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  1. #1651

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    RE: RC Guys Super Decathlon coming


    ORIGINAL: WI53072

    Guys,

    I am now working on mounting my fuel system and setting up to put my throttle servo in. Being new to gas, I see many folks are removing the idle adjustment screw on their carbs. Is this a good idea or is this just standard operating procedure? Also, what sort of pushroads/connectors are you using for the throttle linkage set-ups? AND what fuel dots and what on/off/charge switches should I use for the 4.8V ignition battery?

    Jim I am glad you are geeting all set-up for the arrival of your SD. I am still waiting for my cowl replacement from Dan, and am expecting he must of shipped it last week so more than likely I will see it this week sometime. This thread is huge!!! This plane has had a lot of comments and build tips throughout. I really like Cmoulders radio set up which leaves room for smoke someday if I should decide to go that route as it seems like a lot of messing around. What I am finding is you really have to think hard about where to put what in this plane. So far I have decided to keep the rudder pull - pull servo mounted in the cabin and both elevator servo's mounted externally in the tail of the fuse. It seems the throttle servo gets mounted where ever it suits your engine throttle linkage which is on the left upper portion of the engine mount.

    I still need to order a 3.5" spinner for the plane. Looking like Tru-Turn as well.

    Paul

    Paul whatever switch works best for you. Iused two stock Futaba HD switches for mine. For fuel dots they are pretty much all the same except the quick fuelers from Dubro. Iwouldn't recommend those. The fuel Dots are a kind or K.I.S.S. method. Ialso put my switches in behind teh dorr so there are no exposed switches visible on the outside of the plane

    The Idle screw you can remove that completely if you want just make sure that your servo can control all positions of the throttle. There is nothing bad gonna happen if you remove it completely

  2. #1652
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    RE: RC Guys Super Decathlon coming

    Hey, Paul.

    The Tru-Turn spinner that looks the most like the Decathlon is the Standard, but they don't offer it in a 3.5 inch. At least, not in the RED color plating. I opted for the :

    TT-3502
    3-1/2" P-51 2-BLADE Aluminum Spinner

    I think its shape will compliment the SD, and it saved some money over some of the other shapes, which were also "close" but not perfect. Plus, the lower price of the P-51 style spinner allowed me to get mine cut for the Xoar propeller and get the Red color and still save some money. The 'Base' number I put above can be added to, for custom prop cuts and colors. Dan at RC Guys said that a Blue could also work well, because the striping on the side is blue, and it points right at the spinner. Makes sense. Black, of course, is always the new black, and the straight aluminum color is always a winner.

    The DuBro or Sullivan fuel dots both work well. If you're planning on flying at a giant scale meet, you'll want to have an IBEC for shutting the engine off from a switch on the radio. For a charging switch, pretty much any charging switch will work, but I prefer the double-pole switches, which add that extra margin of safety and functionality.

    I'm lucky on the smoke system, as the Syssas come with smoke taps built into the muffler. I keep a set of banjo bolts pieces on hand, should I decide to add smoke at any time. It's always some extra hassle, but at least the muffler hookups would be easy, should I decide to go ahead at some point.

    Because I held my everything-must-go, wheeling-and-dealing sale this past week, I ended up with two of my JR ST126MG servos back in hand, so I'll be using JR servos all around, for elevators and for ailerons. Plus, I've still got the JR 8611A for the rudder, and I found I had a beautiful 3" servo arm I got from Wild Hare that'll make a great rudder bar for that servo. Like you, I'm opting for the pull-pull setup. I'm hoping to cross my pull-pull wires to minimize any tendency to go slack.

    As for throttle linkage, my Syssa comes with a tiny (2mm?) ball link for the throttle, and I used some plastic tubing and inner plastic slide-rod, much like a Sullivan Gold-N-rod setup, with a threaded bit screwed into the plastic rod, and into the ball link near the engine. Back by the servo, I have a small piece of linkage wire with a threaded end, threaded part screwed into the plastic rod, and the smooth part goes through a set-screw linkage mounted to the servo arm (and that is the ONLY place I will use those set-screw linkages). I checked, and mine has no idle stop screw in it. I think it boils down to setting it up the way you want to. I like being able to trim it down to a stop, but the IBEC gives me an easy kill-option from a switch. If you have an IBEC, you can leave it in. If you don't have an IBEC, you can't kill it remotely if you have an idle stop screw in place.

