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  1. #1

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    A123 Info Page is up

    For those looking to get more information on A123 battery packs, I put an A123 info page up just for quick reference. If you have any other questions or think I should add something, please feel free to post it here or contact me via the website.

    http://www.sincityjets.com/batteries/a123info.html

  2. #2

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    RE: A123 Info Page is up

    Heat shrink tubes for making our own packs.
    Racing silver solder.
    HD servo leads. Or kits to make yer own.
    A spot on the flight line for the big Vegas 3D event.
    20ga silicone twisted wire.
    Banana plugs for those Dapters.
    Couple hours of 3D learnin from Bender.
    a123 1100 packs.
    More Joe and Moriah photo shoots.

    I don't want much but a all in one shop
    I didn\'\'\'\'t put the bullet in the fire and you quit talking about my mother! \"Cosby, Shop Class, 1968 or so\"

  3. #3

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    RE: A123 Info Page is up

    I would expect that from someone from Altaville

    As far as the leads for the Dapter, use deans connectors, and we are starting to bring in the 1100's. 2 out of 9 isn't bad.

  4. #4
    Bob_S's Avatar
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    RE: A123 Info Page is up

    "They offer a 10 year shelf life and 1000+ cycles, compared to ~200 cycles with Lipo's." This only applies if you charge at 10C. Other than that it looks great!
    Bob S
    Austin, Tx

  5. #5

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    RE: A123 Info Page is up

    Bob, I'm not sure what you meant by it only applies if you charge it at 10C. You would get 1 cycle from a lipo if you charged it at 10C.

    Did you mean you could get MORE life from the A123 if you charged it lower than 10C?

    Sorry for the confusion.

  6. #6
    yarom's Avatar
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    RE: A123 Info Page is up


    I started using that Dapter on my 2300 and 110 packs. Works like a champ. Just read the instructions.

    I am still quite unclear how I should setup my Triton or my Ice for chrging with the dapter.

    This is all while waiting for the new TP charger that is A123 compatible...

  7. #7

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    RE: A123 Info Page is up

    I just did a charge on a Acucycle elite and a Dapter. Plug the dapter to the battery, Press the button as per instructions, Start the charge in Lipo 7.4v, Crank up the amps to max (2A in this case), Hang around about 10 minutes and done. Only problem is the Dapter cuts off and the charger starts the warning sounds from being cut off too soon. Triton should be the same. Just set it for lipo 7.4v.

    Tried the Celpro charger out too. It's sweet, preset for a123 auto charge. Plug in a pack and it takes off and gets er done, goes into balance mode at the end.
    I didn\'\'\'\'t put the bullet in the fire and you quit talking about my mother! \"Cosby, Shop Class, 1968 or so\"

  8. #8

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    RE: A123 Info Page is up

    I SENT YOU A PM ABOUT THESE BATTERIE'S, DIAL ME IN SOME INFO!

    3DAP

  9. #9
    Bob_S's Avatar
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    RE: A123 Info Page is up


    ORIGINAL: SinCityJets

    Bob, I'm not sure what you meant by it only applies if you charge it at 10C. You would get 1 cycle from a lipo if you charged it at 10C.

    Did you mean you could get MORE life from the A123 if you charged it lower than 10C?

    Sorry for the confusion.
    Actually I need a calculator. lol I was thinking a 10c charge was 2a.

    Nevermind!
    Bob S
    Austin, Tx

  10. #10
    Scoubidou's Avatar
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    RE: A123 Info Page is up

    Should we put 1 Amp load on the A123 to measure the voltage?
    Seneca Engineering
    http://www.seneca.ca/

  11. #11
    Bob_S's Avatar
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    RE: A123 Info Page is up


    ORIGINAL: Scoubidou

    Should we put 1 Amp load on the A123 to measure the voltage?
    Not much point in doing that. The voltage looks pretty much the same over the entire discharge band. This means you can't tell the difference between a pack that is discharged 5% and one that is discharged 95%. This is the downside to the A123 cells, you can't inspect them and determine if they are ready to fly or not.
    Bob S
    Austin, Tx

  12. #12

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    RE: A123 Info Page is up

