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RCGF Engines

Old 03-08-2012, 11:52 AM
  #5801
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Default RE: RCGF Engines

well, I bought the RCG 30cc at the HK store and a RCGF 32 at the store of the french dealer of RCGF.

and I confirm your remark on the packaging.
what I think is that RCGF made second choice engine for the chiness market and the first choice is exported.

stephane
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Old 03-08-2012, 12:10 PM
  #5802
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Default RE: RCGF Engines

I would use low ash regular oil for the break-in period. After that it will be up to you.
If you use Synthetic oil for break-in it will take much longer for your engine to have a good seat.

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Old 03-08-2012, 12:57 PM
  #5803
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Quote:
ORIGINAL: yurdakut

dear friends ahicks, captmicom, aussiesteve sorry I m late..I have seen that there is no any signature or trademark which means RCG or RCGF neither on the box nor on the engine..only ''made by RCGF model'' is written on the packgae box...so does it mean this is not rcgf/rcg?so as much as I understood and read about break in before, I will work the engine only for adjusting needles try not to heat and force too much..I will burn 1 tank on the ground after that I will fly and I will not fly it on WOT for a long in time...wht about oil preferences?synth for breaking in or non-synth?after breaking in ?thank you again
If it looks like cheese, smells like cheese, taste like cheese, it most likely IS cheese?

Regarding oil, people have differing ideas regarding using synth. for break in. Personaly, I'm with Captmicom on his school of thought. I'm not racing or pushing any of my engines hard though. If I were, I might pay a little more attention. As it is, I'll not likely ever wear one of these out using any decent oil designed for use in air cooled engines.
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Old 03-08-2012, 02:15 PM
  #5804
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Default RE: RCGF Engines

Quote:
ORIGINAL: ahicks
As it is, I'll not likely ever wear one of these out using any decent oil designed for use in air cooled engines.
Give the man a prize for the most commonsense comment as it is 100% true.

The below information applies to just about any engine we use in theis hobby.

For your break in, The trick is to heat cycle the flame plated chrome liner to consolidate it and to flush out the excessive metallic particles that are created in those first few runs. This is most easily done by putting that engine in the air and flying it and using a slightly richer oil mix than normal (30:1 instead of 40:1). The rings on these (and 99.9% or all other Chinese engines) are quite hard so they will never really conform to the bore anyway (how often do you see a comment about people noting the rings look "just like new" after a while of running).

Ever bought a new chainsaw? How was that run in? (They start them, then tune them then run them hard)

Ever read the piston ring manufacturers instruction on how to break in piston rings? (they tell you to apply reasonable load as early as possible).

The best way to run these 2 strokes in is to give them a little more oil than normal for the first couple of litres of fuel, the make them work. You want to get the cylinder BMEP high enough to make that piston ring work and you are not going to do that by "babying" it. That applies to about 99% or all ringed internal combustion engines on the planet. Defintiely avoid prolonged WOT runs for the first hour or so but do not be afraid to give the engine some work. Also avoid long periods of low cooling air flow (such as extended hovering or long ground runs without the plane moving). Do not run it rich on the fuel settings, (do not run it lean either) Just use it how it is intended to be used.

For the break in period (The first hour or two of running), You need an oil that will flush out the metal particles. For this reason it is always a good idea to use a reasonably rich oil ratio. Many use Pennzoil air cooled at 30:1 but your location may not have that. I use the oil I will be using in the engine for it's lifetime and instead of mixing it at 40:1 (which is my normal mix), I mix it at 30:1 for the first couple of litres.

As to which oil to use? there are many good ones available. If you can get Stihl Ultra HP, use that at 30:1 for break in of the first couple of litres and at 40:1 or 50:1 for the rest of the engines life. If you can get Mobil 2T Racing - same comment, also Redline Racing or "Kart" oil - same ratios. Castrol TTS is another choice as is Motul 800. If you can't find any of those readily where you live, go to your local morocycle shop and ask what they stock for air cooled dirt bikes and use that. If there isn't a bike shop near you, try your local chainsaw / garden equipment shop.

