Wing Failute 50cc Aeroworks Ultimate
06-27-2011, 07:03 AM
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Wing Failute 50cc Aeroworks Ultimate
Well I am going to let the cat out of the bag here. I had a wing failure on the 50cc Aeroworks Ultimate during simple pattern sequence. Watch the little strip of covering that covers the upper wing halfs joint. I noted after a flying session that this little strip of covering would have wrinkles in it as if it had been stretched. I could iron it back down but after the next flying session the wrinkles would be back, I thought it was normal. The aircraft had about 30 flights on it when the upper, I guess the upper, wing failed, both left side wings departed the aircraft in level inverted flight and ALL hardware was intact after the crash. Impact was very hard, bent the crankshaft on the DA, batteries exploded and burned, tank clunch was thrown thru the side of the tank etc.
I fly IMAC / pattern style stuff, no 3D, no high speed snaps.
I took lots of pictures, sent them to Kim @ Aeroworks asking for a new kit under warranty. I guess Aeroworks did all they could, I mean they don't know me or how this aircraft was treated,so they offered 30 % or $210 off of a new kit. I declinde their offer and expressed my integrity as a FAA licensed A&P mechanic was worth more than that. Aeroworks suggested I left some bolts out or loose<- this was the second flight of the day. I my mind taking the 30% would admit that I was lying about the cause of the airframe failure and philosophically couldn't go there.
Anyway , this post is not about Aeroworks warrant but rather a "heads up" on watching those wings and consider carefully before you buy the Ultimate. I have several other Aeroworks mono planes and love them.
I fly IMAC / pattern style stuff, no 3D, no high speed snaps.
I took lots of pictures, sent them to Kim @ Aeroworks asking for a new kit under warranty. I guess Aeroworks did all they could, I mean they don't know me or how this aircraft was treated,so they offered 30 % or $210 off of a new kit. I declinde their offer and expressed my integrity as a FAA licensed A&P mechanic was worth more than that. Aeroworks suggested I left some bolts out or loose<- this was the second flight of the day. I my mind taking the 30% would admit that I was lying about the cause of the airframe failure and philosophically couldn't go there.
Anyway , this post is not about Aeroworks warrant but rather a "heads up" on watching those wings and consider carefully before you buy the Ultimate. I have several other Aeroworks mono planes and love them.
06-27-2011, 12:35 PM
#2
RE: Wing Failute 50cc Aeroworks Ultimate
Frank, you must be very adamant since this is your 4th post in different threads about the wing failure. I have not maidened yet, and I will watch for wing joint weaknesses to exhibit themselves. The wings are indeed very thin, so I hope and trust that AW built the joints with lots of strength in mind. It's interesting that we have not read of other wing failures on this particular plane, so I hope that you got the only lemon, and that the rest are ok. Thanks for the heads up again. Jon
06-27-2011, 04:25 PM
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RE: Wing Failute 50cc Aeroworks Ultimate
i have expirence some warranty work with AREOWORK,my plane had some BLEMYS,since i open the box., I was told by AREOWORK> PLANE AND SIMPLE., I will never buy their plane again
06-28-2011, 12:18 AM
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RE: Wing Failute 50cc Aeroworks Ultimate
Sorry about your loss, and thanks for the info about how you were taken care of by the manufacturer of the kit.
06-28-2011, 05:03 PM
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RE: Wing Failute 50cc Aeroworks Ultimate
I know things happen from time to time and I sure don't know why they reacted the way they did but they have always treated me VERY good, taking care of any issues. I just ordered a new 50cc Extra 260 from them a couple of hours ago to replace the one in my avatar. Again, Rocco, Mark and the gang have always done right by me.
07-03-2011, 09:50 PM
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RE: Wing Failute 50cc Aeroworks Ultimate
Aerowork sells but don't care what happens afterwards.
Sorry to hear that your plane failed andAW won't cover for their problem.
I like to share my bad experience with AW as well.
When my first kit came damaged, they made a claim to UPS which didn't make sense to me because one part had broken pin but other elevator part had a glue issue.
2nd kit had a majorflying quality issue and I wanted to figure out why and what to do to make it better.
Mark Dennis of AW didn't give me any real answer. After trying with him and totally frustrated, I talked with Rocco (or should I call him loco?) for Mark's attitude and issues not getting properly answered. Rocco has exactly same attitude. AW doesn't care !!! Since it came from Rocco himself, I'm seeing it as a company policy.
Rocco, if you're reading this, remember that long long letter with all the e-mail exchanges with Mark ???
From the beginning I mentioned I'm not looking into any discount or replacement. I just wanted to get suggestions.
