dgliderguy

I read in my gas engine instruction manuals that ethanol deteriorates the reed in the carb, and that only ethanol-free gas should be used in our sparkie engines.

So, does anyone in this forum seek out ethanol-free gas only? I believe every gas station for miles around my home town has 10% ethanol in their unleaded gas. Is there such a thing anymore as ethanol-free gasoline?

Interested to hear your inputs.

JoeAirPort

My Feedback: (41)

I can get it when I go to my girlfriend's (that kind of has a double meaning, I know). She lives in a small town that the scam hasn't reached yet. I always fill up there and avoid buying gas in my big city. I have thought of filling up my RC filler gas can. The engines run ok with it though. The carb's just need rebuilding after a couple of years since it eats at the gaskets etc.

DMcQuinn

My Feedback: (13)

In the St. Louis area, we have had 10% ethanol in all our gas for many years. I believe the engines run fine on it and I also believe the modern carb parts have been upgraded to handle the 10% ethanol without deterioration.

JoeAirPort

My Feedback: (41)

I was totally wrong about the gas in my girlfreind's town. It's 10% Ethanol. Dam it !!!!! I hate the Ethanol scam.

Tired Old Man

My Feedback: (1)

Most gas comes from major distribution centers or via pipeline to smaller storage facilities. Even if it's not posted you have probably been using gas with ethanol.

GBR2

My Feedback: (1)

Avgas might be ethanol free but you have to go to a small airport to find it.

2slow2matter

My Feedback: (1)

If you want 100 octane, but then you would have to increase the compression of your engine for it to be beneficial at all.

pumbadog

In my area, the basic grade gas has no alcohol but mid and premium does. They're using the alcohol for the octane.

BOUND_4_HELL

Ethanol has been mandated on all car gas for a few years now in North America. All gas companies need to have an average of 15 to 20% ethanol in their gas depending in which state or province you live in. If you want ethanol free gas you will need to go to a local small airport, as they are exempt form the ethanol scam for safety reasons. The ethanol increases the chance of carburetor icing at higher altitude in piston engine airplanes. You can get 87 grade Aviation Gas at all local airports.

Some gas stations have no ethanol in the high grade gas as they mix more ethanol in the lower grades to get their mandated percentages, but higher octane levels will make our small engines really hard to start and run poorly. All gas grade 87, 89, 93 have the same number of calories to burn and therefore all have the same power output. Higher grade gas is used on high compression engines. The higher the compression the higher the power output of any piston engine.

Octane is used in higher compression engines to control pre-mature ignition / knock. Our small engines have approx. 7.5 to 1 compression ratio and start and run best with regular 87-octane gas. Running higher grades will not give you more power and will make it harder to start, as the octane changes the flash point of gasoline and will not ignite as readily as with 87 grade gas.

Bound_4_Hell
You can never have enough power, as you can always throttle back.

Tired Old Man

My Feedback: (1)

Carb components have been tweaked over the past few years to deal with the ethanol, so just go to the local gas station and buy the darn gas. If you don't have a ZDZ, MVVS, or 3w there's no point in anything more than "regular" unleaded. If you have a ZDZ, MVVS, or 3w then buy the premium. It's that simple and requires no rocket science thought processes to carry it any further.

Av gas contains lead and our engines don't benefit from lead. Lead was required in earlier engines that had real valves and seats. There was a change in valve train components quite a few years ago that eliminated the need for lead. In fact, you may find yourself with lead fouled plugs if you elect to spend $5.00 plus a gallon for low lead av gas.

You guys worry waaaaay too much!

Jezmo

Just a note for the starting on AvGas. I run it in my glow to gas conversions and also my Zenoah G26. I get first flip starts on all. The conversions are a G51 and a G90 SuperTigre and also a Saito 91 four stroker. They all are sparked by CH Ignitions.

I agree with Tired Old Man, the ethanol doesn't hurt a thing. I run pump gas with it in all of my lawn equipment and they mostly have either Zama or Walbro carbs.

captinjohn

Tired Old Man....do you know Pat Roy? Capt,n

Tired Old Man

My Feedback: (1)

I do, but for reasons that must remain cloudy I have to keep some distance, especially in public forums.

