JohnVH

My Feedback: (38)

Thanks Ward, thats Kens bird, Im not sure what it is, but I think its a fiberglass one, Im sure he will chime in to answer the questions.

Richard D Bahmann aka/Wrongway

My Feedback: (42)

How about one of these. The price is right and with lightened backplate about 3.5 to 3.75 oz. for the 3 1/2 inch spinner in fiberglass.

http://www.espritmodel.com/index.asp...OD&ProdID=4628

Ken-h

My Feedback: (3)

rdb,

Yes, thats the same spinner I am using for mine as seen in the photo's. Those are No-limtz spinners and I use them on all my airplanes. Hey John, where's that photo with the rooster tail? That has got to be my favorite one. Winter time around here does not stop us.

Hope you guys enjoy the planes, I drill on mine! I've dirt napped mine once this spring and it held up great. I am trying not to do that again.

Ken

JohnVH

My Feedback: (38)

extra surfin

madman75

Any one have trouble getting the wing tube in the sockets in the fuse and wings? I can't get mine to go at all. I'm afraid I'll get it stuck. Any ideas on how to get it to go?

JohnVH

My Feedback: (38)

Look around the root of the wing where the tube is, make sure no extra glue got into the inside of the tube there, if there is a little cleaning up of that will take care of it. Or Ive heard of some using baby powder I think to make it slide a bit easier.

madman75

I have looked at the sockets. Nothing. The tube will go in maybe 2" in the wings or fuse and then gets super tight. If I twist the tube to try to get in more it squeaks. I'm worried I may get it stuck.

JohnVH

My Feedback: (38)

is that onto the next in rib? on my early edge model I did a little filing onto the cardboard tube to make it fit easy with a rat tail file. I dont think you want to sand that carbon tube, keep that strong. Im sure Ken will chime in eventually with some info, he has dealt with alot more of the models than I have.

Flyfalcons

Yeah plus carbon dust is just nasty. I'd try some baby powder before doing anything else. My wing tube on my Edge fits pretty tight in one of the wings, but a little baby powder does help.

madman75

Got an email from Ken, he thinks the tube is oversized and is sending a new one. I hope that is the fix. I can't see anything wrong with the tube sockets.

BAS

My Feedback: (28)

madman , how is the covering and quality otherwise. ??

madman75

The covering isn't very good. A lot of wrinkles and not overlapped very far. I've got a few places where the wood is showing at the seams. The curved areas of the covering aren't cut very smooth. It looks like the person who did the covering was learning to do it. I'm tossing all the hardware. The pins in the hinges aren't peened very well. The control horns are too loose for my liking. The balls will pop out of the ball links. One of the blind nuts for the landing gear was the wrong size for the screw. I'm tossing the wheels and axles. the axles aren't the standard 3/16" axles so they won't work with any other wheels. I'm going to order the hardware from TBM when I figure out what I need. I wouldn't pay the regular price for it. It ain't worth the effort to send it back. If I run into any more problems, I might just go off on it and use it for fire wood. If I ever get it done, I hope it flies good because it sure ain't the best looking ARF I've seen.
I can't figure where to mount the RX and ignition switches. There's no wood to mount them. I guess I'll have to glue in some wood in places to mount them. The fuse has a bunch of lightening holes so there's just no wood for the switches.
It seems that planes I have more than the normal problem with have some kind of bad omen. They just don't last very long. Must be some kind of mental block.

SU-13

My Feedback: (1)

i had that same problem with the edge(with the wing tue being tight. what i did is try and get it in as far as i can, and just kept turning it to wear it in a little, pulled it back out, put lots of baby powder on it, but it back in the wing and turned it some more. since then its been real good, and been getting easier and easier to put on.



harv

The Internet Killer

Damn, sounds like you got the first one off the assembly line from a Monday morning (hung over and no supervisor).

I'm planning on getting one when I get paid for this job I'm working on.

Hope you get yours sorted out.

macanaw

My Feedback: (30)

Dear god. It sounds to me like you have been unhappy with the plane before you even got it. My PAU was the exact opposite of what you are stating. The axels and wheels are standard dubro so I'm not sure why you think they won't work on anything else, wrinkles are just a part of climate, altitude and temperature change with ANY plane, the hinges are dubro and PAU hardly has anything to do with that, Switches are a matter of preference and setup for mounting position, whats the big deal in glueing in a piece of wood where you want to mount it.........

I guess what bothers me is that I have looked at many of your posts and you bash everything, you even started bashing this plane before you got it. No offense but it does not bode well for your credibility when this is your standard vomiting.

Just my opinion though.

Richard D Bahmann aka/Wrongway

My Feedback: (42)

I inspected the covering on mine today. It is near flawless. Nice plane.

