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WACO YMF

Old 09-01-2008, 09:09 PM
  #7001  
WacoNut
 
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Default RE: WACO YMF

Thanks Ken,
I still have alot of finishing work to do, nice to see the end of the tunnel on this project.
Anthony
Old 09-01-2008, 09:50 PM
  #7002  
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Default RE: WACO YMF

Hello to all! And greetings to all of the Waco Brotherhood! (Quickly performing the Brotherhood secret handshake.) I have to say, watching this thread has given me the Waco itch. I definitely want to join the Brotherhood! That Pica 1/5 is/was a nice kit. But I was thinking that the 1/6 size would be a better fit for me. So, any chance that the templates might show up on the House of Moy website? Or could someone tell me where the plans, plus templates would be available? I already looked at the AMA plan service, but they only show the 1/5 size. (Still not showing that the templates are now available. Good job guys!) Any help would be greatly appreciated. Planing my future build list.

Thanks!

Bob J.
Old 09-01-2008, 10:25 PM
  #7003  
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Default RE: WACO YMF

Okay, Here is the roster to date.

WACO BROTHERHOOD MEMBERSHIP:

#1 stickbuilder
#2 Hughes500
#3 Jim Henley
#4 mmattockx
#5 CTflyboy
#6 michaelj2k
#7 Ronj10
#8 gwulle
#9 jim schroer
#10 Skinny Bob
#11 Bart5495
#12 Pimmnz
#13 HarryJ
No. 14 Old Git
#15 ChrisMH
#16 Nerevar
#17 Ricatic
#18 Clay H.
#19 Tripp2Loo
#20 KHodges
#21 Bill Hogue (WACO One)
#22 Mangolo (Waldo)
#23 av8ter
#24 yel914 (Rick)
#25 damifino
#26 skylarkmk1
#27 Jacque
#28 Edwin
#29 AROPLANE
#30 CubNut (Anthony)
#31 BQuartucy (Bob Q)
#32 AERORON
#33 funkymusic
#34 Live Wire (Larry)
#35 obo (Bob)
#36 Jackk36 (Jack)
#37 fatherrooster (Jim)
#38 Ilikebipes
#39 Kestrel0222
#40 CROWMAN17 (Marc)
#41 redcesar
#42 S. Christensen (Scott)
#43 Bill Deidrich
#44 Mike Barbee
#45 mrdhud (Dan Hudson)
#46 SoCalSal
#47 Todd (NightStalker)
#48 argon (Bob Gonzalez)
#49 mango 12 (Scott)
#50 skyjet 1
#51 ZIG
#52 Didg
#53 MarvinE255 (DOC)
#54 Joe Norris (Full Scale WACO Pilot)
#55 vasek
#56 SuperCub Man (Jim)
#57 Black Drape (Ron)
#58 aminiet (Angel Minet)
#59 Snowball
#60 doc zinger
#61 jagnweiner (Scott)
#62 Meesh (Bob)
#63 BigBoy99 (Bernie)
#64 stifts (Steve)
#65 RCWalker (Wallace)
#66 Mobyal
#67 lazyace
#68 bladerunner1955 (Don)
#69 trlambsr
#70 Big Bird (Ken)
#71 Tony V (Tony)
#72 red 1
#73 412t1 (Sean)
#74 Mr Lucky (Ben Warner)
#75 RICKSTUBBZ (Rick Stubblefield)
#76 ffdg (Fred)
#77 tomcraig
#78 Michou41a Michel
#79 Watzscale (Dick Watz)
#80 Devens
#81 msilvestro (Mark)
#82 Cheechukranch (Lewis)
#83 kruzin55 (Chris)
#84 lynchr (Ron)
#85 airplanegeek
#86 Mainer Jim
#87 Garthwood (Charles)
#88 RCBOATMANIAC (Dave)
#89 Thomas B
#90 George Werber
#91 frequent flyer (Don)
#92 adamiani Alex
#93 Kvlasblom
#94 geertdewit (Geert)
#95 Wobble Wing (Bud Halverson)
#96 Joe Gulik
#97 T.L.A.R.eng
#98 kurrikan
#99 Nathan King
#100 nine o nine (Mitch Epstein)
#101 dsquire (Don)
#102 Mr. WACO (Charlie Nelson)
#103 Ken Acosta
#104 denoferth (Dennis)
#105 germrb (Bob Germaine)
#106 J.D. Ramsay
#107 ccrebidoux (Chris)
#108 LarryN (Larry)
#109 X3heimmr (Marty Heim)
#110 Lou Melancon
#111 BEARMX (Barry Waters)
#112 Sir Crashalot (Bob J)
#113 RPSBLS (Bob)
#114 Squeakalong (No name given)

