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DLE 20cc Gasser! (Data & Links 1st Post)

Old 08-02-2012, 01:03 PM
  #5651
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Default RE: NEW DLE 20cc Gasser! (Data & Links 1st Post)

 Thx
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Old 08-08-2012, 02:53 PM
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Default RE: NEW DLE 20cc Gasser! (Data & Links 1st Post)

I have read through the forum as time has permitted and have used the search function, but I still am not certain on the correct answer.

I want to go to to a LIFE 6.6v battery. Have any of you run this type of battery with any luck or bad luck? I am afraid of burning up the electronic ignition. I was looking at the cost to replace the ignition if I should happen to burn it up, and $85 versus $22 to me is a no brainer. I know that nicd and nimh coming off the charger at at a higher voltage than 6.6v, but they do drop quickly. I would appreciate a little more insight and experiences if you have them. Thanks,

Shannon
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Old 08-08-2012, 03:38 PM
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Default RE: NEW DLE 20cc Gasser! (Data & Links 1st Post)


Quote:
ORIGINAL: spitfire66
.....I want to go to to a LIFE 6.6v battery.......

http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/fb.asp?m=10165225

or the same thing pre-made for $7.99

http://www.shop.kavarootusa.com/prod...&categoryId=10
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Old 08-08-2012, 08:44 PM
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Default RE: NEW DLE 20cc Gasser! (Data & Links 1st Post)


Quote:
ORIGINAL: spitfire66


I want to go to to a LIFE 6.6v battery. Have any of you run this type of battery with any luck or bad luck? I am afraid of burning up the electronic ignition

Shannon
These are the perfect solution. Interference illiminating, optikill, LED to show ignition power, and adjustible voltage regulation. And on top of it all, Ed's customer service is the best.
www.tech-aero.net/ultra-ibec

I had two of these in planes that had crashed and I sent them in to him so that he could look them over to ensure they are okay to use on my next builds. He checked them out and did the needed repairs for no charge. And he will spend more than enough time with you on the phone to help you, in any situation you may have. He has team members that are also on Team Futaba, so they have lots of experience. I highly, highly recommend Tech-Aero products!

Jeremy



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Old 08-08-2012, 09:36 PM
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Default RE: NEW DLE 20cc Gasser! (Data & Links 1st Post)

G'day,

I have used the Ultra IBEC on all my small planes and have had great success. Highly reccomend the product.
Glenn

Quote:
ORIGINAL: mach2


Quote:
ORIGINAL: spitfire66


I want to go to to a LIFE 6.6v battery. Have any of you run this type of battery with any luck or bad luck? I am afraid of burning up the electronic ignition

Shannon
These are the perfect solution. Interference illiminating, optikill, LED to show ignition power, and adjustible voltage regulation. And on top of it all, Ed's customer service is the best.
www.tech-aero.net/ultra-ibec

I had two of these in planes that had crashed and I sent them in to him so that he could look them over to ensure they are okay to use on my next builds. He checked them out and did the needed repairs for no charge. And he will spend more than enough time with you on the phone to help you, in any situation you may have. He has team members that are also on Team Futaba, so they have lots of experience. I highly, highly recommend Tech-Aero products!

Jeremy



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Old 08-08-2012, 11:21 PM
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Default RE: NEW DLE 20cc Gasser! (Data & Links 1st Post)

Quote:
From all reports this is a great product backed up with great service.

On the other hand, for the $45 purchase price you could instead get about 1400 of [link=http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Fairchild-Semiconductor/1N4007/?qs=ZbYWOjW8mGpgsSEErKxdmfUH0OoFY7oB]these[/link]. That's enough to equip 700 planes with a ignition voltage reducer suitable for LIFE type batteries. If you only need enough for a few planes then your local electronics shop can set you up for a buck or two. Using these with a separate ignition battery will increase your plane's weight by a few ounces over the Ultra IBEC. If that's a problem then there are usually other, cheaper ways to save that much weight.

Nothing wrong with either choice, just letting you know there are choices.

