Welcome to Club SAITO !
01-15-2019, 07:43 AM
What do you need? I have a LOT of parts for the big Saito singles on hand. Pretty popular around here.
01-15-2019, 07:43 AM
Yep I agree i am just saying my lazy approach to engine care has been my ticket for a long time. Most of the engine’s i have repaired. Have been ones that they run a couple times stuck them in the corner and then sell on eBay because there all stopped up.
I always say there is no go to method. If it works for you then stick with it.
I always say there is no go to method. If it works for you then stick with it.
01-15-2019, 07:55 AM
Right now just a couple gasket sets and carb rebuild kits for a GN and a std 150.
More of a general question at this point for reference going forward.
01-15-2019, 07:57 AM
Yep I agree i am just saying my lazy approach to engine care has been my ticket for a long time. Most of the engine’s i have repaired. Have been ones that they run a couple times stuck them in the corner and then sell on eBay because there all stopped up.
I always say there is no go to method. If it works for you then stick with it.
I always say there is no go to method. If it works for you then stick with it.
01-15-2019, 07:57 AM
How often do you fly? Which Saito engine and how many hours?
I did replace the bearings in my first Saito, an open rocker thirty many years ago .The rest is original. Also had some varnish problems in the early days. Made changes in several areas that have worked out well. Well enough that I continue to use them and often make those changes for others at their request.
01-15-2019, 08:03 AM
Never said the wear was immediately apparent.
Also been VERY clear that indeed you can use too much castor
Proper engine clearing and after run oiling minimize the tendency to varnish. Avoiding lean runs from tachometer chasing that last 200 RPM helps too
I didn't knee jerk react to observations of varnish from too much castor as so many have done It is a matter of finding an effective balance.
After forty years with four strokes and plenty of raw evidence from all types of fuel, store bought and custom blended, I stay with the low dose castor program based on solid observation. Not limited to my own engines but several times that from other owners.
The gallon or two a month flyer may never realize the diffeernce but it is there.
Also been VERY clear that indeed you can use too much castor
Proper engine clearing and after run oiling minimize the tendency to varnish. Avoiding lean runs from tachometer chasing that last 200 RPM helps tooI didn't knee jerk react to observations of varnish from too much castor as so many have done It is a matter of finding an effective balance.
After forty years with four strokes and plenty of raw evidence from all types of fuel, store bought and custom blended, I stay with the low dose castor program based on solid observation. Not limited to my own engines but several times that from other owners.
The gallon or two a month flyer may never realize the diffeernce but it is there.
Appreciate a voice of experience. Priceless. I have enjoyed a long conversation with Mr Kelly of Merlin glow plugs ( highly recommended) on this subject also. Absolute wealth of experience.
Thanks for sharing yours!
01-15-2019, 08:13 AM
Well i have two 56’s I bought for a twin
in the 90’s and at that time i flew about every day. The last couple years mot so much. I finally put them in that twin and adjusted the valves. The 91’s and 80’s not as much time. But I also find that i have enough engines now that none of them get slammed like they used too.
in the 90’s and at that time i flew about every day. The last couple years mot so much. I finally put them in that twin and adjusted the valves. The 91’s and 80’s not as much time. But I also find that i have enough engines now that none of them get slammed like they used too.
01-15-2019, 08:13 AM
Yep I agree i am just saying my lazy approach to engine care has been my ticket for a long time. Most of the engine’s i have repaired. Have been ones that they run a couple times stuck them in the corner and then sell on eBay because there all stopped up.
I always say there is no go to method. If it works for you then stick with it.
I always say there is no go to method. If it works for you then stick with it.
I hear people all the time who claim not changing their car oil worked great for them too. Then again they sell the car with only 20,000 miles on the clock.Worked fine.
I would rather buy a car with 50,000 and good oil at the prescribed intervals regardless how well the other guy did at 20K . Apples and oranges.
The strawman thing that gets thrown in all too often. No need to bash a reasonable dose of castor based on observations from too much castor oil, improperly used
01-15-2019, 08:18 AM
I have talked with Mr Kelly often.(Glow plugs, colder plugs with OBG , etc) Missed him at the Toledo show last year. Hope he makes it this year.