    Putting a load on to learn their habits should be done as you charge and fly them for the first few times. I only have a general knowledge from reading posts here. I expected first flight to pull the bat. to 6.7v or so, it did. 2nd flight showed 6.5v and third was 6.3. Ran out of daylight but thats where I would of done a quick charge. Graphs show a rapid drop off of useable energy at around 6 to 6.1 volt and I would want to test that theorie with a load checker.
    I didn\'\'\'\'t put the bullet in the fire and you quit talking about my mother! \"Cosby, Shop Class, 1968 or so\"

  13. #13

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    RE: A123 Info Page is up

    So when's the big Vegas event? You going, Guy? If so let me know, I'm open for the next 3 months. We'll fly out and rent a car. I'd like to see and hear more about the A123 batts, especially how they hold up in temps from 0 to -15c.
    Never lie, and never minimize or gloss. Tell it like it is and let the pieces fall where they may. The truth always wins.

  14. #14
    AEROSHELDON's Avatar
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    RE: A123 Info Page is up

    would a Dapter work with an Ion Cube?
    Have fun and play nice!

  15. #15
    Scoubidou's Avatar
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    RE: A123 Info Page is up

    would a Dapter work with an Ion Cube?
    Dont' wait your money on a dapter if you already have the Ion cube. You could buy a new charging ports for the A123 and install them into the Ioncube. Fromeco is not advertising yet but it's in stock and about 30$.
    Daniel
    Seneca Engineering
    http://www.seneca.ca/

  16. #16

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    RE: A123 Info Page is up


    ORIGINAL: AEROSHELDON

    would a Dapter work with an Ion Cube?
    A dapter would not work on the cube. Like Scooby says, if they have come out with an A123 capable adapter, use that. Personally, I prefer the CellPro 4S.

    As far as the Vegas event, there is an IMAC competition Feb 15-17 that I will be sponsoring, and will be present at.

    As far as checking them "under load," it is not very useful for determining left over energy. Fully charge your batteries, fly 2-3 times, charge the batteries again and determine what your avaerage Mah per flight is. These 2300 Mah cells will actually last longer than a 2300 lipo or nimh pack.......how can that be?? 2300mah is 2300 mah! Not true. As the voltage of the pack decreases, the Amperage draw increases.....this means you draw more Amps from a pack as the voltage decreases; kind of like how your gas gauge on your car goes down faster on the last half of the tank (this is obviously for a different reason).

    Since the A123 packs stay at about the same voltage for their duration, the Amp load does not significantly increase near the end of the cycle, whereby you actually get a little longer time with an A123 pack. Now, with that being said, you will not get a huge amount of more time, I simply make this illustration to show you that a 2300 Mah pack will last just as long, if not longer than any other chemistry battery. Don't be scared of the cliff dive at the end of the pack's cycle, just be familiar with how many Mah your plane uses per flight.

    Using a charger that tells you how many Mah you put back in in CRUCIAL!

  17. #17
    Bob Pastorello's Avatar
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    RE: A123 Info Page is up

    I'm only chiming in here to support the suggestions about KNOWING what your airborne system uses out of your battery pack. I've used A123, 2300's since early 2007 doing my own packs. In all three airplanes, 50cc class, running 5 Hitec 5955TG's, not 3D flight, my typical current usage per 10 minute flight has averaged around 260ma. That is actual measured use, based on immediately flying a fully-charged pack for 3, ten minute normal flights, then recharging with the FMA CellPro 4S, letting it go all the way through full balance mode to 100%, and reading the milliamps that it put in.

    I've checked this on all three setups, and the current usage is very consistent for my applications.

    So, what I do is take my average, add a safety margin factor (I use 25% because I'm conservative), and figure a 10 minute flight to actually "use" 325mah.....so a fully charged pack means definitely a "fly all day" setup for me.

    As others have said, these are just outstanding innovation in our airplanes, and I converted everything, ignitions included, to A123 technology and have not looked back.

    The two DEFINITE "caveats" to using them;
    1. KNOW pretty accurately what your airborne radio system typically uses for YOUR average flight.
    2. ONLY use a charger that tells you exactly how many ma have been put back in it.