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Old 08-09-2012, 06:45 AM
  #5657
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Default RE: NEW DLE 20cc Gasser! (Data & Links 1st Post)

Quote:
ORIGINAL: aerobear

Quote:
From all reports this is a great product backed up with great service.

On the other hand, for the $45 purchase price you could instead get about 1400 of [link=http://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Fairchild-Semiconductor/1N4007/?qs=ZbYWOjW8mGpgsSEErKxdmfUH0OoFY7oB]these[/link]. That's enough to equip 700 planes with a ignition voltage reducer suitable for LIFE type batteries. If you only need enough for a few planes then your local electronics shop can set you up for a buck or two. Using these with a separate ignition battery will increase your plane's weight by a few ounces over the Ultra IBEC. If that's a problem then there are usually other, cheaper ways to save that much weight.

Nothing wrong with either choice, just letting you know there are choices.
I pay seven cents a piece for them at my local surplus electronics store. Just walk in, get a handful for a quarter and out the door. I then use the extra power cable supplied with the DLE engines to splice it in and hook up to the switched side of my switch.

Some people like to have a ready made product but I like to go DIY when I can.
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Old 08-09-2012, 07:03 PM
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Default RE: NEW DLE 20cc Gasser! (Data & Links 1st Post)

Im having intermittent ignition cutouts. Looks like it may be the Optikill. The LED blinks off when the ignition cuts out. 
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Old 08-09-2012, 08:17 PM
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Default RE: NEW DLE 20cc Gasser! (Data & Links 1st Post)

acdii - Have you tried removing the Optikill to test your theory?
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Old 08-09-2012, 08:24 PM
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Default RE: NEW DLE 20cc Gasser! (Data & Links 1st Post)

Ditto... Just 1 1N4007 in series is enough to drop the voltage by 0.9V
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Old 08-09-2012, 08:37 PM
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Default RE: NEW DLE 20cc Gasser! (Data & Links 1st Post)

Yep, I do like to know that a pro has made my unit. And I dont mind giving a guy like Ed my money. He inspected and fixed two of my units for free! Not many companies in this hobby do stuff like that. At least from my experience.

There is a lot of circuitry in the Ultra IBEC. Can you show what your home made unit looks like? Not talking mess. Im really interested.

Also, BEC in IBEC stands for Battery Eliminating Circuit. So adding another battery for the ignition isn't really the same thing. Youre just making a voltage regulator...I would however like to know how to make one. So please show...

I also like the LED showing power to the ignition. There are also 4 different voltage level options. How does your home made unit have an optikill? Thats a pretty cool thing.

Im not a techno or electronics guy. So it would be cool to see how to make something like this.

Jeremy
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Old 08-09-2012, 10:17 PM
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Default RE: NEW DLE 20cc Gasser! (Data & Links 1st Post)


Quote:
ORIGINAL: mach2
.....I also like the LED showing power to the ignition. There are also 4 different voltage level options. How does your home made unit have an optikill? Thats a pretty cool thing.......
All of those are attractive features that the diode solution does not have. Like I said, nothing wrong with that choice. I'm just pointing out another choice for those like me that find very cheap very attractive.
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Old 08-09-2012, 11:23 PM
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Default RE: NEW DLE 20cc Gasser! (Data & Links 1st Post)

Mach2, I do not have a picture of the diode soldered in series to the wire going to the CDi. But it is simple what I do. I use a twin switch - 1 for Rx and the other for CDi. The switch wire going to the Cdi is spliced and a diode added in series. I cover the diode and the soldered joints by heat shrink.

I use Life batts. i.e 6.6V and so the reduction of 0.9V is enough to make the Cdi happy at 5.7V.

For the optokill I use the RcEXL optokill costing usd 10 landed.

For more details you may search this thread for "1N4007" and you will get more details.

The whole thing is very simple and less prone to trouble. I am using this in 8 of my gassers.
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Old 08-10-2012, 04:06 AM
  #5664
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Default RE: NEW DLE 20cc Gasser! (Data & Links 1st Post)


Quote:
ORIGINAL: acdii

Im having intermittent ignition cutouts. Looks like it may be the Optikill. The LED blinks off when the ignition cuts out.
What else is going on when that happens? If the receiver is loosing signal, or power (browning out, bad switch/connections?), that might be causing it as well? Does the receiver battery have a fresh charge?

