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Great Planes 25% Pitts M-12s 3D

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Old 05-21-2010, 11:12 PM
  #176
brwilkins
 
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Default RE: Great Planes 25% Pitts M-12s 3D

I just noticed that there's an update bulletin from Great Planes for this bird. The monokote colors listed in the manual are incorrect.

Product bulletin can be found here: http://manuals.hobbico.com/gpm/gpma1421-tech.pdf


I couldn't wait for a DA-60 (but boy how I want one!) and couldn't make up my mind on any of my other options, so I went with the tried and true DA-50. Got her bolted on today. Maybe maiden next weekend if my muffler and opti-kill shows up this week.
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Old 05-22-2010, 04:28 AM
  #177
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Default RE: Great Planes 25% Pitts M-12s 3D

I'm using a DA-50. I'm still in breakin process, using a Xoar 22x8. My plane wight is 18 lbs. The fact is when I need vertical power, my feeling is that I need a little more power. A friend of mine is building one with a DLE-55, 10% more power then DA and I will test and compare.

By now I can say that the DLE-55 fits better.
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Old 05-24-2010, 01:32 AM
  #178
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Default RE: Great Planes 25% Pitts M-12s 3D

3W has a nice 55cc engine, very lightweight.
BME 58cc very solid
TBM had the ZDZsuper 80cc for 500$[X(] which is a great deal...I didn't buy one
because I wasn't sure if they were going to keep the zdz engine line of not....They ARE...
was too late ....ohh well...

I have wanted a Evolution 80cc
and there 50cc engine is fantastic as well...

Advantage hobby, you can save quite a bit off there engines with the sales they are having...

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Old 05-29-2010, 04:51 PM
  #179
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Default RE: Great Planes 25% Pitts M-12s 3D

Successful maiden.

I maidened mine today, so I thought I'd share my thoughts. I decided to run a brand new DA50. Since I'm just breaking this engine in, I expected it to be a little bit under-powered and it was, but not terribly under-powered. It would hold a hover for a few seconds and then slowly start dropping. Going into a climb from straight and level flight though, vertical was not a problem. I haven't had a chance to weight it yet, but I will.

I highly recommend increasing the suggested low-rates substantially for the elevator. On takeoff, the elevator barely had enough effect to pull it off the ground. The high rate recommendation seems just slightly above what should be the low rate settings. The high/low recommendations for aileron seemed pretty close though although I did back off the low-rate recommendation for the ailerons. It was rolling quite fast with the recommended low rates. High seemed fine.

I followed another poster's advice and installed silicon tubing on the muffler to extend the exhaust down and out of the cowl. I think this may have been a slight design flaw because if you install any wrap-around pitts-style muffler in that large cowl, it's just going to blow exhaust crap all over the inside of the plane. I'm wondering if maybe they should have shortened up the bottom of the cowl a little somehow. No big deal though. A couple of pieces of silicon connector tubing took care of the issue.

When flying, the plane seemed very stable and well-mannered. I flipped the elevator on high rates and slowed it into a nice forward stall. No wing dip whatsoever. I held it there for a long time and it actually just made a nice parachute manuever! I had started it out fairly high of course and held it almost all the way to the ground, just daring it to drop a wing. Nope. Just a nice slow drop nearly straight down. Very cool! In knife-edge, it didn't seem to pull one way or the other, so not much, if any, mixing required there. I thought this was especially cool since I helped a friend of mine with his Aeroworks 50cc Pitts Python last weekend which was pulling toward the belly quite a bit. From a knife-edge perspective, the GP Pitts definitely wins. As with any plane with a big front end, it slows down very quickly when you pull the throttle back. It was a piece of cake to land. Probably the easiest landing airplane in my flock.

The only flying characteristic that I did notice was that it seemed to want to roll a little when I was coming out of turns. It almost seemed like it was out of trim for a few seconds when I would come out of a normal turn. It wasn't anything terrible, but I did notice it.

