mmattockx

Years ago I bought two used Super Tigre G19 engines. They came with no instructions or literature but I do recall the seller saying they were real screamers that liked the smaller props and high RPM. I never installed one at the time and then was out of the hobby for a number of years. I am getting back into things now and am working through my pile of R/C stuff to see where I am at and what I have. I would like to get the G19's sorted out and use them in the next while and am hoping someone here can help me out with some recommended prop sizes and a supplier for a header to use with a mousse can muffler. I am also missing a needle valve on one of them, is there a supplier of parts for these old ST's?


Thanks,
Mark

controlliner

I had one of these. It was the controll line version. It had a venturi intake 10 mm across. I had to use crank case pressure to allow it to run. It was a screamer with an 8X6. You have to use all castor oil fuel with this engine. It has a 2024 T3 connecting rod with no bushing. If you use synthetic oil based fuel, the big end of the rod will "egg" out real fast. Ask me how I know.

Bax

My Feedback: (11)

The RC version can use 8 x 6, 9 x 4, or 9 x 5 propellers.

Yes! Use an all-castor fuel. At least 20% oil content by volume.

mmattockx

Gentlemen, thanks for the information. Does anybody have a source for a needle?


Mark

flyingtigre

You've aroused my curiosity.

Are you looking for an actual G19:
(http://sceptreflight.net/Model%20Eng...281951%29.html)
or the later G20-19 or G15-19?

If one of the latter two, is it standard or R/C? If G15-19, is it Aero or Car?

mmattockx

Good questions. They aren't the original G19 you linked to, so they have to be one of the other two. I think they are R/C aero engines unless the car ones use the same prop drive/thrust washer arrangement. They certainly look the same as the rest of my aero engines. I will get a couple of pictures tomorrow and post them up for clarification.


Mark

mmattockx

Pictures of one engine and the box it came in. Hopefully this helps sort out what I have and where I can get the needle for it. For those that asked, the carb throat measures just under 7.50mm ID and the OD of the carb spigot where it seats in the engine is 9.90mm.


Thanks,
Mark

aspeed

You could try this guy for a needle. http://www.clstunt.com/products.htm It looks like they are $3 if they fit. It is more of a control line guy, but they may be the same.

mmattockx

Thanks for that, I will send them an email and see what they say.


Mark

downunder

I'm not certain but I think the ST needle valves from Stuka Stunt use a different (American) thread to the original ST needle. Best I can find on a search is this one which is for an ST G51 but ST has used the same needle since about the 60's. Seems to be a Canadian mob too.
http://hobbyhobby.com/store/product/...-Control-Line/

Your engine seems to be the plane version seeing it's got the spinner backplate and what appears to be the 5mm crankshaft so will have a front ball race. The car version used a 1/4" crankshaft and no front bearing, just a bush.

mmattockx

I just went and pulled the needle from the other G19 and it looks to be an exact twin to the one in the picture. The Stuka Stunt people have a direct replacement needle and the PA series, which has the imperial thread you mention. The HobbyHobby site lists the needle separately but says to call them for availability. Between them and the Stuka Stunt site I should be able track one down, many thanks.


It is definitely a 5mm shaft and looks like a front bearing but I can't be certain on that without pulling the backplate.


Do these things like a lot of nitro or not? I used to use nothing more than 15% and fuel is now much more expensive so I want to avoid the higher nitro contents if I can. Anybody have an idea on a muffler or header? The PO of my engines hogged out the screw holes to fit an OS muffler but I would prefer to use the correct one if I can get it.


Mark

1QwkSport2.5r

Almost all SuperTigre engines run perfect on 5% nitro fuel. That's all I use in mine along with a hot plug and they run great. They're mostly all designed for 0-5% anyway.

I can't help much on the muffler bit because if I didn't have a direct-fit muffler, I'd find one that fits or make an adapter to fit something. I don't know if the screw spacing is the same, but I have (1) muffler from a ST S29 that is sized more appropriately for a .15-.19 size engine than a .29.

aspeed

Back then, mufflers were more of an inconvenience than anything. If there was one available, it would likely heat up and rob power. A modern one would be a better bet, or a muffled half pipe.

downunder

This is one of my G15/19's with its original flow through "muffler". Randy Smith at http://www.aeroproduct.net/ is worth a try for one of his very light weight CNC mufflers if you can't find anything else to fit.

flyingtigre

The photos do make it easier to assist.

This is a G15-19 and probably aero. As Downunder said, the backplate tips it off. For its time, it was considered one of the more powerful engines in its class. I've not seen a specific recommendation as to which prop to choose for this engine but it likes to rev so possibly an 8X6 or 9X4. For breakin, a lighter prop, possibly an 8X4 and for general R/C usage a 10X4 - your prop of choice could make a difference.

Be sure that you use fuel containing castor as the lubricant or at least a high quality blend and don't let it run lean. I've mostly run 10% nitro in all ST engines but 5% works fine. Proper breakin will take time for this engine and is best done with all castor fuel.

As a guess, the carburetor is probably a MAG IV. The MAG IV was introduced when it was decided to change the rotation to normal (clockwise, viewed from carb arm end, is closed). The World Engines 1978 catalog shows the MAG IV carb number for the G15-19 as 2160545. I haven't located the number of the specific needle for this carb but it's possibly the same one that fits the carbs used in X-15 thru G21 series of FI engines.

