ZAGNUT

My Feedback: (1)

and what exactly is your definition of "mistreating"?? anything outside of a "clean room"? the occasional lean run or microscopic speck of dust??

sorry, but in the real world an engine should be able to handle a little abuse without self-destructing


dave

Rudeboy

Indeed...

I say again: no matter how bad you treat an engine... the liner should not peel!

I have cooked engines badly over the years (yeah, I run 'em lean... too lean sometimes) but I have never had a peeled liner.
I have had engines that ate a lot of plugs... sooner or later that plug wire gets caught in a port... making a nice long scratch all the way down the liner ,through the plating, down into the brass... no peeling...

I have not run an OS engine for the last 12 or 13 years I might add for the record.

The plating should not just come loose from a plated object... if it does, there's no bond between the base metal and the plating... that is BAD PLATING!

JAKA: every engine ingests dirt, there's no way around it. Maybe there's more dirt on a dry lake bed than on a grass runway... I dunno (never seen a dry lake)... but it has nothing to do with a peeling liner...
Dirt may accelerate wear, I'll give you that, but it should be no cause for peeling... unless your engine is sucking up pebbles, but I don't think that's the case.

Flyboy Dave

My Feedback: (21)

Out with the old....in with the new. Lets give ol' Dago Red a kick in
the pants !!! This .91 should do allright.

I think one fella had it right, when he said OS should have stayed with the
quality....and priced accordingly....look at YS....[X(]

ben flyn

If this is the case, why doesn't any other engines peel like O.S. engines? Hmmm?

Flyboy Dave

My Feedback: (21)

"Other engines" use the chrome plating process for their cylinder walls. This
is superior in hardness and longivety to the cheaper and softer nickel plating
OS has been using.

This is what happens when the nickel plating lets go....the whole cylinder is shot.
For the most part, cylinders and pistons have to be replaced as a set. OS Engines
thinks we should pay $115.00 to keep their cheapened $150.00 engine running. [X(]

Virtually all the new engines manufacturers from the Orient use the superior
plating processes. Their engines cost much less, and the parts are but a fraction
of what OS "expects" us to pay.

OS Engines is "expecting" alot from customers like me....They will be sadly
dissappointed when I don't meet their expectations....

Dave.

ChuckAuger

My Feedback: (12)

Webras are nickle plated..never heard of a Webra peeling..

Bob Yeager

My Feedback: (5)

I've always been an OS booster, mainly due to my good luck with the SFs and FSRs. I have had 4 FX.46s, and they have all peeled! I'm pretty careful about filtering fuel, lean runs, and flying off pavement. As they say, "where there's smoke, there's fire!" OS definitely has some problems. I hate to say it, but after years of hyping OS, I'm looking at alternatives. I just had to throw in my 2 cents. Regards to all.

Tony R

I have a cylinder from an older 61 FSR ABC that I purchased from a swap meet. The bottom of the cylinder has peeling. There are still hone marks in the are where it peeled. At first I thought it was some type of corrosion or film, but when I scraped it, it peeled even more. I have 3 more ringed FSR's that do not have this problem. So I guess avoid the ABC non-ringed if you can.

Tony R

Newbie- Back into RC after all those years.

Flyboy Dave

My Feedback: (21)

I have three .60 FSR's, and one .61. They are all ringed. I think when they went
to the .61 they changed the plating....but I'm guessing. The .60 FSR is just about
my favorite all time best engine....

....the .61 RF was closing in on second place....then it took a dump. Quite frankly,
I was appalled when I heard the price for the parts. That is rediculous. So I guess
it was towards the end of the FSR era when they stopped chroming them.

I still hold the FSR's dear to me....I'm not an OS hater....No 60's can touch the
old FSR at my field for power and speed. I come honkin' by with the Arresti
about 125, and the Guys ask what's in that thing ? I tell them "an old 70's style
OS 60", and they all say the same thing...."your kidding ?" [X(]
The 1.08 FSR is one of the best running engines as well.

Dave.

p51b

My Feedback: (2)

Guys, the OS liner peeling problem is, by no means, a new one. My 61FSR/ABC is on its third liner/piston set, this time a 'real' ABC set from Perf. Specialties. The first one shucked out in the early 80's. It was in a tippo and was pampered and well cared for. The second one gave up the ghost while in storage and filled with after run lube. I had taken it out to clean up and run, and noticed that it was turning pretty roughly and didn't have any compression.

I have never had a peeling problem on any other engine brand in over 50 years in the hobby.

The FSR's probably represent the pinnacle of OS' production quality, and are among my favorite engines. I have two others besides the ABC, and both are ringed models. All are beautifully finished and run great - almost rivaling my beloved ST Blueheads.

Flyboy Dave

My Feedback: (21)

I called Perf. Spec. about the RF liner/set....they're out of them right now....