    I probably mentioned this already. I have positively decided that I am going ahead with the videos for the build. I'm going to try and incorporate some of my earlier videos to supplement it. It took three videos just to cover installing the Robart Pin Hinges. That was a lot of work. I don't think there's any need for me to do a remake of those. What do you think?

    Dan has been responsive to all of my questions so far, so I feel good about going ahead with the video series.

    ~ Jim ~
    J.M. Surra, author of AERODYNAMIC and
    T.I.T.O.R. - In early July of 1947, something crashed in Roswell, New Mexico. . .

  3. #1653
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    RE: RC Guys Super Decathlon coming

    The Big Brown truck just left me a box. A spinner from Tru-Turn. The WRONG spinner. An Ultimate style came, when I ordered a P-51.

    They didn't have any standard styles, the closest match to the Decathlon in 3-1/2".

    This Ultimate style sure is long and pointy. It would look TERRIBLE on a Decathlon, now I'm positive of that.

    Refused. Return to Sender.

    The P-51 isn't an exact match to the stock Decathlon, but it's got a nice look. I think it will work nicely with the Decathlon. Red anodized.

    When it actually GETS here, that is. LOL

    ~ Jim ~
    J.M. Surra, author of AERODYNAMIC and
    T.I.T.O.R. - In early July of 1947, something crashed in Roswell, New Mexico. . .

  4. #1654
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    RE: RC Guys Super Decathlon coming

    I'm having a little harrumph this morning, because I am SOME p$%^&*d-off at Tru-Turn.

    I called them to say that they'd sent me the wrong spinner. She told me to ship it back to them, and they'd send me the correct one. Not only that, but the one they sent me was WAY more expensive than the one I'd ordered, and they'd charged my credit card well over a hundred dollars for it. Ouch.

    I asked them to issue a pickup ticket, so I didn't have to deal with the shipping, and so I didn't have to pay for the shipping, or the gas to get halfway across the city to where the UPS office is.

    She said that isn't their policy, and that I have to ship it back. Then she said said they'll reimburse me - up to ten dollars - for the shipping. I asked her who's going to reimburse me for the fifteen bucks worth of gas I'm going to use driving through traffic, because they won't issue a pickup ticket? I explained that there is no UPS office convenient to my location, and that even our closest Post Office is a fifteen minute drive, and a LONG wait in line there. Couldn't they just issue a pickup ticket?

    Sorry. Not our policy.

    I figure I spend anywhere from fifty to three hundred dollars a year with Tru-Turn, and encourage my friends to use them for any number of spinners or prop-lock systems. After I get done saddling up, fighting traffic, and paying to ship Tru-Turn's mistake back to them today, so they can do me the favor of "reimbursing" me for the overcharge on my card for the wrong item and only part of what I'll spend returning it, and nothing for my time doing that, after they could have issued a pickup ticket and solved my problem easily and conveniently, that will be the last penny I ever spend with them.

    There's no reason to work with a mail-order vendor if the convenience factor isn't present, and for me, here in Texas where they are, I get charged tax besides. Customer loyalty only goes so far.

    I'm giving serious consideration to cancelling the order altogether.

    I haven't been this P$%^&*D-off at an RC vendor for years.


    ~ Jim ~
    J.M. Surra, author of AERODYNAMIC and
    T.I.T.O.R. - In early July of 1947, something crashed in Roswell, New Mexico. . .

