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Thread: Club Enya


  1. #1076

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    RE: Club Enya

    ORIGINAL: Kostas1

    Bruce,

    i am amazed, 10k @ 13x6 ; These are awesome numbers.


    That sounds like the same rpm that I am getting with my latest Enya 80-4C engine(s). I also have a few of the 60-4C engines, which are the same engine with a slightly smaller bore.

    I'm not saying that these old Enyas are as good as the modern day Saitos. Especially since I have many of today's Saito engines. But I am saying that the Enya four-strokes have a different personality, a good one, and they do a great job of flying models where the absolutely lightest weight or top rpm are not required.


    Ed Cregger
    \"Practice makes prefect\"

    Saito Club Member #52

  2. #1077

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    RE: Club Enya

    Holm,

    Did you lapp those valve seats with some compound? I'd like to try that on my cylinder head that has the nicked exhaust valve seat. I'd love to show you a picture, however, the engine is all assembled at this point. It's a real pain in the butt to get the valves out of the VT-240 cylinder head because the design uses split clips to hold the valve spring on. It took me nealry 45 minutes to get the two clips on. I did it inside of a plastic bag in case they sprung off.

    I will try and take a picture when I take it apart to replace the cylinder head. The nicks are VERY small though and I had to use a 10x power eye loop to see them.

  3. #1078

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    RE: Club Enya


    ORIGINAL: umd pru

    Holm,

    Did you lapp those valve seats with some compound? I'd like to try that on my cylinder head that has the nicked exhaust valve seat. I'd love to show you a picture, however, the engine is all assembled at this point. It's a real pain in the butt to get the valves out of the VT-240 cylinder head because the design uses split clips to hold the valve spring on. It took me nealry 45 minutes to get the two clips on. I did it inside of a plastic bag in case they sprung off.

    I will try and take a picture when I take it apart to replace the cylinder head. The nicks are VERY small though and I had to use a 10x power eye loop to see them.


    If the cylinder with the nicked valve seat isn't obviously less powerful than the other cylinder, then you are worrying for naught. Just fly it and don't worry about it.


    Ed Cregger
    \"Practice makes prefect\"

    Saito Club Member #52

  4. #1079

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    RE: Club Enya

    Guys,
    A trick that I used to lapp the valve seats on my Enya VT-240 is per the following. Remove springs and clips on each valve stem. Drive the valve stem with small fuel line tubing and connect it to a Dremel tool. I installed a drill bit into the Dremel tool and then you have a flexable drive line with the fuel line to the valve stem. I used rubbing compound on the seats and spun the valve up at a very slow speed. It gave me a perfect seal, but now the valve is matched to that seat. Do not mix them up. Also do not over-rev the valve during the lapping process.

    This worked for me on a VT-240 and a R120,
    Jim Meighan

  5. #1080

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    RE: Club Enya

    @umd pru:

    I've used a mixture of some chrome polish paste and cigarette ash to lap the valves, nothing other used as a screw driver.
    The valves of the Enya 120 have a slit to fit the screw driver like a ordinary slotted screw. If the 240 dont have those slits use the fuel line trick described
    above from jameighan but I wouldn't use a Dremel for that, think the fingers are enough. The Valves and the seats aren't regenerating itself if they are
    worn out.
    The split clips on the 120 are the same as you described. I think you have R120 Heads on The VT240, slightly bigger valves as on the standard 120 that I have.
    There shouldn't be much lapping necessary to get a good seal, it is better to lap only slightly, test the seal with alcohol and repeat..


    @NM2K:
    The performance of the cylinder is one thing, but if the engine is idling the remaining compression can be to small to keep the cylinder firing.
    At full power you will barly notice the leaking head, the symptoms that umd pru described are exactly like that.

    Kind Regards,

    Holm

  6. #1081

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    RE: Club Enya


    ORIGINAL: tiffitech

    @umd pru:

    I've used a mixture of some chrome polish paste and cigarette ash to lap the valves, nothing other used as a screw driver.
    The valves of the Enya 120 have a slit to fit the screw driver like a ordinary slotted screw. If the 240 dont have those slits use the fuel line trick described
    above from jameighan but I wouldn't use a Dremel for that, think the fingers are enough. The Valves and the seats aren't regenerating itself if they are
    worn out.
    The split clips on the 120 are the same as you described. I think you have R120 Heads on The VT240, slightly bigger valves as on the standard 120 that I have.
    There shouldn't be much lapping necessary to get a good seal, it is better to lap only slightly, test the seal with alcohol and repeat..


    @NM2K:
    The performance of the cylinder is one thing, but if the engine is idling the remaining compression can be to small to keep the cylinder firing.
    At full power you will barly notice the leaking head, the symptoms that umd pru described are exactly like that.

    Kind Regards,

    Holm


    Did you catch the part in his post where he said he needed to view the scratch with a 10x magnifier to even see it? That seems way to small to effect how the engine runs, to me.


