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-   -   Saito 180 glow to gas conversion (http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/gas-engines-142/10332664-saito-180-glow-gas-conversion.html)

Edwin 02-13-2011 07:36 AM

Saito 180 glow to gas conversion
 
It hit me this morning while looking at my saito 180 (that hasnt been used in years due to glow fuel costs) that I could buy the carb kit from horizon ($160). Then use a spare ignition setup with a rimfire plug. I just have to modify the prop hub with the magnet. Is there anything else I'm forgeting?
Edwin

w8ye 02-13-2011 08:50 AM

RE: Saito 180 glow to gas conversion
 
Yes, you are missing a few things as the Gasoline Saito FG-30 (180) is more related to the FG-36 (220) than it is the Glow 180 or 150 engines. The FG-30 looks like a Saito 220 and not a 180.

The intake on the gasoline FG-30 engine attaches with 3 screws instead of the compression nut. Therefore the head is also different.

I converted my Saito 150 to gasoline for the same price of glow fuel problem.

I used the original carb with a Perry VP 22 pump and a Cline fuel regulator.

The ignition setup is RCEXL and the timing ring and sensor mount is from CH which is no longer in business. The magnet ring mounts over the existing prop driver hub and has not slipped. The sensor mounts to the front of the cam box.

The engine starts and runs nice. The needles are not overly sensitive. Doesn't get hot or anything. I use the same prop as I did on glow fuel.

There's a narrow slightly richer spot in the mid range.

I find using the original carb with a pump and regulator to be more cost effective and less of a mounting problem than using a Walbro WT-256 four stroke carb from a Ryobi four stroke.

Here is a picture of someone's Saito 150 with a CH timing set up exactly like mine

http://images.rcuniverse.com/forum/U...33/Ge96349.jpg


Edwin 02-13-2011 03:19 PM

RE: Saito 180 glow to gas conversion
 
Didnt notice that. Sounds like an even better option though. I have a spare rcxcel ignition setup for the cm-6 plug which is supposed to work for the rimfire. Are you using the rimfire plug? What kind of mix are you using? I just hated seeing that engine sit there all lonely with nothing to do. And really didnt want to sell it.
Edwin

w8ye 02-13-2011 03:22 PM

RE: Saito 180 glow to gas conversion
 
I use the 20:1 mix that I use with my Saito FRG-20 and FG-36 engines. Pennzoil air cooled

I have some Rimfire plugs but in my Saito 150, I'm using the RCEXL 1/4-32 plug.

You will have to buy the spark plug boot for a 1/4-32 plug to put on your RCEXL ignition system.

w8ye 02-13-2011 03:30 PM

RE: Saito 180 glow to gas conversion
 
The reason I recommend the stock Saito carb is two fold.

The gas carbs on the Saito engines do not work the best in the world as far as being easy to adjust.

The Two smaller Saito Gasoline engines, the FG-14 and FG-20 have such a weak pump and no reulator that they almost have a glow fuel carb anyway.

The expensive Walbro WYB carb on the FG-30 & 36 are impossible to get parts for and some of them have been problem childern for the owners as far as the pop off pressure setting goes.

You cannot use a regular Walbro carb on a four stroke. You have to ad a pump diaphragm return spring or else buy a carb that was used on a four stroke in the beginning. One such carb is the little Walbro WT-456.

Here's a link to the Perry pump

http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...XDG63&P=ML

Here's the Cline Regulator

http://www.billsroom.com/pcfs/

Here's the Iron Bay regulator

http://www.ironbaymodelcompany.com/i...es/Page438.htm


mbkite12 02-13-2011 03:55 PM

RE: Saito 180 glow to gas conversion
 
I have a saito 180 and am a little stupid
can some one walk me through the procedure
and do they have spark plugs that fit in the glow plug hole.

w8ye 02-13-2011 03:59 PM

RE: Saito 180 glow to gas conversion
 
This is the ignition you want to buy and it is available from several sources

http://www.agaperacingandhobby.com/v...?productid=163

But you will need to get someone to make an aluminum ring to go around your prop hub to hold the magnet and an aluminum bracket to hold the sensor as in the picture above.

Here is the RCEXL 1/4-32 spark plug

http://www.agaperacingandhobby.com/v...?productid=172

Here is the 120 degree 1/4-32 boot kit if you are converting a different ignition

http://www.agaperacingandhobby.com/v...?productid=299


w8ye 02-13-2011 04:16 PM

RE: Saito 180 glow to gas conversion
 
This guy may work with you to make the parts as he has worked with other people

Someone here can help with dimensions

http://www.rcuniverse.com/community/...le&forum=1

Antique 02-13-2011 06:48 PM

RE: Saito 180 glow to gas conversion
 
The Agape site says the 120 degree cap is for a CM6...I DOES fit the Rimfire and Chinese 1/4=32 plug, not the CM6..

w8ye 02-13-2011 06:56 PM

RE: Saito 180 glow to gas conversion
 
You cannot put a CM-6 plug into a 180 head the way they are made. The Saito FG-30 has a CM-6 but they moved a few things around. The cylinder is cast different.

