Golden Age, Vintage & Antique RC Want to discuss some of those from the golden age, vintage rc planes or even an old classic antique vintage rc planes, radios, engines, etc? This is the place for you. Enjoy!

WACO YMF

Reply
Old 01-27-2007, 06:38 AM
  #1026
damifino
 
damifino's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Winston Salem, NC
Posts: 681
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: WACO YMF

Quote:
I'll e-mail them to you, and we can discuss the idea's that I have. I don't want to cause any confusion in the thread by posting unproven ideas.
That is a good plan. PM me when you are ready and we'll exchange e-mail addresses and phone #'s. Thanks
damifino is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2007, 07:08 AM
  #1027
Stickbuilder
Thread Starter
 
Stickbuilder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Leesburg, FL
Posts: 8,656
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: WACO YMF

damifino,

PM sent to you.

Bill, AMA 4720
WACO Brotherhood #1
Stickbuilder is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2007, 08:17 AM
  #1028
WacoOne
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Gulf Breeze, FL
Posts: 201
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: WACO YMF

I know I'll get corrected by the experts here, but in all my studies of the YMF-3 vs YMF-5, the only difference is the vertical tail. The lateral stability of the -3 wasn't sufficient so they made a larger vertical tail and called it the -5. All -3's were retrofitted with the larger tail so in effect, they are all -5's. This info came from a reprint of an Air Classics article by Phil Mercier that I have(don't remember the date of the issue).
Here is a quote from the article:
" By mid-1934, with 12 MF's completed, there arose a minor but potentially dangerous problem. Complaints were voiced about inadequate directional control during ground operation and slow flight configuration. This was corrected by enlarging the vertical tail surfaces. All models from the 13th machine on had this "fix", and were redesignated -5 models. All earlier -3's were recalled, at customer descretion, to have verticals of increased area added. As far as can be ascertained all of the F-3's were returned or retrofitted with the F-5 vertical surfaces at the factory or at Waco dealerships."

Bill Hogue
WACO Brotherhood #21
WacoOne is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2007, 10:41 AM
  #1029
Jim Henley
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Omaha, NE
Posts: 589
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: WACO YMF

H-500,
Do you have a set of the Pica plans and or the booklet? There is a template that is used to determine the spacing on the blisters. My cowl was completed to that point, so I did not check to see if these were spaced exactly or not. However, the marks are still on the cowl where the spacing was marked out and it looks about right.
If there is something I can pass along to you let me know.
Jim Henley is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2007, 12:10 PM
  #1030
Hughes500E
 
Hughes500E's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Armstrong, BC, CANADA
Posts: 1,514
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: WACO YMF

Thanks Jim,
I see the template on the fuse sheet. I am still curious about this, they must have made a change along the way. I have to assume that this was not a case of close enough 'cause I believe it would be harder to do it in spaced groups of two like this.
Anyone have the plans for the older Dave Platt 1/6th? Can you check on it and see if it is the same as these pictures?


Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Nl28276.jpg
Views:	23
Size:	14.1 KB
ID:	607611   Click image for larger version

Name:	Hc92591.jpg
Views:	19
Size:	9.6 KB
ID:	607612  
Hughes500E is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2007, 01:04 PM
  #1031
Jim Henley
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Omaha, NE
Posts: 589
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: WACO YMF

H-500
Interesting, now that I see your cowl, It almost looks like they were trying to define each cylinder,
whether the valve gear was under the narrow or wide blisters, it sure looks to me as if that was the intent.
On another note here's a shot of the wing tabs (thank you ronj10) and the right side interplane strut I had to build to accomodate the extra positive stagger the prior owner built into the plane.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Xv64818.jpg
Views:	25
Size:	35.4 KB
ID:	607635   Click image for larger version

Name:	Dy79447.jpg
Views:	26
Size:	53.4 KB
ID:	607636  
Jim Henley is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2007, 01:26 PM
  #1032
Hughes500E
 
Hughes500E's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Armstrong, BC, CANADA
Posts: 1,514
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: WACO YMF

Looks good Jim,
I must of overbuilt mine

So I'm looking at the template you showed me and on my manual, page 39 shows the blisters in the exact same locations as my glass cowl in the pictures above. I am unsure as to why Pica would do this but if your guys' plans and templates are different than mine, then we found another difference in the age of these kits [:'(]