What they suggested was a discount with no real explanation ATALL.
Even though that I have to agree Aeroworks make high quality kits and nice selections, I won't buy or recommend AW kit to anyone.
DON'T BUY AEROWORKS.
I recently got a 3DHS and I might get a comp arf in the future.
Ah, BTW shouldn'tAW take hard snaps and 3d flying stresses as well ???
F3A planes are designed just above snap rolls to minimize weight, but come on, this is a IMAC we're talking about.
Solo 48, I'm with you !!!
Sorry to hear that your plane failed andAW won't cover for their problem.
I like to share my bad experience with AW as well.
When my first kit came damaged, they made a claim to UPS which didn't make sense to me because one part had broken pin but other elevator part had a glue issue.
2nd kit had a majorflying quality issue and I wanted to figure out why and what to do to make it better.
Mark Dennis of AW didn't give me any real answer. After trying with him and totally frustrated, I talked with Rocco (or should I call him loco?) for Mark's attitude and issues not getting properly answered. Rocco has exactly same attitude. AW doesn't care !!! Since it came from Rocco himself, I'm seeing it as a company policy.
Rocco, if you're reading this, remember that long long letter with all the e-mail exchanges with Mark ???
From the beginning I mentioned I'm not looking into any discount or replacement. I just wanted to get suggestions.
What they suggested was a discount with no real explanation ATALL.
Even though that I have to agree Aeroworks make high quality kits and nice selections, I won't buy or recommend AW kit to anyone.
DON'T BUY AEROWORKS.
I recently got a 3DHS and I might get a comp arf in the future.
Ah, BTW shouldn'tAW take hard snaps and 3d flying stresses as well ???
F3A planes are designed just above snap rolls to minimize weight, but come on, this is a IMAC we're talking about.
Solo 48, I'm with you !!!
07-06-2011, 10:45 AM
#9
RE: Wing Failute 50cc Aeroworks Ultimate
I own several Aeroworks planes and prefer their quality of the bird, hardware provided along with the detailed instructions. I did witness what I thought was outstanding customer service earlier this year with a club member. His used 100cc Aeroworks Extra folded a wing during a snap roll and demolished the airframe. He insisted the wing tube should not have failed and called Aeroworks. To my surprise Rocco replaced the airframe to this second owner of the plane at no charge. Jerry.
07-06-2011, 01:18 PM
#10
RE: Wing Failute 50cc Aeroworks Ultimate
***No offense to any poster here.*** But I hate these kinds of post. I deal with customer service every day. There is no way to tell who is right by one side of the story. Plus, the average consumer has no idea how many people try and screw the company. I have heard guys talk about dumb thumbing one in the ground and then calling the company to say a part failed. I know there are legitimate problems with equipment from EVERY company out there. I just hate to see an above average company get a black eye without hearing all the facts. Finally when I hear one of these stories, I wonder how the person approached the company. If you come to me with an attitude, you will get attitude back. So if you have a legitimate complaint. In a calm cool tone tell the person exactly what happened and ask if there is anything the company can do to help you. You can be firm with your position without being a turd.
david
david
07-09-2011, 03:25 PM
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RE: Wing Failute 50cc Aeroworks Ultimate
ORIGINAL: turboromy
Aerowork sells but don't care what happens afterwards.
Sorry to hear that your plane failed and AW won't cover for their problem.
I like to share my bad experience with AW as well.
When my first kit came damaged, they made a claim to UPS which didn't make sense to me because one part had broken pin but other elevator part had a glue issue.
2nd kit had a major flying quality issue and I wanted to figure out why and what to do to make it better.
Mark Dennis of AW didn't give me any real answer. After trying with him and totally frustrated, I talked with Rocco (or should I call him loco?) for Mark's attitude and issues not getting properly answered. Rocco has exactly same attitude. AW doesn't care !!! Since it came from Rocco himself, I'm seeing it as a company policy.
Rocco, if you're reading this, remember that long long letter with all the e-mail exchanges with Mark ???
From the beginning I mentioned I'm not looking into any discount or replacement. I just wanted to get suggestions.
What they suggested was a discount with no real explanation AT ALL.
Even though that I have to agree Aeroworks make high quality kits and nice selections, I won't buy or recommend AW kit to anyone.
DON'T BUY AEROWORKS.
I recently got a 3DHS and I might get a comp arf in the future.
Ah, BTW shouldn't AW take hard snaps and 3d flying stresses as well ???
F3A planes are designed just above snap rolls to minimize weight, but come on, this is a IMAC we're talking about.
Solo 48, I'm with you !!!
Aerowork sells but don't care what happens afterwards.