RDB

madman75

This is in reply to macanaw. I call 'em like I see 'em. I don't know who the hell you are but I don't think you know what you're talking about. I have been in RC for over 20 years so I know what I'm talking about.
BAS ask me about the plane and I told him my observations. Also, if you find the original build thread, there was some issues with the covering also. I'm not talking wrinkles that will come out with heat, I'm talking the kind of wrinkles you get when the covering gets stuck together. I checked the axles on standard wheels and the axles are bigger than 3/16". The wheels aren't Dubro, the axles aren't Dubro and the hinges aren't Dubro.
Show me where I bashed the plane before I got it. I never saw one before. I had real concerns that any normal person would have when spending money on something they haven't seen before.
Show where I bash everything. I call 'em like I see 'em. Too bad it ain't what everyone wants to here.
I covered and finished an Aeroworks YAK54 50cc and it was great. Yes I got an ARC and covered it myself. I'm not the best at covering but my YAK looks pretty damn good. Here's the link. Check it out yourself.
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_4837521/tm.htm
I'm going to take some pictures of it to show you. The covering might be fine for you but someone else might not like it. I have a few other ARF's and the covering job on them is nearly flawless.
Herve emailed me and offered a refund. I never said anywhere I wanted a refund, I just like to be able to get it together. I told him to send me a wing tube and if that didn't fit we would discuss it more. I'm not going to use hardware I feel is up to what I feel is safe to use.
I've based my standards on other planes I've built and have helped build so my standards may be a little high. The Aeroworks was a dream to build and complete. I helped a friend put together a Kangke WACO and the covering and assembly was great. I helped him complete an Aerotech Pitts Python and it went together great also. So this isn't my first rodeo.
The only thing that makes me vomit is jerks that think their ***** don't stink or think they know what they're talking about.
I'll post some pictures and hope the detail is good enough to show some of the flaws in the covering.

madman75

Let me try this again. It seems the moderator didn't like some of the words I used.
This is in reply to macanaw.
I don't like the personal attack. No where did I say I was unhappy before I got it. Never saw one to comment on. I was concerned about issues considering the money I was going to spend. I read in the original build thread there were some issues with the covering along with some other things. Why don't you go and read it for yourself before you shoot off at the mouth. You make me want to vomit with that greater than thou attitude.
I checked the axles and wheels. They are not Dubro. The axles are larger than 3/16". 3/16" is .1875 not .200 like the axles supplied. The wrinkles are not what can be removed with a heat gun or iron. The wrinkles are what you get when the covering sticks together. If the hinges are Dubro, then their quality is junk. No where on Dubro's site did I find hinges like the Robart hinge point hinges. I'm not going to use hardware that I feel may fail and could cause damage or injury. Not worth it.
Show me where I bashed this plane before I got it. Show me where I bash everything. I call 'em like I see 'em. If you can't stand the truth you don't have to read it.
I don't know who you are but it seems to me you don't have a clue what you're talking about. I've been in this hobby for over 20 years and have built numerous kits, scratch built and a few ARF's. I have covered many planes over the years. I'm not the best but I feel my covering jobs look pretty good. I would expect this plane to have a pretty good covering job too. I have two ARF's that the cover job are pretty much flawless and went together wonderful. I have an Aeroworks YAK 54 50cc that I covered and finished. Yes, I got the ARC version and did it myself so I say I know how to cover a big one like this.Here's the link. Didn't seem to bash it.
http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_4837521/tm.htm
Many years ago I designed and built a plane with an 82 1/2" one piece wing powered by a Quadra 35 that weighed 14 lbs. Pretty good in those days.
I helped a friend put together a Kangke WACO and an Aerotech Pitts Python. Both had great covering jobs and went together great. So this ain't my first rodeo. Didn't bash them
BAS wanted to know my opinions and I told him. I'm not going to bite my tongue and say everything is fine to pacify people like you.This way he can buy it knowing the issues I had. That's only fair to him and others. If you don't like what I said TOUGH. I read the same problems and comments and still bought it anyway hoping it was just a fluke.
You know what makes me vomit is people that think they know what they're talking about just to show people how much they think they know but don't have a clue.
I can say that there is some parts that are covered very well. The rudder, ailerons, elevator and hor. stabs are done well but the fuse and wings could be better. I have fixed most of the covering the best it can be done. It looks a lot better. Since you don't want the truth I won't tell you the other things I had to fix because I might be accused of bashing.
I don't know about your credibility since you haven't said a thing about your experience. So your comments don't bode well with me.
After building the Aeroworks, Kangke and Aerotech, maybe my expectations were high since this is what I had to set my standards to.
When I stated about where to mount the switches, I was looking for someone to state how they did it on theirs. Maybe there was something I was missing. Again I didn't like your attitude.
Herve the owner emailed me and offered a full refund. I never stated that I wanted a full refund. I just want things to fit and go together without fixing things. Is this to much to ask for? This is supposed to be an ARF not an ARFAF(almost ready to fly after fixing).
Maybe PAU has very good quality planes, I can't say for sure. I know that Herve contacted me about a refund but didn't discuss the problems I reported. He should use this as a tool to help with the quality control of his products.
I hope this passes the moderators scrutiny.

