Kmot

My Feedback: (24)

Price is relative. There are plenty of people who can plunk down $4 Grand for a toy motor, and lots more. They will sell plenty.

Maxam

My Feedback: (62)

At Toledo the rep's said the OS will cost $3000.00.

kochj

I suppose so...
I forget there very wealthy people out-and-about!

Dad_Roman

I just did a simple conversion. IIRC the site said 365000 yen.

Also IIRC thats about 3750. + collector, + shipping, yadayadayada

mmike65

Hey Guys
Just wanting to know if anybody knows if there is any plans (blueprints) for a Radial Engine in the 20cc to 30cc, or if any engine that size are being sold anywhere ? Thanks.

Wulf

My Feedback: (5)

Hi,
Sorry to say,I just got another up date from Hobby King on the Seidel 7-70 radials saying that they now have NO estimated time of arrival within the next 2 months for this item.I sent back if we could get a full refund and that the time for delivery is now unacceptable.I`ll let you what they have to say to this.Has anyone ordered direct from Seidel or their manufacturer?

Wulf

My Feedback: (5)

I just went to the HK site agin and they say they will not refund my money.They say they could not refund any shipping ($90)and would convert the rest of my full payment(money) into their bonus points-I don`t want their bonus points! I want the total amount paid by me to them including shipping refunded to me,right back into my PayPal account like any honest company would do.They have had my money long enough,this is robbery!Are there any other people here that have 7-70s ordered from Hobby King?
Lets get together on this problem.

SJN

Go to paypal, and get your money back. By far the easiest way.

radial1951

Hi mmike65,
I guess the first question has to be "Do you want to fly a plane with it?'. Next: "How many cylinders would you like?".

The Saito FA-170R3 is 28cc with 3 cylinders. 9+cc per cylinder. Never heard of any problems with them.

Technopower do 7 cylinders in 22cc and 32cc and 9 cylinders with 41cc. At 3cc and 4.5cc per cylinder these are quite small. Others may disagree, but I seriously doubt the practicality of powering a plane with an engine producing 0.1hp/pound. The above Saito 170 produces more than 0.6hp/pound. The soon to be released FA-200R3 will be better again.

Didn't Siedel do a 35cc 7 cylinder? I thought it used to be on their website....

The only drawings I know of for a radial of this size are for the Osprey 35cc 3 cylinder gas engine by the late Gerald Smith. He also did 5 and 7 cylinder versions. It is an excellent design, being fully enclosed with fuel transfer to the inlet port via the pushrod tube and rocker box. The fuel/oil mix passes through every section of the engine, lubricating and cooling as it goes. I have never heard of one being used to power a plane. It's a fairly slow revving engine weighing approx 6 pounds, the original turned a 22x10 prop at 4000rpm and idled at 500rpm! Obviously the valve timing is pretty tame compared to say a Saito which is fairly wild (just listen to the idle of the 325 radial). I guess it's been more of a model engineering project for static display and operation. It looks almost identical, per cylinder, to the Russian radial used in the Polikarpov PO-2 with one large diameter tube for both pushrods. The construction was serialised in Engineering In Miniature magazine in the 1980s(?). ps in case you didn't notice, I like the design.

There are plenty of other designs around, but nothing in that size range that I know of.

Regards, RossG
radial1951

kochj

I was in direct contact with UMS India ( if you would have read my previous post)
THey had given a (special deal) but wanted 160$ for shipping. I talked with them some more, and then
found that HK had them ( yeah ahhhaa...) and went with them,,..

Had HK delievered, I would have saved 180$ or so...
If I wanted the seidel, then I would have went back to them...
UMS makes these engines in runs...THey don't always have them avaliable...
MY guess, is that they would rather sell them from there own shop for 1500$ and make money off shipping..
Rather than give a huge discount off them by selling to Hextronix Limited (Hobby king is a sub division) in large quantity...

My guess, is that HK didn't sell enough of them to get enough money to cover the large volume they needed to sell the engines
at the price they originally had them at??? NOt sure..