That explains why my 1/6th is the same as this one as well, NUTS!
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Ki19918.jpg
Views:	24
Size:	15.0 KB
ID:	607658   Click image for larger version

Name:	Yt61535.jpg
Views:	23
Size:	12.2 KB
ID:	607659  
Hughes500E is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2007, 02:59 PM
  #1033
pimmnz
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Auckland, NEW ZEALAND
Posts: 1,958
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: WACO YMF

Blister spacing appears to be dertermined by the engine fit of the original airplane. A quick troll through various full size Waco photos shows differing spacings on U/YMF's and also differing blister shapes. I guess that this cowl is as scale as any other, but you need to determine the original engine fit to ensure the dummy engine looks right.
Evan WB#12.
pimmnz is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2007, 06:20 PM
  #1034
Hughes500E
 
Hughes500E's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Armstrong, BC, CANADA
Posts: 1,514
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: WACO YMF

Quote:
I guess that this cowl is as scale as any other
I found a full scale, and it looks like a group of two. As a matter of fact, it is the same as my old 1/6th scale, same colors and serial numbers. These plans I purchased must be the same model as well to have the groups of two, going by the manual and blister template. Interesting, I still don't like it , but at least I know it's scale!

[:'(]


YMF-3 NC14031 matches my Cowl
http://www.nationalwacoclub.com/f3f5...4031%2003.html
Hughes500E is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2007, 06:43 PM
  #1035
Stickbuilder
Thread Starter
 
Stickbuilder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Leesburg, FL
Posts: 8,656
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: WACO YMF


Quote:
ORIGINAL: Hughes500E

Quote:
I guess that this cowl is as scale as any other
I found a full scale, and it looks like a group of two. As a matter of fact, it is the same as my old 1/6th scale, same colors and serial numbers. These plans I purchased must be the same model as well to have the groups of two, going by the manual and blister template. Interesting, I still don't like it , but at least I know it's scale!

[:'(]


YMF-3 NC14031 matches my Cowl
http://www.nationalwacoclub.com/f3f5...4031%2003.html
I'm not sure that anyone knows for sure which one is correct. What I am willing to do is this: If you will contact Stan's and ask them if they are willing, I will provide them with my new cowl and will attach the blisters, or send the blisters unattached for them to use as a plug. They can then, pull a mold, and lay up glass cowls for those of us who are resurrecting these old beasts. All I would ask is that they not destroy my cowl, and that they return it to me. If they wanted to be real nice, they could also include one of the glass cowls for my trouble.

Bill, AMA 4720
WACO Brotherhood #1
Stickbuilder is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2007, 06:49 PM
  #1036
Hughes500E
 
Hughes500E's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Armstrong, BC, CANADA
Posts: 1,514
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: WACO YMF

WOW, that is nice of you Bill. I will contact Brad myself and explain this all to him.
At least I understand what's happening now.

My apology's everyone, I really have my heart and soul into scratchbuilding this one. When the cowl came in "different" to what I have been looking at and studying, I was crushed!

Sorry!
Hughes500E is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2007, 06:50 PM
  #1037
Jim Henley
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Omaha, NE
Posts: 589
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: WACO YMF

H-500,
I checked the spacing on my cowl and the blisters are evenly spaced, then I pulled the plan and sure enough, the template has the blisters grouped just like your cowl. I then took a look at my instruction manual, it only has 13 pages with no reference or photos of the cowl, just a simple drawing without blisters.
I'm not sure what the heck I've got, the box indicates that several versions of the WACO can be built but the plans only show the open or closed cockpit version. It also show the outline of the tail feathers on the closed cockpit which are considerably different than the YMF - 3 / 5.
Jim Henley is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2007, 09:36 PM
  #1038
Hughes500E
 
Hughes500E's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Armstrong, BC, CANADA
Posts: 1,514
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: WACO YMF

More to come on this but the kit/plans with the #'s NC4031, the proper scale cowl is the one with the blisters in groups of two.
My plans have these numbers but I like the single spaced cowl better and I'm hoping the 3 cylinder Saito rockers line up better, I just won't use the NC4031 #'s

Getting pretty tight in the scale dept with all this
Depending on timing, I may swap the cowls later........
Hughes500E is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2007, 11:42 PM
  #1039
pimmnz
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Auckland, NEW ZEALAND
Posts: 1,958
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: WACO YMF

