Glow to Electric Conversions Discuss glow/gas conversion to electric here.

HANGAR 9 Piper J-3 Cub 40 Conversion

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Old 05-30-2006, 07:05 PM
  #1  
Cyrus Abdollahi
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Default HANGAR 9 Piper J-3 Cub 40 Conversion

Hi,

I just bought the new Hangar 9 Piper J-3 Cub from my hobby shop (It was on sale for $200.00 and I could not pass it up). I opened up the kit and I must say, they did a fantastic job. The quality is EXCELLENT.

The airplane comes in a nice clean Cub yellow and black trim. If I go the gas route, I am going to have to install a fuel tank, cut out a filler port, and cut into the cowling. Then after all that work, the nice cub yellow is going to get hosed in all that engine oil. I love the sound of a gas engine, but I am starting to HATE the mess they make.

In short, I would like to turn it into a Electric flyer. Here are the airplane specs from the manufacturer, and I think they will be critical to your input.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Specifications:

Wingspan:............. 80"........................ Weight: 6.75-7.5 lbs (3-3.4 kg)
Fuselage Length:... 49.9"........................Engine: .36-.46 2-stroke, .56-.82 4-stroke
Wing area:............ 919 sq. in................ Radio: 4-channel w/ 5 servos
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------






Ok, so now you know the requirements. Below is a list of some electric stuff that I do have. It would be great if I could use what I already have, but the stuff I have is for a smaller electric (which is not yet finished). I have a feeling I will need bigger equipment for my cub.



My junk:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

*Apache Smart Charger Li-Poly
Charges:
4cell 14.8V
3cell 11.1V
2cell 7.4V
1cell 3.7V

Then below this it says:
2500mA
2000mA
1700mA
1200mA
700mA
250mA
(These are current values, so I am not sure what these are for??)


*JETI model Advance 30 plus electronic speed controller (Brushless Motors)
(I can find out more specs on this particular model if necessary and provide it)

*I also have a wall plug AC-DC coverter by (Hangar 9?) that outputs 12V DC at 600 mA. This is used to charge a torquemaster motorcycle battery for my field box. I don't think it has the necessary Amps for my Apache. I know for a fact that Radio Shack does sell a nice 12V 15A power supply that accepts banana clips. (I would probably need that, yes?)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I figure that I will have to put the batteries where the fuel tank would normally go. Replacing the engine with an electric motor is going to make the nose much lighter. I would suspect that the batteries will want to go as close to the firewall as they can go to balance the CG (But that will be solved by moving it around until the airplane balances).


I have not opened the Apache Charger yet, so I can always return it to my local hobby shop and get my money back and order a different charge if it becomes necessary.

I need to know which brushless motor unit should I buy to power this airplane. I want it to fly like a nice piper cub, not do prop hangs. I want it to have enough power to be nimble, but not fly 3-D (This is a cub afterall!!) The prop is probably going to want ~8000 RPM at the most? So a reducer gear might be necessary. (It would be great if the motor came in a unit with the reducer gear already attached!)

Also, what kind of batteries should I buy, (I guess the voltage and mA rating will depend on the motor I select, how long a flight time I want, and most importantly how much am I willing to spend <Not too much!>)

I may or may not need a new electronic speed controller. If I do need a new one, is there a nice (and affordable!) one out there that you would recomend?

This will all run on my JR system.

It would be great if I can walk away from this post with a general idea on how to pick a motor, battery, charger ETC for any airplane in general.

Thank you for your input. If you happen to have a link for your recomendations that would be a great help too!