All in all, I think the plane is a winner. It looks good and flies good. As others have said, it's heavy and putting something a little larger than a 50cc engine might be a good idea although I'm sure mine will hover just fine once I break my DA50 in. My only "beef" still, is the covering. That awful monokote job just looks plane bad. Hopefully GP will try to work on this a little at the factory so that others don't end up with all the wrinkles.
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Old 06-03-2010, 08:08 PM
  #180
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Default RE: Great Planes 25% Pitts M-12s 3D

Does anyone have any idea where to get a wing bag for this plane? WingTote makes a biplane bag, but it's too short. Hobby Pak makes one the right size, but their website says they won't be taking any orders until sometime in July.

I tried putting the wings in a single wing, WingTote bag using towels to keep them apart, but the bellypan on the one wing makes it too fat to fit.

Any ideas?
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Old 06-03-2010, 11:06 PM
  #181
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Default RE: Great Planes 25% Pitts M-12s 3D

aeroworks?
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Old 06-04-2010, 09:01 AM
  #182
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Quote:
ORIGINAL: weezle

aeroworks?

Good idea. Thanks. I just ordered the set for their Pitts Python. The measurements look to be about the same. My only concern might be the belly pan. From the pictures, it looks like their belly pan is a little smaller. I'll post once I receive them and check the fit for the GP Pitts.

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Old 06-04-2010, 09:09 AM
  #183
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Default RE: Great Planes 25% Pitts M-12s 3D

Is anyone having any difficulty with the cowl mounting screws rubbing on the cowl?

I tried using just the screws as per the instructions, but they were vibrating on the cowl pretty good and hogging out the holes. So, I tried using servo grommets in the holes to give it a little buffer. The fiberglass cowl is pretty much cutting through the grommets though. I also looked at trying to use 4-40 bolts through the cowl into blind nuts on the mounting blocks, but to do that was going to require me to have to dremel off the triangle stock that reinforces the mounting blocks. For now, I've just gone back to screws with rubber washers and tightened them as tight as I can. If that continues wearing on the fiberglass cowl, I'll probably go with the Dubro cowl mount system (http://www.shopatron.com/products/pr...999/101.0.1.1?)

Anybody have any other suggestions on cowl mounting?
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Old 06-04-2010, 01:54 PM
  #184
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Default RE: Great Planes 25% Pitts M-12s 3D

Very easy fix.

Screw, then flat washer then a small piece of fuel tubing for nitro (about 1/4 inch long) over the screw then screw the assembly into the hole and problem solved. I do this with all off my cowled engines as well as my canopies. Won't vibrate out or hog the holes out. Very simple and cheap. Just remember do not over tighten the screws, they just need to me snug to allow the fuel line to absorb the vibrations from the engine.

Neil.
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Old 06-04-2010, 02:44 PM
  #185
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Default RE: Great Planes 25% Pitts M-12s 3D


Quote:
ORIGINAL: brwilkins

Is anyone having any difficulty with the cowl mounting screws rubbing on the cowl?

I tried using just the screws as per the instructions, but they were vibrating on the cowl pretty good and hogging out the holes. So, I tried using servo grommets in the holes to give it a little buffer. The fiberglass cowl is pretty much cutting through the grommets though. I also looked at trying to use 4-40 bolts through the cowl into blind nuts on the mounting blocks, but to do that was going to require me to have to dremel off the triangle stock that reinforces the mounting blocks. For now, I've just gone back to screws with rubber washers and tightened them as tight as I can. If that continues wearing on the fiberglass cowl, I'll probably go with the Dubro cowl mount system (http://www.shopatron.com/products/pr...999/101.0.1.1?)

Anybody have any other suggestions on cowl mounting?
See on my construction page here: http://bliksemseplek.com/m12.html

About half-way down there is a picture of how I use 10-24 nylon bolts for the cowl. Very easy to do. Knock out the blind nuts, run a tap through the wood - I use a rechargeable drill. soak the thread with thin CA. When cured run the tap through again.

I have been using this method on all my gas powered aircraft cowls and canopies. The holes never wallow out and the screws don't back out.

Bliksem


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Old 06-04-2010, 03:21 PM
  #186
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Default RE: Great Planes 25% Pitts M-12s 3D

I just weighed mine. 18.8 lbs.