    Ed Cregger
    \"Practice makes prefect\"

    Saito Club Member #52

  7. #1082

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    RE: Club Enya

    Yes you are right. This is very small for the described effect.
    Tere are another possibility for the leak: a bent valve...

    Kind Regards,

    Holm

  8. #1083

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    RE: Club Enya

    Thanks for the insight gentlemen. My VT-240 is a VERY low time engine. I'd estimate a MAXIMUM of 20 hours of run time so it's not a matter of the valve/seat being worn out. Something either went through the engine or the defect has been there since it was manufacutured.

    The head on the VT-240 is NOT the same head as on the 120 engines due to the intake manifold geometry and design. both heads on the VT-240 are identical and interchangable and both valves are interchangable. I took apart a friends Enya 120 on Wednesday and found the intake valve is bigger than the exhaust valve as is usually the case.

    My VT-240 needs a new cylinder head because I felt that the nick in the valve seat wouldn't be repairable. It's a VERY VERY small nick but one which crosses the seat boundary and **could** allow for a bad compression seal. I don't have any means of measuring the compression, however, I can tell you that the cylinder with the nicked seat head skips badly at idle but it still runs fine at higher throttle settings. Another data point is the exhaust manifold temperature is higher on the nicked seat head than on the other head. My father, who has been in aviation all his life, told me that higher exhaust gas temperatures on a particular cylinder usually indicates an exhaust valve problem. Now, the difference is small - the bad cylinder runs about 20-30 ΒΊF hotter than the other good cylinder and it still runs and produces good power at mid-high throttle which leads me to believe that it would be worth while to attempt to lap the valve seat with some compound before turning this cylinder head into an office desk decoration.

    I'm going to get some regular automotive valve lapping comound at autozone and attempt to lapp this sucker in by hand. It can't hurt at this point. Ken Enya processed my order last night and a new cylinder head is winging it's way eastward (or westward? I don't know).

    The valves in the VT-240 DO have slots in them such that a screw driver could be used to rotate them. I was considering that approach but was apprehensive about damaging these small - and seemingly fragile - valves. I really like the fuel tubing/dremel idea and will probably go with that.

    If the cylinder with the nicked valve seat isn't obviously less powerful than the other cylinder, then you are worrying for naught. Just fly it and don't worry about it.
    I'd love to just forget about it and fly it, however, I HATE having an engine that is not 100%. I've flown my fair share of A/C with finicky engines and I was never able to completely trust the engine and enjoy the airplane.


    Tere are another possibility for the leak: a bent valve...
    I've considered that too and I ordered a valve along with the cylinder head.

    I should have been clearer in my description of the issue. I *CAN* see the defect with my naked eye, however, you can REALLY see it with the small eye loupe. I'll see about pulling the cylinder head tonight or tomorrow morning and getting a picture of the problem.

  9. #1084

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    RE: Club Enya

    Please dont use any automobile lapping compund, it is far to rough to do the head job on model engines.
    I do have that auto lapping paste in several granulations, but I've used chrome polish ans cigarette ash.

    There are two incarnations of the Enya 120, the 120 itself and the later and more powerful 120R which has
    different valves. In my 120 engine the valves are the same for intake and exhaust as you can see on the picture.
    Maybe the VT240 has different flanges..

    Kind Regards,

    Holm

  10. #1085

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    RE: Club Enya

    tiffitech
    The valves utilized in the Enya VT-240 have the same part number as the valves on the 120C and the 90C.
    FYI,
    Jim Meighan

  11. #1086
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    RE: Club Enya

    Enya 180-GS.... interesting. Check out the video!

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k9Soo...layer_embedded

  12. #1087

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    RE: Club Enya

    I received my parts yesterday from Ken Enya. One brand spanking new cylinder head, one valve, one piston ring (for spare) and 4 new crankcase gaskets.

    For now, I'm going to remove the cylinder head and valve and replace them with new parts. I'll monkey around with it later. I'll post up some pictures of the offending head when I get it all apart.

    What kind of compound would you recommend if not automotive valve lapping compound? I realize it wouldn't take much to get the job done. I've read that toothpaste acts as a VERY mild abrasive and will clean the seal up.

    Also, I wouldn't use cigarette ash as I don't smoke.

    I'm going to perform a leak test on the suspect valve before deciding on anything though.

  13. #1088

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    RE: Club Enya

    well, good news and bad news. The good news is I got the cylinder head changed out and got some REAL good close ups of the damaged head. The bad news is, in my rush to get the head swapped, I completely forgot the leak test.

    Check out the pictures. You can clearly see up to three nicks right across the valve seat on the one valve seal.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

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  14. #1089

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    RE: Club Enya

    What I do is lap the valve in using a back and forth motion. Do not spin in full circles. After a light lap job...place a very light coating of blue-ing on the valve faceto check how the vale seats. It should be even all the way around the seat. Good Luck.