Heh heh heh, I can just see where this thread is going. Two modellers out on the field, peering into the cockpit of an old 1/4 scale YMF..."I see you've put the mag switch 1" left of the battery master". "Yeah, its C/N 302, the bloke drilling the original full size panel slipped and the first hole was 3/16" out so he just put the switch in the new place, I had to take a couple of photos of the restored one and match it with the old blueprints, but I know it's scale!"
Evan, WB#12.
pimmnz is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2007, 12:26 AM
  #1040
Hughes500E
 
Hughes500E's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Armstrong, BC, CANADA
Posts: 1,514
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: WACO YMF

Sssshhhh I'm already losing sleep over the non scale Interplane strut mounts []
Now someone told you about my cockpit, egad [:-]

Hughes500E is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2007, 05:35 AM
  #1041
flyguy888
 
flyguy888's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: coon rapids, MN
Posts: 172
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: WACO YMF

If your planes detail is causing you to be anxious or lose sleep maybe it is because you are not building it for yourself but to gain approval of someone else. That is always a bad reason to do anything.
No model plane is completely scale. Though some indeed come mighty close. You have to decide what fits you for detail - not what fits someone elses idea. No matter how scale you make your airplane there are those who walk up to every new plane at the field and have to find something wrong with it. You should not be building your plane for these types of people but for yourself.
flyguy888 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2007, 06:44 AM
  #1042
Stickbuilder
Thread Starter
 
Stickbuilder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Leesburg, FL
Posts: 8,656
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: WACO YMF


Quote:
ORIGINAL: ronj10

If your planes detail is causing you to be anxious or lose sleep maybe it is because you are not building it for yourself but to gain approval of someone else. That is always a bad reason to do anything.
No model plane is completely scale. Though some indeed come mighty close. You have to decide what fits you for detail - not what fits someone elses idea. No matter how scale you make your airplane there are those who walk up to every new plane at the field and have to find something wrong with it. You should not be building your plane for these types of people but for yourself.
Amen!! Remember guys, everything that we do is just an illusion. The switches ond knobs on my IP are not really switches or knobs, and they operate nothing. Those who look at it are given the impression that they are functional, thus the illusion. The same goes for the fuel tank fillers. They see threaded brass, and removable caps, but if you were to pump avgas into the holes, you would get wing disassembley in pretty short order. If it looks right, then go with it, and enjoy. Most of the changes that I make on these old kits are to improve the building, or the strength or both. The mods that I am doing on the Landing Gear on the next one will be to stop the dreaded bounce on landing that we get with stiff, unyielding landing gear wire.

Trust me here, if you do a reasonably good job of framing, and covering and finishing your WACO, it will be a hit at your field, and you will become the, "Ace of the Base". (at least for a day)
Stickbuilder is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2007, 09:34 AM
  #1043
Stickbuilder
Thread Starter
 
Stickbuilder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Leesburg, FL
Posts: 8,656
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: WACO YMF

To: CHRISMH,

I have the fuselage parts traced, and ready to send to you for posting on the website. I need your e-mail address since I cannot e-mail a website. The first posting has 16 pages of full size parts. Each page has a size reference drawn. If it does not copy at the size indicated, you will need to correct the part before cutting. All parts show the dimension of the material, and also the kind/s of material used. The modification/s for using a radial mount are indicated, as is the stock part configuration for those who wish to use the Maple engine bearers. Also the provisions for making the tank a rear loader are shown as well. This is a major undertaking, and I sure hope that some of you build one. It was worth the time spent. This one won't die.

Bill,
AMA 4720
WACO Brotherhood #1
Stickbuilder is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2007, 03:02 PM
  #1044
Stickbuilder
Thread Starter
 
Stickbuilder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Leesburg, FL
Posts: 8,656
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: WACO YMF

I don't know when i'll hear from ChrisMH again. He said that we could utilize his website to make getting the templates from easier, but I can't e-mail to a website, I must e-mail to an e-mail address. I have all the fuse parts scanned, and ready. Here is a preview.

Bill, AMA 4720
WACO Brotherhood #1
Stickbuilder is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2007, 03:07 PM
  #1045
Stickbuilder
Thread Starter
 
Stickbuilder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Leesburg, FL
Posts: 8,656
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: WACO YMF

Well, you will have to click on the bottom right to open them in full size, but it looks as if they will be usable.