Sorry to hear that your plane failed and AW won't cover for their problem.
I like to share my bad experience with AW as well.
When my first kit came damaged, they made a claim to UPS which didn't make sense to me because one part had broken pin but other elevator part had a glue issue.
2nd kit had a major flying quality issue and I wanted to figure out why and what to do to make it better.
Mark Dennis of AW didn't give me any real answer. After trying with him and totally frustrated, I talked with Rocco (or should I call him loco?) for Mark's attitude and issues not getting properly answered. Rocco has exactly same attitude. AW doesn't care !!! Since it came from Rocco himself, I'm seeing it as a company policy.
Rocco, if you're reading this, remember that long long letter with all the e-mail exchanges with Mark ???
From the beginning I mentioned I'm not looking into any discount or replacement. I just wanted to get suggestions.
What they suggested was a discount with no real explanation AT ALL.
Even though that I have to agree Aeroworks make high quality kits and nice selections, I won't buy or recommend AW kit to anyone.
DON'T BUY AEROWORKS.
I recently got a 3DHS and I might get a comp arf in the future.
Ah, BTW shouldn't AW take hard snaps and 3d flying stresses as well ???
F3A planes are designed just above snap rolls to minimize weight, but come on, this is a IMAC we're talking about.
Solo 48, I'm with you !!!
They are way over rated. Ill take a TOC or Pilot anyday
07-09-2011, 07:18 PM
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RE: Wing Failute 50cc Aeroworks Ultimate
David,
I do take offense to your post and I believe that you made your opening statement to cover your negative comments. I’m tired of people coming onto these forums and not fully reading the OP’s letter, or not remembering what they read, then making derogatory statements. You could have asked Frank some specific questions about his experience with the Ultimate, on this Forum or in private, before making your negatively biased comments. You stated, “I just hate to see an above average company get a black eye without hearing all the facts.” David, how much of an explanation do you want so that YOU feel that YOU have all the facts? Would a two page dissertation make you happy? Frank clearly laid out the facts in several paragraphs, and closed his comments with, “this post is not about Aeroworks warrant but rather a "heads up" on watching those wings and consider carefully before you buy the Ultimate..”
To anyone else that might have concerns about their Aeroworks 50cc Ultimate:
I have known Frank Baity for many years and Frank is the utmost professional. Frank’s comments about his Ultimate were to warn current and future Ultimate owners to look out for potential problems with the upper wing jont, and as a side note to let Ultimate owners know that he, Frank, felt that Aeroworks did not seem to believe his comments about possible issues with the airframe. Aeroworks response to Frank was the typical, “you must have left some bolts out or loose.” I understand that Aeroworks get phone calls all the time with people making false claims and they, Aeroworks, have to try and fend them off. But, in this case, Frank has a legitimate claim to poor workmanship on his Ultimate. As to what would be fair compensation for the loss of the airframe, that’s not for me to decide.
Frank has purchased several Aeroworks models over the past several years and currently fly’s the AW 50cc Extra 260 for IMAC style acro. Frank closed his letter by clearly stating, “I have several other Aeroworks mono planes and love them.” Frank speaks highly of AW’s products, as well do I, but in this case Frank is highly disappointed in the outcome of his AW 50cc Ultimate and in the way that Kim treated him.
FYI - Frank recently retired as a Sales Account Executive from a Fortune 500 aviation company, is an A&P mechanic, full scale pilot, an avid R/C modeler (addicted would better describe his passion for R/C), has flown Pattern for well over 35 years, has flown R/C helicopter since the GMP Cricket days, has built more models from a box of wood or from plans than anyone and their two buddies has extremities to count on, etc, etc, etc, the list goes on.
Yes Frank is a friend, but I would not defend his character if it was not deserved.
Mike Smith
I do take offense to your post and I believe that you made your opening statement to cover your negative comments. I’m tired of people coming onto these forums and not fully reading the OP’s letter, or not remembering what they read, then making derogatory statements. You could have asked Frank some specific questions about his experience with the Ultimate, on this Forum or in private, before making your negatively biased comments. You stated, “I just hate to see an above average company get a black eye without hearing all the facts.” David, how much of an explanation do you want so that YOU feel that YOU have all the facts? Would a two page dissertation make you happy? Frank clearly laid out the facts in several paragraphs, and closed his comments with, “this post is not about Aeroworks warrant but rather a "heads up" on watching those wings and consider carefully before you buy the Ultimate..”