Twice now, I've blamed my optokill when I should have been looking further upstream....
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Old 08-10-2012, 05:09 AM
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Default RE: NEW DLE 20cc Gasser! (Data & Links 1st Post)

I haven't spent the time to troubleshoot it yet. The RX is not loosing signal, both packs have a full charge.  It may or may not be the actual switch, when I first ran the engine up it started dropping and revving, which got my attention, then I noticed it did it at all speeds, so I checked the LED while it was running and I could see it blinking off.   I stopped the engine, pulled the wing off and checked all my connections inside, then gave the switch a firm pull to turn it on and it ran OK, no more drops, so thought well maybe it was the switch, so I took off and after it was up about a minute I heard it dropping off again. It did it a couple more times before I landed it, so what ever it is, didnt get fixed when I rechecked the connections. 

If the RX is turned off the OPtikill stays on, at least I think it does, or maybe its when the TX is turned off, need to double check, it's one or the other. 

Over the last weekend I had removed the tank and repositioned the ignition, it kept coming loose and flopping around in the cowl, so maybe I pulled a wire loose in the harness. However, if it was a lead to the ignition, would the LED still blink out?  My thought would be either the power connection or the RX connection would cause it. 
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Old 08-10-2012, 05:31 AM
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Default RE: NEW DLE 20cc Gasser! (Data & Links 1st Post)

using Miracle switches?
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Old 08-10-2012, 06:27 AM
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Default RE: NEW DLE 20cc Gasser! (Data & Links 1st Post)

Aerobar \ Sandy Jain - Sounds like using that diode is a good option if you already have the extra battery and swith \ charging jacks. If not, then the Ibec seems like a good - somewhat cheaper - and lighter alternative to a dedicated ignition battery. Agreed?
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Old 08-10-2012, 07:08 AM
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Default RE: NEW DLE 20cc Gasser! (Data & Links 1st Post)


Quote:
ORIGINAL: microdon2

Aerobar \ Sandy Jain - Sounds like using that diode is a good option if you already have the extra battery and swith \ charging jacks. If not, then the Ibec seems like a good - somewhat cheaper - and lighter alternative to a dedicated ignition battery. Agreed?
The diode is installed just upstream from ignition module. It's not necessary if you are using an IBEC?

The point is you can use a plain Rcexl (or whatever) opti switch, along with the diode installation, in place of the more expensive IBEC? How you power either isn't the point (receiver battery or second, dedicated ign. battery). You can go either way with either the IBEC or the Rcexl/diode setup.

Rcexl switches are pretty cheap now. Add the price of a diode (.50) to that, and you have the same functional end result as the much more expensive IBEC?

Confusing as all get out at first, but once you get your head wrapped around it not to bad.
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Old 08-10-2012, 07:33 AM
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Default RE: NEW DLE 20cc Gasser! (Data & Links 1st Post)

A dedicated battery is not necessary at all. I run my smaller gassers - dle20 - with just 1 batt feeding the Rx n CDi.
What I like to do is to have 2 swithes....1 fr Rx n other fr CDi. In the wire fom the switch to the CDi I attach the diode.

And yes this works for Life only. for LiPo you will need more diodes, in which case an Ibec may be better.

But I will highly reccomend Lfe for CDi as they give a constant voltage over 80% of their life.
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Old 08-10-2012, 09:28 AM
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Default RE: NEW DLE 20cc Gasser! (Data & Links 1st Post)

How do you run both on one battery?

Do you use a "Y" on the battery, with each half connected to a switch, with one going to the RX and the other the CDI?

Isn't there a chance of noise feeding back from the CDI into the RX that way?

Bill S.
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Old 08-10-2012, 10:37 AM
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Default RE: NEW DLE 20cc Gasser! (Data & Links 1st Post)

Been using the diode setup for a few years now. All the A123 batteries that i have have a jr type of lead for the charge balance plug. I use that for the ignition lead. Main lead goes to rec'r. Have had good results so far.

