Glow Engines Discuss RC glow engines

what On Board Glow Igniter to buy

Reply

Old 03-13-2018, 06:15 PM
  #1  
the Wasp
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (1)
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: VT
Posts: 2,764
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default what On Board Glow Igniter to buy

I will be buying a couple On Board Igniters, 1 for a Twin and the other for a single cylinder,, and I am just wondering what brand people feel has the better quality, and why is it better ??

can I get some input please ?

thanks !!

Jim

Last edited by the Wasp; 03-13-2018 at 06:17 PM.
the Wasp is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-13-2018, 10:34 PM
  #2  
Chris Nicastro
 
Chris Nicastro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Coeur d'Alene, ID
Posts: 2,552
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

I’ve tried a few and the one that lasted for years and was great for me was the Sullivan unit. I wore out about three plug caps on an OS 160 side mounted on a Stearman biplane. I will say the set up programming was difficult at first but once you understand what to do its ok. I ran a separate small battery pack for it and it was set to about 30% throttle. I never had a flameout dead stick landing in several seasons of flying.

For or a twin just make sure you get even rpms at idle and full power within a couple hundred rpm. It’s tough to tune within a tighter tolerance than that unless you have patience and a good tachometer. Watch your temps too.

Good luck!
Chris Nicastro is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2018, 02:55 AM
  #3  
TomCrump
 
TomCrump's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Traverse City, MI
Posts: 7,532
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

I like the on board drivers from Electro Dynamics. They are easy to install and program. They've proven to be reliable, too. ElectroDynamics GlowLite Onboard Glow Drivers

The units provide an extra sense of security, especially in my multi-cylinder models like this Magnum 1.60 twin powered Lockheed Vega.
Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

Name:	m_003 (2).jpg
Views:	16
Size:	636.3 KB
ID:	2259174  

Last edited by TomCrump; 03-14-2018 at 03:02 AM.
TomCrump is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2018, 01:41 PM
  #4  
triumphman49
My Feedback: (149)
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Decatur, AL
Posts: 402
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Might think of CDI ignition, as cost is not that much more, . . . and the glow igniters call for extra battery pack - most with CDI are using the receiver battery. Many, with stock carb are using either gas or glow fuel. CH Ignitions is a good source for CDI info and conversions.

T-man49 in Al
triumphman49 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2018, 01:42 PM
  #5  
triumphman49
My Feedback: (149)
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Decatur, AL
Posts: 402
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

T-man49 in Al

Last edited by triumphman49; 03-14-2018 at 01:44 PM. Reason: double post
triumphman49 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2018, 03:07 PM
  #6  
the Wasp
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (1)
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: VT
Posts: 2,764
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

I have been thinking about it, it's $147 w/Plug to convert a Saito 100, now add shipping of the engine, about $18 insured, now convert my Twin, 2 Plugs = $155, and shipping just went up,, now the price is over $300

Jim
the Wasp is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2018, 04:06 PM
  #7  
triumphman49
My Feedback: (149)
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Decatur, AL
Posts: 402
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Jim, Agape Racing and Hobby (and ebay) are other sources you may investigate. I've been able to spread out thru time, various conversions and am well pleased . . . . just opened a box from CH - Adrian - with my MVVS 144T. It looks great ! !

T-man49 in Al
Mike
triumphman49 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2018, 06:02 PM
  #8  
the Wasp
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (1)
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: VT
Posts: 2,764
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Mike, thank you for the info, it all looks promising, in fact I like it.. would you know if there is a thread or site that reviews the installation ??

Jim
the Wasp is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2018, 02:14 AM
  #9  
triumphman49
My Feedback: (149)
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Decatur, AL
Posts: 402
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Jim, not sure bout that, but both Hobbsy and SrTelemaster - who frequent the Saito Club forum, are highly technical folks and suspect they would be able help direct you. I was never completely satisfied with my 1st conversion attempt (before Adrian purchased CH). Magnet and sensor mount were my issues.

T-man49 in Al
Mike
triumphman49 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2018, 06:24 AM
  #10  
SrTelemaster150
 
SrTelemaster150's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Brasher Falls, NY
Posts: 3,826
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Originally Posted by the Wasp View Post
I will be buying a couple On Board Igniters, 1 for a Twin and the other for a single cylinder,, and I am just wondering what brand people feel has the better quality, and why is it better ??

can I get some input please ?

thanks !!

