PacificNWSkyPilot

My Feedback: (19)

Wow, Gungadin. Not good. Doesn't sound promising, does it? Anybody reading this who might be able to drop by Todd's place and negotiate the release of the hostage engines if it turns out that he's folded?

Hmmm, maybe it IS time to worry.

I did decide what I'm going to do with my present Syssa in my Giant Super Sportster. I'm going to fly it as long as it runs good, and as long as I can fix it, but when it starts to become a problem, that might be a good time to make the change to electric with that bird, and sell off the Syssa for whatever I can get. Or, maybe I should do that now while it's perfect, and use the money for the electric mods. Either way, I could start getting ready for it.

It's out of the frying pan and into the fire for me, anyway. About a week ago I purchased a 30CC size Skyline Raven (74") from a place online named General Hobby, and I've never heard a word from them since. It was supposed to come out of California. I've looked for a receipt, or a shipping notification, you know, the stuff we all usually see when we order something from Tower or whoever. Nothing. Nada. I went to my Paypal account, and they were paid instantly.

When somebody orders a book from my website and pays by Paypal, I have it set up to send them and email that details how they have purchased one copy of this at this price, and their total charges were so many dollars, etc. I think that's pretty normal.

Trying not to get annoyed yet, since I'm mostly just stocking the shelves with projects to have on hand while I'm laid up from foot surgery (twelve weeks-yikes), but I can't get them to answer their phones either. I'm pretty sure that PayPal offers me protection if the box never shows up, but I still like to whine about it, because I want my plaything. They have a paragraph by their phone number that says she's pretty busy and out in the warehouse a lot, bit I would have thought my call would have been returned. Not an unreasonable expectation, I reckon.

Jim

Red Raider

My Feedback: (86)

OK, Guys, here's the latest from Todd:
He's had more than a few issues getting set up in his new location and getting back up to speed, let alone getting caught up. Engines that were sent to him in February got caught up in the move but are still in que. He told me he was multitasking all day every day trying to get everyone's issue resolved. He underestimated how many engines he would sell and consequently the time that would be required to tend to all of his customers. He has been working on a new cylinder design while trying to find a company in the US that can do the chrome plating. That will be resolved shortly. He also got caught up in some of the drone issues, but that too will be resolved very soon. Now for the interesting part. He knows he needs help with the customer service aspect. He and I are going to discuss that tonight. I'll let you know how that discussion goes. If you have any questions, please don't hesitate to post it here. If I don't know the answer, I'll tell you, and then see if I can find out.
Don't give up just yet!!!
Steve

hairy46

My Feedback: (1)

Good to hear, thank you!

Red Raider

My Feedback: (86)

See my post (6152). I've conversed with Todd since he first started the business. I've never met him, but we've exchanged email and phone calls off and on for several years. I own 4 of his engines and can tell you they are far superior to anything coming out of China. Plus they're made in the USA!! Part of the issue is that he refuses to outsource any parts or services. He could do it cheaper if he worked with a Mexican or Chinese company, but that would defeat the purpose of trying to keep jobs and our money at home. Give him a little more time and if you don't hear anything from him by the end of the week, send me your contact info in a PM, and I'll see what I can find out.
Steve

Joystick TX

Deja vu. The issues due to a move, underestimating how many engines he would sell, new cylinder design, (the V2 that Jim and I were waiting for?), chrome plating problem, and needing help with customer service are ALL the same issues that he had three or four years ago. The only new issue is the contract for the drone engines. I had the answer to solving his customer service problem, for free, and emailed him to contact me about it and he never did.

Based on the comments on this and other websites, I don't think he is spending much time on answering customer questions or providing information on shipments, etc., so maybe having someone take that job off his hands will not free up enough of his time to make it worth it, even if it was free. I guess the bad publicity his company gets by having poor, to non-existent customer service, keeps his sales down to a manageable level so he does not aggravate his prime customer.

You can lead a horse to water, but you can't . . . . . . .

JohnB96041

I have never had a problem getting items that I needed for any of my planes/engines/ect. Just went to the website and placed an order. Guess I have been lucky. I love my SAP hp180 engine. It beats all of my DLE engines and also beats a brand new Evo 33 GX. Sure hope he gets things fixed with the issues that have been posted.