My setup is as follows:

DA-50R w/ 22/8 prop
Spektrum AR9100 RX
2 LIFE 2S packs on RX, 1 LIFE 2S pack on ignition
Hyperion digital/metal servos

I was going to post pictures but this website only seems to give me javascript errors, so no luck there.
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Old 06-04-2010, 11:32 PM
  #187
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Default RE: Great Planes 25% Pitts M-12s 3D

you could try Neoprene Bonded Washers on your cowl.
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Old 06-05-2010, 01:51 AM
  #188
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Default RE: Great Planes 25% Pitts M-12s 3D


Quote:
ORIGINAL: weezle

you could try on your cowl.
YEs, and make sure to add a small lock washer ontop of the Neoprene Bonded Washers.
It is the way Aeroworks does thers, and I believe it works well...

For my cowls, I either do the fuel tubing deal, and to even add less chance of a screw vibrating
out, is to use a yeall sylavan, or simular Nyrod glued into a drilled hole....
You can then use the DUbro hex servo screws and use the neoprene or the fuel tubing deal...

This is lighweight, and very reliable....
I highly recomend it....
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Old 06-05-2010, 01:55 AM
  #189
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Default RE: Great Planes 25% Pitts M-12s 3D


Quote:
ORIGINAL: brwilkins

I followed another poster's advice and installed silicon tubing on the muffler to extend the exhaust down and out of the cowl. I think this may have been a slight design flaw because if you install any wrap-around pitts-style muffler in that large cowl, it's just going to blow exhaust crap all over the inside of the plane. I'm wondering if maybe they should have shortened up the bottom of the cowl a little somehow. No big deal though. A couple of pieces of silicon connector tubing took care of the issue.


You could make use thing painted balsa, and make a dam, that helps exit hot air and oils....
Like doing engine baffeling, only make a box around the mufflers, and cowl so it has no place to
go except out....
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Old 06-15-2010, 08:03 AM
  #190
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Default RE: Great Planes 25% Pitts M-12s 3D

Wing Bags


I got the wing bags from Aeroworks (the ones for their Pitts Python). The top wing bag fits perfect. The bottom wing bag is fine length-wise, but not quite thick enough in the middle where the belly pan is. It will just barely stretch over the belly pan. There's also a pocket on one of the wing bags. The cabanes will fit in there length-wise, but the edges do stick up a little on the ends. It has a velcro closure, so that keeps the cabanes in, no problem.
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Old 06-26-2010, 08:18 AM
  #191
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Default RE: Great Planes 25% Pitts M-12s 3D

Just received my GP m-12 a few days ago and what a great ARF it is! I've been reading some of your post about the aircraft and payed close attention to what you all have said. Just out of curiosity did anyone have to shorten the axles? I had to shorten mine about 1/2" so the wheel pants could fit.
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Old 06-26-2010, 02:39 PM
  #192
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Default RE: Great Planes 25% Pitts M-12s 3D

I cut my axles flush with the wheel collar and did not install the wheel pants. I fly off of grass and wheel pants usually only last me a few flights. However, to make it look a little better, I ordered new wheels with aluminum hubs and rubber tires from TBM. I think these look pretty nice and use the same axles. http://www.troybuiltmodels.com/items/TBMTIRES3.5.html

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Old 07-05-2010, 06:22 AM
  #193
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Default RE: Great Planes 25% Pitts M-12s 3D

I've been reading up on all the concerns with the weight of this bird and as of right now mine weighs in a 17.3 lbs minus the prop and spinner which are going to be carbon fiber, and two wing servos. So I think it's looking good so far. Don't know how true this is but I did speak with a tech. from GP about this plane and he told me that the test model flown by Frank Noll in the advertisement video weighed 22lbs. with a DA-50??????? So I don't know.
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Old 07-05-2010, 08:21 AM
  #194
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Default RE: Great Planes 25% Pitts M-12s 3D

Mine is 19 pounds on a DA-50 and it will NOT hold a hover (literally falls tail-first out of the sky). This is a new DA-50 on a 22x8 Menz prop and Lawnboy ashless 32:1 (the recommended break-in stuff). It seems to fly fairly "scale". If you want a plane that flies fairly scale, stick a DA-50 in it and you'll like it. If you want a 3D plane or anything more than scale, get a larger motor. By the way, I'm also running a carbon fiber spinner and left the wheel pants off, so that 19 pounds should be fairly close to what you'll get as well. I have about 3 gallons run through my motor thus far and I'm hoping that when I switch to synthetic and a 23" prop, it will perform better.