....sold out ! ....he said try back in a couple weeks. It took me 15 years
to wear out a 60 FSR. It had no compression whatsoever, but would still
start up and ran fine with the electric starter.

Dave.

ShempHoward

My Feedback: (3)

If Chuck Auger had an ABN DF 46 then I must stand corrected but after witnessing disassenbling of more than a few 91 DF's I have yet to see an ABN liner as they have all been true ABC. I can't even imagine an ABN liner holding up to the temps and RPMs they need to spin at??

ChuckAuger

My Feedback: (12)

Yes Shemp..The pic of the liner I posted some pages ago was indeed ABN. Wasn't a great pic...But like I said, the much newer VXDF I have is ABC..

proptop

My Feedback: (8)

That reminds me...Our former club pres. had a couple of O.S..91 ducted fan engines w/ liners that peeled on him too. This was a couple-3 years ago, and I recall him saying that the box indicates "ABC" but the plating was/ is actually Nickel.

spokman

My Feedback: (2)

My new .46FX has a two year warranty so I'm not going to baby my engine. If it peels OS gets to give me a new one!

der_steuermann

My Feedback: (2)

For anyone doubting that the OS .91 VR-DF stock piston/sleeve assembly is ABN


http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...=++&search3=Go


This text and the pic showing no shining chrome inside the liner belongs to towerhobbies (original quote):

NOTES FROM OUR TECH DEPARTMENT

This is a replacement cylinder & piston for the .91VR-DF ABC.

Features: This is a matched set. You cannot purchase the parts individually.

This is an "ABC" cylinder & piston set."A"luminum piston,"B"rass cylinder liner, with a "C"hrome plating on the cylinder.

The plating is actually Nickle but is still being labled ABC not ABN.

The inside of the liner is tapered so when the piston goes up it gets tighter. .

This has 4-ports and an alignment notch for proper installation. .

Specifiactions: Bore: .965" (24.5mm) gab3/26/94



----------------



Or just call one of the jet gurus out there (Bob Violett, Tom Cook,...)

ben flyn

Flyboy, What plug where you using in your O.S. 61 with a tuned pipe? How long did they last?

Flyboy Dave

My Feedback: (21)

I use the Fox Miracle plugs....they last forever.

Dave.

Bax

My Feedback: (11)

The Tower Tech note is wrong. O.S. Max ducted-fan engines, racing marine engines, and the racing car engines have true ABC piston/liner sets.

bax

Flyboy Dave

My Feedback: (21)

Chrome plating....or "flash chrome" or Stelite plating on engine parts doesn't
always look shiney....in fact....it looks dull....almost like galvanized....

....not shiney like a car bumper.... Likewise chrome plating in an AAC
liner....(chrome plated aluminum) is a dull grey in color when new.

Dave.

der_steuermann

My Feedback: (2)

Regarding the OS .91 VR-DF I whish this would be reality[sm=disappointed.gif]

So what to do?

Two weeks ago I sent one of my worn out OS .91 VR-DF sleeves together with the piston to Don Blackburn to Amarillo, TX. He's specialized in hard chroming for model engines. My liner is one of those original OS with nickel coated brass (ABN) construction.

I received the assembly today. Don rechromed and honed the sleeve to my specs. He made a good job. Now it features a true chrome plating with a taper fit in mint condition.

Thus I would like to recommend his service for anyone who wants to upgrade his "old" ABN liner.

ChuckAuger

My Feedback: (12)

The new ones might, the older ones don't. I could be convinced if I wasn't holding the liner from an OS 46 VRDF in my hand..... In the other hand I have an OS 46 VXDF..(hard to type with an engine in each hand ) and it's ABC...

Rudeboy

There you have it... If you want something done properly... do it yourself...!

proptop

My Feedback: (8)

I don't know how many of you guys are also into R/C cars, but there seems to be a "non-existent" problem with one (maybe more) of the high performance buggy .21's. Seems the pinch goes away quickly in the VZ-B, and a lot of guys are complaning about it, but, there is no "problem" according to O.S. people (?) It seems rather obvious, to me at least, that there's either a plating or Q.C. problem there too...

RC Fan

I just bought a 46 FX from Tower (mail order from the US to Moscow - I paid 35 bucks for the shipping) and then I read this thread[:@]

I am really put off now. This is my second 46 FX - the first is also brand new - not even run in.

So guys what's the advice - should i sell them and buy TT or GMS or Magnum. I own a TT 46 Pro and it runs great - no problems.

Also I checked the Tower website and found that TT's also have nickle plated cylinders - do TT platings also peel (GMS and Magnum are ABC's).

Incidentally I have always run my engines with 75 % methanol + 25 % pure castor oil and 0% nitro (nitro is difficult to come by). Will this fuel blend help preserve the nickle liners on the OS 46 FX??