JT Hammer

Hi guys....I have been fortunate enough to acquire one of these gems, in fact, just picked it up today at the post office. This is one sweet engine! Now that I have stopped fondling it, I'll ask the question. What should I put it in? Yes, I actually want to use it for a while before putting it on the dispaly stand. I would like to put it on a vintage or 'oldie' type model. I am considering the Early Models rendition of the Champ, but am not sure it will accommodate a .30 four stroke engine. Can anyone comment on that? Have also considered the .40 size Taube (Balsa USA). Do you think this model is too large for the Saito? I even considered the Stik Trainer Plus (Balsa USA) as this has almost reached 'oldie' status and would definitely highlight the engine! Does anyone have another suggestion? The issue for me is, just how much power does this engine have... I am assuming, about as much as a 2 stroke .25, so maybe the average .40 size model is too much for it. Looking forward to your feedback.

JT

iflyj3

My Feedback: (7)

I have a pre Gold edition of the Saito .30 four stroke open rocker in a Lazy P51 (A fun fly type). The Saito .30 has the power of a .20 two stroke in my opinion. I also have the Early RC Champ, yet unfinished. Yes the Saito would fit in it fine.

Hope this helps.

Frank Schwartz

My Feedback: (1)

I had one of those gems years ago when they first came out...ran like a champ. I had it in a ragged old Stick 40 with just rudder and elevator and of course, motor control. No ailerons. Flew it so much with trainer cord for the beginners that I literally wore out the valve stems. Bought a new head with new valves and when I put it back together, the engine was as tight as new. Sleeves and pistons in Saitos must last forever. Great product. Maybe I need to buy me another .30 for Xmas??

JT Hammer

Based on your remarks, Ive gone ahead and ordered the Early rc Models Champ. From what I've read it's a pretty simple bird to put together. How far along are you in your build Dan?.. I am regarding the engine and kit as Christmas presents to me (Santa is so generous this year!). I am planing on building the kit wing as provided, and building another wih ailerons and less dihedral. This should make it a bit more able in the air. From your comments Frank, the .30 Saito is a tough little engine. I am looking forward to having a four stroke engine. I believe the last one I had back in the mid 80's was a little HP .21. It really ran well and wish I hadn't sold it way back then. I'm thinking with the Saito .30 on the front of the light Champ, no additional nose weight will be required. I wonder if Champs with smaller engines require nose weight? I am hoping the Champ kit comes before Christmas, as Early Rc still has to cut wood and make the kits. This will be a winter project. Flying up here (2 hours east of Toronto, Canada) has pretty much ground to a halt except for a few crazies who fly off ice/snow. I used to, but prefer tp stay warm now. So next April, if all goew according to plan, the Champ will be ready for her 'maiden'. Perhaps I will keep the forum abreast of my progress......cheers - Terry

Frank Schwartz

My Feedback: (1)

I think you refer to the Live Wire Champ. I built one of those years and years ago with a Fox 19 R\C (exhaust baffle) in it with five channels reeds. Hi and low escapement on the engine and up down and right and left... Silk covered. Decided to do an outside loop (thought I was a hot shot pilot then...) and took forever to tuck under and there it was ..trucking along like gang busters, upside down about fifty feet from the ground..and me holding full down to keep it going straight and level.... Well, I let go of the down stick trying to hit rudder and roll it out, but the lift and the speed took over first and the plane went straight in (down is up..and up is down when you are inverted, y'know) ...never had enough left to rebuild.
Anyhow...I have one of those replica kits for the Champ and plan to build it this winter...maybe a new Saito 30 would do well... Santa, are you listening??
Frank Schwartz AMA123
85 years young...still building and flying............

Avaiojet

Vintage?

The Tiger Shark is that, for sure!!

If you can scratch build, I suggest the Tiger Shark.

You could size the model to fit the engine.

Mine has an Enya 120 4S in it but I sized it to 72" in span.

Not many know this model, but, in some ways, the Tiger Shark started it all. That's the fuselage of my Tiger Shark on the bench.

Here's some photos.

Joe Nagy

My Feedback: (3)

Hi JT;

& congrats on you're acquiring dat beautiful engine.