Many thanks,

-Cyrus A.
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Old 05-30-2006, 08:53 PM
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airflow
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Default RE: HANGAR 9 Piper J-3 Cub 40 Conversion

try Horizon Hobbies completion guides

[link=http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/RelatedParts.aspx?ProdID=HAN4000&Category=Completion+Guides&SubCategory=Electric+Conversion+Setup]Electric conversion[/link]
-OR-
http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products...ProdId=HAN4000

if these links don't work for you, go to http://www.horizonhobby.com and try a search for Piper J-3 Cub 40 ARF

When you get that, you'll see and click on:
See Our Recommended
Completion Guides

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Old 05-30-2006, 09:13 PM
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Default RE: HANGAR 9 Piper J-3 Cub 40 Conversion

Hi, I have a similar size Cub by Great Planes that I converted to electric. I wrote an article about it and if you would like I will send it to you. It is MicroSoft Publisher but I could send it via PDF as well. Let me know. Norm

mine flies superbly
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Old 05-30-2006, 10:02 PM
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Cyrus Abdollahi
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Default RE: HANGAR 9 Piper J-3 Cub 40 Conversion

Hi norm,

That would be a great help to me!

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Old 05-31-2006, 09:21 AM
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normgoyer
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Default RE: HANGAR 9 Piper J-3 Cub 40 Conversion

Hi Cyrus, punch into www.victorvalleyrcflyers.com and go to April Newsletter and the article in in this edition. If you do not have PDF (Akrobat Reader) capabilities I will send you the text but this one has pix in color etc. Norm
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Old 05-31-2006, 11:05 AM
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Cyrus Abdollahi
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Default RE: HANGAR 9 Piper J-3 Cub 40 Conversion

Thanks for your input guys; however, I still feel like I am lacking in my understanding of how to go about this conversion.

Here is what I found on the OS website, http://www.osengines.com/engines/osmg0547.html:

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
OS .46 AX Specifications
Stock Number: OSMG0547
Displacement: 0.455 cu in (7.5 cc)
Bore: 0.866 in (22.0 mm)
Stroke: 0.772 in (19.6 mm)
Output: 1.65 hp @ 16,000 rpm
RPM Range: 2,000-17,000
Weight w/muffler: 17.2 oz (489 g)
Includes: #A3 glow plug, E-3010 muffler
Requires: glow fuel, prop
Suggested prop sizes: 10.5x6, 11x6-8, 12x6-7
15480 .46 AX ABL Parts Listing
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Using a conversion table, a two stroke OS .46 AX at 1.65 HP would be the equivalent of a 1.23kW motor.

Does this mean that I would want to replace the Glow engine with an Electric motor that has a rating of 1.23kW, or is there more than meets the eye?

Also, the OS website says that on the high end the prop spins at 16,000 RPM. I guess I never realized they went that high.

It appears that on the Hangar 9 website you gave me, they sell an 'electric prop.' I don't see what would be different for an 'electric prop' or a standard glow prop. (I suppose the airfoils are different on the blades?) If so, why? The power source might be different (Glow or electric) but that should not affect the prop. I would except to use a 10x6 if I use a Glow engine or an equivalent electric motor.

Will I have to buy 'electric props'? If so, what RPM should these props run at? Will they be the same as Glow, faster, slower?


EDIT: Also, I happen to have a model motors AXI2814/10 brushless motor which was going to go into another (smaller) airplane. I do not know if this would be the right size for this airplane or not.
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Old 08-16-2006, 03:29 AM
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Default RE: HANGAR 9 Piper J-3 Cub 40 Conversion

Hi Cyrus,
What's new, how is your 2nd summer school engineering class coming along?

Have you had a chance to play/build your Cub some more yet?

You have all the parts already.

***Look I'm going to be getting one of those Hyperion E-meters also.
Do you recommend them, is it easy to use.
Does the tach read RPM easily, or do you have to hold it just right, Etc....
I will most likely order in the morning, reply as soon as you can please. You will probably not read this before I place my order with Randy at Dynamo Electrics.

Send me e-mail, there is some thing we need to talk about as far as protecting your meter, I learned something today that might help.

Good luck with school and your CUB project, please keep us informed with data on that Hyperion motor , ESC.