WACO Sisterhood Roster:

S-1 Janelle (Lady Stickbuilder)
S-2 Sissy Nightstalker
S-3 Barb Barbee
S-4 LadyMango (Lynda)
S-5 BUMBLE GEE BEE (Gabi)
S-6 Sue Watz

S-8 Lady RCBOATMANIAC (Christine)

Bill, AMA 4720
WACO Brotherhood #1










Old 09-01-2008, 10:29 PM
  #7004  
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Default RE: WACO YMF

NEW BROTHER ALERT!!!!

Welcome Bob J. (aka Sir Crashalot). Brother # 112

So far as I know, there are no reproduction plans/templates for the 1/6th scale. I have actually never seen a kit for this one, even though I know that they exist. You can find one occasionally on fleabay, or here on RCU. Maybe one of the Brothers has a kit that he would be willing to cut the templates from and make them available.

Anyway, we are glad to have you.


Bill, AMA 4720
WACO Brotherhood #1
Old 09-01-2008, 10:41 PM
  #7005  
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Default RE: WACO YMF

Bob,

Welcome aboard from the Ugly Stick builds. No secrect handshake, just a liking for Wacos. As you already know, the 1/6th Pica Plans are on the House of Moy web site in PDF format with out the templates. You can have the file printed out full size at Kinko's or some where similar, but expect to pay +/- $30-35 for it. You could try to call the AMA Plans dept and see if they would sell you the 1/5th templates without the plans. If they will, you could then find a copier that will rescale the templates to 83.45% (an approximate figure, you will need to check each part against the plans for fit in both the vertical and horizontal axis, not all copiers scale equally in both directions). If they won't, you can get the whole 1/5th plan set and rescale them the same way. Be prepared for a little custom fitting of each part and follow the mods suggested.

Maybe some one out there who has a new 1/6th Pica Waco kit can trace the parts from the 1/6th kit and send them to you and/or the AMA with the plans.
Old 09-02-2008, 05:34 AM
  #7006  
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Default RE: WACO YMF

Hey WacoNut ,great looking aircraft ! I love blue and white.Here is my 1/5 scale almost complete.I used navy blue Krylon with light blue trim.
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Old 09-02-2008, 10:11 AM
  #7007  
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Default RE: WACO YMF


Welcome Sir Crashalot.

I've been lurking in the background of this thread for a couple of years now, very interesting. I have to be careful discriminating between models and full size.

I've found a wealth of information here plus a friendly welcome. it's a comfortable and comforting thread.



old git - - - - aka John L.

Waco Brotherhood No. 14.
Old 09-02-2008, 12:18 PM
  #7008  
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Default RE: WACO YMF

Sir Crashalot

Welcome aboard Bob, This is my first attempt a 1/6 scale Waco built from a kit. (not exactly scale) but it was a great flying plane until she meet the demon[:@][:@] Im trying to do a better job on my 1/5
(may she rest in peace)
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Old 09-02-2008, 01:04 PM
  #7009  
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Default RE: WACO YMF

All (FWIW),

For those of you thinking about doing the paint scheme on Waco YMF Classic NC 14081, here are the colors (number and color);

Base color Q-1916 White*
Stripe color H-9170 Bahama Blue*
Accent color M-9502 Insignia Blue*

* = Randolph Aircraft Products (Randolph Dope) 2004 Color Chart. If ordering use both the number and color.

These colors are from a list of Wacos that appears to be from Waco Classic Aircraft, serial numbers F5001 through F5047.