Start the engine, let it warm up for a few seconds, tune the high needle to max RPM then richen it about 1/8 turn, set the low needle to give a good crisp transition then go fly it. Running a tank on the ground ususally ends up doing more harm than good as most enignes get overheated when doing that. Very few provide proper cooling in that process.
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Old 03-08-2012, 02:29 PM
  #5805
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Default RE: RCGF Engines

Steph18 you say you have the rcg 30 from hobbyking and the rcgf 32 also, just to confirm are you saying that the motor supplied by hobbyking called rcg 30 is identical to the rcgf 32?.

I have two rcg 20s, one dle 20, one crrc26 and two dle30s andI fancy a rcgf32 but if the rcgf32 is the rcg30 from hobbyking it would be great to confirm this as I think this may be the case but want to ask someone who has actually had experience with the two motors that come from the companys.
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Old 03-08-2012, 02:32 PM
  #5806
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Default RE: RCGF Engines

Quote:
ORIGINAL: steph18

what I think is that RCGF made second choice engine for the chiness market and the first choice is exported.

stephane
You really think they go out of their way to make a low grade and a high grade product? Gee - I wonder if any mistakes happen and the low grade one ends up in high grade packaging

What actually happens (and this doesn't apply only to this brand) is that they get a customer (such as Hobbyking) that places a much larger order for product than any of the "Western based" distributors orders at any one time. To achieve turnover (which is VERY important to a Chinese business - sometimes even more so than total profit margins) they negotiate a low price for them then delineate the product with a different name so as to keep the Western based bulk buyers on side.

Then that Large buyer also works on smaller profit markups than the western buyers can work on (many reasons for that - low warranty coverage is one of them) and you end up with an end price for the product that is much closer to where it would be if it was any other industry than RC'ers.
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Old 03-08-2012, 02:59 PM
  #5807
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Default RE: RCGF Engines

Aussie, I know that rcg and rcgf are the same company and product, can you confirm if the rcg 30 from hobbyking is orderedyou get a motor identical to the rcgf 32? or do you get the old rcgf 30 model?.
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Old 03-08-2012, 03:05 PM
  #5808
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Quote:
ORIGINAL: raydar

Aussie, I know that rcg and rcgf are the same company and product, can you confirm if the rcg 30 from hobbyking is ordered you get a motor identical to the rcgf 32? or do you get the old rcgf 30 model?.

The last few that the guys at my field have received from HK are the current 32's
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Old 03-09-2012, 09:13 AM
  #5809
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Default RE: RCGF Engines

In reply to your questions :
I have the RCG 30 and the RCGF 32 and I have compared them.
RCG and RCGF are quiet the same indesign. there are some few differences such as the volume svept for exemple :
the RCG 30 has got 30.5 cc (bore 36 mm and stroke 30 mm) its power equipped with a tune pipe is quite the same than a ys 170 DZ.
the RCGF 32 has got 34cc of volume svept  (38mm of bore and stroke = 30mm) you can calculate the result is 34cc and not 32. I have measured the dimension of these 2 engines and it is the results of my measures that i give you.

after there are small aspect faults on the RCG compared to the RCGF and it can explan the lower cost of the RCG.

if you want only a 30cc and you want to reduce cost  you can buy the rcg it will run correctlly.

stephane
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Old 03-10-2012, 01:55 PM
  #5810
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Default RE: RCGF Engines

I don't know about all of that. What I do know is the four RCGF's I own from BP Hobbies, are great. Tha latest is a 20cc beam mount put in a profile swinging a 17x6 prop. Love it!
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Old 03-10-2012, 02:46 PM
  #5811
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Default RE: RCGF Engines