Bruce
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Old 08-10-2012, 12:02 PM
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Default RE: NEW DLE 20cc Gasser! (Data & Links 1st Post)


Quote:
ORIGINAL: Twin_Flyer

How do you run both on one battery?

Do you use a ''Y'' on the battery, with each half connected to a switch, with one going to the RX and the other the CDI?

Isn't there a chance of noise feeding back from the CDI into the RX that way?

Bill S.
The DLE 20 comes with a pigtail connector for wiring into your switch. I drew this up a while back to demonstrate how I do it.
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Old 08-10-2012, 12:29 PM
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Default RE: NEW DLE 20cc Gasser! (Data & Links 1st Post)

I get that, but Sandy said he wasnt using the optikll so his setup is what I wanted to clarify...

Bill S.
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Old 08-10-2012, 04:59 PM
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Default RE: NEW DLE 20cc Gasser! (Data & Links 1st Post)


Quote:
ORIGINAL: Twin_Flyer

I get that, but Sandy said he wasnt using the optikll so his setup is what I wanted to clarify...

Bill S.
I'm going to assume that we're talking 2.4 rigs installed in 20-30cc planes (possibly smaller, maybe a little bigger, some 50cc guys are running it)? Whatever, someplace we might want to use a light weight, single battery system, including those with digital high torque servos, though that's not necessarily the case.

On single battery set ups, I think most guys are using 2 sets of wires coming from a single battery (at least 2, regardless of battery chemistry). Those 2 leads feed 2 switches (hopefully HD switches with fairly heavy wire). One of those 2 switches feed the receiver as you would normally. How the second is set up depends on the individual.

With SpinnerRow's setup (above), the second switch feeds the power "in" line on his opti switch. Nice and simple.

Others (like me) might take that second switch lead and run it to a "Y" inserted in the rudder channel. Don't want to confuse the issue about why you might want to go this way yet. Get to that later. To run this method, you need to get past the potential for problems caused by the opti switch back feeding the receiver with something that might cause problems. Not going to say that potential isn't there. I'll let the tech geeks argue that point. I WILL say, a BUNCH of us are flying this way with no issues, and have been for a 2-3 seasons. This is my second season this way without a single issue.

If your second switch is feeding the "Y" in the rudder servo, you still need to get power to the "input" side of the opti switch (or IBEC). That can be done with another "Y" inserted anywhere in the system that's handy. The red and black wires are the same (red positive/black negative) no matter where you see them in the system. The Rcexl switch comes with a diagram that has you placing 2 drops of solder to get it's "input" power from the line that plugs into the receiver, controlling the switch's on/off function. This lets you ignore the switch's "input" wire. It's not used.

Why would you want to run that second switch lead to a "Y" in the rudder lead?

1. Switch redundancy. No more concern about a failed switch. That only happens to you one time prior to looking for ways to avoid that happening again. This way either switch is capable of supplying the system.

2. Amperage available to the servos. That battery is capable of producing a lot more amperage than the wires you see commonly used can carry. The extra set of wires feeding the power circuit can provide a big boost in high demand situations - which is exactly why we use the rudder to install the "y". It's generally the biggest servo, and even when not, it's the servo pulling the most power most often - and this way it's getting a direct shot from the battery - in addition to what it might have ordinarily.

Hope this helps somebody trying to get their head wrapped around this. If I've managed to confuse, holler! -Al




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Old 08-10-2012, 06:27 PM
  #5675
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Default RE: NEW DLE 20cc Gasser! (Data & Links 1st Post)

I have no problem understanding the setup, all of them.

My question was, IF you feed the CDI AND the RX via one battery, without some sort of an isloater, isnt there a chance of ignition noise causing interference with the RX?

IE, noise feeding back from the CDI box into the RX via a commen battery connection.

Thats all....

I have only run my DLE 30 on a stand so far, so this part of the hobby is very new to me, though I have been flying since '87.

Bill S.
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