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glow engines are fading away

Old 11-16-2017, 07:47 AM
  #101  
Mark Powell
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Originally Posted by 1QwkSport2.5r
Many people equate spark ignition with gasoline fuel. BUT... Some folks use glow fuel with spark ignition too - which is what I would do -IF- if I converted some to ignition. BUT - the added cost of the ignitions is a turn-off; for the price of a couple or few ignition units and spark plugs, I can buy a gallon of nitro and a 5gal pail of methanol
and probably some oil too for the same price or cheaper.
Yes, they do.

But it's not the ignition that causes the difference in power, it's the characteristics of the fuel - calorific value and fuel/air ratio. It's part (but not all) of the reason why 'nitro' works - it makes the engine even thirstier (an even higher fuel/air ratio) than it is on straight methanol, so you get more power.

OS now make some gasoline engine that use glow plugs, which is the opposite way around. But they are 'special' glow plugs. I won't buy one, I was fool enough once to buy the OS Wankel engine. When they stopped making the first version they stopped making the special plugs it needed too, and unlike the 'mark 2' version it won't go on regular plugs. So I am stuck with a perfectly good engine but I can't get a plug for it.

OS aren't going to catch me like that a second time
Old 11-16-2017, 07:53 AM
  #102  
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Originally Posted by Mark Powell
Yes, they do.

But it's not the ignition that causes the difference in power, it's the characteristics of the fuel - calorific value and fuel/air ratio. It's part (but not all) of the reason why 'nitro' works - it makes the engine even thirstier (an even higher fuel/air ratio) than it is on straight methanol, so you get more power.

OS now make some gasoline engine that use glow plugs, which is the opposite way around. But they are 'special' glow plugs. I won't buy one, I was fool enough once to buy the OS Wankel engine. When they stopped making the first version they stopped making the special plugs it needed too, and unlike the 'mark 2' version it won't go on regular plugs. So I am stuck with a perfectly good engine but I can't get a plug for it.

OS aren't going to catch me like that a second time
I know exactly what you mean. I bought one OS engine (cheaply) just to see if they were up to the hype. So far it runs no different or better than comparable engines - so far the liner hasn't peeled. I have a true chrome liner that I'm going to fit to that engine that should be worry free for many years. Since my first OS purchase, I had been given several OS engines - I've kept most of them to put them to the test. Really though, I'll end up selling most or all of them at some point to free up funds to buy more desirable (to me) engines. I really need to get an Enya 36-4C diesel for an upcoming project.
Old 11-16-2017, 11:15 AM
  #103  
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I'm considering adding CDI to my OS Gemini 120 twin. It will use less fuel, gain more power, and use less oil, while still running on Glow fuel. It's already a heavy engine, so adding 10 ounces wont make much difference. I think it may be a good fit for my .60 Corsair, which will need all the nose weight it can get.

I found a kit from the UK for $143 plus shipping. If over the life of the engine I use 10 fewer gallons I will have saved more than it costs.
Old 11-16-2017, 11:44 AM
  #104  
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A few companies still making engines were overlooked. There's the British Lasers. The Sanye plant in China for ASP, Magnum, and Evolution 2 strokes. Did we include Jett and Nelson? I forget. A couple years ago there were the Russian racing engines that were hand made and hard to come by.

I won't convert to electric for outdoor flying. I love glow too much for that and have never been interested in gas engines. I do have a lot of indoor electrics and they are a blast to fly. Before I moved I could hover my little coax helicopter thru the living room, dining room and into the kitchen and hover over my wife's head. She gave a Christmas gift of a larger quad copter with a very good camera that links to my iPhone, and she bought me a good indoor one with a camera. I do fly those outside trying to get up close on squirrels and critters, but it needs some mods to prevent the plastic body from loud vibrations. IMO, there's a place for electrics for flying at home but glow rules for going to the club's field.
Old 11-16-2017, 02:13 PM
  #105  
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Problem I have with electrics, can't tell when teh engine is dead and you have no more power. With Glow/Gas, very easy, it gets vewy vewy quiet, and then you say Oh S***.
Old 11-16-2017, 06:30 PM
  #106  
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the added cost of the ignitions is a turn-off; for the price of a couple or few ignition units and spark plugs,
don't forget the On/Off Switch, and the Extension Wire if needed,

on the other hand, as for Gas engines, it's rather easy to lighten them up, you could mix 1/3 Glow Fuel to 2/3 Gas and use a Glow Plug,, no Ignition Box, no Battery, No Plug, No Switch, No Wires,

Jim
Old 11-17-2017, 03:40 AM
  #107  
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. I have a true chrome liner that I'm going to fit to that engine that should be worry free for many years.

It will be worry free for years anyway, no need to change the liner.
Old 11-17-2017, 08:58 AM
  #108  
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Hobbsy, which engine are you talking about?
Old 11-17-2017, 02:37 PM
  #109  
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Originally Posted by blw
Hobbsy, which engine are you talking about?
Probably referring to the engine I mentioned - a 10FP. The true chrome liner set I have is for an OS .15 car engine (made by Duratrax); with the shorter stroke of the .10, It will become a .12 and it won't peel.