PacificNWSkyPilot

My Feedback: (19)

When I read Red Raider's post, many of the same thoughts went through my head as what Joystick posted. I know for a fact that Steve (Joystick) did talk a number of times with Todd about working with him to streamline a variety of customer service issues, as well as internal issues. That doesn't mean Todd should have taken him up on it, but there are enough indicators to show it couldn't have hurt to try it.

Both Steve and I were among the first to be left waiting on the V2 models. That HAS been an ongoing problem for years now. At the time of the V2 issue, Toss had already spoken to me about the drone engines, though I haven't spoken of it publicly, except to refer to it as a government contract, which is my way of saying that that's an old issue as well.

But more sprang to mind than just the things I agreed with Steve on. I've ceased to accept the "Bound and determined to produce it strictly American" as an adequate reason for the recurring long waits with both service and production. I work part-time with a company researching the sourcing of parts and machining processes, which allows them to continue growth without any interruptions. I make a little money, they move forward, everybody comes out ahead, and every year they look better and better to their customers. Also, when you call the company, you can hear the sunshine in the voice of any person who answers the phone. Todd is always "looking for somebody to do a better job" on this manufacturing or finishing process or that machining process, but he doesn't actually DO anything about that. And I hardly have to point out that the phone is rarely if ever answered. The same with emails.

I hope he resolves the issues, and I'll never argue about the high quality of the engines. I just have some trouble believing things will change, when the story seems to be pretty much the same as always.

Jim

Red Raider

My Feedback: (86)

Youre absolutely right. Excuses are like butt holes - everybody has one and they all stink. I'm still waiting to hear from him. If I can't do anything to help us all out this time, then I'll be the first to say that it's time to close this thread and go find another source for our engines.

Truckracer

My Feedback: (19)

I heard these same stories and excuses decades ago from another famous American engine builder ... his name was Duke Fox!

Gungadin

Baloney ! There is no good reason to ignore customer e-mails on a consistant basis. And the reason you can't leave a phone message for more than two months is because Todd wants it that way. I met and talked to Todd personally at the Toledo show 5 or 6 years ago, and thought he was a good guy working hard to develope his new business. And he had a good product . However there are some serious deficiencies in his business model. I sent him an almost new engine & IBEC (only run one time for 5 min.), at the end of May to get an update and the new style muffler. There was nothing wrong with the engine at all. If I knew over 2 months later I'd still be waiting to get it back, I certainly would NOT have sent it in, but would have been flying it in the peak of good flying weather in N.E. Ohio, and waited till Nov. to send it in. That way even if it took 3-4 months to get it back I wouldn't be missing out on the good summer flying weather. When Todd told me there were a few updates he could do to my engine and to send it in, he neglected to mention the fact that he was backed up and probably wouldn't be able to get to my engine for a few months. Just a tad inconsiderate in my book.

captinjohn

Need a better exhaust...see Ken Lambert

PacificNWSkyPilot

My Feedback: (19)

Gungadin, you are wrong, wrong, wrong.

Baloney is actually spelled Balogna.

Jim

Joystick TX

Spoken like a true arthur, I mean author.

PacificNWSkyPilot

My Feedback: (19)

Hey, Captinjohn, long time no see!

The last upgrade I got was the upgraded exhaust with the mods to keep it bolted on. It stayed bolted on, unlike the original style. Unfortunately, I only had it out a few times before I flew my GSS through a powerline and shredded the plane. I've had it out and ran it a few times since I rebuilt the GSS, and so far it's staying put okay. I've never had a chance to try out the smoke feature on the muffler yet, but I ordered the banjo bolts just in case. The GSS is kinda skinny, and it just doesn't have the room for a smoke system inside.

Jim

PacificNWSkyPilot

My Feedback: (19)

Ya gart me there.

Jim

Joystick TX

I ran Fox engines from 1948 to 1971 in C/L stunt and Combat, and in RC from 1971 to the mid 1980's and NEVER in all that time had as much problem combined as I have had with the customer service at SYSSA. I was in Okinawa and Japan and had faster turnaround on engine repairs even though they went by slow boats across the Pacific. Both ways!

earlwb

I never had any problems with Fox engines or getting service and support from them. I go way back in using the engines too.