In looking at NC 14081 up close, the only place that Insignia Blue seems to appear is on the Waco Emblem under the name and the emblem appears to be a decal.
Old 09-02-2008, 04:51 PM
  #7010  
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Default RE: WACO YMF

I'm about to change my mind about the color scheme on mine. At this point, all I need to change is the wheel pants and cowl.

Bill, AMA 4720
WACO Brotherhood #1
Old 09-02-2008, 05:07 PM
  #7011  
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Default RE: WACO YMF


ORIGINAL: snowball

Hey WacoNut ,great looking aircraft ! I love blue and white.Here is my 1/5 scale almost complete.I used navy blue Krylon with light blue trim.
Thanks,
The blue and white looks good together, a fine looking Waco you have there
Anthony
Old 09-02-2008, 05:28 PM
  #7012  
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Default RE: WACO YMF

Waco nut.

Can you please tell us where did you get wing struts?

Thank you

Angel
Old 09-02-2008, 07:03 PM
  #7013  
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Default RE: WACO YMF

Angel,
I ordered my strut material from GTM( Glenn Torrence Models. It is almost a perfect match for the Waco strut profile but unfortunately in 1/4 scale. They would be too large for the 1/5.
The K&S streamlined aluminum is another option, they would still look good.
Anthony
Old 09-02-2008, 08:25 PM
  #7014  
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Default RE: WACO YMF

Hello!

Thank you for allowing me to join the Brotherhood. It is truly an honor. The Brotherhood is an elite group of builders. Some amazing WACO’s being built here.

Stickbuilder, skylarkmk1, old git, and mrdhud. Thank you for the warm welcome! It is appreciated. And thanks also for the information.

Skylarkmk1, I am surprised that you remember me from the Ugly Stick thread. As I am but a small fish in a big ocean. I still visit there, from time to time, to see how Sean is coming along. I also had the idea about down sizing the 1/5 plans, templates. It might be my only choice at the moment. But it may be the best solution.

Thanks again to all!
Old 09-02-2008, 08:42 PM
  #7015  
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Default RE: WACO YMF

ORIGINAL: Sir Crashalot

Hello!

Thank you for allowing me to join the Brotherhood. It is truly an honor. The Brotherhood is an elite group of builders. Some amazing WACO’s being built here.

Stickbuilder, skylarkmk1, old git, and mrdhud. Thank you for the warm welcome! It is appreciated. And thanks also for the information.

Skylarkmk1, I am surprised that you remember me from the Ugly Stick thread. As I am but a small fish in a big ocean. I still visit there, from time to time, to see how Sean is coming along. I also had the idea about down sizing the 1/5 plans, templates. It might be my only choice at the moment. But it may be the best solution.

Thanks again to all!


Bob,

If you are interested in building the 1/6 scale, I could be of some assistance to you I have an extra set of plans for a sixth scale I have a lot of scanned copies of all the formers, but if you are interested PM me and I will try and do what I can for you.

Oh and before I forget welcome to the brotherhood, and from experience Bill and John have been a lot of help on my build so far.
Old 09-04-2008, 01:02 PM
  #7016  
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Default RE: WACO YMF

All

I received my pinking tape from Gary Sibert today. Its really nice looking the best I can count there’s 18 points per in. Can’t what to start using it I still have to get the stitching but I can start the fuselage. Hope the pictures turn out the points are so small you mite not see them.

Great job Gary thanks
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Old 09-04-2008, 01:22 PM
  #7017  
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Default RE: WACO YMF

Hey guys another biplane builder that I exchange ideas and info with sent me a link to this UMF-5 that was just recently completed and is now for sale. It says it won 25 awards so it must be a beauty. Here is a link to the Waco. If anyone who knows better than I how to post these pics on the forum, it would be easier to see them.

Here is the link;
http://www.eaa10.org/Newsletter/2008...x.html#forsale

Ben
Mr. Lucky
WB #74
Old 09-04-2008, 02:17 PM
  #7018  
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Default RE: WACO YMF

Here's the photos, Ben. If you will pm me, I will show you how to post them.

