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  1. #1

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    30% Helicopter Fuel for Saito 4 strokes and OS 4 & 2 stroke airplane engines ?

    This may be an old question / subject, but will put it to you folks anyways.

    Have been reading where people instead of using 10 or 15% fuels in their engines, have been switching over to 30% Helicopter fuels. The statements that I have been reading say that they are getting more power from their engines and more cooling. Just wondering if anybody can confirm these statements ?

    Just for the heck of it, purchased my first gallon of fuel for the season yesterday and it was 30%, of which I will be giving it a try in some Saito 4 strokes, OS 4 strokes and OS 2 strokes. I may add that it is also somewhat on the costly side.

    Any comments or advise on this subject ? Besides the fact that the engines may have to retuned.
    Last edited by Granpooba; 04-19-2014 at 05:55 PM.

  2. #2
    1QwkSport2.5r's Avatar
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    30% should be fine. Run it in your OS and Saito engines and you're fine. I'm sure TT engines would handle it fine as well. The average sport engine isn't compressed near high enough to have issues with high nitro. Higher compressed engines will have problems with it like Super Tigre and Fox; that is without adding shims under the head.
    GlowHead Brotherhood #3
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  3. #3
    jeffie8696's Avatar
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    Been using 30% heli fuel in my Magnum 52 FS for a while, no problems. My fuel has 18% lube and I use that as a minimum percentage when selecting my fuels. I could use it in my other 4 strokes but they run fine on just 15%. That particular Magnum 52 isn't quite as "refined" as my Saitos or OSessess. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MtBmcXQpUYk
    Club Saito # 677-Team Boca Bearings-Star Collectibles Muscatine-Glowhead Brotherhood #19

  4. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by jeffie8696 View Post
    Been using 30% heli fuel in my Magnum 52 FS for a while, no problems. My fuel has 18% lube and I use that as a minimum percentage when selecting my fuels. I could use it in my other 4 strokes but they run fine on just 15%. That particular Magnum 52 isn't quite as "refined" as my Saitos or OSessess. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MtBmcXQpUYk
    Yes, I too have been using 15% in all of my engines for years now. Just have read some good reviews about the 30% blend and decided to give it a try. Figure, what could it hurt ? Maybe the engine !

  5. #5
    jeffie8696's Avatar
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    I am not attached to that Magnum so if she blows so be it.
    Club Saito # 677-Team Boca Bearings-Star Collectibles Muscatine-Glowhead Brotherhood #19

  6. #6
    aspeed's Avatar
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    30% is no problem, we used to run 60 and 80% with no problems. (well maybe a few broken cranks and blown plugs, and prematurely worn out piston/cyl.....)

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by jeffie8696 View Post
    I am not attached to that Magnum so if she blows so be it.
    I hear ya ! Also hard for me to get attached to anything mechanical. If they blow, they are easily replaced. Also, lesson learned.

  8. #8
    jeffie8696's Avatar
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    If my Saito gave up I would be moved, but not the Magnum.
    Club Saito # 677-Team Boca Bearings-Star Collectibles Muscatine-Glowhead Brotherhood #19

  9. #9

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    Been using 20-20 Powermaster and Cool Power full synthetic for over 15 years in everything, including helis, cars, and planes too. Never a problem. Broad needle settings, good idle, good power. Never noticed much of a gain in 30% over 20 which I tried a case of a few years ago. Save a few bucks too on 20.

  10. #10
    husafreak's Avatar
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    30% fuel is expensive but it will run fine in engines not designed for low nitro. You will get some more power for sure. You will probably need to richen the needle valve. If your engine runs cooler it will be because of the increased fuel flow through the engine. If you run lean it will get hot and die quicker.

  11. #11
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    I only ran 30% in all my Saito engines for years and years. No downside except for the cost, but I mixed my own fuel, got methanol and nitro for free, so the cost wasn't a factor for me. Usually you will have to retune the engine just slightly, but get a lower and more dependable idle. As far as more power, I'm not sure as I never ran any lower percentage, so I can't compare. Most of my engines had gallons and gallons of fuel through them without any problems. One of the twin cylinder engines is on it's second set of bearings it's so old (in an old Cub floatplane) and has had probably 100 gallons burned in it. Just make sure you have a minumum of 18% oil and you should be just fine.
    Russ