Again, from the World Engines catalog (1978), ST shafts for their X-11 thru G15-19 Std & RC have a shaft size of .196 and thread size 5mm - .80. As of that date, larger displacements (including the G15-19 CAR), were, .275 and 1/4 - 28. An exception is the G60, 65 RV which are 5/16 and 5/16 - 24.

In reference to the bearings. Most indications are that this engine had both front and rear ball bearings (except as Downunder has noted). In referencing my old catalogs, the same case (1521) is shown for both the Aero & Car. In researching, I pulled a couple of NIP cases, One had the number 1521 on the package and it was clearly intended to have a front ball bearing. The other (part number inked out) appears in all ways to be identical to the first except that it has a brass bushing pressed in place for the front bearing. If ST used a brass bearing in this engine as they did in the G20-23, it's important to know which you have. A brass bushing in the front end requires a steel washer to protect from the force of a starter.

An alternative to tearing into the front end is to follow the old saying as it was told to me "love your engine, start it by hand, love your fingers, use a wood prop".

If you are required to have a muffler where you fly, I'd recommend a modern one rather than the ones that were used when this engine was popular. There's a Canadian company that manufacturers these so should be available at your local shop.

Should you require one, prop nuts are readily available at any good automotive supply store.

My G15 (same case) is also missing the spinner but I've left it as is. Just an appearance item but it can be machined down or replaced if you find that offensive.

I have searched thru my parts drawer and wasn't able to locate any that I figure you might require. I am not a dealer so my supply of old parts is understandably limited.

You're fortunate that all you're lacking is the needle, securing other parts are hit and miss. Treat them right and those engines should last years.

downunder

From what I understand, if it has a 5mm crankshaft then it's definitely got a front bearing. If it's got a 1/4" crankshaft then this was done to accept common flywheels for car use but there's not enough metal in the crankcase to be able to fit a 1/4" bearing so the brass bush was used instead. I don't know if a clamp on heat sink head was offered with the car version though.

flyingtigre

Sometimes we can't see for looking. I did a second look at the photos and clearly the relative size of the prop nut and the balance of the engine indicates that it's the metric nut. Appears just like the metric nut on my G15.

Before doing that however, I measured the inside diameter of the brass bearing inserted in the NIP case, and it's just large enough (,295) to handle the CAR crank (.275) and too large for the AERO (.196).

I next pulled my NIB G15-19, and thru judicious use of a flashlight and magnifying glass, I was able to determine that there was in fact ball bearings behind the drive washer. The engine, like the cases, is still inside the plastic package so measurements and viewing was taken thru the plastic. Not perfect but close enough to prove what I wanted to know. The spinner prevents my seeing what prop nut was installed hence the roundabout route that I had to take.

My engine came with a speed venturi for use in either FF or CL so can't assist further regarding the R/C carb.

I've not located any info regarding a heat sink for this engine though ST did provide one for the X21 CAR.

This thread may have wandered from your question as to where parts may be obtained but hopefully it'll prove helpful in determining which is the correct part should one ever be required.

mmattockx

Don't feel bad about digressing from my original questions. The more information the better for me on these, I am starting from scratch with them.


Mark

downunder

I have a web page with a few model engine tests at http://sceptreflight.net/Model%20Eng...sts/Index.html and the tests on the G15 may give some clues about the G15/19 seeing it's based on the smaller engine.

flyingtigre

Came across info on the G15-19 that may be worth following up if you're searching for a heat sink for this engine. Listed under " Race Car and Marine Head" in the old catalog is part 1491 - G15-19 Car. Also shown is part 2290544 for G15, G20, and X-15 Marine. The accompanying picture sure does look like a heat sink.

buzzard bait

What's the bolt spacing on the exhaust? If it''s 32 mm, which it might be, then you're in luck...just get the OS 25 FP/LA muffler. It's very good and reasonably light. If it's 27.5 mm there are tons of choices. If it's either of those there are also Bisson Pitts mufflers.

If it's in between...sorry!

Jim

mmattockx

It was an oddball distance originally but a previous owner drilled out the holes to match the OS 32.11mm distance. I will take a look at the 25LA muffler, thanks.


Mark

airnewery

hi controliner,I am from Argentina ,I am going to buiild a mini bobcat with a G19 since it has the possibility of turning upside down, however I have seen mentioned here that the rod does not have bushings, and I saw the link where recommended 2 x 1 methanol and castor , with that proportion I failed a single explosion, I have come to 4x1 and still does not work , it does with commercial fuel , the best we have available in Argentina , with 10% nitro though it feels a little hot, I think a little over the normal. Then I disarmed him and saw with great tranquility that the rod has bronze bushings or copper would not know for sure then I thought that is diferent to the yours, Given this , it would be risky using fuel blended with castor and synthetic oil ? the manufacturer claims the same quality level as the Tornado.
If necessary pressurizer will build two muffler tongue and then take pressurization
These are some pictures from mine.
I hope your apreciation on the cuestion

Thanks for your attention

proparc

If it's Super Tigre, you need to contact Randy Smith!!

Mr Cox

It looks like the Super Tigres tested here; http://sceptreflight.net/Model%20Eng...281951%29.html

Perhaps converted to RC as a DYI jobs, looks like there could be leaks around the screws that holds the carb in place...

If you are using a regular propeller you'll need to have the intake upwards, the way it is mounted now it will only run in counter clockwise direction (as seen from the cockpit).