No one answerd me prior when I asked if you had paid in FULL.. or partial..

Im glad I got my cash back...sorry to hear, you don't have yours/
HK looses money when they have to use paypal... this is why they don't want to send your money back...

TomCrump

With no firm delivery date, to me, it looks like HK deliberately mislead Seidell customers. Since they cannot confirm a date, it seams that they should refund the shipping costs too. Otherwise, by misleading customers, they are adding to their coffers, by providing no product or sevice.

Wulf

My Feedback: (5)

Yes I did pay full price with shipping up front.They(HK) have had my money since March 7th 2010. $1289.19. I go along with what Tom C says 100%.They are misleading their customers and stringing them along to boot with promises of earlier delivery.(2 weeks ago they said end of May.This week they say maybe in more 2 months!)I have the E-mails to prove this.
(To earlier post above)Yes I do have the PA 27% Gee Bee Y ready for the engine. :-( No engine.

I am currently working with Pay Pal to get my money back.

mmike65

Yes it would be to put on a plane. I like the looks of a 5,7,and 9 cly.
Thanks for the ifo.
Mike

Felix Barrao

I ordered my 7-70 directly from Seidel. Mr Seidel told me that the engine was in stock, I paid it next day, but I recived it 3 months after the payment !! and after several phone calls directly to Seidel.

You could phone to Seidel, and ask for the HK engines, they should know the arrival time to HK.

Good luck
Félix

the Gnome

Hello Mike, I'm flying a Technopower 7A (22cc) really often, first in a K&W Pfalz E III, then powering a 2 Meter Vellie Monocpoupe. Both models weigh about 3.5Kg and fly really nice. The glow driver has to lite the plugs all the time, the little radial turns a 16x6 Menz S prop at about 6,000 rpm. I use a glow driver from Microsens with LiPo Battery.

Concerning the Seidel issue, as having the experience of waiting about 18 months for my ST710 and looking at Your problems, I want to say, that, may be, You should realize that Seidel is a real, real small company. The production made for him in India causes quite a lot of money being paid for the production lots, so the number of engines made even is small.
I don't want to be Mr. Seidels attorney, but from him You can get excellent running and looking radials for 1/3rd of the price similar Saitos or OSes do cost, shouldn't this be the reward for some patience?

Perhaps You should collect Seidel orders, phone him and may be get special delivery conditions with a rellatively short delivery time?

Jens

Holm und Rippenbruch

S.L.engines

If I let my say;

Seidel and my competitor and a great builder myself I have bought many Seidel and I never had big problems, only a few reviews that I did the repair that was unlucky with a few Seidel ST710.

I might add that the production costs are high but you wanted to try to make things too cheap, this is the price you pay.

How can you expect to have such an engine at a price so low and it's perfect and lasting?
There are technical and general costs down automatically after which lacks quality and durability ... and this applies worldwide.
So do not pretend miracles.

If you paid a little something in return too little. If you pay the more you have the right more. And this even in service.

Pre then web surfing on your agreements with orders and delivery times I put in the midst porch of your business and with whom you have made arrangements ...


Best regards and good flying to all.


S.L. engines

radial1951

S.L.engines, your post was most eloquently stated. Especially "...costs down automatically after which lacks quality and durability ... and this applies worldwide.So do not pretend miracles."

As labour is the biggest cost in a radial engine, I guess it's logical to expect "the same for less" from a developing nation in the East. BUT, they have a LONG way to go technologically, which begs the question "Is it really the SAME for less?"... I doubt it.

Gnome, sorry I forgot about your Monocoupe with Technopower radial. I have seen photos. Nice.

Re: the Seidel issue, I paid $1440 for my Saito from Advantage Hobby compared to $1200 for the Siedel and $800 for the ASP from HK. These are not 1/3 the price, perhaps 1/3 the value. I'm sure Mr. Siedel's German built engines are excellent, as I would expect. There are so many things that can go wrong with such a venture. I hope he doesn't live to regret having the engines made in India.