    P.S. - Great A123 info page, SinCityJets...
    "I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it." - George Bernard Shaw

  18. #18

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    RE: A123 Info Page is up


    I bought the FMA Cellpro 4S charger and five node/charging harnesses and assembled
    them myself. I started with the 10 cell Dewalt power supply to make the 5 packs. The
    completion time for one 2 cell pack was about an hour. I did step by step checks and
    charged the pack with the Cell pro charger. This charger has a setting designed specifically
    for the A123 batteries. It charges at 4 amps, beeps once at 98 % of capicity and beeps
    again when cells are fully charged. The full voltage is 7.20, which also can be seen on another
    screen at each pack in a 2 cell pack reading 3.60 volts. After installing into the two airplanes,
    the voltage read on a Hanger 9 meter thru the Smart Fly heavy duty switches is 6.9 volts. The
    Hanger 9 meter is 1 amp loaded,I believe.
    What I found interesting was the wires on the Charge/Balance Nodes. They are 20 gage,
    and I felt no heat on them or the batteries during charge. I have to wonder, if the model pulls
    4 amps or less while doing a snap roll, then would 18, 16 or 14 gage that some profess to be
    necessary, actually be necessary? 30%ers with 5 Hi-Tech 5955s, maybe. Those of you who
    have or plan to have load meters might check this for us and let us know results.
    Because of rainy weather for the rest of the week, I will not be able to fly. The upside of this
    is that I will be able to measure the voltage daily to see if there is any leakage. The first few flights
    and measurements will be interesting, and, for me, nerve racking. Having heard nothing but good
    about these batteries, I am willing to take the risk.

    Gerald

    PS The Cellpro 4S charger will tell you how much capacity was put back into the battery after the
    charging.

  19. #19

    RE: A123 Info Page is up

    Guys don't forget that the Thunderpower 1010C now comes with A123 fimware loaded and if you already have one it can be updated.

    I use the 1010C on my 2 cell A123's and don't bother with the balance, I can charge up to 10 amps and it tells how many mAh were put back in.

    Richard
    I Am WrongWayRC

  20. #20
    yarom's Avatar
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    RE: A123 Info Page is up


    I am waiting for their new smaller/cheaper charger. My LHS has orders for a hundred and I'm one of them.

  21. #21

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    RE: A123 Info Page is up

    Yarom,

    I have to tell you, the CellPro is a pretty great charger, and unlike the Thunder Power chargers, it balance charges by PUSHING current to the low cell, as opposed to PULLING current off the high cells. It can make a big difference.

  22. #22

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    RE: A123 Info Page is up

    Yep, the last 10% of charge is balance mode.

    To all installing a123s and are planning on using the Cellpro. You will need to make your side of the fuselage charge jack balance capable for the Cell pro to work without having to remove the canopy to get to the batteries charge lead. The Cellpro will only charge if a balance lead is detected.
    I didn\'\'\'\'t put the bullet in the fire and you quit talking about my mother! \"Cosby, Shop Class, 1968 or so\"

  23. #23

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    RE: A123 Info Page is up


    If the SmartFly BatShare works with the A123 batteries, without being
    overloaded by the excess current possibility of multi-servo-ed models,
    then wouldn't it be a good theing that the Cellpro begins it's charging
    with cells that are already balanced? Seems like a good idea to me.

    Gerald

  24. #24

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    RE: A123 Info Page is up


    If the SmartFly BatShare works with the A123 batteries, without being
    overloaded by the excess current possibility of multi-servo-ed models,
    then wouldn't it be a good thing that the Cellpro begins it's charging
    with cells that are already balanced? Seems like a good idea to me.
    Or any other chargers for that matter?

    Gerald


  25. #25

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    RE: A123 Info Page is up


    ORIGINAL: altavillan

    Yep, the last 10% of charge is balance mode.

    To all installing a123s and are planning on using the Cellpro. You will need to make your side of the fuselage charge jack balance capable for the Cell pro to work without having to remove the canopy to get to the batteries charge lead. The Cellpro will only charge if a balance lead is detected.

    Alta,

    you can actually use a JR charging jack adapter. Many of my customers have me put a JR lead as the balancing connector, and then I make a JR to CellPro balancing connector for use on the charger side.

    This allows you to use a standard JR servo extension to make the balancing lead as long as you want it!


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