I agree fully with your choice of the deBolt Champ, and would suggest building the original #1 of the 3 derivations, #1 had a more open structure, which would look great with a silk and doped finish. My 2nd choice for you would be Lou Proctor's Mini Antic Mono, maybe even the Mini Antic Bipe, but that may be stretching it for power output of the 30 Saito, don't know?

Hey Wow! Enjoy your new project build, let us know your final choice[s], and keep us informed with photos during your build. Best regards from Glendale, Arizona,

Joe Nagy.

AA5BY

I've two Saito .30s, one on a Sig LT-25 .25 size and one on an old Das Box Fly (bipe) .20 size. Both are light airframes and both fly very well with the Saito .30. If your airframe calls for a .20-.25 and is built light... it should fly great. Looking forward to your reports.

JT Hammer

Holly Molly! I guess a few of us have reached vintage status, as well! I have a half century of rc flying under my belt, too. Of course I stared flying when I was three (so I lied LOL!!). My first transmitter was a ground based box, with a long antennae screwed on the side, and a long cord with a micro switch for keying commands - like one blip for right and two for left. The receiver had tubes as well. I believe the system was an E.D. from England. I still have it somewhere in the basement. At the time I had it installed in a J-3 Cub (about a 6 foot span), powered by a Veco .19, and one escapment for rudder only. I didn't have a whole lot of of success with this arrangement but as a teenager, enthusiasm made up for this. The last few years I have been heavy into 'speed' prop jets and quickee racers (all Jett powered), but I think I'llk take a rest and do something relaxing - like this project. And I will keep you fellows abreast of my progress. I will likely begin the Champ after Christmas, assuming I have it by then. Look for it under the vintage forum under something like - Saito/Champ Project. Until then....Cheers - JT

JT Hammer

Re: The Tiger Shark

Charles, I seem to have a vague recollection of this model. Doesn't it pre-date the Astro/Smog-Hog series of models? The Tiger Shark is a great looking airplane and certainly has plenty of vintage appeal! I wish I could blink one into existence at my place. I used to do a lot of scatch building. However, presently, I need to do things more simply so I go the kit route and have even been guilty of ARF'ing it.. I know...ugh! Thanks for showing us your pics I really appreciate it.....JT (Terry)

Frank Schwartz

My Feedback: (1)

The Tiger Shark was a control line kit by Victor Stanzel Co. and , if my memory serve me correct, was introduced in the late thirties, and ran to the early fifties. The blown up R/C version was a very good adaptation of a very good looking design. It was not a Stanzel design, however, but an R/C'r with an eye for a handsome plane.

Avaiojet

Frank,

I'm impressed with your knowledge. Good for you.

I do know of the Shark P-60, which was also a Victor Stanzel design. I have no idea what year though? This drawing or plans, appeared in the February 1983 issue of Model Builder.

Is the Shark P-60, possibly the design before the Tiger Shark?

Frank Schwartz

My Feedback: (1)

OK, let's clarify this..the original Tiger Shark was by Stanzel and was for their monoline control line system. To the best of my knowledge, there was no larger model or any other model of this plane by Stanzel. Later R/C versions are by other people. I always loved the design lines.
I have no model magazines from before WW2 to refer to as my mother threw all my model stuff away when she cleaned house when I and my dad went into service...she even sold my 1931 Model A Ford roadster...and my first copies of Superman comics....oh well...
Frank Schwartz

Avaiojet

Frank,

You have no idea how lucky you are?

My mother kept my model stuff and threw me away. [sm=bananahead.gif]

JT Hammer

Hi guys. I have acquied the Champ kit and am posting my build progress in this forum under 'Early Rc Models Debolt Champ build'. Be glad to have you follow along and feel free to make comments!

JT

JohnBuckner

My Feedback: (1)

The Stanzell Tiger Shark used what they called the 'G Line' system it predated the much later Stanzell monoline systems by a good margin. The airplanes elevator was not controlled at all. Instead there was a single line attached forward of the wings leading edge by several inchs in standoffs. This line at the flyers end was attached to the end of an eight foot bamboo pole and the flyer controlled the flight by moving the pole up or down.

The elevator and rudder were hinged but used rubberband wrapped sliding wires for to make fine trimming adjustments.

John