Jim
The best ignition for any engine over about 100 is not OBG but CDI retaining glow fuel.
SrTelemaster150 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2018, 06:27 AM
  #11  
TomCrump
 
TomCrump's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Traverse City, MI
Posts: 7,532
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Originally Posted by SrTelemaster150 View Post
The best ignition for any engine over about 100 is not OBG but CDI retaining glow fuel.
Do you have documentation to prove this, or is it just your opinion ?
TomCrump is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2018, 10:23 AM
  #12  
the Wasp
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (1)
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: VT
Posts: 2,764
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Originally Posted by TomCrump View Post
Do you have documentation to prove this, or is it just your opinion ?
I have to agree with him to some degree, an Ignition on average will produce more power, and will have the Advance so the engine will start easier when the timing is Retarded, and the Spark Plus will be much less likely to go bad in flight than a G-Plug, and because of the Advance the engine will be less sensitive to different props and Nitro percentage, and I have to wonder if an Ignition would use less battery power than an On Board Igniter,,

now on the other hand I have come to understand Glow Plugs better than I ever have before, I feel that most people, in this "Glow Plug" hobby are>, what I call> "RPM Oriented", meaning that they feel that the "more RPM the better", well for the most part it's just not true (but I do have to admit that I do like flying fast !! so I too was in that thinking that more RPM is the better)..everything I have read about Glow Plugs talks about is Heat Range, Compression, Methanol/ Nitro%, Oil types and Percentage, and Engine size,, but the one thing all those write-up do not talk about is> "Prop Size",, and Prop Size does have a Flywheel Effect on an engine and that does have an effect on how the Fuel is burned in an Glow engine,, a small prop on a given engine with a given Plug and Fuel will turns faster than a larger prop so the Fuel is burned quicker with the smaller Prop so the Glow Plug can be apt to flame out quicker or more times than it would with a larger Prop, I have seen it happen many times and I have helped people by simply telling then to put a larger Prop on their plane,,, in 1 of these cases 3 hours of changing G-Plugs and tuning on a MDS 61 did not help a bit, but when I finely stuck my nose in and told the owner to change his Zinger 9x4 to a 12x6 his problem was instantly gone, and as for changing an Zinger 13x4 to an APC 15x8 on a Magnum 160 4St, 2 weeks of tuning for him was done, and later I told this guy to change his Thunder Tiger G-plugs to OS and that too made his engine run even better,

LOL I'm getting to my point LOL ,, so if some one know's how to setup their Engine well with the correct Plug Fuel and Prop size they can make a Glow Plug work for them for years, many people have, and here too you can say the Ignition System has more things to go bad on it than just a G-Plug without an On Board system..

just my 2 cents and a Nickel too

now see, new see, I'm back right now where I stared 16 years ago, I am thinking and knowing "an Ignition with my setups will produce more power than a Glow setup"

Jim,
I'm hoping I don't have to edit,, but I did

Last edited by the Wasp; 03-17-2018 at 10:32 AM.
the Wasp is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2018, 11:11 AM
  #13  
triumphman49
My Feedback: (149)
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Decatur, AL
Posts: 402
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Hello Tom, Have followed some of Sr's posting ( and yours also) on various threads for a long time. Hoping he may choose to participate here with more info. Believe his "size" cutoff is probably due to extra on board equipment and actual benefits received from smaller engines. Leaner tuning creates some additional rpms' and fuel conservation and reduced idle speeds.

T-man49 in Al
triumphman49 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-22-2018, 09:58 AM
  #14  
Jesse Open
 
Jesse Open's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Just North of Canadian border
Posts: 473
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

The power consumption of a glow driver is tied to the amount of time spent at low speed. At high speeds it is off after all.
The CDI draws current as long as the engine is inended to run, usually higher currents as speeds increase.
You can take advantage of leaner running by using a cooler plug since the hot plug was a compromise to get a slow idle.
The colder plug will now allow you to lean out the high speed without the attending detonation.
Jesse Open is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2018, 02:40 AM
  #15  
Hobbsy
My Feedback: (100)
 
Hobbsy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Colonial Beach, VA
Posts: 18,309
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Originally Posted by TomCrump View Post
Do you have documentation to prove this, or is it just your opinion ?

