Glow Engines Discuss RC glow engines

Welcome to Club SAITO !

Old 12-09-2005, 09:32 PM
  #1026
William Robison
 
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Sol:

You wont hurt anything by shortening the exhaut header.
-------------------
Ernie:

The crank fit in the bearings ranges from a free fit to a light push fit. Even with hardened oil holding it, I've never had a crank that trook more than a light whack with a wooden mallet to get it out. AFTER the prop drive was taken off. It is always possible that Michael's is tighter, but he's already said he's whacked it. With the prop drive off, the crank would be out.

Bill.
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Old 12-09-2005, 09:34 PM
  #1027
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Ernie:

Sorry, I missed part of your question. Heat is not needed to get the crank out, only for the bearings.

Bill.
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Old 12-09-2005, 11:07 PM
  #1028
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Thank you Mr. Robison and good tip earlier on the location of the set screw for the throttle arm, prevented serious modifications to the firewall.
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Old 12-10-2005, 03:11 AM
  #1029
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Quote:
ORIGINAL: William Robison

Tom:

I was a partner in a Howard DGA 14 restoration about 20 years ago, the engine alone cost us $30K.

Bill.
You overpaid! Haw!
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Old 12-10-2005, 03:24 AM
  #1030
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Tom:

Quote:
You overpaid!
Maybe so, but we zero timed everything, including the engine. That made it cost more. And thinking back on it, the plane was finished in late 1989 so it wasn'r really 20 years ago.Probably got the engine in late 1988 or early 1989.

About the only major modernization was using Ceconite and butyrate dope instead of muslin and nitrate dope.

For those who don't know the plane, here's a picture.

Bill.

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Old 12-10-2005, 09:50 AM
  #1031
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Do you have any experience with the new 220. I'm especially interested in it performance, Im thinking of using 220 on my Patty Wagstaff Extra 300. All my buddies recommend a DA 50 but I like 4 strokes and want to have something different. What do you guys think?
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Old 12-10-2005, 12:48 PM
  #1032
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Bill,

I see that engine is painted yellow. We did a lot of custom engines. Painted any color the customer wanted. ANd all hardware sent out for chrome plating. That would also drive the price up. Nice Howard!

PS: I know this is off topic but let me toss it in here and then we are done with it: I had a HUGE socket designed for the hub locks on my 4WD Jeep Cherokee and thought it would be cool to have it chrome plated. I buried it in a box of hardware I was sending out for chrome plating on a R-1340 I was building. I thought I was being slick and it would not be known till I got 'my' hardware back. Little did I know at the time, the stock clerk took those boxes of hardware and inventoried every single nut, washer, and bolt so the customer could get billed for it. He saw my socket, and sent it out anyway. I got it back and it was nicely chromed and then he told me 'everyone' in the shop knew about it! [X(] lol...took a while to live that one down.
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Old 12-11-2005, 09:15 PM
  #1033
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Here is the FA 91 on the Funtana 40, had to butcher the cowl anyway.
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Old 12-12-2005, 01:04 PM
  #1034
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Hello number 60 here,
I managed to get hold of a velocity stack for my 82. When fitted there is a very large gap between the stack and the carb because of the recess on the carb. Am I missing somehing here or have I got the wrong part?

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Old 12-12-2005, 01:49 PM
  #1035
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A340:

The carb was designed to have a choke slider between the carb and the stack. To get full benefit of the stack the gap needs to be sealed.

Looking at the end of the carb before you put the stack on you'll see a groove around the inlet. This was for a Teflon ring intended to seal the choke. Using a suitable diameter tubing you can make a short sleeve to fit the groove with the necessary length to close the gap. Many other ways to do it too.

If you do use a metal sleeve be sure to use some RTV, JB Weld, or something to hold it firmly, not allowing it to vibrate.

HTH.

Bill.
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Old 12-12-2005, 04:33 PM
  #1036
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solafein, why did you have to cut all that on the bottom for the muffler. You pretty much cut all of the bottom out. Couldn't you just cut out a hole right at where the muffler is?

Thank you Bill for your help. I will look into this. I just want to take it out. Is the part that I'm taking off to get the crank out hard to get back on.

And you say that I would have to put the engine in the oven (well I'd have to have heat) to get the bearings out?

Thanks again

~Michael~
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Old 12-12-2005, 04:46 PM
  #1037
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Michael:

No special tool required for putting the prop drive back on. The first time you put a prop on the engine the drive and its cone will lock in place.

Heat is necessary to get the bearings out easily. The front bearing can be pressed, it's easiest just to use heat and do both bearings at the same time.

Bill.
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Old 12-12-2005, 04:50 PM
  #1038
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Bill,
When checking valve clearance what method do you recommend to find the correct piston position.
Do you personally even use a gauge or do you do it by feel?
Thanks!
JLK
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Old 12-12-2005, 05:04 PM
  #1039
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Thanks William, sounds simple now you have explained it. [sm=thumbup.gif]

Leigh.
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Old 12-12-2005, 06:29 PM
  #1040
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John:

with the rocker cover off you can watch the valve rockers move. turning the engine in its normal direction of rotation you will see the ehaust rocker move to open its valve, then as it closes the intake rocker will move. Then rocking the crank back and forth get to the position where both rockers have their valves just open a little bit. Pull the glow plug and use a toothpick or similar probe to feel the piston position. This way it's easy to find TDC as close as we need to. Use a "Sharpie" or similar to out a marker on the prop drive washer in line with the casting mark on the front of the case. Turn the crank exactly one turn, you're in the right position for valve adjustment.