Truckracer

My Feedback: (19)

Joystick and Earlwb, I guess my reference to FOX had more to do with some of his screwball designs that required updates and improvements before they ever ran well and his hard headed nature. Like Syssa, his business model was always a half bubble off of plumb also. For many years his business depended on machining for the auto and truck industries while his model engine shop was often an afterthought. Shades of Syssa and the reported government contract. Yes for a fact, Duke did have good customer service very unlike Syssa. Some of Duke's engines were quite good, even great but many were quite the opposite.

I remember an email exchange I had with Todd a few months after the Syssa first came out. I suggested some improvements that might make his engine more accepted by a wider range of users but he wasn't hearing any of it .... his engine was perfect and he informed me so. That was so like a conversation I had with Duke in about 1974 or so when the foreign engines were starting to eat his lunch. The new engines would pretty much run right out of the box and last a very long time where Duke was sticking to his tight assembly, wear it in policy with no better if as good of performance and shorter lifespan.

Yes, while Duke had some good engines, he had quite a bit in common with Mr. Syssa.

Red Raider

My Feedback: (86)

Ok, guys - here's the outcome of my discussion with Todd. He and I have come to an understanding whereby I am going to be the US representative for Syssa Engines. There are going to be some changes and at least one new service coming in the near future. I'm going to handle repairs and parts as well as try to handle customer service issues, while Todd focuses on the production part of the company. Please give me a chance to develop a system, but as I'm doing that, I want to do a good job representing Todd and his great product. I've already arranged for him to send me the engines that are in the que for repair and I'll turn them around as soon as I get them. That includes everything that has been there for awhile. I will also have a full inventory of parts hopefully within the next few days.

Now - I know you are all skeptical. To be honest, I don't know how it's going to work either. There's a lot of bad experiences and broken promises that need to be reconciled. I'm not getting paid except for the work I do. So, why am I doing this? I own 4 of these engines and fly them on everything from a large Cessna 150, to a MXS-R. They're a great engine, and I don't want my investment (or yours) to wind up on the bottom of a lake. But, I believe in made in America, Syssa Engines just like all of you. So, for all of you, for all of us, I'm going to do my best.

Here's the new plan. Syssa engines are going to be a limited edition. No major advertising, no deals with Horizon or other big distributors. Anyone who wants one will be able to get one. They will be selectively hand assembled, test run and adjusted before being delivered to the owner. Repairs, parts and support will be available into the foreseeable future.

When you see my name on the Syssa website, you'll know that we're up and running. Remember that this is going to be more like Ferrari than GM. That analogy works for the quality of the product as well as the size of the company.

Please post your comments, especially the ones wishing me luck!

the pope

How do you know he's telling you the truth ? Its obvious he doesnt and hasnt for yrs given a crap about his customers why would you be any different ? The only thing I would think that would make him give a rats nut sack about would be if his 30cc rc engines were his only source of income . Cheers the pope

lonestoner

I'm all for made in the USA,I just purchased a Moki for my ultra sport 1000 just so the Chinese will not get my money,
Going gas shortly,question:
is syssa going to perform better than da?

the pope

I don't think anyone could compare da with syssa c.s. DA is A+ and syssa is a F- . Look on the giant scale forums and you will find all you need to know . Cheers

Red Raider

My Feedback: (86)

I don't. In the end it doesn't matter. If this works out it'll be good for everyone. If it doesn't, then the inevitable will happen and that will be the end of it. I've heard that some of your friends down under were using these engines in their racing endeavors. Some were turning as fast as 14,000rpm. Ran them as hard as they could get them to go day after day. You have to expect some issues. Using them for purposes other than their designed use and being 10,000 miles away. . .

But, I'm the U.S. rep. I'm going to do the best I can with what I have to work with.

PLANEIAC

My Feedback: (1)

I bought one used 4,5,6 years ago cant remember. The gentleman was honest and told me he couldn't get the muffler to stay tight. I ordered the new muffler and finally installed it in an AW 260. It is a compact, beautiful and light weight engine that runs exceptionally well. Better than my DA35 but it is brand new and I'm still dialing it in. Not more powerful just smoother as The SAP180 is broke in. I hope you get it right RR because it would be great for all of us that know its a Darn good engine. That's what makes it so frustrating!

PS- I must be the other 50% I have never had a problem ordering items from Syssa.

Red Raider

My Feedback: (86)

You're only part of the 1/3. :-) I never had any issues either. That's why I'm willing to do this. I can't help but think this is going to be good for all of us.