01-15-2019, 08:19 AM
Read a story the other day about a guy who instead on running 10/40 and the mechanic tryed to tell him that was not good for your engine. He got upset of course. When the car left it was clattering from to much viscosity.
I sold oil for awhile and man some people are definitely stuck in the past.
But yes if a little caster makes people happy then go for it.
I sold oil for awhile and man some people are definitely stuck in the past.
But yes if a little caster makes people happy then go for it.
01-15-2019, 08:39 AM
I have seen many flat tappet engines where the owners tried to use non ZDDP oil. The guy at the auto parts said it would be fine in many cases.
Of course, cam and lifter wear was excessive!
We didn't mind replacing the cam and lifters, and they didn't mind using modern oils containing old oil additive ZDDP.
Already discussed that, sorry
Extending the life of any engine makes me very happy.
A similar story to yours, but the other way round
"Is 5W-40 Motor Oil Now Suggested For EcoDiesel Engines?
August 4, 2016 By Marc Roden
(photo credit: trucktrend.com)
EcoDiesel engines are being switched from 5W-30 motor oil to 5W-40 and apparently there is a good mechanical reason for it.
Update August 2016: We now offer an aftermarket oil filter for the Ram 1500 and Jeep Grand Cherokee with the EcoDiesel engine There’s an online commotion brewing regarding a technical service bulletin (TSB) released by Fiat-Chrysler (FCA) on July 20, 2016. The bulletin pertains to an engine oil upgrade from 5W-30 to 5W-40 for the 2016 Ram 1500 and Jeep Grand Cherokee models with the EcoDiesel engine. This bulletin directs Chrysler-Jeep dealers to drain the factory-fill 5W-30 motor oil and replace it with 5W-40 motor oil. You can TSB-18-078-16%20Oil%20Spec%20Change%20%282%29.pdf.Addendum cards have also been shipped to dealers which are to be added to owner’s manuals. These cards recommend the use of synthetic 5W-40 engine oil that meets the FCA Material Standard MS-10902 and API CJ-4 specifications.Some Dodge dealers we spoke to seem to think that this recommendation applies only to 2016 EcoDiesel models. Based on the language in the bulletin, it’s easy to arrive at that conclusion. But there is more to this story.Why Is 5W-40 Now Recommended For The EcoDiesel Engine?
It took some digging, but we think we may have found the answer. We spoke to several Dodge dealers and also FCA Customer Care. Few had even heard of the engine oil changeover or they simply read back the bulletin. But a service manager at a Salt Lake City Dodge dealership had heard all about the reason for this oil switch from an FCA warranty official.Apparently the 3.0L EcoDiesel engine is experiencing an unsettling number of main bearing failures. FCA is laying the blame on the thin viscosity of 5W-30 engine oil. They believe that the thicker viscosity of 5W-40 engine oil will cure this issue. This service manager suggested that all model years will have a 5W-40 recommendation and that 5W-30 engine oil will be obsolete for the EcoDiesel engine."
https://www.oildepot.ca/5w-40-motor-...iesel-engines/
Of course, cam and lifter wear was excessive!
We didn't mind replacing the cam and lifters, and they didn't mind using modern oils containing old oil additive ZDDP.
Already discussed that, sorry
Extending the life of any engine makes me very happy.
A similar story to yours, but the other way round
"Is 5W-40 Motor Oil Now Suggested For EcoDiesel Engines?