*** Thunder Power just put out a new line of batteries. Little heavier and bigger given the same mAH, but a whole lot more higher discharge rate.
Their 2070 mAh are rated at 25C constant/40 burst.
All the rest are bigger and rated at 22C/40C like 3400, 3850, 4500, and 4600 mAH.
More batteries to follow in the future. So lets talk after you have some numbers to analyze.

Gryphon
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Old 08-16-2006, 12:24 PM
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Default RE: HANGAR 9 Piper J-3 Cub 40 Conversion

Hi,
I also converted a Hangar 9 80 inch Cub to electric. It flys great. A real floater. I use a 4 cell lipoly, 500watt brushless direct drive.
It flys better than it did with a 4 stroke.
Jim
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Old 08-16-2006, 04:57 PM
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Default RE: HANGAR 9 Piper J-3 Cub 40 Conversion

Hi You will need as a minimum for scale power an AXI 2826-12 with a 40 amp ESC or for more power and faster aerobatics an AXI 4120 with 22.2 volts and a 70 ESC. Look up www.victorvalleyrcflyers.com and then at the newsletters from March on for articles on the conversion of the GP Cub which is almost identical. Norm

I love mine and fly it every week.
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Old 08-16-2006, 05:32 PM
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Default RE: HANGAR 9 Piper J-3 Cub 40 Conversion

I believe he already bough all the gear 2 months ago.
Hyperion HP-Z4025-10 560KV. The KV is a little lower than the 640 KV we were looking for, but instead he is running 4cell lipoly, and maybe 5 cell lipoly in the future. So it will be a superior combo due to higher voltage and lower KV.
I think he is running either a 4200mah, or (2) 2100 4S TP,
Hyperion 80 Amp-opto ESC
Medusa Research UBEC 3.5A
13X8 prop through 14-10

The results will be very high efficiency, and high power 550-730+ Watts. Larger props should be best.

Should climb fast and have a real good speed. It will have plenty of power to tow gliders way up and fast. How about towing a large banner???

Gryphon
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Old 08-23-2006, 11:13 AM
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Default RE: HANGAR 9 Piper J-3 Cub 40 Conversion

I just maidened my Hangar 9 Cub last week. Here is my power setup:

Motor: AXI 4120/18
Battery: Tanic 5S1P 5000 MAH
ESC: Phoenix 60
Prop: Zinger wood 13X10

This combo runs 855 watts at 45 amps and has more than enough power. I can fly it for at least 30 minutes on one charge.

I've tried APC 14X10 and it pulls 1090 watts at 55 amps-way too much. An APC 14X8.5 is much better and it pulls 845 watts at 44 amps. I like the wood prop because it looks more scale like.

This is a beautiful looking and flying airplane with an electric setup. With this motor, you could also add floats at a later time and still have enough power.
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Old 10-02-2006, 12:20 PM
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Default RE: HANGAR 9 Piper J-3 Cub 40 Conversion

Hi I converted the World Models 1/5th scale clipped wing cub, I used the Axi 4120/14 motor, with a 3700mah 4s1p Shark lipo, the set up was well up on power and got the 8lb model off the ground in about 15 yards. I used a 13x6 apce prop and a Jeti 70 opto esc with a separate powere pack for the radio. I get about 10 minutes with aerobatics thrown in, or 12 with a sedate flight.
Stearman
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Old 10-15-2006, 11:07 AM
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Default RE: HANGAR 9 Piper J-3 Cub 40 Conversion

Can anyone explain why the H9 J3 Cub manual shows reverse aileron differential for the control throws?

Typically, less down travel than up is recommended for ailerons on non-symetrical wings, in order to counteract drag induced yaw. But as you can see, they're recommending more down travel than up, not less.