Dan's documentation is his reporting here based on his experience and I can attest to the ability run at leaner settings, lower idle speeds and ***** cat starts. I have four Saitos converted, a high compression .80 @ (15.5 to 1), a Saito 1.00, a Saito 1.25, and Saito 1.50 @ (11.24 to 1). The .80 and 1.50 are set at 30 btdc and the 1.00 and the 1.25 at 35 btdc. The two high compression ones are pretty rattly at full blatt when set at 35 btdc.
and a high compression Saito 1.50, @ 11.24 to 1).
Hobbsy is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2018, 04:09 AM
  #16  
TomCrump
 
TomCrump's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Traverse City, MI
Posts: 7,532
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Thanks.
TomCrump is online now  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2018, 06:50 AM
  #17  
Joespeeder
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Davison, MI
Posts: 547
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Jim,

Lot's of good info others have posted here. I really love CDI Glow for all the benefits stated. Some of my projects have been shown when converted and the short story is they always end up CDI glow, NOT gas. For all the reasons mentioned.

Having said that, there are times I use glow drivers and the two I would recommend are Craig Engineering for multiple cylinders and SwitchGLow Pro for Singles. Check them out they are compact and really nice. The Switch Glow sips battery power at a very low rate.

I believe the SwitchGlow Pro is made by a Military Supplier that flys RC so it's a newer design. Buy ZRC SwitchGlo Pro PushGlo Shop - ZRC USA

The CraigEngineering units are good for up to 4 cylinders. Crain Engineering - Glow Plug Drivers

And of course, Adrian is great at CHIgnition for getting all the CDI stuff. I run 15% Coolpower at 35degrees as my standard. Simple and easy. SrTelemaster has shown us the way ! Thanks to his posts even guys like me can set up a CDI Glow in a simple and reliable fashion. I even helped a friend do the FG-57 piston in a Satio 180 with CDI Glow per Sr's posts. It's a really nice combo and runs like a champ in the real world. Not just on a bench test. Neither of us are what you would call engine guys. However, it was very easy and runs great.

Let use know how you make out.

Joe

Last edited by Joespeeder; 03-23-2018 at 06:57 AM.
Joespeeder is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-23-2018, 07:38 AM
  #18  
the Wasp
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (1)
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: VT
Posts: 2,764
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

a thanks to all !, it's all good info, and thanks for the links Joe ! I will look into them,

for sure I will go with the Ignition on my Saito 100T (when I find the correct plane for that engine), with an Ignition I'm betting it will produce pretty much the same power (or more) on 15% as it would with a Glow Plug burning 20% ,,

too add, I would like to try an O.B.G. unit on at least one engine, just to try it, now what engine to pick LOL

Jim
the Wasp is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-30-2018, 09:36 AM
  #19  
SrTelemaster150
 
SrTelemaster150's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Brasher Falls, NY
Posts: 3,826
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Originally Posted by SrTelemaster150 View Post
The best ignition for any engine over about 100 is not OBG but CDI retaining glow fuel.
Originally Posted by TomCrump View Post
Do you have documentation to prove this, or is it just your opinion ?
As a matter of fact I do.

https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/show...A180HC-CDI-BBC

In addition I have also done GI (glow ignition) vs CDI tests on FA-91S, FA-100, and FA-200Ti engines.

The FA-91s gained 300 RPM when tuned @ 35 degrees BTDC spark advance with the usual 20-25% fuel economy improvement.

In the case of the FA-100 the needle settings weren't leaned out significantly but RPM increased by over 600 RPM with CDI compared to GI so don't think fuel consumption decreased as much as usual.. The engine was being set up for a friend so I didn't have time for more comprehensive fuel consumption testing.

The FA-200T1 was the exact opposite. Fuel economy improved by 70% to approximately 1oz per minute at WOT. (12 minutes @ WOT for 12 oz of fuel with CDI compared to 7 minutes for GI) RPM gains were not as dramatic @ about 100 RPM.

Last edited by SrTelemaster150; 03-31-2018 at 11:22 AM.
SrTelemaster150 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-30-2018, 09:41 AM
  #20  
SrTelemaster150
 
SrTelemaster150's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Brasher Falls, NY
Posts: 3,826
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Originally Posted by triumphman49 View Post
Might think of CDI ignition, as cost is not that much more, . . . and the glow igniters call for extra battery pack - most with CDI are using the receiver battery. Many, with stock carb are using either gas or glow fuel. CH Ignitions is a good source for CDI info and conversions.