  5. #1655

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    RE: RC Guys Super Decathlon coming

    Jim, sorry to hear that you are having difficulty with Tru Turn. I am sure you will get it all worked out before not long though. I have been at a slight stand still here due to a busy work schedule etc.. Anyway I was able to get a few minor things accomplished early yesterday and today though. Hopefully I can devote a little more time tonight to finishing the fuel system install and the ignition system install. I am just anal about being able to take things apart after they are assembled for routine maintenance or reparis. I built a slick fuel tank mount that in the end will allow me to slide it out of the fuse since it is on rails for lack of better words. i also painted my firewall and will pick up a bushing for the hole for the ignition wire access to the fuse. Also note, my replacement cowl showed up absolutely A1, not a scratch. Thanks to Mr. Dan Spears and RC Guys!!

    Any thoughts where I should mount the fuel dot?? Also, I am honing in on my ignition switch location. I am going to mount it on the external of the plane on the fuse so I can get at it easily and quickly without having to clammer to open the door to get at it. I have the optilink which will be in the plane and tied to Aux2. I will mount the Rx and future smoke system switch and fuel dot (this came with the motor) on the inside of the door like cmoulder did with his SD build.

    Here are a few pic's of what I have done so far.

    Paul
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  6. #1656
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    RE: RC Guys Super Decathlon coming

    Hi Paul,

    I'll get it worked out with Tru-Turn, no problem. I'll pay and spend a chunk of my day driving to ship it, and they'll sit there and watch me pay. No problem.

    Back to your questions.
    Having a nice big access door is quite handy, and I quite like the idea of switches being inside. I've ordered a battery-monitor panel (called a MAMA?) with L.E.D. lights, so they can be seen. Not only to remind me to turn the switches off (of course, I've NEVER done that - since last month !), but to monitor the voltage during the day of flying.

    Here are my thoughts on this. Why not keep the switches inside? When you prepare to fly, you have to open the door to access the switches. Then, when you land, you have to open the door to switch OFF the switches. No matter what you do, you be opening the door anyway. Which leads me to my suggestion. Why clutter up the outside of the bird, when you can simply lay a length of Tygon and a plug just inside the door? You'll have access to it just prior to turning on the switches at the same access point - the door - and you'll also have access to it for refueling after you land - when you turn the switches off.

    This bird allows unprecedented access to the roomy fuse interior through the door. Why not take full advantage of it? The only requirement, as far as I can see, is to make sure you have a durable door opener device. I've seen nice pull-lever devices on these aerobatics with removable cockpit covers. One pull releases the hatch, and it's spring-loaded to securely lock it back in place. That would do it. Anybody know where to find one? They must be available in a number of places.

    Your firewall looks great! Very crisp and neat. I think you're making great progress.

    ~ Jim ~[8D]
    J.M. Surra, author of AERODYNAMIC and
    T.I.T.O.R. - In early July of 1947, something crashed in Roswell, New Mexico. . .

  7. #1657

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    RE: RC Guys Super Decathlon coming

    Hi guys.

    Opening the door to get to switches for me is a hassle. It's just a hard angle with the plane on the ground. In addition, the door and hinges have not proven to be very robust.

    If I ever start using the roof window routinely (it's usually off and I just stick my hand in), I"ll move switches outside.

    Got Saito 180 back..... $100 repair. Case and bearings in lower end. Rethinking fuel (had just started runing 5% Omega instead of 15%), after-run (which I never use) and storage. Horizon tech recommended trying after-run and then storing with engine in upright postion. Now, if I could just access the venturi (!).

    Have fun.

    Scott

  8. #1658

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    RE: RC Guys Super Decathlon coming

    My fuel DOT and switches are on a mounting plate behind the door. No issues whatsoever. Nice place for them. Hidden and yes when I fuel up my plane in knealing on the ground but sometime i work from off one of the tables at the field. But it's whoevers prefrence.

  9. #1659
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    RE: RC Guys Super Decathlon coming

    It's important to run the engine dry, then take out the plug and put in some after-run oil and turn the engine over. Saito valves can get scale on them and seize up. The same for the bearings, etc. And of course, any brand can suffer the same problems.

    Use more than a few drops of the oil, too. It's good for the motor.