From the H9 J3 Cub Manual
Aileron Control Throws
Low Rate
3/8" (8º) Up 1/2" (9º) Down
High Rate
7/8" (21º) Up 11/16" (22º) Down
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Old 10-19-2006, 12:55 PM
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Default RE: HANGAR 9 Piper J-3 Cub 40 Conversion

Wow !!! It is sooooo cool finding a post on exactly what I am working on.I also have the 82" J3 from hanger 9.Shes been sitting in a box for 3 years and I am now ready to conquer !!
Here is what I have for equipment.I would like to use the least amount of power to get the job done.
13XL on a 6 to 1 planatery.
Hacker 40 12L outrunner
Hacker 60 14L outrunner
Hacker 99
I have access to Lipo and 3700 sub Cs.
What do you guys recomend ??
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Old 10-20-2006, 07:06 AM
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Tim Green
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Default RE: HANGAR 9 Piper J-3 Cub 40 Conversion

Ahah - I'll answer my own post, since Horizon Hobbies responded, stating that what's in their manual is "a misprint", and that it was "printed directly backwards".

ORIGINAL: Tim Green

Can anyone explain why the H9 J3 Cub manual shows reverse aileron differential for the control throws?

Typically, less down travel than up is recommended for ailerons on non-symetrical wings, in order to counteract drag induced yaw. But as you can see, they're recommending more down travel than up, not less.

From the H9 J3 Cub Manual
Aileron Control Throws
Low Rate
3/8" (8º) Up 1/2" (9º) Down
High Rate
7/8" (21º) Up 11/16" (22º) Down
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Old 10-20-2006, 08:32 AM
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Default RE: HANGAR 9 Piper J-3 Cub 40 Conversion

Thanks Tim, I was wondering about that myself. I set my aileron at 1/2 up 1/4 down. I also noticed on my Cub that the tail wheel arm that fits into the rudder was not centered and broke on takeoff it is a very week area which I have beefed up.

Jim R
Rogers AR
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Old 10-20-2006, 10:20 AM
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Default RE: HANGAR 9 Piper J-3 Cub 40 Conversion

Hi Cub pilots, If you want a more realistic flight with your J-3 use CAR with about 20% coordination. The full size Cub is a rudder airplane and to make proper turns you must use the rudder or else you skid all over the sky. I fly 3 electric Cubs and one full size one and if they have scale ailerons and not strip ailerons you need to CAR your plane, it flies much better. Of courss you can hand input the rudder if you like. Norm
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Old 10-21-2006, 10:17 AM
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Default RE: HANGAR 9 Piper J-3 Cub 40 Conversion

I would assume that car would be some kind of mixxing to give rudder imput mixed with aleron ???? Sounds like a great idea.
Hey can anyone answer my above questions ?
I can I power that plane on 24 cells and a Hacker A5012L out runner or do I need to go with the A60 14L.Also what prop should I start with.I am going shopping today at the local hobby shop.Please help.
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Old 10-21-2006, 02:59 PM
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Default RE: HANGAR 9 Piper J-3 Cub 40 Conversion

Hi, I use an AXi 2826-12 wtih 14.5 volts and a 13 X 6 prop. It (GP 81" Cub Arf) flies perfectly usually at 1/2 to 2/3 throttle. The plane weighs 6.5 pounds. I just got back from the flying field and while I was up there were 2, 1/3 scale gas models, 3 nitro models and one helicopter....no problem. Electrics can hold their own and then some. When I first started electrics in my club about 1.5 years ago I was it, now almost 50% of the club is flying electrics. Norm
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Old 10-21-2006, 03:36 PM
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Default RE: HANGAR 9 Piper J-3 Cub 40 Conversion

Thanks and do you care to share the KV of that motor ??
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Old 10-21-2006, 04:46 PM
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Default RE: HANGAR 9 Piper J-3 Cub 40 Conversion