Bill, AMA 4720
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Old 09-04-2008, 10:11 PM
  #7019  
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Default RE: WACO YMF

Ben,

That is a nice looking UMF you posted the link to. A couple of things stand out to me that are not quite right (at least to my eyes) or are at least different;

Cowl appears to be for a Jacobs type engine with equally spaced cowl bumps making it a YMF. Registration is a UMF but does not state what engine is in it. The "For Sale" notice states a 240 hp W-670 Radial but not the make. Continental does have a 240 hp W-670-M which would make it a "VMF" but as it appears in this case, retained the registration as a UMF with the engine change.

Strut fairings (boots) - look good.

Rear lift handle - loop style, the original Waco and the Waco YMF Classics have a retractable lift handle on both sides.

Main Landing Gear - lower ends of the center struts appear to be attached to the axel similar to a UPF-7, Upper ends appear to be recessed a little further than "normal" for a U/YMF.

Rear windshield - seems shorter and extends further down the side than on the Waco YMF Classics (side view picture).

Exhaust stack ends - appear to be longer and round in cross section, originals generally had rectangular or some times a split flaired end as seen on NC 14132 (pict #65 on the National Waco site).

Airlerons - Don't extend to the wing tips and are more "Barn door" type.

Wing tips - Don't appear to taper like the originals, almost seem to have an equal taper (like many models have ie; the COX ARF Waco).

With all the above being said (I know I am being nitpicky), it is still a very nice looking plane and has some neat touches (strut boots, loop lift handle and landing gear struts) making it a unique and handsome aircraft..
Old 09-05-2008, 05:51 AM
  #7020  
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Not much gets by John
Anthony
Old 09-05-2008, 09:38 AM
  #7021  
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Default RE: WACO YMF

This airplane is a homebuilt replica of a Waco UMF/YMF. The details that John pointed out give it away. The wing on this aircraft is actually a different airfoil than the "stock" Waco. The UMF/YMF used a Clark Y airfoil. John Hudek (the builder of this replica) used a NACA airfoil. (I don't remember the number). The engine is a "tank" engine, which is a Continental W-670 that was originally used in Sherman tanks. There are several differences in these engines, and most people who use them in experimental aircraft end up using a mix of aircraft and tank parts.

John did a magnificent job on this airplane! It is absolutely gorgeous in every detail. He built it himself, from scratch. (He don't need no steeenking kit!!!) It really is a wonderful airplane. But again, it is not a Waco per se. It is a Waco replica, and a gorgeous one at that!

Cheers!

Joe
WB #54
Old 09-05-2008, 11:34 AM
  #7022  
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ORIGINAL: WacoJoe

This airplane is a homebuilt replica of a Waco UMF/YMF. The details that John pointed out give it away. The wing on this aircraft is actually a different airfoil than the "stock" Waco. The UMF/YMF used a Clark Y airfoil. John Hudek (the builder of this replica) used a NACA airfoil. (I don't remember the number). The engine is a "tank" engine, which is a Continental W-670 that was originally used in Sherman tanks. There are several differences in these engines, and most people who use them in experimental aircraft end up using a mix of aircraft and tank parts.

John did a magnificent job on this airplane! It is absolutely gorgeous in every detail. He built it himself, from scratch. (He don't need no steeenking kit!!!) It really is a wonderful airplane. But again, it is not a Waco per se. It is a Waco replica, and a gorgeous one at that!

Cheers!

Joe
WB #54
Joe,

When you see John, You can tell him that he done good.

Bill, AMA 4720
WACO Brotherhood #1
Old 09-05-2008, 01:06 PM
  #7023  
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Default RE: WACO YMF


ORIGINAL: WacoJoe

This airplane is a homebuilt replica of a Waco UMF/YMF. The details that John pointed out give it away. The wing on this aircraft is actually a different airfoil than the "stock" Waco. The UMF/YMF used a Clark Y airfoil. John Hudek (the builder of this replica) used a NACA airfoil. (I don't remember the number). The engine is a "tank" engine, which is a Continental W-670 that was originally used in Sherman tanks. There are several differences in these engines, and most people who use them in experimental aircraft end up using a mix of aircraft and tank parts.