To anyone else that might have concerns about their Aeroworks 50cc Ultimate:
I have known Frank Baity for many years and Frank is the utmost professional. Frank’s comments about his Ultimate were to warn current and future Ultimate owners to look out for potential problems with the upper wing jont, and as a side note to let Ultimate owners know that he, Frank, felt that Aeroworks did not seem to believe his comments about possible issues with the airframe. Aeroworks response to Frank was the typical, “you must have left some bolts out or loose.” I understand that Aeroworks get phone calls all the time with people making false claims and they, Aeroworks, have to try and fend them off. But, in this case, Frank has a legitimate claim to poor workmanship on his Ultimate. As to what would be fair compensation for the loss of the airframe, that’s not for me to decide.
Frank has purchased several Aeroworks models over the past several years and currently fly’s the AW 50cc Extra 260 for IMAC style acro. Frank closed his letter by clearly stating, “I have several other Aeroworks mono planes and love them.” Frank speaks highly of AW’s products, as well do I, but in this case Frank is highly disappointed in the outcome of his AW 50cc Ultimate and in the way that Kim treated him.
FYI - Frank recently retired as a Sales Account Executive from a Fortune 500 aviation company, is an A&P mechanic, full scale pilot, an avid R/C modeler (addicted would better describe his passion for R/C), has flown Pattern for well over 35 years, has flown R/C helicopter since the GMP Cricket days, has built more models from a box of wood or from plans than anyone and their two buddies has extremities to count on, etc, etc, etc, the list goes on.
Yes Frank is a friend, but I would not defend his character if it was not deserved.
Mike Smith
07-11-2011, 07:15 PM
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RE: Wing Failute 50cc Aeroworks Ultimate
ORIGINAL: daveopam
***No offense to any poster here.*** But I hate these kinds of post. I deal with customer service every day. There is no way to tell who is right by one side of the story. Plus, the average consumer has no idea how many people try and screw the company. I have heard guys talk about dumb thumbing one in the ground and then calling the company to say a part failed. I know there are legitimate problems with equipment from EVERY company out there. I just hate to see an above average company get a black eye without hearing all the facts. Finally when I hear one of these stories, I wonder how the person approached the company. If you come to me with an attitude, you will get attitude back. So if you have a legitimate complaint. In a calm cool tone tell the person exactly what happened and ask if there is anything the company can do to help you. You can be firm with your position without being a turd.
david
***No offense to any poster here.*** But I hate these kinds of post. I deal with customer service every day. There is no way to tell who is right by one side of the story. Plus, the average consumer has no idea how many people try and screw the company. I have heard guys talk about dumb thumbing one in the ground and then calling the company to say a part failed. I know there are legitimate problems with equipment from EVERY company out there. I just hate to see an above average company get a black eye without hearing all the facts. Finally when I hear one of these stories, I wonder how the person approached the company. If you come to me with an attitude, you will get attitude back. So if you have a legitimate complaint. In a calm cool tone tell the person exactly what happened and ask if there is anything the company can do to help you. You can be firm with your position without being a turd.
david
I agree with your comments as I have seen/heard the same issues. I worked in the hobby industry for a helicopter distributor for a number of years and the storys we received would make Pinocchio blush.
The OP outlined his experience well and did close indicating his satisfaction with AW products. From his written demeanor I doubt he approached AW in an ungentlemanly manner but the treatment he received was indicative of a turd house attitude. He may choose another supplier for his next purchase, rightly so, and it makes me question any future personal dealings with them.
I have owned AW products and found them to be no better than other major ARF suppliers despite AW's frequent higher cost. I guess the additional is for bragging rights that some fellows can't live without.
07-11-2011, 08:59 PM
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RE: Wing Failute 50cc Aeroworks Ultimate
David,
I am responding to your PM. To shed even more light on the subject you are getting a one page dissertation, and I hope that my comments are taken as constructive criticism and will help guide you in your capacity as a Moderator of the fourms.
Thanks,
Mike Smith
I am responding to your PM. To shed even more light on the subject you are getting a one page dissertation, and I hope that my comments are taken as constructive criticism and will help guide you in your capacity as a Moderator of the fourms.
Thanks,
Mike Smith
07-13-2011, 09:50 AM
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RE: Wing Failute 50cc Aeroworks Ultimate
ORIGINAL: ExperimentalAviator
David,
I do take offense to your post and I believe that you made your opening statement to cover your negative comments. I’m tired of people coming onto these forums and not fully reading the OP’s letter, or not remembering what they read, then making derogatory statements. You could have asked Frank some specific questions about his experience with the Ultimate, on this Forum or in private, before making your negatively biased comments. You stated, “I just hate to see an above average company get a black eye without hearing all the facts.” David, how much of an explanation do you want so that YOU feel that YOU have all the facts? Would a two page dissertation make you happy? Frank clearly laid out the facts in several paragraphs, and closed his comments with, “this post is not about Aeroworks warrant but rather a ''heads up'' on watching those wings and consider carefully before you buy the Ultimate..”