    Whereas the glow fuel elements attract moisture and allow it to attack the metal, the after-run oil displaces it and coats the metal. Long-term, it's very important; especially in four-strokes, which have a lot of moving parts.

    ~ Jim ~[8D]
    J.M. Surra, author of AERODYNAMIC and
    T.I.T.O.R. - In early July of 1947, something crashed in Roswell, New Mexico. . .

  10. #1660

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    RE: RC Guys Super Decathlon coming

    Guys,

    Just talked to our club president and he thought it be a good idea to have the kill switch on the outside of the plane for ease of access. I have already installed the fuel dot on the outside of the plane. So it looks like I will place my Rx switch behind the door and also leave room there for the fuel dot and switch combo I recieved from Valleyview for the future smoke system addition. This plane requires a lot of thoughtfull planning when laying out your equipment. Off to the LHS to pick up a few items for over the weekend. Hopefully the fuel system will be done and the radio install can begin!!! I would like to fly this plane before snow flies this year!!

    Paul
    Wonder Rather Than Doubt, Is The Root Of All Knowledge.
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  11. #1661

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    RE: RC Guys Super Decathlon coming

    After careful consideration and talking with several other club members and reviewing this thread to death I have decided to place my ignition and Rx switches inside the door of the SD. I took several pictures of what I have come up with. Sorta a power panel set up that if I had to, I could un-bolt and un-plug connections and remove for easy service. Here is what I came up with. The next hurdle will be the throttle servo. I am trying to keep the middle bay as open as possible so I can one day add smoke to the SD and have the room to do it easily and cleanly. Back at it tommorow since the weather report says windy and rain likely.

    Have a look at the pictures of my progress.

    Paul

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  12. #1662
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    RE: RC Guys Super Decathlon coming

    Whatever you decide to do, Paul, you'll know you did your best, based on your own wants and needs.

    Looks pretty good to me from here. Nice work.

    ~ Jim ~
    J.M. Surra, author of AERODYNAMIC and
    T.I.T.O.R. - In early July of 1947, something crashed in Roswell, New Mexico. . .

  13. #1663

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    RE: RC Guys Super Decathlon coming

    Guys,

    Made great progress tonite. Wing strut fuse mounting braket installed (was hard to do, small area to work in), fuel tank final install complete, motor installed and throttle linkage hooked up and travel adjusted. I used a small ball link on the throttle arm, worked good. Next step is to locate where I want to mount the Rx and get that in along with the rudder servo and pull-pull set up and finally the e;evator half servo's mounted in the tail. Looks like the fuse should be all done toward the end of the week. I still have to figure out where exactly I am going to mount the batteries. I believe in the belly of the middle compartment at about the CG. I will know better once I began to balance the plane next week or so. Upside of crappy flying weather and wife in school means I can work on airplanes in the basement. I will post some pictures again maybe tommorow.

    Jim has your SD arrived yet? did you get the spinner worked out? My spinner and single bolt prop adapter got here from Valley View today, thanks to Tammy!! Let me know how you are doing Jim in getting your SD!!

    Paul
    Wonder Rather Than Doubt, Is The Root Of All Knowledge.
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  14. #1664
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    RE: RC Guys Super Decathlon coming

    Hi Paul,

    Glad you're making good progress on yours.

    My Tru-Turn Spinner is still in limbo; I sent it back last week, and I'm waiting for the correct one[:@].
    No word yet on my SD, I don't even know if it's been shipped yet. I've been a little distracted with some exciting news coming from Syssa, the engine manufacturer. They're about to come out with something special very soon[X(], but I'm not allowed to breathe a word of it. However, it seems I am to be lucky enough to be one of the first who will see and hold one in my hot little hands (of the things I can't talk about! lol). They should announce it this week, or maybe next.

    So, yeah, for all my big talk, right now I've got - let's see - nothing, nothing, and nothing. Impressive, eh?

    It's all very exciting.

    ~ Jim ~
    J.M. Surra, author of AERODYNAMIC and
    T.I.T.O.R. - In early July of 1947, something crashed in Roswell, New Mexico. . .