John did a magnificent job on this airplane! It is absolutely gorgeous in every detail. He built it himself, from scratch. (He don't need no steeenking kit!!!) It really is a wonderful airplane. But again, it is not a Waco per se. It is a Waco replica, and a gorgeous one at that!

Cheers!

Joe
WB #54

Very good Joe. Your information is correct. I contacted Barry Branin who is essentially the Grand Pubah of the F-5 Waco owner's. All other F-5 owners stay in contact through Barry. Barry's Waco is a 1935 YMF-5 NC15241. Here is a picture of the YMF at Boeing Field with the Dream Lifter in the background. Not the best picture but the one Barry sent me nonetheless. I sent the info on John Hudec's UMF-5, and Barry was somewhat aloof. He also pointed out the same discrepancies that both you and John noted. Barry is the owner of more than one Waco but when it comes to flying Barry spends about 99% of his time in the F-5. He is a died in the wool F-5 lover if there ever was one. Barry has gone out of his way to help me with my UMF-5 project. I know that one of the things that he loves the most about any of the Waco's is the Clark Y Airfoil. Not building the UMF replica with a Clark 5 Airfoil is somewhat puzzling considering that this is one of the best attributes of this design. Last month I was offered a title to a Waco 10/GXE. I asked Barry what he thought I should do. I do not remember his exact words but something like run fast in the opposite direction was in there somewhere. He is basically keeping me pointed in one direction and that is to locate a title of a UMF-5, or a YMF-5 depending on what I can manage to locate. He has convinced me to stay focused on that direction.

One of the main things that Barry and I both agreed on was the price that John was asking for the replica. $200K is top dollar right now for even a brand new authentic UMF-5. History tells the story on replica sales. Unfortunately they do not get the money that is costs to build them. My own personal opinion is this; a replica UMF-5 is better than NO Waco at all. If you can not find a title or a basket case to restore then you have to chose whether or not you want to make the extreme sacrifice of time that it takes to build a Waco and build a replica. If you take this path then build it EXACTLY to factory specifications. Fly it until you get to your dirt nap and then leave it to your kids, and hope they will get as much enjoyment out of the ship that you did. IF you are going to build a replica, the last thing you want to do is sell it. You are going to take a LOSS, so why build one if you are just going to turn around and sell it for less money than it cost to build. Only John Hudec knows why he is selling his ship.

The other side of the coin is this; John Hudec has obviously built his replica UMF-5 to a very high standard of quality. I applaud him for his efforts but think that he should consign himself to selling his project for allot less so that he can get the money and start another build. It I were him, I would be happy flying the UMF and simply enjoy what it is that all open cockpit biplane owners enjoy.

Barry told me last month just before strapping me in the front cockpit of his YMF. "This is exactly like riding a motorcycle at 5000 feet". Thank you Barry! You will go down in my book as one of the very few gentlemen who helped to change my life. Even if I never saw or talked with him again for the rest of my life, I would think about him almost everyday and consider him to be one of the most important people in my life. Since I can not repay him for his kindness then it is my duty to pass it forward. I hope that I can do as well as Barry.

It may be a Replica UMF-5 with a Tank engine and an incorrect set of wings but it is still a very beautiful accomplishment. One that any one of us would love to own.

Ben
Mr. Lucky
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Old 09-05-2008, 01:07 PM
  #7024  
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Default RE: WACO YMF

All,

Well, as you can see I put the pinking tape on one side of the fuselage. I don’t think I like it[:@] I’m afraid it will really stand out and look to busy. What do you think? I’m thinking about taking it off.
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Old 09-05-2008, 01:44 PM
  #7025  
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Default RE: WACO YMF


Dan,

Before you do that, take a scrap piece of wood, apply the covering material to it, and then add the pinking tape, and a coat of your primer (whatever you are using). Then use some 400 Wet or Dry sandpaper, and work on the edges a little, and then hit it with another coat of the primer. See what that looks like. You may need to do it again, and keep on trying until you manage to subdue the pinked edges. Then you will know if you want to do that or not.

Bill, AMA 4720
WACO Brotherhood #1

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