To anyone else that might have concerns about their Aeroworks 50cc Ultimate:
I have known Frank Baity for many years and Frank is the utmost professional. Frank’s comments about his Ultimate were to warn current and future Ultimate owners to look out for potential problems with the upper wing jont, and as a side note to let Ultimate owners know that he, Frank, felt that Aeroworks did not seem to believe his comments about possible issues with the airframe. Aeroworks response to Frank was the typical, “you must have left some bolts out or loose.” I understand that Aeroworks get phone calls all the time with people making false claims and they, Aeroworks, have to try and fend them off. But, in this case, Frank has a legitimate claim to poor workmanship on his Ultimate. As to what would be fair compensation for the loss of the airframe, that’s not for me to decide.
Frank has purchased several Aeroworks models over the past several years and currently fly’s the AW 50cc Extra 260 for IMAC style acro. Frank closed his letter by clearly stating, “I have several other Aeroworks mono planes and love them.” Frank speaks highly of AW’s products, as well do I, but in this case Frank is highly disappointed in the outcome of his AW 50cc Ultimate and in the way that Kim treated him.
FYI - Frank recently retired as a Sales Account Executive from a Fortune 500 aviation company, is an A&P mechanic, full scale pilot, an avid R/C modeler (addicted would better describe his passion for R/C), has flown Pattern for well over 35 years, has flown R/C helicopter since the GMP Cricket days, has built more models from a box of wood or from plans than anyone and their two buddies has extremities to count on, etc, etc, etc, the list goes on.
Yes Frank is a friend, but I would not defend his character if it was not deserved.
Mike Smith
David,
I do take offense to your post and I believe that you made your opening statement to cover your negative comments. I’m tired of people coming onto these forums and not fully reading the OP’s letter, or not remembering what they read, then making derogatory statements. You could have asked Frank some specific questions about his experience with the Ultimate, on this Forum or in private, before making your negatively biased comments. You stated, “I just hate to see an above average company get a black eye without hearing all the facts.” David, how much of an explanation do you want so that YOU feel that YOU have all the facts? Would a two page dissertation make you happy? Frank clearly laid out the facts in several paragraphs, and closed his comments with, “this post is not about Aeroworks warrant but rather a ''heads up'' on watching those wings and consider carefully before you buy the Ultimate..”
To anyone else that might have concerns about their Aeroworks 50cc Ultimate:
I have known Frank Baity for many years and Frank is the utmost professional. Frank’s comments about his Ultimate were to warn current and future Ultimate owners to look out for potential problems with the upper wing jont, and as a side note to let Ultimate owners know that he, Frank, felt that Aeroworks did not seem to believe his comments about possible issues with the airframe. Aeroworks response to Frank was the typical, “you must have left some bolts out or loose.” I understand that Aeroworks get phone calls all the time with people making false claims and they, Aeroworks, have to try and fend them off. But, in this case, Frank has a legitimate claim to poor workmanship on his Ultimate. As to what would be fair compensation for the loss of the airframe, that’s not for me to decide.
Frank has purchased several Aeroworks models over the past several years and currently fly’s the AW 50cc Extra 260 for IMAC style acro. Frank closed his letter by clearly stating, “I have several other Aeroworks mono planes and love them.” Frank speaks highly of AW’s products, as well do I, but in this case Frank is highly disappointed in the outcome of his AW 50cc Ultimate and in the way that Kim treated him.
FYI - Frank recently retired as a Sales Account Executive from a Fortune 500 aviation company, is an A&P mechanic, full scale pilot, an avid R/C modeler (addicted would better describe his passion for R/C), has flown Pattern for well over 35 years, has flown R/C helicopter since the GMP Cricket days, has built more models from a box of wood or from plans than anyone and their two buddies has extremities to count on, etc, etc, etc, the list goes on.
Yes Frank is a friend, but I would not defend his character if it was not deserved.
Mike Smith
The OP explained his position very well and AeroWorks' crappy response. Your biography is a fine tribute to your friend but the fact is his hobby credentials are not deserving of special treatment over any first time Aeroworks buyer or hobby newbie for that matter.
Aeroworks is the villain in this matter, not the moderator nor anyone offering an opinion.
The OP's thorough, well explained comments may have changed a few minds away from Aeroworks' products and service. His point is well made in a considerate manner unlike many of the lopsided ego riddled rants seen on RCU.