I dont care what anyone says - I've had 3 OS engines in my hands in the past year that were peeled. I don't trust them.
Old 11-17-2017, 03:33 PM
  #110  
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I flew someone's electric plane once. Everything went pretty well until the landing. I couldn't get the idle set correctly. I'll just stick with glow for the win.


carl
Old 11-17-2017, 05:34 PM
  #111  
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Actually the idling thing is what I actually like about the leckies. Powered gliders it is a bonus too. The prop never stops at the correct spot for landing though. Just to P off our OS hater here. I have had almost 100 OSs in my hand in the last year,? and one had a peeled liner. It is a .32 SX and is just starting at the very top. It is likely OK, but the bearing is gone, and I don't think I should spend good money on bad.
Old 11-17-2017, 09:53 PM
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Originally Posted by aspeed
Actually the idling thing is what I actually like about the leckies. Powered gliders it is a bonus too. The prop never stops at the correct spot for landing though. Just to P off our OS hater here. I have had almost 100 OSs in my hand in the last year,? and one had a peeled liner. It is a .32 SX and is just starting at the very top. It is likely OK, but the bearing is gone, and I don't think I should spend good money on bad.
I'm sure there are a lot of people that share your experience. There's a lot that share mine as well - they just don't raise a stink on Internet forums like I do. Doesn't matter to me either way. If someone wanted to trade me equal displacement engines of good quality - like Italian Super Tigre, Enya, Rossi, Novarossi, Picco/Skyward, etc., I'd happily pass my OS engines onto them in trade. If someone were to go that far, you'd never hear another comment from me about OS.
Old 11-18-2017, 03:42 AM
  #113  
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Originally Posted by blw
Hobbsy, which engine are you talking about?

Talking about Tim's OS, he didn't state the size, I still think the peeling liner thing is pure voodoo BS except for some badly abused ones. I have 5 LA's that I run on full synthetic fuel and they haven't peeled.The .65 and the .46 have flow as both glow and Diesel,conversions.
Old 11-18-2017, 05:59 AM
  #114  
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Originally Posted by 1QwkSport2.5r
I'm sure there are a lot of people that share your experience. There's a lot that share mine as well - they just don't raise a stink on Internet forums like I do. Doesn't matter to me either way. If someone wanted to trade me equal displacement engines of good quality - like Italian Super Tigre, Enya, Rossi, Novarossi, Picco/Skyward, etc., I'd happily pass my OS engines onto them in trade. If someone were to go that far, you'd never hear another comment from me about OS.
Too bad I live in a different country that has an expensive postal service. I have a few Supertigers I could let go for OS AX motors. I do think I would get the short end of the stick, but would still do it. Enyas would be my first to go, but I think there is only two left, and I would feel guilty to even give the one away. My Rossis and Piccos are not on the trade list.
Old 11-20-2017, 03:45 PM
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We had a lot of pics of peeled liners back then Dave. I always thought something changed in the nickel plating process. My beef with OS is the jacked up prices of parts. I refuse to pay that much.
Old 11-20-2017, 03:52 PM
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Originally Posted by blw
We had a lot of pics of peeled liners back then Dave. I always thought something changed in the nickel plating process. My beef with OS is the jacked up prices of parts. I refuse to pay that much.
They have used the same process since the SF series that they do now with the AX and LA series. They just call it "ABL" now. Same old sales/marketing crap.

Overpriced Shat.
Old 11-20-2017, 06:00 PM
  #117  
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They have used the same process since the SF series that they do now
excepted today some of those AX parts are made cheaper in China

Jim
Old 11-20-2017, 07:15 PM
  #118  
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I had a peeled 40FX and a peeled 65LA. They both had a lot of hours on them when their liners went bad, so I am not upset, and I continue to buy OS engines. I know from my work experience that plating is a fussy, demanding, hard-to-control process. Even the best military aerospace platers using the best processes occasionally have problems.

But I agree that OS/Tower Hobbies charged too much for replacement pistons and sleeves. It would have been a good gesture for them to sell piston and sleeves at their cost, given the problems we had.
Old 11-20-2017, 07:35 PM
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Originally Posted by the Wasp
excepted today some of those AX parts are made cheaper in China

Jim
Still the same cheesy single-step nickel plated junkiness at the end of the day.
Old 11-21-2017, 07:09 AM
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Originally Posted by 1QwkSport2.5r
Still the same cheesy single-step nickel plated junkiness at the end of the day.
I thought it was a two layer plating now. Still crappy nickel, that you would think they could do chrome in China.
Old 11-21-2017, 09:26 AM
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Originally Posted by aspeed
I thought it was a two layer plating now. Still crappy nickel, that you would think they could do chrome in China.
Its anyone's guess since it is basically trade secret. Whether it's single step or double step, it's still problematic. The AX and LA engines peel in the same manner that the SF and FX engines did.
Old 11-21-2017, 09:29 AM
  #122  
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When it comes to plating, not all base metals will accept chromium, and need a nickel layer applied first. That is what two step is all about. That is also how they plate plastic by applying a submetal that can adhere to plastic and that chromium can adhere to. The layers are micro thin too. A proper chrome job though will use a base layer of copper which is then polished smooth prior to plating with nickel. Nickel is used as the filler metal, and the chrome is extremely thin.

Last edited by acdii; 11-21-2017 at 09:33 AM.
Old 11-21-2017, 12:44 PM
  #123  
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I think the newer process is called ABL (layered?) The old ones are just nickel on the base metal. I have one old LA .25 that is actually blue, but it works good. Maybe the problematic ones weren't etched properly for the nickel, but the copper sticks well and then the nickel onto that. I think the hotrod stuff polishes the copper. It would be copper nickel chrome. The chrome does peel without the bumper even getting hot. I only did chromate and passivating at work. It could be troublesome when the tanks got oily or used a lot. Even chrome liners can peel in some batches. Fox tried and gave up in the end.
Old 11-21-2017, 01:06 PM
  #124  
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ABL stands for "Advanced Bi-metallic Liner". Bi-metallic means 2 metals. It sure seems pretty telling to me. What's next? ABL "type"? LoL.
Old 11-21-2017, 01:08 PM
  #125  
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Brass sleeve, nickle plated is what I found out so far.

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