    Capt,n Gas engine forum mostley.
    Imagination is far more important than knowledge. Albert Einstein.

    http://www.lambertsrc.com/

  15. #1090

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    RE: Club Enya

    I can report that my Enya VT-240 is in good health once more! I just got done running it and she ticked over at 1700 with no glow on and even lower with it with near instant acceleration to full throttle!

    I couldn't get below 3500 before without dropping the bad cylinder and with glow it would "run" quite low, however, the engine simply had ZERO acceleration and would quit if you weren't gentle with her.

    Now she's back to her former 3.2HP powerful self!

    I can't wait to get the Sopwith Baby back in the air! Maybe tomorrow!


  16. #1091

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    RE: Club Enya

    Congrats to the successful repair!

    But think twice about the problem, the debris that has fritted your Valve seat must came from somewhere...
    Eighter you have some freely moving Parts in the engine or you got the debris trough the carb. Think about air filters...

    Kind Regard,

    Holm

  17. #1092

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    RE: Club Enya

    I've thought about that. I can't honestly explain what is going on. In operation on the airplane, the carbs are within a cowling that is open on the bottom. They sit about a foot off of the ground. I don't really think what did the damage came from the environment. If something were loose in the engine, I don't think it would find it's way into the combustion chamber either. I think something in the crank case would go out the breather vents.

  18. #1093

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    RE: Club Enya

    A blown and lost glow plug element could damage the exhaust valve seat. Otherwise, I would tend to think the source came through the carburetor. I'm assuming we're talking about the exhaust valve seat for the blown glow plug element theory. I can't remember which valve displayed the signs trauma.


    Ed Cregger
    \"Practice makes prefect\"

    Saito Club Member #52

  19. #1094

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    RE: Club Enya

    Hello,

    Will the Enya VT 240 pull a 13-14.5 Airplane with authority? The plane is a Great Planes Giant Super Sportster. Also where do you get rebuild parts?

    Regards,

    Perry

  20. #1095

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    RE: Club Enya

    I am guessing, but I would bet money that the VT-240 would be plenty of power for the Giant Sportster. I am curious about how the weight would work out as far as the model's balance is concerned.


    Ed Cregger
    \"Practice makes prefect\"

    Saito Club Member #52

  21. #1096
    GaGeeBees's Avatar
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    RE: Club Enya


    ORIGINAL: PTS

    Hello,

    Will the Enya VT 240 pull a 13-14.5 Airplane with authority? The plane is a Great Planes Giant Super Sportster. Also where do you get rebuild parts?

    Regards,

    Perry
    Should be plenty of power. I fly a a Top Flite Staggerwing with one and it weighs 21 lbs. Parts come from Enya. Contact info is on the website.
    ...and then the unthinkable happened!

  22. #1097

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    RE: Club Enya

    Thankyou for the feedback....

  23. #1098

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    RE: Club Enya


    ORIGINAL: GaGeeBees


    ORIGINAL: PTS

    Hello,

    Will the Enya VT 240 pull a 13-14.5 Airplane with authority? The plane is a Great Planes Giant Super Sportster. Also where do you get rebuild parts?

    Regards,

    Perry
    Should be plenty of power. I fly a a Top Flite Staggerwing with one and it weighs 21 lbs. Parts come from Enya. Contact info is on the website.

    At one time you had a VT240 NIB. Do you still have the engine and would you sell it?

  24. #1099
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    RE: Club Enya


    ORIGINAL: PTS


    ORIGINAL: GaGeeBees


    ORIGINAL: PTS

    Hello,

    Will the Enya VT 240 pull a 13-14.5 Airplane with authority? The plane is a Great Planes Giant Super Sportster. Also where do you get rebuild parts?

    Regards,

    Perry
    Should be plenty of power. I fly a a Top Flite Staggerwing with one and it weighs 21 lbs. Parts come from Enya. Contact info is on the website.

    At one time you had a VT240 NIB. Do you still have the engine and would you sell it?
    I do still have it and it's still in the box. I'm undecided about selling at this time. Will let you know when I'm ready to let it go.
    ...and then the unthinkable happened!

  25. #1100

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    RE: Club Enya

    [youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q1G9AN5681k[/youtube]

    Here is my Enya in the plane after I installed the new cylinder head and on-board glow system.

    I still get some funky stuff from one cylinder or the other but I attribute that to the "Y" fuel feed system supplied with the engine. As you can see, the engine runs and accelerates nicely!


    Will the Enya VT 240 pull a 13-14.5 Airplane with authority? The plane is a Great Planes Giant Super Sportster. Also where do you get rebuild parts?
    Uh, yeah. My Sopwith Baby about 20-22 lbs ( I can't remember exactly) and the VT-240 hauls it's draggy butt around with authority! Take-off is easily at 1/2-2/3 throttle.

    I got my parts from Enya directly in Japan by emailing Ken Enya at info@enya-engine.com. His responses were nearly immediate and I can say that dealing with them was an A+_ experience! He even did a custom payment for me via paypal, howeve, he will accept payment directly through the website via credit card. I may pick up some more spare parts soon just to have on hand!






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