. Too many forget that throttle controls altitude and elevator controls airspeed. Your note explained the Cap and it's habits very well. A whole lot of Caps have been destroyed over the years by those that didn't understand that. Most during the landing phase.
    Never lie, and never minimize or gloss. Tell it like it is and let the pieces fall where they may. The truth always wins.

  10. #10
    KenLambert's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Livingston, TX
    Posts
    843
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: Cap 232G 27% problems on landing...

    I have had a few also if you really want one to land right ad tail weight increase the throws mix spoilerons and you can land on the rudder every time.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Mk25955.jpg 
Views:	3 
Size:	87.1 KB 
ID:	680854   Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Yu63809.jpg 
Views:	4 
Size:	79.3 KB 
ID:	680855   Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Kp33447.jpg 
Views:	2 
Size:	153.3 KB 
ID:	680856   Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Vo37810.jpg 
Views:	4 
Size:	159.5 KB 
ID:	680857   Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Zk67092.jpg 
Views:	4 
Size:	154.1 KB 
ID:	680858  

    website
    www.lambertsrc.com
    Super Tiger conversions
    thanks Kenneth

  11. #11
    Buggygovroom's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA
    Posts
    483
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: Cap 232G 27% problems on landing...

    Thanks for all the info. Has anyone actually had this model? If so did anyone relocate the gas tank or leave it up past the wing spar?

    I see that being a problem since when it is full it will make me pretty nose heavy and need to be almost completely empty to have my cg right on. Moving it back tward the center of gravity will make it difficult to install the main wing bolts.


  12. #12

    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    Hesperia Michigan, MI
    Posts
    12,350
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: Cap 232G 27% problems on landing...

    oh no[sm=72_72.gif]
    I never met a engine I did not like !

  13. #13
    Buggygovroom's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA
    Posts
    483
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: Cap 232G 27% problems on landing...


    ORIGINAL: captinjohn

    oh no[sm=72_72.gif]
    oh no what?

  14. #14
    rmh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    , UT
    Posts
    12,597
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: Cap 232G 27% problems on landing...

    fiddlin with the cg -is a waste of time -balance it empty -fill er up n go fly Yes I have flown em - same as mine
    the problem is technique .
    it is not hard to learn
    it is NOT the airplane.
    I hear chatter about having a hard time learning to hover n torque roll - but none about learning to actually do landings
    this has all gotten out of control--
    Libby is still watching you

  15. #15
    KenLambert's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Livingston, TX
    Posts
    843
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: Cap 232G 27% problems on landing...

    actually when I do a regular landing I just ad a couple clicks of down trim when I do my aproche and it works for me.
    website
    www.lambertsrc.com
    Super Tiger conversions
    thanks Kenneth

  16. #16
    KenLambert's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Livingston, TX
    Posts
    843
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: Cap 232G 27% problems on landing...

    the advantage to moving the tank is so the cg doesn't change and it does make a difference but there are a lot out there that don't seem to ever get the hang of the cap and move on to something that makes them look like better flyers.
    website
    www.lambertsrc.com
    Super Tiger conversions
    thanks Kenneth

  17. #17
    Buggygovroom's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA
    Posts
    483
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: Cap 232G 27% problems on landing...


    ORIGINAL: KenLambert

    the advantage to moving the tank is so the cg doesn't change and it does make a difference but there are a lot out there that don't seem to ever get the hang of the cap and move on to something that makes them look like better flyers.

    I really like the cap and would rather get used to it rather than move on to a different plane. I dont really have the option to move the tank back much either. I'll just have to go with it.

  18. #18
    Buggygovroom's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA
    Posts
    483
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: Cap 232G 27% problems on landing...


    ORIGINAL: KenLambert

    the advantage to moving the tank is so the cg doesn't change and it does make a difference but there are a lot out there that don't seem to ever get the hang of the cap and move on to something that makes them look like better flyers.

    and myself and a friend are usually the only ones flying in a big empty lot anyway. Im not looking to impress anyone but myself with my flying skills

  19. #19
    KenLambert's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Livingston, TX
    Posts
    843
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: Cap 232G 27% problems on landing...

    try the couple of clicks of down trim on your final it may help with the nose high deal
    website
    www.lambertsrc.com
    Super Tiger conversions
    thanks Kenneth

  20. #20

    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    ButterworthPenang, MALAYSIA
    Posts
    287
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: Cap 232G 27% problems on landing...

    i used a 360ml tank and located at 2" behind cg(6")
    when full tank i have a till heavy cap to do 3d stuff
    10 minutes later(tank empty) while landing my cg is at 6"
    been flying like that for 18months already== no problems
    ts52 at the nose
    thx

  21. #21

    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Spring Valley, CA
    Posts
    270
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: Cap 232G 27% problems on landing...

    Ken,
    What do you mean by Land on the rudder?You mean to touch down tailwheel first?I think that's what you mean.Thanks

  22. #22
    Buggygovroom's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA
    Posts
    483
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: Cap 232G 27% problems on landing...

    Still have this model and its still flying. This post was 2 years ago? wow.

  23. #23
    ggroyal1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Norcross, GA
    Posts
    549
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: Cap 232G 27% problems on landing...

    Mine is still going after almost three years
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Az78943.jpg 
Views:	5 
Size:	57.7 KB 
ID:	1317964   Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Id95895.jpg 
Views:	5 
Size:	47.0 KB 
ID:	1317965  

  24. #24

    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Upplands Vasby, SWEDEN
    Posts
    7,358
    Gallery
    My Gallery
    Models
    My Models
    Ratings
    My Feedback

    RE: Cap 232G 27% problems on landing...

    Hi!
    If the plane is ballooning when landing it is probably tail heavy! That is the way all tail heavy airplane do it
    My Cap 231 doesn't balloon when landing!
    Jan Karlsson - Supplier MVVS Products


Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:39 AM.

SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1 ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.