Regards RossG
radial1951

Dad_Roman

Is it just me or did the Seidel 7 cyl backorder count drop from 7 to 6?

Somebody manage to get thier monies back?

Luna_Rendezvous

If you need to vent your anger about HK appalling refund policy the try their support forum.....

http://www.hobbycity.com/hobbycity/f...s.asp?TID=6830

S.L.engines

I say that like many in Europe and other countries have always had big problems to contact Mr. Seidel, to problems, sometimes the fault is not his directly, but its very unreliable dealers.

Then remember that Megnum. ASP, SC, FR400 / 5 cylinder radial are all made from the same home in China and are very very cheap products.
In Italy not very loved.

This is not to go against anyone.

The new Seidel ST-710 is not absolutely equal to the ST-770 once or as the ST-710 made in Germany. I could talk to who made them because he wanted to do for Seidel engines for me. However those made in India are different, the materials are inferior even though the processes are equal. Are also different heat treatments. Once the cams you had a hardness around 67Rk 54Rk now that the cam is consumed first, after two years must change.

So be careful what you buy .... I'm first a modeler who loves to fly and not throw away their money so I always put first in the shoes of those who buy such an engine after having waited so long to save his money .

Moreover, if the ST-710 UMS Seidel would fall not fix them but there is a buy again why so low a cost not worth repairing it would cost much more.

Greetings to all



S.L. engines


Luigi

Wulf

My Feedback: (5)

According to Wolfgang Seidel -The materials and workmanship on engine made in India(UMS) remain the same as the engines produced in Germany-And as far as venting anger,I`m not. I am sending an attachment along with this reply.This is a E-mail written to me directly to from Wolfgang Seidel.People,you can I decide for yourselves.
I hope this helps people who have ordered Seidel engines from Hobby King-I have dealt with Hobby King before and was very satisfied when I bought my ASP engines from them.In this case it`s different

Wulf

My Feedback: (5)

Attachment worked-There you go!!!!!

S.L.engines

[quote] ORIGINALE: Wulf
Secondo Wolfgang Seidel-Il materiale e di fabbricazione di motori made in India (UMS) restano gli stessi i motori prodotti in Germania-E per quanto riguarda sfogo la rabbia, mi `m no. Io sono l'invio di un allegato insieme a questo reply.This è una E-mail scritte a me direttamente da Wolfgang Seidel.People, si posso decidere per voi stessi.
Spero che questo aiuta le persone che hanno ordinato i motori di Seidel da Hobby King -Ho affrontato Hobby King prima ed era molto soddisfatto quando ho comprato il mio motori ASP da them.In questo caso si `s [diverso
/ quote]


I'm sorry but I'm not the same fatigues, I made the cover of the analyzed two types of engines and two leagues are different, I analyze the hardness of the cams and is different as well as the materials are equal only the heads and bearings. Even the tubes are of different material, arrange before were now non-magnetic magnetic etc..

I told bales because I disassembled and repaired even though many can say that they are excellent engines. And I'm the first to say with a great value for money.
In fact if they ask not hesitate to sell for that price. Indeed are advisers who do not want to spend much money.

radial1951

The stock was definitely -7 yesterday, and is -6 today. I wonder, did HK get their engines from Germany or direct from India? By the look of that email, Herr Siedel isn't very impressed. Does that mean the Indians maybe agreed to a super low price for HK, seeing that big $ carrot? The worry is that our forum members might be dragged into the mess with no engine and no money while Siedel & Co sort it out. I'm a very happy HK customer, bought heaps.Surely this sort of thing is not in the best interests of HK...

Regards, RossG
radial1951

Wulf

My Feedback: (5)

If you read my e-mail above and the attachment You will see that UMS is NOT sending any engines to Hobby King period at this time-I am requesting a refund of my money that I sent to HK for a Seidel engine-That is why number went down from -7 to -6. I canceled my order.