  15. #1665

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    RE: RC Guys Super Decathlon coming

    Nice work Paul!
    Hope the weather clears. "Bout time to take this bird for a ride!
    Scott

  16. #1666

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    RE: RC Guys Super Decathlon coming

    Jim,

    Hang in there! Dan Spears reads this thread often. I am sure he would give you an order status update. I am sure it won't be long!!

    Paul
    Wonder Rather Than Doubt, Is The Root Of All Knowledge.
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  17. #1667

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    RE: RC Guys Super Decathlon coming

    Jim you must be twitching violently to get your plane! I can feel the tremurs all the way up here in Canada.......LOL  

  18. #1668
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    RE: RC Guys Super Decathlon coming

    LOL! You're ALL correct. Dan has been giving me status updates, and even told me it had been delivered - after I found it on the porch, of course!

    IMPRESSIONS:
    Nice packing, good boxes, arrived apparently undamaged. Upon opening, found everything safe and sound, but only had time for a brief examination. I did find a disturbing amount of what appeared to be drool on pretty much everything. Not really sure where THAT came from. Couldn't have been ME.

    This bird is BIG. and LIGHT. It's going to take up some room! My big, buff Giant Super Sportster has now become the young, skinny teenage brother. [X(]The Decathlon fuselage, devoid of tail feathers, still dwarfed the fully-built GSS on the table next to it.

    Holy crap, this is amazing workmanship. I can honestly say it's as pretty as anything I've ever built. Truthfully, the best workmanship I've ever seen on an ARF. I was impressed with an Extreme Flight Yak a while back, but it was much heavier than this. Yet this is strong and rigid.

    Just waiting for my delivery from Syssa, and I can begin the build videos.

    This is going to be a lot of fun!

    ~ Jim ~[8D]
    J.M. Surra, author of AERODYNAMIC and
    T.I.T.O.R. - In early July of 1947, something crashed in Roswell, New Mexico. . .

  19. #1669

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    RE: RC Guys Super Decathlon coming

    Jim,

    After I made my post to you this morning that Dan checks this site often, he emailed me to tell me that your SD was going to be there very soon!!!

    Great news Jim!! I am glad you are enjoying xmas in September! I will be at it again tonight getting the reciever mounted and the rudder set-up put in. I hope to take some photos for the thread!! I am sure we will be in touch on here often now you have your SD!

    Paul
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  20. #1670
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    RE: RC Guys Super Decathlon coming

    Count on it.
    J.M. Surra, author of AERODYNAMIC and
    T.I.T.O.R. - In early July of 1947, something crashed in Roswell, New Mexico. . .

  21. #1671
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    RE: RC Guys Super Decathlon coming

    I made an executive decision today. Since my Decathlon will have twin Rx packs, I decided to steal my R921 receiver with 2 satellite Rx's from my benched Giant Super Sportster. It'll be fine with an AR7000 Rx I have here, and the Decathlon might have smoke at some point, so the extra channels are also valuable.

    So, I spent the morning stealing the R921 and satellites from the GSS, installing the AR7000 in the GSS, and rebinding the GSS.

    My Tru-Turn spinner finally came - the correct one, this time. It's a nice red, and looks very nice, but for some reason the base plate looks crappy. It has dark spots on it and doesn't look the same as the spinner itself; not as well coated, and nowhere near as shiny. That's at 14 inches away, of course. Beyond 24 inches, I guess nobody will be able to tell, but for nearly a hundred bucks, I expected better.

    The Decathlon's nose section is bisected inside by a large plate. This is a feature I won't enjoy working around, as it effectively blocks any decent access to the lower 2 to 3 inches of the firewall inside. I wish it came as a separate piece that could be installed after all the inside work is completed. Right now I'm staring at it a lot, and trying to decide how I'm going to approach this issue for reinforcement and accessing the back for engine installation.

    Paul, how did you deal with this? Did you reinforce your firewall from the inside? Any of you guys who came up with any brainstorms that made it a bit easier, I'd like to hear them.