For the cams that accept the 0.0005" adjustment I will turn the adjuster screw to zero lash, when the locknut is tightened the stretch in the threads will leave you with just enough clearance to feel, this is fine.

The cams with a quieting ramp normally are set using a dial gauge here. One alternate is using a feeler strip of 0.0015" thickness, this is just barely under the minimum clearance, and again the stretch of the threads will add the litttle extra needed. Lacking a feeler strip two thicknesses of cellophane from a cigarette pack is very close.

Another faster way to get to the adjustment position is just turning the prop. You can feel the engine come into compression, as you continue to turn the prop you will feel the crank go over the top and the piston start pushing the crank down. That point of balance bertween the piston going up and down is the adjustment position.

Enough for one session.
--------------------
Leigh:

You are very welcome, sir.

Bill.
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Old 12-12-2005, 07:02 PM
  #1041
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Saito 150
Bill I need your help. While I was fitting the cowl on my new plane I might have gotten a tiny piece of fiberglass down the high speed valve while the screw was out. I always cover the hole while doing work like that but the last few fittings I got in a hurry and removed the stopper. The Saito 150 ran perfectly before when I tested the tank and checked the mount/firewall, etc for vibration.
Then we got lucky here in Okla and had a perfect day 6mph due north breese. Took it out to the field and we knew something was not right when the high speed needle would not richen the motor anymore. I even think I know exactly when I did the stupid deed as I carved a tiny area around the needle hole on the cowling top.
What should I do ?
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Old 12-12-2005, 07:11 PM
  #1042
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Kurt:

That's a simple one. Pull the HS needle, fuel hose, and the throttle barrel. Then with an air gun blow it out from the throttle side out through the threaded part for the HS needle. Your FA-150 should have the sleeve metering low speed, you'll need to be sure there isn't any trash inside it before you put the throttle barrel back in. You'll have to pull the cowl, hopefully the engine can stay in place for the rest.

If a bit of fiberglass has passed through the spray bar it will have been too small to do any damage before being blown out the exhaust.

Bill.
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Old 12-12-2005, 07:14 PM
  #1043
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Thank you !! That's good news. Will get 'er done.
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Old 12-12-2005, 07:53 PM
  #1044
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Thank you for your help Bill. I appreciate that. I will try to get everything out later in the week. I'm just wanting to get the whole engine apart.

Thanks

~Michael~
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Old 12-12-2005, 08:05 PM
  #1045
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That was it Bill. I managed to remove the carb without taking the engine off the mount and as I was sliding the barrel out I saw a tiny piece of crap fall out. It was the fiberglass particle. Thanks again.
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Old 12-12-2005, 08:06 PM
  #1046
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All:

Here are some shots of valve adjusting. First on the overhaul stand, a CU showing the indicator plunger on the rocker, using a flex stand for an installed engine, finally the 0.0015" feeler being used.

Bill.

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Old 12-12-2005, 08:12 PM
  #1047
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Kurt:

Glad you got it. I'd still advise giving it a "Blow Job" to be sure there's not another bit in there.

Bill.
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Old 12-13-2005, 12:08 AM
  #1048
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Quote:
solafein, why did you have to cut all that on the bottom for the muffler. You pretty much cut all of the bottom out. Couldn't you just cut out a hole right at where the muffler is?
I was being stupid and cut the exhaust manifold down to fit the exhaust inside the cowl, I didn't quite estimate it correctly. At the field, when I maidened it, someone pointed out that I needed better cooling, so I opened it up a little. I then ended up with a nice big burn mark on the bottom of the cowl where the muffler was laying. After cutting away the burnt cowling I realized that the hack job needed a little more not to look so bad. My exhaust also came loose and blew a hole into the balsa piece below the firewall. The moral of this story is not to mess with the manifold and just cut the cowl the necessary amount to clear. Performance Specialties also makes a nice flex exhaust that will prevent all this hacking. I should have put a FA82 in it and avoided this all together, but the 91 flies it so nice. Cruise at 1/4 throttle and hover at 1/2. Give it full juice and watch it become a little tiny dot in the sky. I think the Funtana 40 is made for the Saito FA91.

Bill:
The nut that holds the rod that holds the baffle and end piece in place came loose sometime during my feeble attempt at the sportsman sequence. These pieces are now missing. I now have an interesting opportunity. Will the stock exhaust, muffler and manifold for around $43.24 from Horizon, meet NSRCA regulations for sound, or do I need the flexible exhaust and tuned pipe, $155.92 from Horizon, to meet the regulations with a FA 91? The rules state that I am allowed 96 decibels measured 3 meters from the airplane centerline and 94 decibels if an earth or short grass field must be used. I like the FA 91 so much I am putting one in my 40 sized pattern trainer as well.
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Old 12-13-2005, 12:18 AM
  #1049
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Sol:

That limit at 96 db is really loud, so I don't think the stock exhaust would have any trouble meeting it. Wander about and listen to other planes that you know comply, and make your own guesstimate. Personally I'd much rather spend $44 than $156 for something that wouldn't do any better than the $44 parts.

Bill.
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Old 12-13-2005, 07:13 PM
  #1050
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>>> Here is the FA 91 on the Funtana 40, had to butcher the cowl anyway >>>

Nice job! Hard to make it balance, or easy?

Ernie
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