  12. #12

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    I have only run 15% in my saito's so I have little experience with them but I have run nothing less than 30% heli in my YS engines and they purr on it.
    James \"Bulldog\" Gale
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  13. #13
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    If you read the owners book for Saito engines, they recommend up to 30% fuel in their four strokes. So go ahead and use it.
    If its not a warbird, Its just a target.
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  14. #14
    husafreak's Avatar
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    I probably should add that as a heli flyer I always used to have 30% heli fuel on hand and it was easier for me to just put that in my airplane engines. My Saito 72 burns it and my YS 63 and 110 really like it. The YS engines seem to benefit from the high nitro content more than the Saito. In the last year my only nitro heli has a YS120 which burns Powermaster 20% YS fuel. The Saito 72 runs terrific on that. FYI over the years I have had zero issues with my Saito's. Wish I could say that about my 4 stroke YS's...

  15. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by jeffEE View Post
    If you read the owners book for Saito engines, they recommend up to 30% fuel in their four strokes. So go ahead and use it.
    Guess my problem is that I have been in this hobby for more years than I care to mention. Can not really admit to reading an Owners Manual lately.

    But, word of mouth is good !

  16. #16

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    I have only noticed a problem with high nitro on my Fox and Enya engines. They like 5%.
    Glow Head #6, UltraSport #70

  17. #17
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    My old Enya 45 baffle port seems a little over compressed and doesn't like any nitro. I need to look into a head shim and probably a colder plug.
    Club Saito # 677-Team Boca Bearings-Star Collectibles Muscatine-Glowhead Brotherhood #19

  18. #18
    1QwkSport2.5r's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeffie8696 View Post
    My old Enya 45 baffle port seems a little over compressed and doesn't like any nitro. I need to look into a head shim and probably a colder plug.
    If it were me, I'd add a shim or change the plug but not both right off the bat. Some Enyas used to come with 2 heads; 1 high compression and 1 lower compression. I don't know if they did this with the Schnuerle engines only or not though.

    I had a hard time getting my ST S90 to run reasonably well on 5% nitro; I ran a few quarts of FAI fuel in it after break-in because it would quit often even with the needle backed off 1000rpm from peak. It tolerates 5% now even with a Jett muffler.
    Last edited by 1QwkSport2.5r; 04-21-2014 at 07:42 AM. Reason: Fix wording.
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  19. #19
    JollyPopper's Avatar
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    I guess I would want to ask why? Why would you want to run and engine on 30% fuel if it runs ok on 10% fuel? The difference in cost is significant over time.
    \"In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice; In practice, there is\"

    Intolerance is not to be tolerated

  20. #20
    Moderator blw's Avatar
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    JollyPopper- you can usually pick up a few hundred more rpms by going up to 30%. That's a nice edge for some in competition. Some engines just run smoother with more.
    The ultimate responsibility of pilots is to fulfill the dreams of the countless millions who can only stare skyward...and wish.

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  21. #21
    jeffie8696's Avatar
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    My Magnum 52 FS runs much more stable with the 30% and I have a bunch of it.
    Club Saito # 677-Team Boca Bearings-Star Collectibles Muscatine-Glowhead Brotherhood #19

  22. #22
    1QwkSport2.5r's Avatar
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    I've noted on average 200rpm gains for every 5% nitro I add. Exception is the ST S90 I spoke of; I lost 700rpm on FAI fuel from 5% but that was when it was still barely breaking in. My Enya 4-strokes haven't shown much gain on 10% from 5% other than a wider needle window.
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  23. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by JollyPopper View Post
    I guess I would want to ask why? Why would you want to run and engine on 30% fuel if it runs ok on 10% fuel? The difference in cost is significant over time.
    Have read articles and been told that their is an increase in power and an increase in cooling with 30%. Granted the cost is significant. But I have yet to see anybody take their money to the after life. LOL

  24. #24
    JollyPopper's Avatar
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    Yes, agreed on the couple hundered RPM increase with 30% and in competition that little edge may make the difference. But in everyday flying can you even see the slight increase in speed that that 200RPM provides? I see airplanesflying at our field and I honestly can't even guess what actual speed they are going.
    \"In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice; In practice, there is\"

    Intolerance is not to be tolerated

  25. #25
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    [ But I have yet to see anybody take their money to the after life. LOL] If I can't take it with me, I'm not going! I found 15% gives a bit better idle and acceleration and is generally nicer to run with than 5 or 10%. I don't use after run oil on 10%, but do on anything higher.


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