August 4, 2016 By Marc Roden
Update August 2016: We now offer an aftermarket oil filter for the Ram 1500 and Jeep Grand Cherokee with the EcoDiesel engine There’s an online commotion brewing regarding a technical service bulletin (TSB) released by Fiat-Chrysler (FCA) on July 20, 2016. The bulletin pertains to an engine oil upgrade from 5W-30 to 5W-40 for the 2016 Ram 1500 and Jeep Grand Cherokee models with the EcoDiesel engine. This bulletin directs Chrysler-Jeep dealers to drain the factory-fill 5W-30 motor oil and replace it with 5W-40 motor oil. You can TSB-18-078-16%20Oil%20Spec%20Change%20%282%29.pdf.Addendum cards have also been shipped to dealers which are to be added to owner’s manuals. These cards recommend the use of synthetic 5W-40 engine oil that meets the FCA Material Standard MS-10902 and API CJ-4 specifications.Some Dodge dealers we spoke to seem to think that this recommendation applies only to 2016 EcoDiesel models. Based on the language in the bulletin, it’s easy to arrive at that conclusion. But there is more to this story.Why Is 5W-40 Now Recommended For The EcoDiesel Engine?
It took some digging, but we think we may have found the answer. We spoke to several Dodge dealers and also FCA Customer Care. Few had even heard of the engine oil changeover or they simply read back the bulletin. But a service manager at a Salt Lake City Dodge dealership had heard all about the reason for this oil switch from an FCA warranty official.Apparently the 3.0L EcoDiesel engine is experiencing an unsettling number of main bearing failures. FCA is laying the blame on the thin viscosity of 5W-30 engine oil. They believe that the thicker viscosity of 5W-40 engine oil will cure this issue. This service manager suggested that all model years will have a 5W-40 recommendation and that 5W-30 engine oil will be obsolete for the EcoDiesel engine."
https://www.oildepot.ca/5w-40-motor-...iesel-engines/
Last edited by Jesse Open; 01-15-2019 at 09:01 AM. Reason: https://www.oildepot.ca/5w-40-motor-oil-now-suggested-all-ecodiesel-engines/
01-15-2019, 09:27 AM
01-15-2019, 09:41 AM
Yep, that would be him, Aldon.
Sorry to learn of his passing at the young age of 78. He was always a must see at the Toledo RC Show. I was hoping last year that his absence was not due to health issues.
Sorry to learn of his passing at the young age of 78. He was always a must see at the Toledo RC Show. I was hoping last year that his absence was not due to health issues.
01-15-2019, 11:43 AM
My Feedback: (1)
Of the 4 used saitos I've rebuilt they all had damaged cams and lifters. I assumed from the beginning that it was due to poor valve lash maintenance. Now I'm not so sure. With this latest used 82 having valve sticking problems I'm wondering if it could it have been the use of too much castor in the fuel. It's too late for me to tell if sticky valves contributed to the cam and lifter failures on the first three saitos because I tore them down and cooked them for 24hrs at 175°f in antifreeze. All of the castor varnish was removed before rebuilding those first three. This latest 82 though has been an eye opener.
I've always been afraid to run too little castor in any model engine and so I tend to err on the side of caution. Perhaps that's not a bad idea with 2 strokes but obviously not such a good thing with 4 stroke glow engines.
I think I'll add "Too much castor" to my list of things that can cause cam and lifter failures ie sticking valves. Not to mention sticking lifters that are gummed up and won't spin in their bores.
I think you all who have said to run a low percentage castor eg 2-3% are right on. No castor? I'm just not there yet.
I've always been afraid to run too little castor in any model engine and so I tend to err on the side of caution. Perhaps that's not a bad idea with 2 strokes but obviously not such a good thing with 4 stroke glow engines.
I think I'll add "Too much castor" to my list of things that can cause cam and lifter failures ie sticking valves. Not to mention sticking lifters that are gummed up and won't spin in their bores.
I think you all who have said to run a low percentage castor eg 2-3% are right on. No castor? I'm just not there yet.