T-man49 in Al
I would never use the same battery for CDI as the RX. You would lose radio contact long before the ignition started to crap out. A 4 cell 750Mah NMh battery pack will run a single cylinder CDI @ 10000 RPM for about 45 minutes with reserve. The added weight is insignificant and can be mounted behind the firewall to help CG balance.
SrTelemaster150 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-30-2018, 09:47 AM
  #21  
SrTelemaster150
 
SrTelemaster150's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Brasher Falls, NY
Posts: 3,826
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Originally Posted by the Wasp View Post
a thanks to all !, it's all good info, and thanks for the links Joe ! I will look into them,

for sure I will go with the Ignition on my Saito 100T (when I find the correct plane for that engine), with an Ignition I'm betting it will produce pretty much the same power (or more) on 15% as it would with a Glow Plug burning 20% ,,

too add, I would like to try an O.B.G. unit on at least one engine, just to try it, now what engine to pick LOL

Jim
If your Saito FA-100T is an opposed twin you will need the uneven firing CDI with 3 magnets in prop hub ring. (1 magnet starts the firing order, the other 2 fire the plugs) The firing order is 180/540. The inline FA-200Ti is an even fire twin, (360/360) and uses 1 magnet/hall sensor like a single cylinder, but the module will have 2 plug leads.

Last edited by SrTelemaster150; 03-30-2018 at 10:07 AM.
SrTelemaster150 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-30-2018, 09:52 AM
  #22  
SrTelemaster150
 
SrTelemaster150's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Brasher Falls, NY
Posts: 3,826
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Originally Posted by triumphman49 View Post
Hello Tom, Have followed some of Sr's posting ( and yours also) on various threads for a long time. Hoping he may choose to participate here with more info. Believe his "size" cutoff is probably due to extra on board equipment and actual benefits received from smaller engines. Leaner tuning creates some additional rpms' and fuel conservation and reduced idle speeds.

T-man49 in Al
The size cutoff is geared to the space available in the airframe. A 40 size Cub (84" WS) would have ample space so an FA-91 would benefit from CDI in that case whereas a 60 size warbird might not have the space for the module and battery.

Engine size/benefit cut-off is around 91-125 depending on the airframe.
SrTelemaster150 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-30-2018, 10:06 AM
  #23  
SrTelemaster150
 
SrTelemaster150's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Brasher Falls, NY
Posts: 3,826
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Originally Posted by the Wasp View Post
I have been thinking about it, it's $147 w/Plug to convert a Saito 100, now add shipping of the engine, about $18 insured, now convert my Twin, 2 Plugs = $155, and shipping just went up,, now the price is over $300

Jim
Since the 3 cylinder radial system is similar in design to the uneven fire twin systems I would guess that the price would be about 2/3 that of the 3 cyl, systems. .67 x $235 would be about $157, round it up some and I would think $175 would get you going. Adrian has far more stuff available that what is listed. Give him a call.

Last edited by SrTelemaster150; 03-31-2018 at 11:25 AM.
SrTelemaster150 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-30-2018, 10:17 AM
  #24  
SrTelemaster150
 
SrTelemaster150's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Brasher Falls, NY
Posts: 3,826
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

Originally Posted by Jesse Open View Post
The power consumption of a glow driver is tied to the amount of time spent at low speed. At high speeds it is off after all.
The CDI draws current as long as the engine is inended to run, usually higher currents as speeds increase.
You can take advantage of leaner running by using a cooler plug since the hot plug was a compromise to get a slow idle.
The colder plug will now allow you to lean out the high speed without the attending detonation.
Single cylinder CDI systems from C&H draw about 80 Ma@ 10000 RPM. Compare that to 1500 Ma for a single cylinder OBG.

OBG draws over 18X the current as CDI when the OBG is running..

A single cylinder CDI will run @ WOT for 45 minutes with some reserve and draw the same total amps as OBG draws in less than 3 minutes @idle.

Last edited by SrTelemaster150; 03-30-2018 at 10:19 AM.
SrTelemaster150 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 03-30-2018, 12:29 PM
  #25  
the Wasp
Thread Starter
My Feedback: (1)
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: VT
Posts: 2,764
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default

n the case of the FA-100 the needle settings weren't leaned out significantly but RPM increased by over 600 RPM with CDI
can you imagine the prop you could use on that setup

Jim
the Wasp is offline  
Reply With Quote

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us Archive Advertising Cookie Policy Privacy Statement Terms of Service