Mine is probably going to be put up for sale soon. Looks great, but not really what I was hoping for.
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Old 07-05-2010, 09:28 AM
  #195
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Default RE: Great Planes 25% Pitts M-12s 3D


Quote:
ORIGINAL: brwilkins

Mine is 19 pounds on a DA-50 and it will NOT hold a hover (literally falls tail-first out of the sky). This is a new DA-50 on a 22x8 Menz prop and Lawnboy ashless 32:1 (the recommended break-in stuff). It seems to fly fairly ''scale''. If you want a plane that flies fairly scale, stick a DA-50 in it and you'll like it. If you want a 3D plane or anything more than scale, get a larger motor. By the way, I'm also running a carbon fiber spinner and left the wheel pants off, so that 19 pounds should be fairly close to what you'll get as well. I have about 3 gallons run through my motor thus far and I'm hoping that when I switch to synthetic and a 23'' prop, it will perform better.

Mine is probably going to be put up for sale soon. Looks great, but not really what I was hoping for.
Try a 21x8 to keep the revs up while hovering. I've flown a buddy's 21 pound plane with a G62 and it would hover at half throttle and pull out pretty quick. 21x8 prop to keep it in the powerband. Smaller prop equals a lower gear, so to speak. If you stop and think about it, when hovering, the nose is pointed straight up, like going up a steep hill in your car. Your car needs a lower gear to get up the hill and so does your plane being that it's a little heavier.
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Old 07-05-2010, 09:29 PM
  #196
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Default RE: Great Planes 25% Pitts M-12s 3D

If your plane is 19lbs it should hover with a DA50. the DA50 gives about 30lbs of static thrust. I would not go with a lower prop the best power band for a motor of this size is to keep it around 7000 rpm's. what are your rpm's at full throttle? I also might be interested in this bird. (for the right price)
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Old 07-06-2010, 01:44 PM
  #197
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Default RE: Great Planes 25% Pitts M-12s 3D

I ordered a 22x10 majezlik carbon fiber prop. Who do you guys think that will work with that DA-50? Should it hover then?
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Old 07-06-2010, 01:54 PM
  #198
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Quote:
ORIGINAL: Michael lazzaro

I ordered a 22x10 majezlik carbon fiber prop. Who do you guys think that will work with that DA-50? Should it hover then?
I think it will. Mine with a DA50 and a 22x8 almost hovers.
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Old 07-10-2010, 04:40 AM
  #199
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well my prop came in Thursday so yesterday after work I got it drilled, balanced, and mounted up. Fired it up for the first time on this plane and got it tacking out at about 6900 rpm so we will see what happens. Just need to wait on my elevator servos to arrive. Kinda sucks that JR is not making the reversing servo for the 8611 anymore. So I had to go with the 8711 and a reversing 8711...I know a little over kill. But the more I think about the concerns with the weight of this plane verses what engine to use only raises more questions. Is the DLE-55 that much more powerful than the DA-50? Could you use a higher octane gas such as premium instead of regular unleaded in the DA-50? And if so will that give it an extra boost????
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Old 07-10-2010, 07:46 AM
  #200
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Quote:
ORIGINAL: Michael lazzaro

well my prop came in Thursday so yesterday after work I got it drilled, balanced, and mounted up. Fired it up for the first time on this plane and got it tacking out at about 6900 rpm so we will see what happens. Just need to wait on my elevator servos to arrive. Kinda sucks that JR is not making the reversing servo for the 8611 anymore. So I had to go with the 8711 and a reversing 8711...I know a little over kill. But the more I think about the concerns with the weight of this plane verses what engine to use only raises more questions. Is the DLE-55 that much more powerful than the DA-50? Could you use a higher octane gas such as premium instead of regular unleaded in the DA-50? And if so will that give it an extra boost????
According to DA, higher octane gas makes no difference. That being said, I always run 92 octane in my motors, so my comments on performance of my DA50 in this plane are with me running 92 octane gas. Keep in mind though, my DA50 is not yet broken in. Once I complete break-in and go to a 23" prop and synthetic fuel, it should perform much better. Given that I have many other airplanes though and I don't really enjoy this one very much, it may take me quite a while to get it broken in. No matter how you look at it, 19 pounds is still 19 pounds though. Mine's probably going to be put up for sale.
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