now how are these Saito cams a bit different than a "High Ratio Rocker Cam" made for an oval racing Chevy, well these Saito cams do have more lift, and the Saito Tappets have a small diameter, so they both can wear at a faster rate, but more performance. so as Jesse points out, I can see that the thicker Castor will help reduce wear on Saitos cam and tappets,
a bit more info on the "High Ratio Rocker Cam", when one of these Cams are used in a Chevy small block, the diameters of Chevy's Lifter Boars must be enlarged so the larger diameter Ford and Dodge Lifters can be uses. and the larger the Lifter's Diameter is the broader the cam's Nose can be made. and these "Shaft type" High Ratio Rockers can have a ratio well over 2 to 1, while a Chevy SB after market Non-Shaft Roller Rocker only go up to somewhere around 1.75 to 1 or 1.80 to 1, a stock Chevy SB rocker is 1.5 to 1
I hope I have helped
as for me, if I ever have the chance to build the engine I want, it will be a 416 Chevy SB with a Dart Block, and forget the Roller Cam, I will have to have what I want, a High Ratio Rocker Solid Lifter Cam, I will not care if other cars are faster, there is always a bigger fish, and I will not care if the oil cost more, I am a fan of Flat Tappet Solid Lifter cams and the HRRC is the best of them.
Jim
Last edited by the Wasp; 01-15-2019 at 11:52 AM.
01-15-2019, 12:24 PM
There used to be an annual swap meet in Waukesha, a rather large one, and they moved it two years ago to the north side of Milwaukee, putting it too far away for me to attend. There are fewer and fewer swap meets, and those that I have attended recently have been pretty sparse, there were more commercial vendors selling cheap trash arf and drones than anything else.
01-15-2019, 03:09 PM
Every bit of that is spot- on. If not for the fact it is merely a 75 minute ride, I would have dropped out quite some time ago.
Still worthwhile to stock up on props from Lanyu and for many folks to get a good break on glow fuel.Used to be a good place to buy Klotz and nitromethane too. Have to see how that lays out this year.
Hard to lay the current state of the hobby on tha club, but disconcerting none the less
Probably make the trek again this year, Not sure why, habit I guess,
Still worthwhile to stock up on props from Lanyu and for many folks to get a good break on glow fuel.Used to be a good place to buy Klotz and nitromethane too. Have to see how that lays out this year.
Hard to lay the current state of the hobby on tha club, but disconcerting none the less
Probably make the trek again this year, Not sure why, habit I guess,
01-16-2019, 05:23 PM
Well, looks like PSP is not making anymore run in stands. They have shown out of stock for months now. Guess I found a use for my mill after all. Time to get a couple small slabs of aluminum. Need a T cutter for the slots, and already have a plan in my head that I need to put down on paper. I have a Tatone for the smaller engines, but need one for the big gas engines.
01-17-2019, 02:51 AM
Goddam it dave every time i think you take a step forward and buy something good like a keleo exhaust ring you ruin it by buying a smelly two stroke,posting pics of graupner props and riding a harley etc.
01-17-2019, 02:56 AM
acdii
Good deal,
Pics will be appreciated. What size T cutter are you looking for?
Looks like with all these store bought products falling by the wayside; Model builders will be getting a bit more opportunities.
Good deal,
Pics will be appreciated. What size T cutter are you looking for?
Looks like with all these store bought products falling by the wayside; Model builders will be getting a bit more opportunities.
Last edited by Jesse Open; 01-17-2019 at 03:01 AM.
01-17-2019, 04:33 AM
My Feedback: (102)
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Colonial Beach, VA
Posts: 20,370
Likes: 0
Received 25 Likes
on
25 Posts
Awe Pete, you gotta cut me some slack, my four strokes outnumber the two strokes, 15 Saitos, 2 OS to 5 OS la's, 2 Super Tigre's, a 2300 and a 4500, 5 Fox'.
Last edited by Hobbsy; 01-17-2019 at 04:38 AM. Reason: Correction
01-17-2019, 04:39 AM
Very happy to report ZERO two strokes here. None to come either....
YS, Saito, Enya and OS. Every single one a four stroke
Last edited by Jesse Open; 01-17-2019 at 04:44 AM.
01-17-2019, 05:43 AM
Well, looks like PSP is not making anymore run in stands. They have shown out of stock for months now. Guess I found a use for my mill after all. Time to get a couple small slabs of aluminum. Need a T cutter for the slots, and already have a plan in my head that I need to put down on paper. I have a Tatone for the smaller engines, but need one for the big gas engines.