Edwin 02-13-2011 08:24 PM

RE: Saito 180 glow to gas conversion
 
I was looking at this site earlier. Agape's rimfires are cheaper.
http://www.cncengines.com/rc.html
Edwin

w8ye 02-13-2011 08:52 PM

RE: Saito 180 glow to gas conversion
 
The 1/4-32 plugs at Agape Racing are RCEXL plugs. They are a little cheaper than the true Rimfire plugs.

I get by fine with the RCEXL plugs.

Antique 02-13-2011 09:37 PM

RE: Saito 180 glow to gas conversion
 
The Chinese 1/4-32s actually work pretty good, even if you cut the side electrode completely off....There's enough spark in the RC EXL to jump the little gap that's left, just did it on a Magnum twin ignition conversion...

Edwin 02-14-2011 06:41 AM

RE: Saito 180 glow to gas conversion
 
I can make a magnet ring on my lathe. Is it press fit or secured with set screws?
Edwin

Antique 02-14-2011 07:09 AM

RE: Saito 180 glow to gas conversion
 
Set screws allow movement of the ring to set the timing...The hub has a keyway so it can't be timed at assembly like a tapered hub...A tapered hub needs no key and can be timed if the sensor ring doesn't rotate on the crankcase....Either way works the same....

Antique 02-14-2011 07:11 AM

RE: Saito 180 glow to gas conversion
 
Set screws allow movement of the ring to set the timing...The hub has a keyway so it can't be timed at assembly like a tapered hub...A tapered hub needs no key and can be timed if the sensor ring doesn't rotate on the crankcase....Either way works the same....

w8ye 02-14-2011 07:36 AM

RE: Saito 180 glow to gas conversion
 
My ring has two 6-32 set screws that keep the ring attached to the prop driver hub.

Jezmo 02-15-2011 05:59 AM

RE: Saito 180 glow to gas conversion
 
1 Attachment(s)
My setup is pretty much the same as Jim's picture, in post #2 above, except Bill (CH Ignitions) made my timing ring from Delrin for both my Saito 91 and 180. (It also uses grub screws to secure it to the drive hub) I am just using muffler pressure and the stock carb but it works great without the pump and regulator. I know some engines seem to need extra hardware but I've been lucky I guess. The 91 uses almost no gas compared to what it did on glow; heck a quart of gas mix lasts me weeks. I have it in a Tiger2 now but here is a picture of the engine showing the Delrin timing ring and a grub screw. This was when it was still in the Big Stick 60.

Edwin 02-15-2011 08:02 AM

RE: Saito 180 glow to gas conversion
 
Nice clean install. Like it. I hadnt thought of doing a .91 4stroke yet. I have distant DS B-17 build I'm gathering parts for right now. Problems I've had in the past with small fuel tanks has been stiff clunk lines inside the tank. They didnt hang low enough to get all the fuel. I ended up using some 3/8 nuts over the fuel line next to the clunk to get it to move around. That was with glow. I cant imagine how tough it would be with tygon. Thats some pretty stiff stuff. Not an issue with my bigger gassers. But on my 20cc I had to run a 16oz tank so the clunk would behave. Too big for my needs.
Edwin

Jezmo 02-17-2011 09:32 AM

RE: Saito 180 glow to gas conversion
 
Try the Hayes black neoprene tubing inside the tank, but be sure to put a length of brass tubing inside the hose so it can't turn toward the front of the tank and get stuck. That's what I use on my small stuff. Here is a link http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...P?I=LXK824&P=8 to show what I'm talking about.

captinjohn 02-17-2011 10:52 AM

RE: Saito 180 glow to gas conversion
 
Be carefull on that Hayes neopreme from Tower Hobbies. The darn stuff went bad within 2 weeks. They did send me a new pack....I use that on crank pump only. Also I bought a new Futaba Fast Radio from them. Rec battery never did give any where near capacity. I sent it to them...thay would not replace it. The darn thing goes down fast...like a bad cell. So I do not buy or recomend buying from them. They got my last order....andwas buying RC goodies from them for 25+ years. Capt,nhttp://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/js/f...humbs_down.gif

kmtranmd 03-01-2011 05:22 PM

RE: Saito 180 glow to gas conversion
 
Hey Ralph,
Is this something you may have interest in doing for some of us that don't want to do the conversion ourselves? I have 3 Saito 180's that I would love to convert to gas if power output is similar to nitro.

affas 02-19-2013 08:43 AM

RE: Saito 180 glow to gas conversion
 
Old thread but use www.ch-ignitions.com

I have done 4 conversions by him and all with excellent results!!

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YiRu4wsByF8[/youtube]

mikes68charger 02-21-2013 06:44 PM

RE: Saito 180 glow to gas conversion
 
so if one was going to do a gas convershion

should he run the new motor with nitro for a few tanks before swiching to gas?<br type="_moz" />

irocbsa 02-21-2013 07:21 PM

RE: Saito 180 glow to gas conversion
 
Mike, IMHO, all the engine needs for proper break in is enough lubrication. It doesn't care if said lubrication comes from castor oil or something else. I would go straight to gas and just make sure that you run a higher oil/gas ratio for break in with a good quality lubricant.


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