Hi, I have to use a 40 amp Jeti controller and I also use a separate battery pack for receiver. don't know what the kilivolts is, I just plug it in and go fly. If it flies good the combo is right, if it doesn't I change something. Getting involved with the number of electrons when the moon is full will ruin the sport, throw the switch and go fly. It either will or it won't. Norm
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Old 10-22-2006, 03:36 AM
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Default RE: HANGAR 9 Piper J-3 Cub 40 Conversion

Hi
I had the same problems when I decided to switch to Electric, it's like a black art getting the right combo without it costing the earth, (which it does anyway) I spent over a £1000 getting my second model into the air, after loads odf research. This UK site has lots of interesting and helpful information, even if you don't buy from them it will set you on the right track. http://www.puffinmodels.com/dingo.html
Regards Stearman65
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Old 10-24-2006, 12:00 PM
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Default RE: HANGAR 9 Piper J-3 Cub 40 Conversion

I started a few weeks back trying to make the decision on going electric with my H9 Cub. Found a post that had a lot of good info and photos showing one way of doing things. This might help.
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=547559
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Old 03-31-2016, 03:50 AM
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Hi, All,

Looking for a one (1) wing strut for a Hangar 9 J-3 40 Cub. Can anyone help?
If a pair is available, I'll buy them. Thanks.

jim
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Old 06-09-2016, 08:07 AM
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I am flying a 1/6 scale "stick model" SigJ-3 Cub, six foot span, single piece wing about 5lbs with batteries. . I have a functional side door and window setup to install and change battery packs. Magnets hold door/window closed. I am using two 2200mah 3S lipo packs in parallel for 4400mah 3S and using a Cobra 3515/14 950KV brushless motor, 12x6 APC prop and 45 amp Cobra speed control with built in switch mode BEC rated at 3 amps. Battery packs are in front of the cabin with fronts of packs in line with the instrument panel. The CG on mine is line with the wing's main spar. This arrangement does not require lead nose ballast in my Cub. Removing the wing to replace battery packs is too fiddly for me. I recommend large metal clevises to attach wing struts to lugs on the fuselage, with silicone tubing keepers. Screws and nuts are fiddly. Cubs are not very critical about CG, should hang slightly nose down with finger tips at specified CG point. With my setup I get a safe 9 minutes with some wild aerobatics and cruising flight. Model can fly inverted, loop from level flight, and even do an outside loop. Wings are strong and struts are secure. I fly my Cub with aileron/rudder mix most of the time, can switch it off for cross-controlled maneuvers. Cubs need a lot of rudder throw to bring tail around with the rest of the airplane. Use your rudder ( left stick) to counter tendency of model to swing left during takeoff. Hold some up elevator to keep tail wheel on ground during first 20 feet of takeoff run as speed gathers, release up elevator to let tail rise and keep straight with rudder. Let model lift off when it's ready with little or no up-elevator. Keep climb at a shallow angle to avoid stalling and let model get some altitude before turning. Have a friend adjust elevator and aileron trim for you while you keep flying. Model should fly level at half throttle, climb at full throttle, and descend a 1/4 throttle. For landings try to line up for landing and reduce throttle so model settles down to runway . Don't try to "flair" at first. Land on main wheels and let tail settle as you reduce throttle. When you have a feel for stall characteristics, you can try flairing for 3-point landings. Your main wheels should be pointed straight ahead or slightly" pigeon toed" to minimize ground loop tendencies. Practice take off runs using elevator and rudder to keep straight and cut throttle before liftoff. My Cub wants to overshoot the end of the runway during landings. It's easiest to land into a headwind. Avoid taking off and landing in strong crosswinds. BTW, my Cub has equal up/down aileron throw, doesn't need differential aileron throw. I use dual rates on ailerons and rudder, fly mostly on high rates for aerobatics and cruising. There are a lot of good You Tube how-to videos about flying tail-draggers. Cubs were used as the first training step to flying warbirds during WWII. Hope this helps you enjoy your Cub for many pleasurable flights.

Last edited by E-Challenged; 06-09-2016 at 08:34 AM.
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