RTK

My Feedback: (1)

But Avgas smells sooooo nice

octanehuffer

I only use "non oxy 92" fuel in my planes and toys. It runs great and performs better than ethanol fuel. Lasts longer too.
Adam

Jezmo

Yeah, I wish we could get "non oxy 92" here in Houston.

Yep, T-O-M I would stay away from him in public forums too, he's just plain bad to the bone. Glad your still around. [sm=spinnyeyes.gif]

Brokenprop

My Feedback: (6)

So why do you suppose Saito doesn't want any alky in their new 2.2 4 stroke gasser?

Jezmo

Most likely they don't want the headache of tuning issues. The pumper carb that is on it isn't set up for alky and while I'm sure some folks could figure out how to get it right on glow fuel without factory help, and that is a big one here, most would need their support. I don't run glow fuel in my sparkers but I'm told they foul plugs fairly quick with the ultra high oil content in the glow fuel. That might also be another reason.

61ahs

Bound 4 Hell,

I believe you are mistaken, ethanol is required in all gasoline in only three states in the USA - Missouri, Minnesota, and Hawaii. Some large US cities have mandated the use of ethanol in gasoline and some large metropolitan areas have to use it to meet Federal air quality standards. The rest of us however can still buy gas without ethanol. It is available at some gas stations where I live in Michigan, but I don't buy it if I have a choice. It's less efficient (fewer miles per gallon) and there's always the chance you're going to get a load of water.

Rick

Brokenprop

My Feedback: (6)

61ahs

It may just be a ruse, but the service manager at my dealer tells me that the more alky they put in the gas, the worse the milage all the cars get. My mini van was good for 28 mpg going to Toledo two years ago. Now it won't do more than 23. The service manager says it is directly related to the percentage of alky in the gas and that all their customers are reporting the same thing. I know that gas has more energy than alky, but gererally that isn't reflected in the power derived in smaller engines because it can't be extracted. Regardless, E85 produces poorer fuel economy, if your car can handle it.

The weird carb on the Saito 2.2 is a mix of methanol and gas design. I was hoping to use pump gas for it, but everything around here has 10% Ethanol.

If this engine has to run on lantern fuel the fuel cost factor is not much of a sellling point.

Jezmo
The plug fouling issue is a puzzle to me. If you accidently put oil mix gas in your 4 stroke mower, the plug will foul before you can mow the lawn once. (need you ask?) That same mix in a two stroke mower will run for years without fouling the same plug.

Truckracer

My Feedback: (19)

Strange ....... I have used 50:1 mix in my 4 stroke mowers from time to time for years with zero problems and the plug always looks perfect .... and no carbon deposits. I just recently retired an old mower that was at least 15 years old and the retirement wasn't related to the fuel used. Now I don't use 50:1 mix on purpose ... just because it is always there when the regular can is empty and I am to lazy to go to the station. Or because I want to use up last years 50:1 airplane mix.

Yup, ethanol fuel gets less MPG in motor vehicles! But then E85 is now almost $1.00 cheaper / gal in my state so you can afford some loss of mileage. E10 is about $.20 less per gal.

BOUND_4_HELL

Hi 61ahs,

Thanks for the info, the reason I said that is that I was researching gas and octane content a few weeks ago and came across an article that said that ethanol was mandated in all states to some percentage. I assumed the article was correct, I gusset I should not assume everything I read is correct, even if it comes from a reliable source.

ASSUME >> makes an *** out of U and ME.

If you live in a state or province where you can buy ethanol free gas, then count yourself lucky. Ontario is mandated to 15% and next year they are raising it to 20%

Bound_4_Hell

Jezmo

At a ratio of 32:1 (most folks are running 50:1 which is just over 2%) you are looking at 4% oil; our little glow engines are eating 18 to 22% oil plus the composition of the oil is significantly different. That poor plug is getting drowned in oil.

lildiesel

You might check out BP and Amoco fuels. Where stations are forced by state law to sell ethanol blended fuels BP/Amoco will label the pumps since those stations are selling ethanol blends not produced by BP/Amoco. BP Fuels is holding out on bio fuels until they can get non corn derived ethanol products ready.

k4lm

Go to Pure Gas website.  It lists all the stations that sell ethanol free gas.  It lasts longer in storage, up to 2 years.

Vant