madman75

Here's some pictures of the covering. If you can't tell by the pictures, PM me and I'll explain them. I won't explain them in the thread.

madman75

More.

bajaloya

Well, I got the same...and for the original price. The ARF is in my closet, not willing to put it together. When I have complaint about the broken cowl, Herve said that it was broken on the carrier to Vzla. How do I know it was that way? AND WHY should I HAVE to trust that? Bad bussines for me, I am too far away, should not be that way. He just sent me the price for a new cowl and the price for shipping. Since then, the plane is in my closet. I feel truly dissapointed. Truly. Want to get a rid of it as well. Herve you are invited to come here and comment on this. I still have the e mail you sent me.

islandflyer

bajaloya:

We shipped your plane to a Miami address and did not ship any plane to Venezuela, and therefore cannot assume the responsibility of any shipping damage that occurred during this transportation. If we were informed that the cowl was damaged in Miami, we would have promptly sent a new one. However, you did don contact us until you got the plane in Venezuela. We have had some shipping damage issues, and took care of all of the ones we were informed of. If someone decides to re-ship one of our planes to another destination, it is clear this shipping is done under your own responsibility.
In fact, Madman75 received the Extra with a cowl that was broken in shipping, and within less than an hour of being informed of it, we let him know that a new one was being sent to him.

The issues regarding Madman75 and his are of a very different nature, and we will not discuss them on a public forum, but I will communicate with him privately.

I will only mention here that the stock hardware supplied with the kit, which Madman75 has questioned in terms of safety, has been used on our own planes for well over two years, and has been praised by many. We have logged hundreds of flights with a lot of hard 3D flying, and have never had an issue. For the planes using the aluminum screws through the gold aluminum pushrod connector, both pieces being made of soft metal often leads to a little play: this was easily solved with a couple of drops of thin CA in the thread, and the controls have remained solid since.
In fact, the same hardware is being used on both our 43% and 36% prototypes which are being flown extensively. The only difference with the lager planes is that we use steel bolts instead of aluminum, and we use the heavy duty ball links.

Finally, I MUST INFORM YOU THAT ALL SHIPPING IS BEING DEALYED: Ken’s father has just passed away, and he is going out of town for a few days.

astrohog

My Feedback: (1)

In response to Madman75:

This thread (and others like it) really get my blood pressure rising. I believe these on-line forums are a HUGE benefit to our hobby. They are a great place to learn more, meet new people, share new ideas and technologies as well as our own, individual experience. These forums have been very instrumental in the growth of our hobby in the last few years, and give us (the consumers) and the manufacturers an open forum to discuss all aspects of our hobby. WHAT A GREAT THING!!! I have a huge amount of respect for these forums, and believe that we (all members and users of the forums) carry a HUGE responsibility for what we post here! Many of the Companies that advertise and sell products to modelers are cottage-industry type businesses that have evolved through the individual passions and love of this hobby and thrive or die by the feedback provided in these forums! Many of the new innovations in this hobby are created only after countless hours of R&D by each individual business owner in his/her search for that perfect product whether it is an engine, flight box, transmitter tray, new design, etc, etc. These companies (especially the smaller ones) are trying very hard to provide us with a quality product at a price point that that will allow him to put food on the table and allow us to afford it and still feed OURSELVES!!(business 101, law of supply and demand).

If you will look at my posting history (here and other popular forums), you will see that I try very hard to remain neutral, and speak ONLY to my first-hand experience.

DO NOT MISUNDERSTAND THE INTENT OF MY REPLY!!! I HAVE NEVER, NOR WILL I EVER TAKE PERSONAL STABS AT PEOPLE HERE ON THE FORUMS!!!

With that being said, I could not refrain from posting my opinion here any longer.



A little history about me:

- Modeler for 15 years (gas,glow,electric,combat,kits,scratch,ARF)

- active R/C forum member for many years (RCU AND others...I will not mention out of respect to RCU)

- Successfully employed as an outside sales rep for MANY years (I am in industrial sales NOT anything R/C related (you will see relevance later in post)).

- have bought, built and flown 2 PAU airframes, and taken the sticks of each and every one of their models (EXCEPT the new 36% Edge).

- have been very active in 50 cc and up gas 3D scene in the last few years, travelling to many large-scale fly-ins (out of town, out of state AND out of country).