Bill, AMA 4720
WACO Brotherhood #1
Stickbuilder is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2007, 03:09 PM
  #1046
Stickbuilder
Thread Starter
 
Stickbuilder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Leesburg, FL
Posts: 8,656
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: WACO YMF

And the last one. Okay, guys... these are all the cut parts for the fuselage. The sheeting templates are on page 3 of the plans. You can cut them, cause I'm not gonna.

Bill, AMA 4720
WACO Brotherhood #1
Stickbuilder is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2007, 04:03 PM
  #1047
pimmnz
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Auckland, NEW ZEALAND
Posts: 1,958
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: WACO YMF

Oh dear Brother #2, it appears others were taking us seriously...!
Evan, WB#12.
pimmnz is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2007, 05:29 PM
  #1048
Stickbuilder
Thread Starter
 
Stickbuilder's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Leesburg, FL
Posts: 8,656
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: WACO YMF

What am I taking too seriously Dear Brother #12 ?????? Methinks you misdirected your reply.

Bill, AMA 4720
WACO Brotherhood #1
Stickbuilder is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2007, 05:50 PM
  #1049
pimmnz
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Auckland, NEW ZEALAND
Posts: 1,958
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: WACO YMF

Not at all Brother #1, sir, we was just taking the `Which cowl is the proper scale one' quandary to its illogical limit...
Evan, WB#12.
pimmnz is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 01-28-2007, 06:04 PM
  #1050
khodges
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: newton, NC
Posts: 5,443
Gallery
My Gallery
Models
My Models
Ratings
My Feedback
Default RE: WACO YMF

Here's my Sunday afternoon project, complete except for some fine sanding and paint.

In the first pic, you see the rough materials, cut oversize so they can be trimmed as I go. The bent wires are 1/16 piano wire, the heavier one is 1/8 piano wire. The brass tubing is 5/32 for the legs and upper post, 3/16 for the crosspiece and sleeve that fits over the post. The tailwheel is a 1-3/4 Klett, and takes a 1/8 brass tube for an axle.

I first soldered the two bent pieces; they are bent to clear the wheel with the brass legs in place when they straddle the wheel.
Next, I cut the crosspiece to length, with the ends at a 45 degree angle, and slit it across the top edge so it would fit over the bent wires. I aligned it and used silver solder paste to solidly fix it to the wires.

Next I trimmed the legs, slid them onto the bent wires, after trimming the wires so the brass overhung the ends. This is so you can flatten the ends of the brass to make a spot to drill them for the axle. The brass legs are cut to a length that allows the wheel to clear the crosspiece. These legs are also firmly silver soldered in place, and the corners are filled in.

After that, the portion of the small wires that fit into the post are trimmed, so that the larger diameter wire can also be inserted into the post (this wire is the same diameter as the tailwheel wire included with the ARF). The large wire is inserted into one end of the brass tube post, the ends of the smaller wires are inserted in the other end, and the assembly is firmly silver soldered.

Next I added small brass gussets on top and underneath the corners of the wheel forks. These are soldered with regular solder, so thet they will bond at a lower temp and not risk melting the solder that holds the forks together.

Now, I made a sleeve and brace that fits over the post. The brace on the prototype has a pivot because the wheel post is sprung, but I did not spring the model's assembly, so the brace is just soldered in place. This sleeve slides over the post, brace to the rear,will stay in place with the body cover attached.

I took a jeweler's file and cleaned up all the solder joints, and then sanded the entire thing, and put the wheel in place. I cut a couple of spacers for either side of the tailwheel axle to keep the wheel centered, and placed a piece of piano wire through the brass axle; a drop of Ca on either end will hold the pin in place after the assembly is painted.

More pics in the next post.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Nl30701.jpg
Views:	28
Size:	112.8 KB
ID:	608645   Click image for larger version

Name:	Mi22104.jpg
Views:	33
Size:	79.7 KB
ID:	608646   Click image for larger version

Name:	Ty65659.jpg
Views:	28
Size:	228.0 KB
ID:	608647   Click image for larger version

Name:	Lj23715.jpg
Views:	30
Size:	74.0 KB
ID:	608648   Click image for larger version

Name:	Vq50352.jpg
Views:	33
Size:	54.0 KB
ID:	608649  
khodges is offline  
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 02:08 PM.