    ~ Jim ~
    J.M. Surra, author of AERODYNAMIC and
    T.I.T.O.R. - In early July of 1947, something crashed in Roswell, New Mexico. . .

  22. #1672

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    RE: RC Guys Super Decathlon coming

    Jim,

    I too wish that they had left a hatch access to get at the firewall. I mixxed 30 minute epoxy and literally poured it in and used a brush with an extension handle and brushed on a coating the best I could. This is not optimum or the best procedure but I feel I got a ample amount of epoxy on key firewall connection points. Getting the blind nuts on the lower side of the firewall to accomodate my firewall spacer was a real trick. I did it with a blue pushrod inserted through the hole and thread back to the open "cockpit area". Then I slid the blind nut down the push rod to where it lined up with the hole in the firewall. THIS was very difficult. Finally I got the blinf nut to stick long enough to get a thread started and got them set. This was the hardest part of the build so far.

    Absolutely you need to cross the Rudder Pull Pull cable. I tried to do it conventionally, and am not happy with the results. I will be replacing the cable tonite and crossing it over. I also picked up a SWB pull-pull tensioner to install so I have a simple way to adjust any slop in the cable. In theory you should be able to install a pull pull pretty simply. I think the size of the plane makes this more difficult.

    Paul
    Wonder Rather Than Doubt, Is The Root Of All Knowledge.
    Sig Kadet Brotherhood #20
    P51 Mustang Brotherhood #30

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    RE: RC Guys Super Decathlon coming

    Hi Paul,

    To get a pull cable, servo extension, etc. through a distant hole take dental floss and a small nut or screw, and dangle it down through the fuselage and you should be able to maneuver it through the hole with little difficulty, then you can pull the cable through with the floss. The larger plane should make it easier, actually. This thing is HUGE

    Try to make sure you use a threaded end on each end, and leave some thread hanging out, because these cables always stretch. That's the nature of cables, even short ones like flying tail wires. You'll want to be able to take up the slack later on. On my two last planes, I just put the servo in the tail and used carbon fiber linkage. I always wait until I have the other stuff in the plane before I decide, in case it's too much weight for the tail, in which case I install the pull-pull. I'm thinking that with an estimated 48 ounces minimum needed in the nose, the rudder servo in the tail may be too much weight for the back, so I'm preparing mentally for the possibility/probability of having to install pull-pull.

    The one thing I'm bothered about is that tray. Still trying to form a plan of attack. I may decide to do surgery and remove some of it, even if it's only temporary. Sometimes I stare at a problem for a while and let the solution form itself. This one definitely needs a solution.

    ~ Jim ~
    J.M. Surra, author of AERODYNAMIC and
    T.I.T.O.R. - In early July of 1947, something crashed in Roswell, New Mexico. . .

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    RE: RC Guys Super Decathlon coming

    Jim why do you wanna run two Rx?

    I'd use the pull pull rudder. It's a clean light and looks good. If I could do anything different on mine I would have put the elevator servos inside the fuse.

    As for the firewall. Don't overthink it. If you wanna brush in some epoxy on the joints its probly not a bad idea for piece of mind. That firewall is pretty beefy the plane already. I'd wouldn't get to worried about it. I never did a thing to mine and it's been flying for three seasons issue free

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    RE: RC Guys Super Decathlon coming

    Okay,

    I stared at the shelf that bisects the firewall, and I came up with a good plan. I'm going to cut the center of it out, leaving just the outside edge, still attached all the way around. That will give me (nearly) unfettered access to the firewall. Once the firewall has been reinforced properly, and the engine has been solidly mounted and all firewall and water/fuel/proofing has been completed, I can (if I want to) reattach the removed center piece of shelf using scraps to make a lip to glue it to.

    That's the only real concern I have so far, so I'm feeling pretty good about it.

    ~ Jim ~
    J.M. Surra, author of AERODYNAMIC and
    T.I.T.O.R. - In early July of 1947, something crashed in Roswell, New Mexico. . .


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