Before I added this reply to this thread, I took the time to review ALL of Madman's posts here @ RCU as well as on other forums and found them to be MOSTLY as negative and OPINIONATED as this one is. To be fair, there were a couple threads that did not take a wrong turn and remained fairly positive and useful!!


Here are some things I have observed regarding Madman75 and his post/s:

- has been in the hobby for 20+ years, but does not know how to laterally balance a model? [link]http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_6344668/anchors_6348161/mpage_1/key_/anchor/tm.htm#6348161[/link]


- asks a question, receives an answer (kind of..) from a REPRESENTATIVE of the company if the item in question and disregards the reply!

[link]http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_6491535/anchors_6491535/mpage_1/key_/anchor/tm.htm#6491535[/link]


- Then there's this thread where it takes a very negative turn, the others on the thread point it out and Madman takes OFFENSE and FEELS ATTACKED, much like he did by Macanaw, who NEVER attacked him, only stated his observations of his post!!

[link]http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_4587158/anchors_5971015/mpage_37/key_/anchor/tm.htm#5971015[/link]


- and yet another thread that has a very combative feel to it! This is also the second thread where he is talking THIRD party ( my buddy did this...they said that)

[link]http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_5880006/anchors_5883392/mpage_1/key_/anchor/tm.htm#5883392[/link]


- and here is a quote from another post that is VERY negative and combative AND AGAIN to an event he was NOT personally involved in!!

here is the link to that thread: [link]http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_5110722/anchors_5297929/mpage_1/key_/anchor/tm.htm#5297929[/link]



- and then there's this thread where it seems you had some of the same issues with an ARF, but didn't seem to be a big deal??? [link]http://www.rcuniverse.com/forum/m_4837521/anchors_4837521/mpage_1/key_/anchor/tm.htm#4837521[/link]

- and here is where I believe Macanaw saw where you were gonna be unhappy with your kit before you even got it: AND this is after reading a 32 page build thread on this airplane!!!! How can you justify this?


To sum up my post:

I just feel it is really important for us all to make up our OWN minds and come to our OWN conclusions about things and we have a responsibility to our fellow forum members to fairly represent our own OPINIONS and to QUALIFY and QUANTIFY those opinions with as much FACT as possible!!!

I also believe it is WRONG for anyone to be able to post such negativity, without first giving the Company a chance to rectify the situation FIRST!! (this is where my profession comes in) As a sales rep. who sells many other MFGRs products, I have to take occasional complaints about some of the items I sell. THIS HAPPENS TODAY!!! MASS PRODUCTION. Occasional problems will NEVER go away!! As members of our society, we have the OBLIGATION to handle ourselves in a PROFESSIONAL manner and allow people to rectify the situation BEFORE we cause them any potential harm!!

Madman, sounds like you feel you got a bad deal on your Extra. That is too bad, I know how excited I get when I order a new toy and anticipate it's arrival! (and how disppointing it can be if there is an issue!).

It also sounds like the owner of PAU offered to refund your money and correct the situation! BUT THAT WAS NOT GOOD ENOUGH!????

Remember, these planes are produced overseas......If the covering comes bad, does it make sense to ship it back overseas, fix the covering, and send it back?? ( I believe that is what you were inferring??) If I buy a product and am not pleased with it, I would be ECSTATIC (these days) to have the company OFFER to refund my money!! I would NOT EVEN THINK about badgering them into re-engineering or changing it to suit MY liking!!

If you do not take Herve up on his offer, I have to assume that you still feel that you got a fair deal and think that you owe it to the forum to post that!!

PLLEEAASSEE people, let's keep this a positive place for us all to enjoy!!

There will always be differences of opinions and that is great!!! (what makes our Country the BEST in the World, no?), but let's do it in a fair, unbiased, civil manner here in our little Universe!!!

stepping off of my podium now!!

Regards,

Astrohog

bajaloya

I was expecting this. Facts: You are not sure if the cowl broke before it got to Miami and I am not sure if it broke on the way here. But, I am sure that the 600 plus USA dollars I sent you were good, otherwise you should had complaint. There is not a single line in your site mentioning your company shipping policy. I dont feel like I am taking advantaje of anything, you should have replaced the cowl or at least give me a discount in the new one. It seems to me that 48 dollars after paying 630 plus was too much.THANKS anyway.

BAS

My Feedback: (28)

Pictures dont lie that covering i observed that Madman posted were the worst covering i have ever seen on a arf. I have ordered around 30 in the last few years by SD models, Aeroworks , Hangar nine and Wildhare. If i got a plane with quality like that i would be sending it back. Not in defense of Madman but i am glad i cancelled my order on this bird. I will stick to the companies that are consistent on quality .