What's real clear to me is that RCGF needs to clean up their business practices, such as serializing all complete engines to provide traceability, etc., etc., etc. I have several 20 CC motors that have run perfectly right out of the box. Plus a couple of others not run yet. This crap about sn or no sn for support is just that, although I have no plans to do that either. I know how and have the parts to fix the Walbro (sort of) carbs on these motors, which is the most common problem area. You'd think that RCGF would have learned by now!
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Old 03-13-2012, 10:45 AM
  #5812
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Default RE: RCGF Engines

dear friends thank you all for your kindly replies...these are good and important experiences..so I cant find pennzoil on the other hand I can find castrol series, stihl series.. thank you all..
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Old 03-13-2012, 10:50 AM
  #5813
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I use Penzoil aircooled oil, but I think Stihl chain saw engine oil is good. Don't know about Castrol though.
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Old 03-13-2012, 11:41 AM
  #5814
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Default RE: RCGF Engines


Quote:
ORIGINAL: aussiesteve

Quote:
ORIGINAL: ahicks
As it is, I'll not likely ever wear one of these out using any decent oil designed for use in air cooled engines.
Give the man a prize for the most commonsense comment as it is 100% true.

The below information applies to just about any engine we use in theis hobby.

For your break in, The trick is to heat cycle the flame plated chrome liner to consolidate it and to flush out the excessive metallic particles that are created in those first few runs. This is most easily done by putting that engine in the air and flying it and using a slightly richer oil mix than normal (30:1 instead of 40:1). The rings on these (and 99.9% or all other Chinese engines) are quite hard so they will never really conform to the bore anyway (how often do you see a comment about people noting the rings look "just like new" after a while of running).

Ever bought a new chainsaw? How was that run in? (They start them, then tune them then run them hard)

Ever read the piston ring manufacturers instruction on how to break in piston rings? (they tell you to apply reasonable load as early as possible).

The best way to run these 2 strokes in is to give them a little more oil than normal for the first couple of litres of fuel, the make them work. You want to get the cylinder BMEP high enough to make that piston ring work and you are not going to do that by "babying" it. That applies to about 99% or all ringed internal combustion engines on the planet. Defintiely avoid prolonged WOT runs for the first hour or so but do not be afraid to give the engine some work. Also avoid long periods of low cooling air flow (such as extended hovering or long ground runs without the plane moving). Do not run it rich on the fuel settings, (do not run it lean either) Just use it how it is intended to be used.

For the break in period (The first hour or two of running), You need an oil that will flush out the metal particles. For this reason it is always a good idea to use a reasonably rich oil ratio. Many use Pennzoil air cooled at 30:1 but your location may not have that. I use the oil I will be using in the engine for it's lifetime and instead of mixing it at 40:1 (which is my normal mix), I mix it at 30:1 for the first couple of litres.

As to which oil to use? there are many good ones available. If you can get Stihl Ultra HP, use that at 30:1 for break in of the first couple of litres and at 40:1 or 50:1 for the rest of the engines life. If you can get Mobil 2T Racing - same comment, also Redline Racing or "Kart" oil - same ratios. Castrol TTS is another choice as is Motul 800. If you can't find any of those readily where you live, go to your local morocycle shop and ask what they stock for air cooled dirt bikes and use that. If there isn't a bike shop near you, try your local chainsaw / garden equipment shop.

Start the engine, let it warm up for a few seconds, tune the high needle to max RPM then richen it about 1/8 turn, set the low needle to give a good crisp transition then go fly it. Running a tank on the ground ususally ends up doing more harm than good as most enignes get overheated when doing that. Very few provide proper cooling in that process.
dear steve thank you for detailed info and detailed brands for oil..
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Old 03-13-2012, 12:38 PM
  #5815
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Default RE: RCGF Engines

i bought a rcgf 15 from hobby king on the 3rd flip of the prop it froze up it has been now 3 months and 2 weeks since i sent it in i keep sending emails but no answer on what is going on with it will buy no more from then i think i just lostmy money allen
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Old 03-13-2012, 01:24 PM
  #5816
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Well I purchased a gas from HK and the prop shaft was drilled off center. Try to get a $2.00 part from them is like pulling teeth. No customer service at all. Brand new engine never been run
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Old 03-13-2012, 02:27 PM
  #5817
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If you want to send it to me I might be able to fix it.

Captmicom
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Old 03-14-2012, 04:41 AM
  #5818
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Default RE: RCGF Engines


Quote:
ORIGINAL: WildeOne

What's real clear to me is that RCGF needs to clean up their business practices, such as serializing all complete engines to provide traceability, etc., etc., etc. I have several 20 CC motors that have run perfectly right out of the box. Plus a couple of others not run yet. This crap about sn or no sn for support is just that, although I have no plans to do that either. I know how and have the parts to fix the Walbro (sort of) carbs on these motors, which is the most common problem area. You'd think that RCGF would have learned by now!
I surely don't disagree with you, but I think what RCGF has learned is that they don't need to spend time, money and effort to do as you suggest, and people will continue to buy their product. They may complain from time to time, but they still buy!

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Old 04-01-2012, 02:51 PM
  #5819
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I have an RCGF 45 cc engine mounted on my GP Super Sportster and it was a good match for that airplane when I first installed the engine. However, the engine has developed issues at full throttle. The engine misses or studders at full throttle and occasionally backfires at full throttle. I have adjusted high and low speed needles untill the cows come home without sucess. The engine has very little run time and has very good compression. I suspect the problem must be ignition, carb or reed valves but I don't have a clue where to start. I have several gas engines but have not run into this kind of problem with them. Has anyone else out there experienced similar issues with this or other engines? Any suggetions, theories or thoughts?

Thanks for your kind consideration.

Heli-NuBee (Roger)
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Old 04-01-2012, 04:30 PM
  #5820
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Default RE: RCGF Engines

First shots in the dark, assuming fresh plug and double checked fuel system, might be low ign. batt. voltage? The other, if you have other gassers with the same or Rcexl ignitions - borrow one long enough to swap one into this plane for a try?
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Old 04-01-2012, 04:42 PM
  #5821
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Backfire is usually caused by incorrect timing. Have you checked for 28* BTDC timing?
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Old 04-01-2012, 06:38 PM
  #5822
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Hey Roger,

AHicks and WildeOne are both on to possible problems. One of the first things that pop into my head from your description is that if it runs good for a short time and then starts back firing the batt could be the problem because it is not holding a charge. If your batt drops below about 3.8 volts it will mess with the CDI. If you are using a lipo and it is a 2 cell or more it can cause your CDI to freak out and miss like H-E- double hockey sticks. We have had customers that have used two cell lipos and with a full charge it did make the engine miss and backfire until it pulled the batt down a bit. These RcExl type CDIs do not like much more than about 6.5 volts give or take a bit. As Wildeone said if you have bumped the hall switch and knocked it way out of time that can also cause it to back fire. Try some of the suggestions. Let us know if you are still having trouble. Also let me know who you got your engine from. If they are not around anymore then I might be able to help if it needs warranty work.

Captmicom,
RCGF Service Center USA
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Old 04-02-2012, 09:17 AM
  #5823
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Thanks to everyone for their input. Fuel system was checked, spark plug was changed, ignition battery was changed and timing was checked. I am using a 4.8 volt 2000 mah nimh n-loop battery on the ignition. I guess my next step will have to be to try a different ignition system on the engine. I have seen faulty reed valves create such problems on larger racing engines but I really don't want to have to pull the engine until the last resort.

Roger
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Old 04-02-2012, 03:17 PM
  #5824
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I bought a 20cc rcgf and it's been around the shop a while. I installed it on an airplane and somehow the muffler has disappeared!! Dang! The airplane is ready to go except for a muffler. The cost for replacement mufflers for the rcgf engines is a bit outragious! $30 for a 20cc single stack muffler and $68 for a pitts style?

Anybody know where I can find a better deal than that? Anybody that upgraded to the pitts want to sell the stock muffler?

HELP!

Grounded in Florida!
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Old 04-02-2012, 04:11 PM
  #5825
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$30.00 is not a bad deal for the muffler. If you were to replace it with say a Bennett or JTec if you can find one to fit, it would cost the better part of a $50.00 bill. Just my two cents... Captmicom
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